To Be Or Not To Be Led Astray

[righteousrepublic]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

[simpleton]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

Those are many questions that I think scriptures answer very well. And of course depending upon each situation. But the first scripture that popped in my mind reading the above is Matthew 15
Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.....

Also Hosea 4 :
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children....

Pride also comes into play, if an individual, even that has a "strong testimony", allows pride to step in it can destroy any "strong testimony". We have church history and scriptures to show that.
To me, humility is the key to endurance in our "testimony" and I believe that it is only through humility and trust in God that an individual may ward off the " fiery darts of the adversary", and those darts most of the time are thrown at us from other humans, be they close family, friends, or relatives or enemies.
Hence the saying " Pride cometh before the fall".
Another major influencing factor is the " Pride of this world" or the pride of Babylon. We cant stand to have the finger of scorn pointed at us. So many have fallen even with a " strong testimony" because of that factor.
Lehi's dream pointed that out very clear.

Anybody can lead anybody astray that is willing, or that is say "overzealous" or that is " looking beyond the mark" or that "lacks knowledge" and for many other various reasons.

Another thing, according to scripture, that God knows His sheep, and they are numbered and He says that not one will be lost. That to me also seems to say that not every single person in this world past present and future are his sheep "that know his voice". The gospel net brings in all kinds, but not all are His sheep. " wheat and the tares" etc.

Look at the church even today, I would say most of us are tares. Yet many have " testimonys". But who or rather how many of us will stand true upon the "rock" when the terrible storm beats down upon us?...
That remains to be seen....

[Zathura]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

The number one issue that comes to mind is thinking you know something that you don’t actually know.

Imagine you discovered a really big mountain and you tell everyone it’s the biggest one in the world . You don’t believe someone tells you there’s one literally 3 times bigger. Eventually someone takes you to Everest and you’re blown away , your mind expands and you have a new perspective .

This has been my own experience with “knowing”. You think you know something until God shows you what it really means to know something.

Anybody can be led astray. I’d say it’s easier to be led astray by someone you know and trust than by a stranger, no? The person leading others astray might not even be aware. “The blind leading the blind”.

Those who go off the path are surely at ease with their choices, for a time at least. I imagine most will eventually express regret internally .

How to get back on the path?

Here’s a brief story I’ve shared here before.

The Stake President came to visit and taught all the adults in the ward. Afterwards he had a Q&A. A woman asked him

“what should My 16 year old son do to prepare for a mission?”

He replied:

“He needs to have a spiritual experience”

Some time later he gave a talk in Stake conference and the theme of the day was personal prayer . He shared that the “night of his conversion” was a night he found himself praying all night . It was implied he had an intense experience that converted him to the Lord.

So, how do you even get on the path in the first place? I believe you need to have spiritual experience with God . Logically, you would look for the same thing to get back on the path you drifted from.

What is “the path”?

Many would say church membership.

I say:
a. Mosiah 4:2-12,
b. Mosiah 5:1-9
c. Alma 36:1-26
d. Helaman 5:35-45
e. 3 Nephi 11:31-40
f. 3 Nephi 19: 8-30
g. Enos 1:2-12
h. 2 Nephi 31:5-21
i. 2 Nephi 32:1-7
j. Moroni 7:35-48
k. Moroni 10:8-33
l. 1 Nephi 2:16
m. Alma 5:6-49
n. Alma 18:41 - Alma 19:1-29
o. Alma 22:14-23
p. Moses 6:64-

[The Airbender]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?


Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

we are commanded not to out our trust in the arm of flesh. Anyone who does not seem the confirmation of the spirit can be less astray.

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

I have been led astray a number of times. It was either because I chose my will over the spirit, convinced myself that my will was Father's will, or followed the wrong spirit.

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Fault-finding is not of the Lord. Murmuring and contention aren't either. Righteous judgement is.

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

The only way to be wrong with God and at ease is to be pulled into carnal security. I once was able to feel what I would feel if I was left to myself and it was the most horrible experience if my life. I had work to do. It was not repentance as we think of it, as I was living as I should. Rather, it was the weight of the things in me that I carry, emotional baggage, the weight of generations, the things my parents and grandparents never worked through in their lives as well as my own unbelief and transgressions. In my mind to be off the path means not working for improvement. And people can avoid it now behind the veil, but they will have to gave it someday. It will not be a pleasant experience.

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

[I AM]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

------------
first, what are we talking about when we say "led astray";
you seem to assume that by being "led astray" means to be led away from the church.
What if the church has been "led astray" - because they are following the ways of the World, instead of Christ.

What if those that you think have been led astray,
are actually those who choose to follow Christ, and His word, and NO ONE ELSE,
and have been led to the truth.

John 8

31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples,
32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”


Mark 8
34 ¶ And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it.

36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

[simpleton]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

------------
first, what are we talking about when we say "led astray";
you seem to assume that by being "led astray" means to be led away from the church.
What if the church has been "led astray" - because they are following the ways of the World, instead of Christ.

What if those that you think have been led astray,
are actually those who choose to follow Christ, and His word, and NO ONE ELSE,
and have been led to the truth.

John 8

31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples,
32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”


Mark 8
34 ¶ And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it.

36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

I wonder how many really understand the above verse. And how it applies and affects every single one of us, more especially those that take upon them the name of Christ. Are we truly unashamed of Him? Would we truly own Him in the face of Babylons pointing finger and scorn? Well, according to Lehi's vision of the tree of life, most are ashamed of Him....

[righteousrepublic]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

The number one issue that comes to mind is thinking you know something that you don’t actually know.

Imagine you discovered a really big mountain and you tell everyone it’s the biggest one in the world . You don’t believe someone tells you there’s one literally 3 times bigger. Eventually someone takes you to Everest and you’re blown away , your mind expands and you have a new perspective .

This has been my own experience with “knowing”. You think you know something until God shows you what it really means to know something.

Anybody can be led astray. I’d say it’s easier to be led astray by someone you know and trust than by a stranger, no? The person leading others astray might not even be aware. “The blind leading the blind”.

Those who go off the path are surely at ease with their choices, for a time at least. I imagine most will eventually express regret internally .

How to get back on the path?

Here’s a brief story I’ve shared here before.

The Stake President came to visit and taught all the adults in the ward. Afterwards he had a Q&A. A woman asked him

“what should My 16 year old son do to prepare for a mission?”

He replied:

“He needs to have a spiritual experience”

Some time later he gave a talk in Stake conference and the theme of the day was personal prayer . He shared that the “night of his conversion” was a night he found himself praying all night . It was implied he had an intense experience that converted him to the Lord.

So, how do you even get on the path in the first place? I believe you need to have spiritual experience with God . Logically, you would look for the same thing to get back on the path you drifted from.

What is “the path”?

Many would say church membership.

I say:
a. Mosiah 4:2-12,
b. Mosiah 5:1-9
c. Alma 36:1-26
d. Helaman 5:35-45
e. 3 Nephi 11:31-40
f. 3 Nephi 19: 8-30
g. Enos 1:2-12
h. 2 Nephi 31:5-21
i. 2 Nephi 32:1-7
j. Moroni 7:35-48
k. Moroni 10:8-33
l. 1 Nephi 2:16
m. Alma 5:6-49
n. Alma 18:41 - Alma 19:1-29
o. Alma 22:14-23
p. Moses 6:64-

All those scriptures are great. I only add this. The basic path is clinging to the iron rod leading to the tree of life.

1 Nephi 8:20-23,28
20 And I also beheld a strait and narrow path, which came along by the rod of iron, even to the tree by which I stood; and it also led by the head of the fountain, unto a large and spacious field, as if it had been a world.
21 And I saw numberless concourses of people, many of whom were pressing forward, that they might obtain the path which led unto the tree by which I stood.
22 And it came to pass that they did come forth, and commence in the path which led to the tree.
23 And it came to pass that there arose a mist of darkness; yea, even an exceedingly great mist of darkness, insomuch that they who had commenced in the path did lose their way, that they wandered off and were lost.
28 And after they had tasted of the fruit they were bshamed, because of those that were scoffing at them; and they fell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

rod of iron
Ps. 2:9; Rev. 2:27; 12:5; 19:15; JST Rev. 19:15 (Rev. 19:15 note a); 1 Ne. 8:30; 11:25; 15:23 (23–24).

1 Nephi 11:25
25 And it came to pass that I beheld that the rod of iron, which my father had seen, was the word of God, which led to the fountain of living waters, or to the tree of life; which waters are a representation of the love of God; and I also beheld that the tree of life was a representation of the love of God.

[Zathura]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

The number one issue that comes to mind is thinking you know something that you don’t actually know.

Imagine you discovered a really big mountain and you tell everyone it’s the biggest one in the world . You don’t believe someone tells you there’s one literally 3 times bigger. Eventually someone takes you to Everest and you’re blown away , your mind expands and you have a new perspective .

This has been my own experience with “knowing”. You think you know something until God shows you what it really means to know something.

Anybody can be led astray. I’d say it’s easier to be led astray by someone you know and trust than by a stranger, no? The person leading others astray might not even be aware. “The blind leading the blind”.

Those who go off the path are surely at ease with their choices, for a time at least. I imagine most will eventually express regret internally .

How to get back on the path?

Here’s a brief story I’ve shared here before.

The Stake President came to visit and taught all the adults in the ward. Afterwards he had a Q&A. A woman asked him

“what should My 16 year old son do to prepare for a mission?”

He replied:

“He needs to have a spiritual experience”

Some time later he gave a talk in Stake conference and the theme of the day was personal prayer . He shared that the “night of his conversion” was a night he found himself praying all night . It was implied he had an intense experience that converted him to the Lord.

So, how do you even get on the path in the first place? I believe you need to have spiritual experience with God . Logically, you would look for the same thing to get back on the path you drifted from.

What is “the path”?

Many would say church membership.

I say:
a. Mosiah 4:2-12,
b. Mosiah 5:1-9
c. Alma 36:1-26
d. Helaman 5:35-45
e. 3 Nephi 11:31-40
f. 3 Nephi 19: 8-30
g. Enos 1:2-12
h. 2 Nephi 31:5-21
i. 2 Nephi 32:1-7
j. Moroni 7:35-48
k. Moroni 10:8-33
l. 1 Nephi 2:16
m. Alma 5:6-49
n. Alma 18:41 - Alma 19:1-29
o. Alma 22:14-23
p. Moses 6:64-

All those scriptures are great. I only add this. The basic path is clinging to the iron rod leading to the tree of life.

1 Nephi 8:20-23,28
20 And I also beheld a strait and narrow path, which came along by the rod of iron, even to the tree by which I stood; and it also led by the head of the fountain, unto a large and spacious field, as if it had been a world.
21 And I saw numberless concourses of people, many of whom were pressing forward, that they might obtain the path which led unto the tree by which I stood.
22 And it came to pass that they did come forth, and commence in the path which led to the tree.
23 And it came to pass that there arose a mist of darkness; yea, even an exceedingly great mist of darkness, insomuch that they who had commenced in the path did lose their way, that they wandered off and were lost.
28 And after they had tasted of the fruit they were bshamed, because of those that were scoffing at them; and they fell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

rod of iron
Ps. 2:9; Rev. 2:27; 12:5; 19:15; JST Rev. 19:15 (Rev. 19:15 note a); 1 Ne. 8:30; 11:25; 15:23 (23–24).

1 Nephi 11:25
25 And it came to pass that I beheld that the rod of iron, which my father had seen, was the word of God, which led to the fountain of living waters, or to the tree of life; which waters are a representation of the love of God; and I also beheld that the tree of life was a representation of the love of God.

Of course. It’s synonymous with the straight and narrow path. You do what those scriptures say to do to get on the path, then retain it.

Do exactly what those people did, experience what they experienced

[I AM]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

------------
first, what are we talking about when we say "led astray";
you seem to assume that by being "led astray" means to be led away from the church.
What if the church has been "led astray" - because they are following the ways of the World, instead of Christ.

What if those that you think have been led astray,
are actually those who choose to follow Christ, and His word, and NO ONE ELSE,
and have been led to the truth.

John 8

31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples,
32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”


Mark 8
34 ¶ And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it.

36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

I wonder how many really understand the above verse. And how it applies and affects every single one of us, more especially those that take upon them the name of Christ. Are we truly unashamed of Him? Would we truly own Him in the face of Babylons pointing finger and scorn? Well, according to Lehi's vision of the tree of life, most are ashamed of Him....

-------------
1 Nephi 8
26 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the other side of the river of water, a great and spacious building; and it stood as it were in the air, high above the earth.

27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the attitude of mocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit.

28 And after they had tasted of the fruit they were ashamed, because of those that were scoffing at them; and they fell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

[brianj]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

You have to allow yourself to be lead astray. No church leader can lead someone astray without that individual's consent.
Can an uninformed church member be lead astray? Probably pretty easily. That's why it is important to exercise personal responsibility to learn for yourself and develop your own testimony of true principles.

What does it take to be lead astray? Probably a spiritual weakness or a willingness to be lead astray. Several years ago there was a General Conference talk teaching us that before we doubt our testimonies we should doubt our doubts. If you don't wish to be lead astray, start by asking if Christ lives. Ask if you have the gift of the Holy Ghost. Ask if the Book of Mormon is scripture. Start at the center of your testimony and work your way out instead of focusing on a fringe of your testimony and letting a doubt there destroy your testimony.

I have been lead astray, but not far enough to leave the church. I was lead astray by a very contentious and prideful family member, as well as by some church leaders who failed to recognize the difference between gospel principles and their opinions. To come back I had to learn truth again, through scripture study, temple attendance, and prayer.

I do believe those who are constantly looking for faults with church leaders are on a path to falling away. So what if they have faults? They are mortal! I was greatly disturbed when President Hunter went into the hospital, some spokesman said he's just tired from all his work, and it later came out that he had cancer. Why did they lie? In the end it doesn't matter why they lied: they are mortal and therefore imperfect.

To get back on the path remember this: If you shall do His will you shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God or some anonymous trickster. If you aren't on the path and want to know if the church is the right path or not, I have a simple challenge for you. First Nephi has 22 chapters. For 22 days, read one chapter each morning. Pray before and after reading. Go to church during those 3.14 weeks. Before you start this challenge, write down a personal inventory of beliefs, happiness, and life satisfaction. On day 22 write down another personal inventory. Then compare them and see what a difference it has made.



Someone I know recently decided to study church history, became very bothered by some things he read, let those things erode his testimony, and he turned from the church. I sincerely doubt he will find himself happier in six months, but if he takes my challenge after those six months then I have total confidence that he will find he is becoming happier.

[righteousrepublic]

Can a church member with a strong testimony, having studied the scriptures often and implementing that knowledge and changing their life accordingly be led astray by another in a high church calling at will?
Can an uninformed church member lacking in scripture study and improving their conduct be led astray by someone in a high church calling at will?

Just what does it take for someone to be led astray?

Does it take something huge to cause another to be led astray? Or can some small issue do the job?

Can someone that is always finding fault with the church and/or its leaders lead someone else astray? If so, how? If not, why?

Would anyone here be willing to admit having been led astray? How and why?

Are those that chronically find fault with either church leaders or policies on the path?

Are those off the path at ease with themselves?

How does one get back on the path and what should their actions and thoughts include?

------------
first, what are we talking about when we say "led astray";
you seem to assume that by being "led astray" means to be led away from the church.
What if the church has been "led astray" - because they are following the ways of the World, instead of Christ.

What if those that you think have been led astray,
are actually those who choose to follow Christ, and His word, and NO ONE ELSE,
and have been led to the truth.

John 8

31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples,
32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”


Mark 8
34 ¶ And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it.

36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

I wonder how many really understand the above verse. And how it applies and affects every single one of us, more especially those that take upon them the name of Christ. Are we truly unashamed of Him? Would we truly own Him in the face of Babylons pointing finger and scorn? Well, according to Lehi's vision of the tree of life, most are ashamed of Him....

-------------
1 Nephi 8
26 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the other side of the river of water, a great and spacious building; and it stood as it were in the air, high above the earth.

27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the attitude of mocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit.

28 And after they had tasted of the fruit they were ashamed, because of those that were scoffing at them; and they fell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

Even Peter denied Christ three times. Are any of us that will not open his/her mouth and proclaim Christ in the face of harm or death any better than Peter?

Do we remain on the path having closed lips?

[Zathura]

------------
first, what are we talking about when we say "led astray";
you seem to assume that by being "led astray" means to be led away from the church.
What if the church has been "led astray" - because they are following the ways of the World, instead of Christ.

What if those that you think have been led astray,
are actually those who choose to follow Christ, and His word, and NO ONE ELSE,
and have been led to the truth.

John 8

31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples,
32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”


Mark 8
34 ¶ And when he had called the people unto him with his disciples also, he said unto them, Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.

35 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it; but whosoever shall lose his life for my sake and the gospel’s, the same shall save it.

36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.

I wonder how many really understand the above verse. And how it applies and affects every single one of us, more especially those that take upon them the name of Christ. Are we truly unashamed of Him? Would we truly own Him in the face of Babylons pointing finger and scorn? Well, according to Lehi's vision of the tree of life, most are ashamed of Him....

-------------
1 Nephi 8
26 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the other side of the river of water, a great and spacious building; and it stood as it were in the air, high above the earth.

27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the attitude of mocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit.

28 And after they had tasted of the fruit they were ashamed, because of those that were scoffing at them; and they fell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

Even Peter denied Christ three times. Are any of us that will not open his/her mouth and proclaim Christ in the face of harm or death any better than Peter?

Do we remain on the path having closed lips?

Hard to say my friend, but Peter was not yet converted at that time. After the events of Acts 1 I do not believe Peter would have ever denied Christ again(Peter's eventual death is proof of this). This is why I shared those scriptures in my other post. Experience what Peter experienced, then you will be converted.

Even then, our friend Finrock posted something like this awhile back:

"They may be able to inflict enough pain to get my lips to say I deny Christ, but I could never truly deny Christ in my heart and soul".

[righteousrepublic]

I wonder how many really understand the above verse. And how it applies and affects every single one of us, more especially those that take upon them the name of Christ. Are we truly unashamed of Him? Would we truly own Him in the face of Babylons pointing finger and scorn? Well, according to Lehi's vision of the tree of life, most are ashamed of Him....

-------------
1 Nephi 8
26 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the other side of the river of water, a great and spacious building; and it stood as it were in the air, high above the earth.

27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the attitude of mocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit.

28 And after they had tasted of the fruit they were ashamed, because of those that were scoffing at them; and they fell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

Even Peter denied Christ three times. Are any of us that will not open his/her mouth and proclaim Christ in the face of harm or death any better than Peter?

Do we remain on the path having closed lips?

Hard to say my friend, but Peter was not yet converted at that time. After the events of Acts 1 I do not believe Peter would have ever denied Christ again(Peter's eventual death is proof of this). This is why I shared those scriptures in my other post. Experience what Peter experienced, then you will be converted.

Even then, our friend Finrock posted something like this awhile back:

"They may be able to inflict enough pain to get my lips to say I deny Christ, but I could never truly deny Christ in my heart and soul".

Doesn't count. If we are not willing to die for Christ, we are not his, in that we cannot be heirs with him in the Celestial kingdom.


121:29
29 All thrones and dominions, principalities and powers, shall be revealed and set forth upon all who have endured valiantly for the gospel of Jesus Christ.

2 Tim. 1:8
8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord...but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;

1 Jn. 4:15
15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.

Rev. 1:2
2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

Rev. 19:10
10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Mosiah 18:9
9 Yea, and are willing to mourn with those that mourn; yea, and comfort those that stand in need of comfort, and to stand as witnesses of God at all times and in all things, and in all places that ye may be in, even until death, that ye may be redeemed of God, and be numbered with those of the first resurrection, that ye may have eternal life—

Speaking out loud in remembrance of and acknowledgement of Christ is essential.

[harakim]

-------------
1 Nephi 8
26 And I also cast my eyes round about, and beheld, on the other side of the river of water, a great and spacious building; and it stood as it were in the air, high above the earth.

27 And it was filled with people, both old and young, both male and female; and their manner of dress was exceedingly fine; and they were in the attitude of mocking and pointing their fingers towards those who had come at and were partaking of the fruit.

28 And after they had tasted of the fruit they were ashamed, because of those that were scoffing at them; and they fell away into forbidden paths and were lost.

Even Peter denied Christ three times. Are any of us that will not open his/her mouth and proclaim Christ in the face of harm or death any better than Peter?

Do we remain on the path having closed lips?

Hard to say my friend, but Peter was not yet converted at that time. After the events of Acts 1 I do not believe Peter would have ever denied Christ again(Peter's eventual death is proof of this). This is why I shared those scriptures in my other post. Experience what Peter experienced, then you will be converted.

Even then, our friend Finrock posted something like this awhile back:

"They may be able to inflict enough pain to get my lips to say I deny Christ, but I could never truly deny Christ in my heart and soul".

Doesn't count. If we are not willing to die for Christ, we are not his, in that we cannot be heirs with him in the Celestial kingdom.


121:29
29 All thrones and dominions, principalities and powers, shall be revealed and set forth upon all who have endured valiantly for the gospel of Jesus Christ.

2 Tim. 1:8
8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord...but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;

1 Jn. 4:15
15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.

Rev. 1:2
2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw.

Rev. 19:10
10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Mosiah 18:9
9 Yea, and are willing to mourn with those that mourn; yea, and comfort those that stand in need of comfort, and to stand as witnesses of God at all times and in all things, and in all places that ye may be in, even until death, that ye may be redeemed of God, and be numbered with those of the first resurrection, that ye may have eternal life—

Speaking out loud in remembrance of and acknowledgement of Christ is essential.

Yeah, even until death. Not anything. Death is definitely not the worst thing.


I was definitely led astray many times. It's been a LONG time but I can think of some things:
I was led astray to think that if I did anything wrong, I would go to hell.
I was led to think that if I was doing anything wrong, I couldn't receive revelation.
I was led to believe the church is always right and therefore I don't need personal revelation (I could pray to find out the same things I could read in the scriptures/hear in conference.)
I was told by a church leader that he raised the dead. I also saw little kids get up and "bear their testimony" and the kicker was one time when a girl told me she KNEW something was true which I knew was a hundred percent false, then the next day she bore her testimony using the exact same intonation. So all of these false testimonies were leading me astray the whole time, but if you think the church is unquestionably true, then at the moment she bore her testimony, I was led astray because I did not believe the church so much. (That one is not really leaders, but they often give boilerplate testimonies too.)
I was led astray by not teaching me church history so the first time I came into contact with it, I seriously questioned my testimony.

[righteousrepublic]

Yeah, even until death. Not anything. Death is definitely not the worst thing.


I was definitely led astray many times. It's been a LONG time but I can think of some things:
I was led astray to think that if I did anything wrong, I would go to hell. True, if not repented of. Alma 45:16 Mosiah 26:30
I was led to think that if I was doing anything wrong, I couldn't receive revelation. Not true. The HG teaches small things if we hear.
I was led to believe the church is always right and therefore I don't need personal revelation (I could pray to find out the same things I could read in the scriptures/hear in conference.) Not true. Paying heed to the HG is revelation. I know from experience.
I was told by a church leader that he raised the dead. I also saw little kids get up and "bear their testimony" and the kicker was one time when a girl told me she KNEW something was true which I knew was a hundred percent false, then the next day she bore her testimony using the exact same intonation. So all of these false testimonies were leading me astray the whole time, but if you think the church is unquestionably true, then at the moment she bore her testimony, I was led astray because I did not believe the church so much. (That one is not really leaders, but they often give boilerplate testimonies too.) My comments below.
I was led astray by not teaching me church history so the first time I came into contact with it, I seriously questioned my testimony. My comments below.

2 Nephi 2:11
11 For it must needs be, that there is an opposition in all things. If not so...righteousness could not be brought to pass, neither wickedness, neither holiness nor misery, neither good nor bad. Wherefore, all things must needs be a compound in one; wherefore, if it should be one body it must needs remain as dead, having no life neither death, nor corruption nor incorruption, happiness nor misery, neither sense nor insensibility.

This isn't "the gospel by righteousrepublic", but let's think about this for a moment. Opposition in all things. Could it not be that even in the church as it as traveled from its restoration to where it is today, that we find an opposition within it?
Many early teachings do not coincide with those of today....and we have to ask ourselves why. Why so many opposing doctrines that can cause personal discontentment and discord among members? And now we find members clinging to the early teachings and attempting to impose it onto others even to the point of deriding them because hey refuse to accept it. On the flip side, we have members with strong testimonies of today's teachings that refuse to infuse teachings from yesteryear. So what do we have in all this? Opposition.

How do we fix the problem, one might ask. Well, in considering the fact that church leaders are always urging, almost prodding us, to read the scriptures. There must be a meaningful purpose for this, right?

Look around and see how many people are still breastfeeding off the church. Are they stuck in that mode because they, for whatever reason, either don't want to feast upon the word as counseled, or maybe they're in it for the social gatherings. Whatever.

Now here's where it gets challenging. For those who do feast upon the word, internalize it and live it to the best of their ability, they eventually reach a point to where they can stand on their own. They possess a strong, firm and unyielding testimony of Christ and his teachings. They come to a point that they no longer need to breastfeed off the church, Instead, they go to partake of the sacrament, to fellowship and, yes. learn what other members know based on their testimonies. They even enjoy the brotherhood and sisterhood aspect of the church. Yet inside, they are steadfast and immovable and their every action is in attempting to glorify God. Sound familiar?

When it comes to the opposition problem, and even though it causes a riff, we have to conclude that those believing in the early doctrines and those not will both have it laid out to them after this life whatever the facts are.

But I will say this, for both sides of the same coin, we must all seek being cleansed from all sin through the blood of the Lamb and become as little children to be taught by the Spirit, and do, so we can go to live with Father and His Christ.

People cannot fall or be led astray if they have strong faith, and don't allow Satan to break them down. Helaman 5:12

There is more to be said about personal, spiritual growth, and stopping to breastfeed off the church, but this is where I end.