Re: The Book of Mormon Through the Eyes of a Rabbi
Posted: March 16th, 2019, 9:21 pm
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Some quotes from some recent threads. I just kept wondering what Rebbe thought.
From the same thread:Ashkenazis are the ones who started the revolution in Russia (Bolshevism) and caused so much wickedness in Germany (Berlin was worse than what Vegas is now. It was literally a cesspool) before Hitler came to power and cleaned up all the filth and helped the relocate ( yes the German government paid their way out of the country even though they didn’t deserve it).
The Holocost was not what it was reported and now the Jews (mainly Ashkenazi) are manipulating many governments and murdering the Palestinians daily.
From the same thread:“The main movers and shakers behind the pro-abortion movement in the U.S. are Jews...
While there are, of course, pro-life Jews who are disturbed by the abortion rates in both the United States and Israel, I would venture to say that they are certainly in the minority, especially in the U.S. Their low regard for Gentile life at any stage of development is reflected in the number of abortions performed by Jewish doctors (about half of all abortion providers are Jewish) [1] in Jewish owned “women’s clinics” (about a half of all such clinics are owned by Jews) [2] which is way out of proportion when you consider what a small percentage of our population Jews comprise.
Various people have commented publicly about the disproportionate number of Jews in the abortion rights movement. For instance, Kenneth Mitzner, founder of an organization entitled The Pro-life League Against Neo-Hitlerism said:
“It is tragic but demonstrably true that most of the leaders of the pro-abortion movement are of Jewish extraction.” https://davidduke.com/the-abortion-indu ... mist-jews/
“Jewish Leaders Behind The Homosexual and Lesbian Movement...
http://www.intmensorg.info/hlm.htm
“America's Jews Are Driving America's Wars...
Jewish groups and deep pocket individual donors not only control the politicians, they own and run the media and entertainment industries, meaning that no one will hear about or from the offending party ever again. They are particularly sensitive on the issue of so-called “dual loyalty,” particularly as the expression itself is a bit of a sham since it is pretty clear that some of them only have real loyalty to Israel. http://www.unz.com/pgiraldi/americas-je ... icas-wars/
“Rabbinical Torah Jews believe that the Zionist state of Israel is illegitimate in the eyes of God and that it DOES NOT represent true Jews or Judaism.http://christianitybeliefs.org/end-time ... rt-israel/
Abortion, homosexual lies as well as some wars, have been from people who want the world to have such Zionist ideas...
“World Zionist leaders initiated a program to change America and its religious orientation. One of the tools used to accomplish this goal was an obscure and malleable Civil War veteran named Cyrus I. Scofield. A much larger tool was a venerable, world respected European book publisher — The Oxford University Press.
I'm not sure if you read my post very carefully, I didn't call anyone names and I didn't call anyone evil. Speaking generally I said, "There are very evil people in this world from all cultures and it has nothing to do with melanin, family trees, or religion. There are evil Latter-day Saints among us, wolves in sheep’s clothes." I did in no way imply or insinuate that anyone commenting here is evil. When I was thinking of evil saints among us, I was thinking of the man running for sheriff who terrorized a family I knew because of the non-member father who he bragged to about his sexual exploits and then tried to bury him and his family when he found out his wife was a less active member. Then there was a friend of mine who used home teaching to molest the daughter of a family he was assigned to. Wolves among us they are there, and they are among many other groups and we should not assume that these outliers ARE the group, that was my point.
I'm criticizing those who condemn an entire group of people because of the actions of a dangerous few on the one hand and I'm pointing out factual statistical data on the other hand. There is a big difference between saying, "Asians perform better in mathematics statistically than any other group" and "All Asians are racists," I hope you can see the difference between the two.
I know that the Ashkenazi's are not ethnic Jews, that wasn't my point. My point was that there are very intelligent people in that group and that some use intelligence for good and for evil. I then pointed out that there are good and evil people among the saints but in both cases that should not cause people to simply hate the entire group."Thinker wrote: ↑March 17th, 2019, 4:44 pm Ashkenazi’s” are not really Jewish - their ancestors converted in Europe & don’t practice Judaism - so they are not Jewish ethnically nor religiously. So it’s like saying some exclusive club of people hijacking the name “Jew” (but are as Jewish as any of us) are smarter - or like people of the “red shoe club” are smarter. Nonsense.
There is a lot of legal discrimination in the form of affirmative action and other "progressive" policies and that is deeply ingrained into the fabric of the modern "left."Thinker wrote: ↑March 17th, 2019, 4:44 pm And the study was discredited showing that so-called Jews (Ashkenazi) did NOT do better on tests, but were disproportionately accepted into ivy league universities despite their lower test scores than other peer students. Up until the 1980’s it was legal for so-called “Jews” to discriminate & hire only “Jews” & it seems the practice continues only more subtly.
I have no doubt that there are people in those groups who support things that I would vehemently disagree with, but I don't whitewash every single person in the group as having those ideas. There are plenty of non-ethnic, non-religious, non-Jewish people that support and promote horrible things. I'll bet that there are many more so-called "Christians" that support all that and worse.Thinker wrote: ↑March 17th, 2019, 4:44 pm What bothers me about this is that these so-called impersonating (non-ethnic and non-religious) “Jews” are dominating societies including the US - and for the worse. They have supported homosexual sick decrees, abortion murders, unjust wars & stealing middle eastern land & control most media. And they have banged the victim-mentality holocaust drum so long and loud that if you question them or their evil deeds, you are called ad hominem attacks like “anti-semite.” Did you know there is now a law that states even talking badly about the STATE of Israel (which was stolen from Palestinians in 1948) it will be considered “anti-semetic” & you will face punishment??
It’s a public forum, people have a right to criticize and offer their ideas. Unfortunately it is all too easy to get off the original topic. If you are going to play here, you need to have thick skin and the stamina to work through a disagreement civilly.
Why not discuss scripture and life through the eyes of CHRIST?
Because THIS thread was started and the topic fueled by someone who is not a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, is a Jewish rabbi, and finally may not have a belief in Jesus Christ, BUT may have an interest in the Book of Mormon as an historical record of some early Jewish offshoots. Doesn't he have a right to start and discuss a thread to the topic of his liking?
The Rebbe knows Hebrew and I do not. He has studied things I have not and his ideas and commentary are welcome here. I’ve been enjoying his perspective and insights as well.Thinker wrote: ↑March 17th, 2019, 5:50 pmWhy not discuss scripture and life through the eyes of CHRIST?
Why put people up on a pedestal - because you’ve been told to?
I find herd mentality that blindly venerates people just for claiming to be “chosen” while turning a blind eye to evil - very concerning. Christ seemed to see problems with that as well.
“God is no respector of persons.”
“Thou shalt have no other gods before God.”
Many blindly support Jews partly because of propaganda even in text books... (e.g: focusing on the Holocaust which was horrific, but the killings in Soviet Union was worse, & Maoist China was worse than the other 2 combined yet are ignored in school books etc). Another influence that’s contributed to Christians blindly supporting Israel & Ashkenazi so-called “Jews:”
http://themillenniumreport.com/2018/02/ ... eld-bible/
Some inconvenient facts and apparent plans...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4AWP0XVopCQ#
He knows Hebrew and his commentary is fascinating in that regard, plus many of us would like to hear what he has to say.Thinker wrote: ↑March 17th, 2019, 6:40 pm Christ - and the truth he stood for - are never irrelevant.
If you really want to limit the discussion - then use private message. Otherwise, expect on an internet forum of diverse opinions - that is what you will find. I have a right to post as much as you do.
We have Jewish ancestry - and I have had friends of all races and religions - so this is not about prejudice. It’s about calling out what is deceiving many. People pretending to be Jews. And many Christians - including lds - go along with this veneration of Jews - just for being called that - when most use the name but don’t live Judaism and have no ethnic ties - & many are behind much evil that is hurting many. Look it up yourself.
How did mass genocides happen? People blindly went along with dangerous herd mentalities. That’s what I see happening & I’m holding up a red flag. Question everything. Would God - who is love - ask for mass killings - for stealing land? Not the God I believe in. Would God look on status as more important than heart and action? Not my God. Why do you hold this unknown person up as someone who’s eyes you want to see through? What is so special about him? Does God see him as more valuable than the homeless on the street? What are goym - and why does the Jewish Talmud state it’s ok to disrespect & kill them?
http://researchlist.blogspot.com/2011/0 ... d.html?m=1
The Rebbe wrote: ↑February 15th, 2019, 8:48 am Ok....ready?
Before I begin this chapter by chapter, verse by verse analysis of the Book of Mormon through Hebraic eyes, let me preface it with two things:
First, I do not know if I will be able to do this with the entire book. I am exceedingly busy with synagogue business and the spiritual/emotional needs of the congregation, so I will do my best to tackle as much as I can in whatever time I have available.
Second, I will work under the assumption that the events and characters in the Book of Mormon are real and as portrayed. I am not saying I believe this, nor am I saying that I endorse this. Still, it is far simpler to work within these parameters.
Ok! Let's start. 1 Nephi 1:1:
Name etymology: Nefi - possible from the Hebrew נפל (Nefil) which means "tall one"?1 I, NEPHI, having been born of goodly parents, therefore I was taught somewhat in all the learning of my father; and having seen many afflictions in the course of my days, nevertheless, having been highly favored of the Lord in all my days; yea, having had a great knowledge of the goodness and the mysteries of God, therefore I make a record of my proceedings in my days.
Nephi as a scribe or keeper of Jewish histories: In ancient Israel, a scribe was an office of high prestige. Being a scribe meant that one was well instructed in the Torah-Law of Israel. Being a scribe, Nephi would have been certainly a prestigious member of his society.
In the Jerusalem Targum, Moshe and Aharon are called the scribes of Israel. Judaism mantains that Moshe began a school of prominently faithful israelites who would have the mission of transmitting the teachings of the law. Nephi would have been a member of such ancient scribal school.
Mysteries of the Almighty: There is a word-play between the word ספר (sofer - scribe) and the ספירות (sefirot) which account in Judaism for the mysterious nature of G-d. Nephi was therefore very knowledgeable in the higher truths of Judaism.
Part of the role of a scribe was also to translate Torah into other languages so that the laymen in exile would understand it. The greatest known literature in Judaism are the Targums in Aramaic and the Samaritan Targum. This role of scribe seems to be fulfilled when Nephi writes in the Egyptian language.2 Yea, I make a record in the language of my father, which consists of the learning of the Jews and the language of the Egyptians.
In Judaism, hands were used in connection to oaths. (See, for example B'reshit 24:2) By emphasizing that the writing is of his own hand, Nephi is taking an oath concerning its truthfulness.3 And I know that the record which I make is true; and I make it with mine own hand; and I make it according to my knowledge.
Teshuvah or Repentance: The word in Hebrew for this is שוב (shuv) which quite literally means to turn or, more interestingly, to return. Nephi's warnings were that the people had strayed from Torah understanding and practice. Repenting in Judaism is more than a feeling. It is seeking the original way; the way of the Almighty, praised be He. Two schools of thought within Judaism defined such repentance: Some say repentance is to seek the state of the Sinai. Others define it as seeking the state of our primary existence as it was in the Garden of Eden.4 For it came to pass in the commencement of the afirst year of the reign of Zedekiah, king of Judah, (my father, Lehi, having dwelt at Jerusalem in all his days); and in that same year there came many prophets, prophesying unto the people that they must repent, or the great city Jerusalem must be destroyed.
Name etymology: Lehi (לחי) means "jaw".5 Wherefore it came to pass that my father, Lehi, as he went forth prayed unto the Lord, yea, even with all his heart, in behalf of his people.
Prayed with all his heart:
The heart in Jewish culture meant the center of one's spirituality, whether good or bad. The Jewish Midrash in B'reshit Rabbah 67 says:
"The wicked are in the power of their heart, but the righteous have their heart in their power."
The meaning idea of Lehi praying with all his heart meant that no evil was to be found in his heart for he had overcome it.
From Nephi's description of the angels seen by Lehi, we can be sure that Lehi saw כרובים (cherubim) – which in Hebrew means "the near ones". The ending "-im" in Hebrew is a masculine plural ending, but it does not always indicate the masculinity of the term.6 And it came to pass as he prayed unto the Lord, there came a pillar of fire and dwelt upon a rock before him; and he saw and heard much; and because of the things which he saw and heard he did quake and tremble exceedingly.
In ancient Jewish tradition the pillar of fire symbolizes the power of G-d's word to transform. It is said that Onkelos converted many into Judaism by narrating how G-d is the pillar of fire before Israel.
7 And it came to pass that he returned to his own house at Jerusalem; and he cast himself upon his bed, being overcome with the Spirit and the things which he had seen.
8 And being thus overcome with the Spirit, he was carried away in a vision, even that he saw the heavens open, and he thought he saw God sitting upon his throne, surrounded with numberless concourses of angels in the attitude of singing and praising their God.
9 And it came to pass that he saw One descending out of the midst of heaven, and he beheld that his luster was above that of the sun at noon-day.
In the ancient wisdom of Kabalah (Zohar Terumah 2:176a), the cherubim represented the closeness between G-d and Israel. When Israel was in connection with G-d, the cherubim turned unto G-d for praise. When Israel strayed away the cherubim would rebuke the Jewish people. It comes as no surprise that it is the cherubim who send the message to Lehi.
Jewish tradition mantains that the stars are governed by the angels of heaven. The twelve cherubim mentioned by Lehi are also cited in the Book of Enoch:10 And he also saw twelve others following him, and their brightness did exceed that of the stars in the firmament.
"Its ceiling was like the path of stars and lightning, and between them were twelve fiery
cherubim, and their skies were as waters."
Like what is inferred from Enoch, Lehi's vision shows that such angels ruled above the stars of heaven. This is particularly revelant as Babylonian culture of Lehi's time would see the stars as governing the fate of mankind. In Lehi's vision G-d shows him how he is above and in control of the fate of Jerusalem.
Another possible word-play between ספיר (sapir - brightness) and ספר (sefer - book). In Judaism, it is said that the heavens contain the records of what will become of the world. Therefore, this again indicates a revelation of the fate of Jerusalem.11 And they came down and went forth upon the face of the earth; and the first came and stood before my father, and gave unto him a book, and bade him that he should read.
Usually the term in Hebrew for filled in this case is מלא (maleh) which means not only to fill, but also to confirm.12 And it came to pass that as he read, he was filled with the Spirit of the Lord.
There is a clear word-play here with מלא (fill) and מלאך (malach - angel). The only difference between the two words is the letter כ in its final form. This is also the first letter of the word cherub as well as the word star (כוכב - cochav). It seems therefore that the spirit-filling of Lehi comes as a second witness to the message of the angels, as demanded by Torah-Law which requires two witnesses to establish truth.
It may sound odd to the reader that Lehi rejoiced over such news. However, in Judaism this is a rather common attitude. Ancient kabalah believes that when something evil befalls Israel it means that it's in fact such a highly elevated goodness that this world cannot comprehend it. This is why the prophets often rejoiced over that which would ultimately save Israel even if it meant suffering for a while.13 And he read, saying: Wo, wo, unto Jerusalem, for I have seen thine abominations! Yea, and many things did my father read concerning Jerusalem—that it should be destroyed, and the inhabitants thereof; many should perish by the sword, and many should be carried away captive into Babylon.
14 And it came to pass that when my father had read and seen many great and marvelous things, he did exclaim many things unto the Lord; such as: Great and marvelous are thy works, O Lord God Almighty! Thy throne is high in the heavens, and thy power, and goodness, and mercy are over all the inhabitants of the earth; and, because thou art merciful, thou wilt not suffer those who come unto thee that they shall perish!
The Talmud in tractate Avodah Zarah states that dreams are 1/60th of a prophecy. Rumba (Maimonides or Moses Ben Maimon) in Moreh Nevuchim states that, in order to achieve the level of the prophets, one must at least speak to an angel in a dream. The highest level one can achieve within prophecy without actual involvement in the prophetic events is to rebuke the people in the name of G-d. This shows how Lehi was a prominent prophet in his time.15 And after this manner was the language of my father in the praising of his God; for his soul did rejoice, and his whole heart was filled, because of the things which he had seen, yea, which the Lord had shown unto him.
16 And now I, Nephi, do not make a full account of the things which my father hath written, for he hath written many things which he saw in visions and in dreams; and he also hath written many things which he prophesied and spake unto his children, of which I shall not make a full account.
Given that a scroll can wear out, in Judaism plates are considered to be a means in which one would only record the most sacred or precious information. To this very day Jewish prayer books are often covered by engraved plates for that very reason. An important example is the Copper Scroll from the Dead Sea Scrolls which contained the location of several treasures from the Temple of Jerusalem.17 But I shall make an account of my proceedings in my days. Behold, I make an aabridgment of the record of my father, upon plates which I have made with mine own hands; wherefore, after I have abridged the record of my dfather then will I make an account of mine own life.
Jewish tradition maintains that the Law given by G-d to Moshe was carved onto tablets of pure sapphire, the same sapphire on the flag of Israel.
18 Therefore, I would that ye should know, that after the Lord had shown so many marvelous things unto my father, Lehi, yea, concerning the destruction of Jerusalem, behold he went forth among the people, and began to prophesy and to declare unto them concerning the things which he had both seen and heard.
There's a clear word-play between גילויה (giluyah - manifestation) and גאולה (geulah - redemption). Thus Nephi seems to indicate that the manifestation of Messiah would mean the redemption of the world.19 And it came to pass that the Jews did mock him because of the things which he testified of them; for he truly testified of their wickedness and their abominations; and he testified that the things which he saw and heard, and also the things which he read in the book, manifested plainly of the coming of a Messiah, and also the redemption of the world.
It may almost go unnoticed to the reader that one of the reasons why the Jewish people of Lehi's time may have become upset is because at the time the idea of a global redemption was not yet unanimous in Judaism. Many thought that only Israel would be redeemd and the other nations would serve them.
There is an ancient Jewish proverb that is likely to have been known by Nephi which says:20 And when the Jews heard these things they were angry with him; yea, even as with the prophets of old, whom they had cast out, and stoned, and slain; and they also sought his life, that they might take it away. But behold, I, Nephi, will show unto you that the tender mercies of the Lord are over all those whom he hath chosen, because of their faith, to make them mighty even unto the power of deliverance.
"Pray to God for mercy until the last shovelful of earth is cast upon thy grave."
Nephi's words seem to be an answer to such a proverb by turning it around and stating clearly that he would not take his prayers to his grave.
Jews in some groups and as individuals are not above criticism; nor should be. Also it is a mistake to hold the State of Israel up as some sacrosanct, untouchable entity. But I think it is unfortunate that this approach is brought up in a thread started by the Rebbe where he is explicating passages from the Book of Mormon based on his Rabbinic training. I hope this type of thing hasn't been enough to make him vacate this forum.Thinker wrote: ↑March 17th, 2019, 4:44 pm Steve,
If you have a problem with something someone states - rather than call then names like “evil” why don’t you explain why they are mistaken?
It’s odd that you criticize others for “fine lumping an entire group of people into a category” yet you do so yourself in accepting incorrect prejudice, “Ashkenazi’s and that they have statistically the highest IQs of any group.”
“Ashkenazi’s” are not really Jewish - their ancestors converted in Europe & don’t practice Judaism - so they are not Jewish ethnically nor religiously. So it’s like saying some exclusive club of people hijacking the name “Jew” (but are as Jewish as any of us) are smarter - or like people of the “red shoe club” are smarter. Nonsense. . . . . . .
Unfortunately for your position, the very article you thought supports this position, does not. You might want to bone up on subjects such as mtDNA vs. Y Chromosome descent vs. autosomal DNA and what constitutes the human genome en toto.Thinker wrote: ↑April 22nd, 2019, 7:07 am Larsen,
We’ve been through this before. Even if there was some small trace of Jewish blood - it has been diluted so often throughout history that it makes it non-effect in a religion that demands a continual maternal line.
More importantly, “God is no respector of persons” and we shouldn’t lift someone up as more inherently worthy than others either.