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Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 9:27 am
by John Tavner
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 12th, 2019, 8:17 am
MMbelieve wrote: February 12th, 2019, 3:40 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:18 pm
justme wrote: February 11th, 2019, 11:17 am
I regret that I have but one like to give to this post. I would give it a thousand.
He who would be the greatest among you , will be the servant of all... we agree (I think!)

But saying they are two God's co-equal, clearly He has never said such to those who profess to had heard Him, and even ever seen Him. Making that assumption is unsupported by any of the records of the words of the Messiah EVER!!!

Sure, go ahead and teach your daughters to expect their future husbands to give themselves to them when they marry, and have a veil made for their Husband's to wear on their wedding day. Because hey it's their turn to wear the pants.

Blessed are those who are persecuted in the cause of right, for theirs is the kingdom of even. The buck stops with G_d... not His wives!!!
I thought it took a man and his wife to be god. Your acting like a man obtains this as himself?
Teach our daughters that they wear the pants and their husband will be veiled....? Where does this crazy idea come from? It seems only men ever mention things like this.

I think you underestimate the influence women have had in the ears of all men from the beginning. No man can do it alone and never has been able to. My husband can represent us in heaven as he does here, but I will not be a casual participant in heaven - considering I am able to be there.
Actually there is a Law of Opposition. Men being evil by nature (the natural man), an enemy of G_d from the beginning. Women being good by nature. Hence the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in the Garden. If a women chooses to be evil, she can out do the man hands down, because she has the power of opposition. If a man who is evil by nature chooses to be perfectly good, all things obey him and He is G_d, because of this power of opposition. Priesthood is the training wheels men are given to learn how to use the power in the Priesthood. If a man is wicked, he has no power in the Priesthood. You can say women have it, but their is no way they can use it of their own accord. They can seek Adonai or the Father to administer, and by Faith all things are possible, but they in and of themselves will never posses this power. It takes up to 999 wives to help one man arrive to G_dhood. To say there would be no G_d's without women, is ABSOLUTELY TRUE... beside the need for women to create the bodies! However to say "I thought it took a man and his wife to be god." There is NO G_d's who has only one wife, worlds without end! That Law is the one thing that keeps most women out of being married to a G_d, or even making it to heaven.

Everyone here is chattering about men and women are now equal before G_d, because an apostate Gentile Church has said so, past scriptures and revelations be damned! I was just pointing out the silliness of thinking our gender roles have reverse or that we are equal in what we have been commanded to do. Those commands given in the garden WILL stand as long as time remains! I now how tempting it is to create a G_d in our own image... those who do have that backwards!

Shalom
I don't agree with most of what you've said, but I do appreciate the thought about the tree of Good and evil.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 9:33 am
by John Tavner
If I were a prophet and felt to prophecy, I would say that the changes being made are to separate the wheat from the tares. This is not in the traditional sense. I am become more and more convinced by the day that the changes are inspired by the Lord in a round about way in order to force people out of the church[es] (we are not the only ones experiencing changes). There will come a time when the changes will be so great that the division grows greater and greater. The division will be those that seek God through revelation and humility, searching the scriptures and striving to follow the HOly Ghost and those that trust in the arm of flesh. There will come a time when the church will implode - as will many if not most other churches. This will be necessary for Zion to be created. Zion can not be created with the cultural or traditional structures that we now maintain. Thus for those who truly seek the Lord and begin to cast off the world, they will be gathered together into two literal churches in the last days - the Church of the Lamb of God or the Church of the Devil. We must be prepared and seek the Lord with broken hearts and contrite spirits praying to him continually asking for His mercy to change us through the Grace of Christ in order to be prepared when the call comes out.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 9:48 am
by oneClimbs
mike_rumble wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:03 pm
5tev3 wrote: February 11th, 2019, 2:01 pm Anyone who wishes to be followed needs to deserve it. They need to earn it the same way God earns our love and trust, not by belittling or controlling us but by longsuffering, patience, persuasion, etc. God is not selfish, he weeps over us, he does more for us than we realize or credit him for because we are blind to most of it. He is rejected and looked upon with disdain by the world like an unruly teenager views their parents or worse. .
Does God need to earn our love and trust?
This sounds very odd to me. Maybe I misunderstood?
Let me rephrase. God deserves our trust because of who he is and what he has done, is doing, and will do for us. He deserves our honor when we truly understand these things. Does God get to choose who he is and what he does or does he have no choice? I think we could agree that God loves who he is and what he stands for. God also doesn't give us everything at once, he returns blessings for obedience, he gives line upon line and in a way, you could say that he seeks to "earn" our trust through persuasion versus simply demanding it or forcing it. I hope this clarifies what I mean.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 11:02 am
by Sarah
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 12th, 2019, 8:17 am
MMbelieve wrote: February 12th, 2019, 3:40 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:18 pm
justme wrote: February 11th, 2019, 11:17 am
I regret that I have but one like to give to this post. I would give it a thousand.
He who would be the greatest among you , will be the servant of all... we agree (I think!)

But saying they are two God's co-equal, clearly He has never said such to those who profess to had heard Him, and even ever seen Him. Making that assumption is unsupported by any of the records of the words of the Messiah EVER!!!

Sure, go ahead and teach your daughters to expect their future husbands to give themselves to them when they marry, and have a veil made for their Husband's to wear on their wedding day. Because hey it's their turn to wear the pants.

Blessed are those who are persecuted in the cause of right, for theirs is the kingdom of even. The buck stops with G_d... not His wives!!!
I thought it took a man and his wife to be god. Your acting like a man obtains this as himself?
Teach our daughters that they wear the pants and their husband will be veiled....? Where does this crazy idea come from? It seems only men ever mention things like this.

I think you underestimate the influence women have had in the ears of all men from the beginning. No man can do it alone and never has been able to. My husband can represent us in heaven as he does here, but I will not be a casual participant in heaven - considering I am able to be there.
Actually there is a Law of Opposition. Men being evil by nature (the natural man), an enemy of G_d from the beginning. Women being good by nature. Hence the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in the Garden. If a women chooses to be evil, she can out do the man hands down, because she has the power of opposition. If a man who is evil by nature chooses to be perfectly good, all things obey him and He is G_d, because of this power of opposition. Priesthood is the training wheels men are given to learn how to use the power in the Priesthood. If a man is wicked, he has no power in the Priesthood. You can say women have it, but their is no way they can use it of their own accord. They can seek Adonai or the Father to administer, and by Faith all things are possible, but they in and of themselves will never posses this power. It takes up to 999 wives to help one man arrive to G_dhood. To say there would be no G_d's without women, is ABSOLUTELY TRUE... beside the need for women to create the bodies! However to say "I thought it took a man and his wife to be god." There is NO G_d's who has only one wife, worlds without end! That Law is the one thing that keeps most women out of being married to a G_d, or even making it to heaven.

Everyone here is chattering about men and women are now equal before G_d, because an apostate Gentile Church has said so, past scriptures and revelations be damned! I was just pointing out the silliness of thinking our gender roles have reverse or that we are equal in what we have been commanded to do. Those commands given in the garden WILL stand as long as time remains! I now how tempting it is to create a G_d in our own image... those who do have that backwards!

Shalom
What commands are you talking about that will remain forever? Do you think the curses will last forever too?

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 11:34 am
by Jesef
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 12th, 2019, 8:17 am
MMbelieve wrote: February 12th, 2019, 3:40 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:18 pm
justme wrote: February 11th, 2019, 11:17 am
I regret that I have but one like to give to this post. I would give it a thousand.
He who would be the greatest among you , will be the servant of all... we agree (I think!)

But saying they are two God's co-equal, clearly He has never said such to those who profess to had heard Him, and even ever seen Him. Making that assumption is unsupported by any of the records of the words of the Messiah EVER!!!

Sure, go ahead and teach your daughters to expect their future husbands to give themselves to them when they marry, and have a veil made for their Husband's to wear on their wedding day. Because hey it's their turn to wear the pants.

Blessed are those who are persecuted in the cause of right, for theirs is the kingdom of even. The buck stops with G_d... not His wives!!!
I thought it took a man and his wife to be god. Your acting like a man obtains this as himself?
Teach our daughters that they wear the pants and their husband will be veiled....? Where does this crazy idea come from? It seems only men ever mention things like this.

I think you underestimate the influence women have had in the ears of all men from the beginning. No man can do it alone and never has been able to. My husband can represent us in heaven as he does here, but I will not be a casual participant in heaven - considering I am able to be there.
Actually there is a Law of Opposition. Men being evil by nature (the natural man), an enemy of G_d from the beginning. Women being good by nature. Hence the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in the Garden. If a women chooses to be evil, she can out do the man hands down, because she has the power of opposition. If a man who is evil by nature chooses to be perfectly good, all things obey him and He is G_d, because of this power of opposition. Priesthood is the training wheels men are given to learn how to use the power in the Priesthood. If a man is wicked, he has no power in the Priesthood. You can say women have it, but their is no way they can use it of their own accord. They can seek Adonai or the Father to administer, and by Faith all things are possible, but they in and of themselves will never posses this power. It takes up to 999 wives to help one man arrive to G_dhood. To say there would be no G_d's without women, is ABSOLUTELY TRUE... beside the need for women to create the bodies! However to say "I thought it took a man and his wife to be god." There is NO G_d's who has only one wife, worlds without end! That Law is the one thing that keeps most women out of being married to a G_d, or even making it to heaven.

Everyone here is chattering about men and women are now equal before G_d, because an apostate Gentile Church has said so, past scriptures and revelations be damned! I was just pointing out the silliness of thinking our gender roles have reverse or that we are equal in what we have been commanded to do. Those commands given in the garden WILL stand as long as time remains! I now how tempting it is to create a G_d in our own image... those who do have that backwards!

Shalom
KoZ, you would be right at home in the Heterodox/Un-Orthodox/Heretic Sub-Forum I'm proposing. "An Apostate Gentile Church" (referring to the LDS/Mormon Church or tCoJCoLDS) is NOT an orthodox view.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 8:01 pm
by thisisspartaaa
The endowment is an ever changing presentation. I don't think many understand this.

If so many are upset over these changes, they should look into the changes. You used to have to wear garments all the way to the wrist and ankles...

They also removed Satan's minster preaching to the congregation and leading the group in a hymn.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 8:32 pm
by Kingdom of ZION
John Tavner wrote: February 12th, 2019, 9:27 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 12th, 2019, 8:17 am
MMbelieve wrote: February 12th, 2019, 3:40 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:18 pm

He who would be the greatest among you , will be the servant of all... we agree (I think!)

But saying they are two God's co-equal, clearly He has never said such to those who profess to had heard Him, and even ever seen Him. Making that assumption is unsupported by any of the records of the words of the Messiah EVER!!!

Sure, go ahead and teach your daughters to expect their future husbands to give themselves to them when they marry, and have a veil made for their Husband's to wear on their wedding day. Because hey it's their turn to wear the pants.

Blessed are those who are persecuted in the cause of right, for theirs is the kingdom of even. The buck stops with G_d... not His wives!!!
I thought it took a man and his wife to be god. Your acting like a man obtains this as himself?
Teach our daughters that they wear the pants and their husband will be veiled....? Where does this crazy idea come from? It seems only men ever mention things like this.

I think you underestimate the influence women have had in the ears of all men from the beginning. No man can do it alone and never has been able to. My husband can represent us in heaven as he does here, but I will not be a casual participant in heaven - considering I am able to be there.
Actually there is a Law of Opposition. Men being evil by nature (the natural man), an enemy of G_d from the beginning. Women being good by nature. Hence the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in the Garden. If a women chooses to be evil, she can out do the man hands down, because she has the power of opposition. If a man who is evil by nature chooses to be perfectly good, all things obey him and He is G_d, because of this power of opposition. Priesthood is the training wheels men are given to learn how to use the power in the Priesthood. If a man is wicked, he has no power in the Priesthood. You can say women have it, but their is no way they can use it of their own accord. They can seek Adonai or the Father to administer, and by Faith all things are possible, but they in and of themselves will never posses this power. It takes up to 999 wives to help one man arrive to G_dhood. To say there would be no G_d's without women, is ABSOLUTELY TRUE... beside the need for women to create the bodies! However to say "I thought it took a man and his wife to be god." There is NO G_d's who has only one wife, worlds without end! That Law is the one thing that keeps most women out of being married to a G_d, or even making it to heaven.

Everyone here is chattering about men and women are now equal before G_d, because an apostate Gentile Church has said so, past scriptures and revelations be damned! I was just pointing out the silliness of thinking our gender roles have reverse or that we are equal in what we have been commanded to do. Those commands given in the garden WILL stand as long as time remains! I now how tempting it is to create a G_d in our own image... those who do have that backwards!

Shalom
I don't agree with most of what you've said, but I do appreciate the thought about the tree of Good and evil.
Fair enough... as per the trees in the garden (which is an allegorical story of who where in the garden). It clearly says that, 'they partake, that men might be'. And in partaking they discovered that they were naked. Hey, folks... if you were innocent and someone told you (like the Serpent) that by having sex, you would have babies. Who is going to be all over that? Yes, Eve! And after doing such, you think they might start thinking about others they have seen, the serpent and Father all wearing cloths, and they now having lost their innocence, it would dawn upon them for the need for coverings? Yes!

Who is Tree of Life? I will tell you that it is something to do with the Living Waters, that if you partake, you shall never die. I will though out these crumbs here for those who are seekers, but I do not reveal this doctrine, as there is no revelation in any canon I could point to, to actually reveal it to another by why of what many here would say... authority.

Shalom

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 8:42 pm
by Kingdom of ZION
Sarah wrote: February 12th, 2019, 11:02 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 12th, 2019, 8:17 am
MMbelieve wrote: February 12th, 2019, 3:40 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:18 pm

He who would be the greatest among you , will be the servant of all... we agree (I think!)

But saying they are two God's co-equal, clearly He has never said such to those who profess to had heard Him, and even ever seen Him. Making that assumption is unsupported by any of the records of the words of the Messiah EVER!!!

Sure, go ahead and teach your daughters to expect their future husbands to give themselves to them when they marry, and have a veil made for their Husband's to wear on their wedding day. Because hey it's their turn to wear the pants.

Blessed are those who are persecuted in the cause of right, for theirs is the kingdom of even. The buck stops with G_d... not His wives!!!
I thought it took a man and his wife to be god. Your acting like a man obtains this as himself?
Teach our daughters that they wear the pants and their husband will be veiled....? Where does this crazy idea come from? It seems only men ever mention things like this.

I think you underestimate the influence women have had in the ears of all men from the beginning. No man can do it alone and never has been able to. My husband can represent us in heaven as he does here, but I will not be a casual participant in heaven - considering I am able to be there.
Actually there is a Law of Opposition. Men being evil by nature (the natural man), an enemy of G_d from the beginning. Women being good by nature. Hence the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in the Garden. If a women chooses to be evil, she can out do the man hands down, because she has the power of opposition. If a man who is evil by nature chooses to be perfectly good, all things obey him and He is G_d, because of this power of opposition. Priesthood is the training wheels men are given to learn how to use the power in the Priesthood. If a man is wicked, he has no power in the Priesthood. You can say women have it, but their is no way they can use it of their own accord. They can seek Adonai or the Father to administer, and by Faith all things are possible, but they in and of themselves will never posses this power. It takes up to 999 wives to help one man arrive to G_dhood. To say there would be no G_d's without women, is ABSOLUTELY TRUE... beside the need for women to create the bodies! However to say "I thought it took a man and his wife to be god." There is NO G_d's who has only one wife, worlds without end! That Law is the one thing that keeps most women out of being married to a G_d, or even making it to heaven.

Everyone here is chattering about men and women are now equal before G_d, because an apostate Gentile Church has said so, past scriptures and revelations be damned! I was just pointing out the silliness of thinking our gender roles have reverse or that we are equal in what we have been commanded to do. Those commands given in the garden WILL stand as long as time remains! I now how tempting it is to create a G_d in our own image... those who do have that backwards!

Shalom
What commands are you talking about that will remain forever? Do you think the curses will last forever too?
The cursings for partaking of the Knowledge of the Tree of Good and Evil. I called them Commandments because we are commanded to multiply and replenish the earth... that covers the women's cursing, and the man's commandment was to earn his daily bread by the sweat of his brow. Yes Father did put in obstacles like weeds and thorns for the man, and multiplying thy conception and sorrow in child bearing, for the women.

I NEVER said it will remain forever! I said it shall remain until TIME no longer exists... or in other words, the End of Time.

Shalom

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 12th, 2019, 8:47 pm
by Kingdom of ZION
Jesef wrote: February 12th, 2019, 11:34 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 12th, 2019, 8:17 am
MMbelieve wrote: February 12th, 2019, 3:40 am
Kingdom of ZION wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:18 pm

He who would be the greatest among you , will be the servant of all... we agree (I think!)

But saying they are two God's co-equal, clearly He has never said such to those who profess to had heard Him, and even ever seen Him. Making that assumption is unsupported by any of the records of the words of the Messiah EVER!!!

Sure, go ahead and teach your daughters to expect their future husbands to give themselves to them when they marry, and have a veil made for their Husband's to wear on their wedding day. Because hey it's their turn to wear the pants.

Blessed are those who are persecuted in the cause of right, for theirs is the kingdom of even. The buck stops with G_d... not His wives!!!
I thought it took a man and his wife to be god. Your acting like a man obtains this as himself?
Teach our daughters that they wear the pants and their husband will be veiled....? Where does this crazy idea come from? It seems only men ever mention things like this.

I think you underestimate the influence women have had in the ears of all men from the beginning. No man can do it alone and never has been able to. My husband can represent us in heaven as he does here, but I will not be a casual participant in heaven - considering I am able to be there.
Actually there is a Law of Opposition. Men being evil by nature (the natural man), an enemy of G_d from the beginning. Women being good by nature. Hence the tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil in the Garden. If a women chooses to be evil, she can out do the man hands down, because she has the power of opposition. If a man who is evil by nature chooses to be perfectly good, all things obey him and He is G_d, because of this power of opposition. Priesthood is the training wheels men are given to learn how to use the power in the Priesthood. If a man is wicked, he has no power in the Priesthood. You can say women have it, but their is no way they can use it of their own accord. They can seek Adonai or the Father to administer, and by Faith all things are possible, but they in and of themselves will never posses this power. It takes up to 999 wives to help one man arrive to G_dhood. To say there would be no G_d's without women, is ABSOLUTELY TRUE... beside the need for women to create the bodies! However to say "I thought it took a man and his wife to be god." There is NO G_d's who has only one wife, worlds without end! That Law is the one thing that keeps most women out of being married to a G_d, or even making it to heaven.

Everyone here is chattering about men and women are now equal before G_d, because an apostate Gentile Church has said so, past scriptures and revelations be damned! I was just pointing out the silliness of thinking our gender roles have reverse or that we are equal in what we have been commanded to do. Those commands given in the garden WILL stand as long as time remains! I now how tempting it is to create a G_d in our own image... those who do have that backwards!

Shalom
KoZ, you would be right at home in the Heterodox/Un-Orthodox/Heretic Sub-Forum I'm proposing. "An Apostate Gentile Church" (referring to the LDS/Mormon Church or tCoJCoLDS) is NOT an orthodox view.
I am anything but orthodox... I see these things as prophesied events, that have happen to every Church established by divinity from Adam on, and by their fruits we shall know them and the truth.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 13th, 2019, 10:03 am
by I AM
John Tavner wrote: February 12th, 2019, 9:33 am If I were a prophet and felt to prophecy, I would say that the changes being made are to separate the wheat from the tares. This is not in the traditional sense. I am become more and more convinced by the day that the changes are inspired by the Lord in a round about way in order to force people out of the church[es] (we are not the only ones experiencing changes). There will come a time when the changes will be so great that the division grows greater and greater. The division will be those that seek God through revelation and humility, searching the scriptures and striving to follow the HOly Ghost and those that trust in the arm of flesh. There will come a time when the church will implode - as will many if not most other churches. This will be necessary for Zion to be created. Zion can not be created with the cultural or traditional structures that we now maintain. Thus for those who truly seek the Lord and begin to cast off the world, they will be gathered together into two literal churches in the last days - the Church of the Lamb of God or the Church of the Devil. We must be prepared and seek the Lord with broken hearts and contrite spirits praying to him continually asking for His mercy to change us through the Grace of Christ in order to be prepared when the call comes out.
-------------

“After a while the Gentiles will gather to this place by the thousands, and Salt Lake will be classed among the wicked cities of the world. A spirit of speculation and extravagance will take possession of the Saints, and the result will be financial bondage.” (Heber C. Kimball, as related by Amanda H. Wilcox, May 1868; see also J. Golden Kimball, by Richards, p. 363)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
“But the time will come when the Lord will choose a people out of this people upon whom he will bestow his choicest blessings.”
(Heber C. Kimball, Des. News, Nov. 9, 1865; see J.D. 11:145)

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 13th, 2019, 12:34 pm
by Sarah
I AM wrote: February 13th, 2019, 10:03 am
John Tavner wrote: February 12th, 2019, 9:33 am If I were a prophet and felt to prophecy, I would say that the changes being made are to separate the wheat from the tares. This is not in the traditional sense. I am become more and more convinced by the day that the changes are inspired by the Lord in a round about way in order to force people out of the church[es] (we are not the only ones experiencing changes). There will come a time when the changes will be so great that the division grows greater and greater. The division will be those that seek God through revelation and humility, searching the scriptures and striving to follow the HOly Ghost and those that trust in the arm of flesh. There will come a time when the church will implode - as will many if not most other churches. This will be necessary for Zion to be created. Zion can not be created with the cultural or traditional structures that we now maintain. Thus for those who truly seek the Lord and begin to cast off the world, they will be gathered together into two literal churches in the last days - the Church of the Lamb of God or the Church of the Devil. We must be prepared and seek the Lord with broken hearts and contrite spirits praying to him continually asking for His mercy to change us through the Grace of Christ in order to be prepared when the call comes out.
-------------

“After a while the Gentiles will gather to this place by the thousands, and Salt Lake will be classed among the wicked cities of the world. A spirit of speculation and extravagance will take possession of the Saints, and the result will be financial bondage.” (Heber C. Kimball, as related by Amanda H. Wilcox, May 1868; see also J. Golden Kimball, by Richards, p. 363)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
“But the time will come when the Lord will choose a people out of this people upon whom he will bestow his choicest blessings.”
(Heber C. Kimball, Des. News, Nov. 9, 1865; see J.D. 11:145)
Right, and the prophet will lead them ;)

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 13th, 2019, 5:55 pm
by I AM
Sarah wrote: February 13th, 2019, 12:34 pm
I AM wrote: February 13th, 2019, 10:03 am
John Tavner wrote: February 12th, 2019, 9:33 am If I were a prophet and felt to prophecy, I would say that the changes being made are to separate the wheat from the tares. This is not in the traditional sense. I am become more and more convinced by the day that the changes are inspired by the Lord in a round about way in order to force people out of the church[es] (we are not the only ones experiencing changes). There will come a time when the changes will be so great that the division grows greater and greater. The division will be those that seek God through revelation and humility, searching the scriptures and striving to follow the HOly Ghost and those that trust in the arm of flesh. There will come a time when the church will implode - as will many if not most other churches. This will be necessary for Zion to be created. Zion can not be created with the cultural or traditional structures that we now maintain. Thus for those who truly seek the Lord and begin to cast off the world, they will be gathered together into two literal churches in the last days - the Church of the Lamb of God or the Church of the Devil. We must be prepared and seek the Lord with broken hearts and contrite spirits praying to him continually asking for His mercy to change us through the Grace of Christ in order to be prepared when the call comes out.
-------------

“After a while the Gentiles will gather to this place by the thousands, and Salt Lake will be classed among the wicked cities of the world. A spirit of speculation and extravagance will take possession of the Saints, and the result will be financial bondage.” (Heber C. Kimball, as related by Amanda H. Wilcox, May 1868; see also J. Golden Kimball, by Richards, p. 363)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
“But the time will come when the Lord will choose a people out of this people upon whom he will bestow his choicest blessings.”
(Heber C. Kimball, Des. News, Nov. 9, 1865; see J.D. 11:145)
Right, and the prophet will lead them ;)
---------------
"A" prophet will lead them.
which will NOT be the prophet of the church.
It is the Lord's end-time servant, the Davidic King
that has been prophesied in Isaiah and in our scriptures that will come.
I have posted endless info. about him in this forum
Start reading Isaiah as the Lord has commanded.
here are just a few scriptures.
I searched for "servant"
The search will show both servants,
the one represents Christ - the other, is the Anti-christ.
The one who personifies Christ - is the Davidic King.

Davidic Servant—An end-time descendant of David who restores Israel and acts as forerunner of Jehovah’s coming to reign on the earth.
http://www.isaiahexplained.com/search/servant
http://www.isaiahexplained.com/42#commentary
http://www.isaiahexplained.com/49#commentary

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 13th, 2019, 7:20 pm
by I AM
also he will completely restore The House of Israel.

The complete division between the righteous and the wicked will come with
the Lord's end-time servant.

2 Nephi 30
These verses are from Isaiah and are talking about the Lord's end-time servant.
The Davidic servant - marred servant.
Righteousness, rod, mouth, sword, arrow, breath and lips, arm, hand or ensign
are all metaphors for Jehovah’s end-time servant.


9 And with righteousness shall the Lord God judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth. And he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth; and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked.
10 For the time speedily cometh that the Lord God shall cause a great division among the people, and the wicked will he destroy; and he will spare his people, yea, even if it so be that he must destroy the wicked by fire.
11 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.
12 And then shall the wolf dwell with the lamb; and the leopard shall lie down with the kid, and the calf, and the young lion, and the fatling, together; and a little child shall lead them.


Isaiah 11

3 His intuition will be guided
by the fear of Jehovah;
he will not judge by what his eyes see,
nor establish proof by what his ears hear.
4 He will judge the poor with righteousness,
and with equity arbitrate for the lowly in the land;
he will smite the earth with the rod of his mouth
and with the breath of his lips slay the wicked.
5 Righteousness will be as a band about his waist,
faithfulness a girdle round his loins.

Although Jehovah’s servant is still the subject of the passage, in the context of Jehovah’s millennial reign of peace (vv 2-9) several candidates exist for those who “judge.” First is Israel’s God: “Jehovah is our Judge, and Jehovah our Lawgiver” (Isaiah 33:22). Second is Jehovah’s servant: “In loving kindness shall a throne be set up in the abode of David, and in faithfulness a judge sit on it who will maintain justice and expedite righteousness” (Isaiah 16:5). And third are Jehovah’s millennial judges: “I will restore your judges as at the first, and your counselors as in the beginning” (Isaiah 1:26).

Because the servant is a forerunner to Jehovah’s coming to reign on the earth, the roles of Jehovah and his servant are closely intertwined. Their judging the nations is therefore likewise intertwined. Isaiah compares them to two arms—righteousness and salvation—who judge the peoples: “My righteousness shall be at hand and my salvation proceed; my arms shall judge the peoples” (Isaiah 51:5; emphasis added). In short, Jehovah’s arm of righteousness—his servant (Isaiah 41:2; 46:11-13)—prepares the way before the arm of salvation, who is Jehovah (Isaiah 33:2; 40:10-11; 46:13; 62:10-11).

He will judge. Because of many parallel roles of Jehovah and his servant, the subject of the above passage may switch back and forth between the two. On one level, for example, the servant—unlike the reprobate judges of Jehovah’s people—judges the people “with righteousness” or “righteously” (besedeq). On another level, Jehovah judges the people “with righteousness” (besedeq)—that is, through his servant who personifies “righteousness” (Isaiah 41:2; 46:11-13). As the servant emulates Jehovah in ministering justice, moreover (Isaiah 9:6-7; 42:1-4), so others who judge emulate the servant.

He will smite. Multiple applications of the above passage similarly apply to the terms “rod,” “mouth,” “breath,” and “lips.” On the one hand, Jehovah’s servant—his rod, mouth, breath, and lips (Isaiah 48:3; 49:2; 51:16; 57:18-19; 62:1-2)—is its subject. On the other, Jehovah is its subject in the sense that he appoints the servant as his instrument of punishment and deliverance. On a third, possible level, the king of Assyria/Babylon—Jehovah’s rod, mouth, breath, and lips (Isaiah 9:4, 12; 10:5, 15; 30:27-28; 33:11-12; 59:3)—is its subject when Jehovah appoints him as his instrument of punishment.

His intuition will be [guided] by the fear of Jehovah. Like Israel’s God, his exemplar, Jehovah’s servant knows intuitively the justice or injustice of the cases he judges. Imbued with Jehovah’s Spirit and the fear of Jehovah (v 2)—having followed his counsel to “sanctify Jehovah of Hosts, making him your fear, him your awe” (Isaiah 8:13)—he is equal to the task. As Moses judged Jehovah’s people, but also appointed additional judges to judge them (Exodus 18:19-26), so the servant and other judges arbitrate equitably for the poor and lowly in the land (Isaiah 16:4-5; 28:5-6; 32:1; 42:1-4; 60:17-18).


avraham-gileadi-davidic-servant/

The Gentiles, will harm and mar this Servant. On account of this, even as the Davidic Servant will be "marred",
he will be completely healed by the LORD.
This healing might involve him being "translated" and also his receiving of his "Calling and Election made sure".
This healing will be truly miraculous for all to see.

The Davidic King will prepare the way for Christ's return.

The Davidic King will have a three-year ministry that reaches to the world and warns the entire world of what is to come.
Similarly, the 144,000 and also the ANGELS will gather the righteous from throughout the world.
But the tribulations of that day will probably have begun before the Davidic King's official ministry to the World has started.

We Gentiles, and also the entire World, will have two choices when the Davidic King arrives:
we will either

(1) harden our hearts to our own condemnation and destruction; or else

(2) we will repent and prepare to join Zion.

There will be a complete division between the righteous and the wicked in that day.



The Great and Marvelous Work will probably not begin until the Davidic King's three-year official ministry starts.
We have not seen the "Great and Marvelous Work", yet; .
This event is still future and it will be incredible. Among other things, the Davidic King will completely restore The House of Israel.

Avraham Gileadi
Isaiah 32
www.isaiahexplained.com/32#commentary

9 Up, and listen to my voice, O complacent women;

you careless daughters, hear my words!

10 In little more than a year

you shall be in anguish, O carefree ones,

for when the harvest is over,

the produce shall fail to arrive.

Not only the men but also the women of Jehovah’s people come under Jehovah’s censure.
Their being spiritually and physically “complacent” and “carefree” in the face of his impending judgments leaves them unprepared and exposed to the evil time.
With another year left of Jehovah’s three-year warning before Assyria’s assault (cf. Isaiah 16:14; 20:3),
Jehovah’s voice—his servant—alerts them to the coming time of scarcity.
Like Lot’s wife, who couldn’t imagine sudden destruction falling upon her city that had been there for centuries
(Genesis 19:26), they too stand to perish (Isaiah 3:16-26).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Although Isaiah is already in a state of mourning because of the wickedness of Jehovah’s people and Assyria’s aggressiveness,
Jehovah now asks him to go naked and barefoot as a “sign and portent” against Egypt and Cush (cf. Isaiah 8:18).
Exposing himself to the elements and to people’s mockery, Isaiah—“my servant”—obeys.

As a type of Jehovah’s end-time servant, Isaiah gives warning of Assyria’s invasion of Egypt and Cush (Upper Egypt)
and of the humiliation of their captives.
They have three years in which to repent before three years of Jehovah’s Day of Judgment overtake them (cf. Isaiah 16:14).

Isaiah 16

13 These things Jehovah spoke hitherto about Moab.

14 But now Jehovah has said, Within three years, as the term of a lease, Moab’s glory shall become ignominy.
For all its large populace there shall be very few left, and those of no account.

Moab’s three-year lease of time in which to mend its ways applies to Greater Babylon in general.
In his long-suffering, Jehovah sends the world three years of warning through his servant before his Day of Judgment commences (Isaiah 20:1-6).
Then, in a long-awaited reversal of circumstances, Greater Babylon’s glory turns to ignominy while Zion’s ignominy turns to glory (Isaiah 47:1; 52:1-3).
Although Greater Babylon comprises a majority of the world’s population, it boasts of no righteous surviving remnant (Isaiah 13:19; 14:22; 21:9).
The few souls of Moab who remain alive aren’t noteworthy.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 8:49 pm
captainfearnot wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:04 am
[email protected] wrote: February 10th, 2019, 11:09 pm This is what I'm talking about with authority being undermined by having two co-equal individuals running a home, it makes no sense. Another way to look at it, can a company or business have two CEOs? Can a country have two Kings or two Presidents? No. The way that has always made sense to me is if the home were a company or corporation the mother would be the CEO and the father the Chairman of the Board of Directors. The CEO manages the day to day tasks and empoyees (children so to speak) of the organization but the highest authority is the Chairman of the Board. Just some of my thoughts.
Some companies do have two CEOs, and some governments are run by more than one head of state. I always get a kick out of how many Mormons automatically associate family life with corporate structure, though.

Image
Pretty much all those companies and nations you reference, despite the fact they may officially have two CEOs or two heads of state, virtually all have only one individual as the defacto highest authority. Example, Oracle may have two CEOs but there is only one Chairman of the Board of Directors (the true highest ranking individual in any publicly traded corporation).

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 8:59 pm
Jesef wrote: February 11th, 2019, 11:09 am
Serragon wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:59 am Enlightening posts in this thread. It is becoming clearer to me why the change was made. It seems that many sisters posting in this thread are not interested in true doctrine, but want instead a version that is more palatable to their modern sensibilities. I expect this from the feminists, but am sad to see it from the mainstream.

It seems that the propensity for Eve to be soothed by the tongue of the serpent is no less true today than it was in the garden.
Unless the scriptures were biased by male patriarchy & not by God. The story was written by the victors/men. Women have been subjugated for thousands of years - doesn’t mean that originated with God. I think equal is truer & more reflective, not less, of eternity. I’m male, just to be clear.
This you are viewing scripture and biblical history through 20th Century cultural marxist norms with that comment. The bible spans many centuries and cultures and has been translated in hundreds, possibly thousands of languages yet it remains surpringly consistent accross time and language barriers. Even other religions outside Christianity have similar views on gender relations (Jews, and Muslims). Yet you want to assume the writers and translators of scripture were biased and you/we today are objective?

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 9:04 pm
by captainfearnot
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 8:49 pm Pretty much all those companies and nations you reference, despite the fact they may officially have two CEOs or two heads of state, virtually all have only one individual as the defacto highest authority. Example, Oracle may have two CEOs but there is only one Chairman of the Board of Directors (the true highest ranking individual in any publicly traded corporation).
I don't think you could come up with a better example of No True Scotsman if you tried.

"Can a company have two CEOs? No."

"Here are several companies with two CEOs."

"Yeah, but can a company have two true CEOs? No."

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 9:11 pm
by Jesef
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 8:59 pm
Jesef wrote: February 11th, 2019, 11:09 am
Serragon wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:59 am Enlightening posts in this thread. It is becoming clearer to me why the change was made. It seems that many sisters posting in this thread are not interested in true doctrine, but want instead a version that is more palatable to their modern sensibilities. I expect this from the feminists, but am sad to see it from the mainstream.

It seems that the propensity for Eve to be soothed by the tongue of the serpent is no less true today than it was in the garden.
Unless the scriptures were biased by male patriarchy & not by God. The story was written by the victors/men. Women have been subjugated for thousands of years - doesn’t mean that originated with God. I think equal is truer & more reflective, not less, of eternity. I’m male, just to be clear.
This you are viewing scripture and biblical history through 20th Century cultural marxist norms with that comment. The bible spans many centuries and cultures and has been translated in hundreds, possibly thousands of languages yet it remains surpringly consistent accross time and language barriers. Even other religions outside Christianity have similar views on gender relations (Jews, and Muslims). Yet you want to assume the writers and translators of scripture were biased and you/we today are objective?
Uh, not quite, I think all of society, culture, & history has perpetuated patriarchy - not just writers & translators of scripture. It's pretty obvious from almost all of history. Queens/Matriarchies being the clear minority overall. The Biblical cultures, like Israel, were mostly patriarchies.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 9:26 pm
Jesef wrote: February 14th, 2019, 9:11 pm
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 8:59 pm
Jesef wrote: February 11th, 2019, 11:09 am
Serragon wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:59 am Enlightening posts in this thread. It is becoming clearer to me why the change was made. It seems that many sisters posting in this thread are not interested in true doctrine, but want instead a version that is more palatable to their modern sensibilities. I expect this from the feminists, but am sad to see it from the mainstream.

It seems that the propensity for Eve to be soothed by the tongue of the serpent is no less true today than it was in the garden.
Unless the scriptures were biased by male patriarchy & not by God. The story was written by the victors/men. Women have been subjugated for thousands of years - doesn’t mean that originated with God. I think equal is truer & more reflective, not less, of eternity. I’m male, just to be clear.
This you are viewing scripture and biblical history through 20th Century cultural marxist norms with that comment. The bible spans many centuries and cultures and has been translated in hundreds, possibly thousands of languages yet it remains surpringly consistent accross time and language barriers. Even other religions outside Christianity have similar views on gender relations (Jews, and Muslims). Yet you want to assume the writers and translators of scripture were biased and you/we today are objective?
Uh, not quite, I think all of society, culture, & history has perpetuated patriarchy - not just writers & translators of scripture. It's pretty obvious from almost all of history. Queens/Matriarchies being the clear minority overall. The Biblical cultures, like Israel, were mostly patriarchies.
Perhaps but "perpetuating patriarchy" is not objectively a negative thing unless viewed through the prism of modern cultural marxism. So the attitude of of "oh the scriptures were all written by sexist and misogynist men so they didn't really know what they were talking about" is consistent and understandable with someone who is an athiest, agnostic or Episcopalian but is mind boggling when coming from someone who professes to be a devout Christian or LDS/Mormon. I will never understand that kind of cognitive dissonance.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 9:33 pm
by Jesef
Cultural marxism? Huh? I don't think so.

There's no cognitive dissonance, not anymore. I've resolved to accept reality, not just idealistic or spiritual fantasy. As such, I acknowledge that the "scriptures" are very likely wrong about many things, & that they were affected by the imperfect/mortal biases of the prophets & writers & translators who produced them. What is culturally Marxist about that?

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 9:38 pm
captainfearnot wrote: February 14th, 2019, 9:04 pm
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 8:49 pm Pretty much all those companies and nations you reference, despite the fact they may officially have two CEOs or two heads of state, virtually all have only one individual as the defacto highest authority. Example, Oracle may have two CEOs but there is only one Chairman of the Board of Directors (the true highest ranking individual in any publicly traded corporation).
I don't think you could come up with a better example of No True Scotsman if you tried.

"Can a company have two CEOs? No."

"Here are several companies with two CEOs."

"Yeah, but can a company have two true CEOs? No."
I used "CEO" as just a example, the actual names and titles of individuals who hold power/authority in those orgaizations is irrelevant, the point still stands. There may always be exceptions to the rule but the fact is you aren't going to find hardly any organizations that don't have one, and only one, offical or defacto individual with the most power/authority. And maybe me using "CEO" specifically as an example was an error since the Chairman of the Board (or majority shareholder) out ranks the CEO (unless they happen to be the same person).

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 10:18 pm
Jesef wrote: February 14th, 2019, 9:33 pm Cultural marxism? Huh? I don't think so.

There's no cognitive dissonance, not anymore. I've resolved to accept reality, not just idealistic or spiritual fantasy. As such, I acknowledge that the "scriptures" are very likely wrong about many things, & that they were affected by the imperfect/mortal biases of the prophets & writers & translators who produced them. What is culturally Marxist about that?
So, are you an agnostic or athiest? Because that is how these comments appear to paint you. I wouldn't be offended or otherwise bothered if you were but it does strike me as incredibly inconsistent if coming from a self-identified Mormon.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 10:37 pm
by Jesef
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 10:18 pm
Jesef wrote: February 14th, 2019, 9:33 pm Cultural marxism? Huh? I don't think so.

There's no cognitive dissonance, not anymore. I've resolved to accept reality, not just idealistic or spiritual fantasy. As such, I acknowledge that the "scriptures" are very likely wrong about many things, & that they were affected by the imperfect/mortal biases of the prophets & writers & translators who produced them. What is culturally Marxist about that?
So, are you an agnostic or athiest? Because that is how these comments appear to paint you. I wouldn't be offended or otherwise bothered if you were but it does strike me as incredibly inconsistent if coming from a self-identified Mormon.
Man, you really seem to want to label me & put me in a box.

No & no. I’m more of a universalist zen Mormon with open-minded skepticism & tons of spiritual experience to boot. Don’t try to figure it out.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 10:53 pm
Jesef wrote: February 14th, 2019, 10:37 pm
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 10:18 pm
Jesef wrote: February 14th, 2019, 9:33 pm Cultural marxism? Huh? I don't think so.

There's no cognitive dissonance, not anymore. I've resolved to accept reality, not just idealistic or spiritual fantasy. As such, I acknowledge that the "scriptures" are very likely wrong about many things, & that they were affected by the imperfect/mortal biases of the prophets & writers & translators who produced them. What is culturally Marxist about that?
So, are you an agnostic or athiest? Because that is how these comments appear to paint you. I wouldn't be offended or otherwise bothered if you were but it does strike me as incredibly inconsistent if coming from a self-identified Mormon.
Man, you really seem to want to label me & put me in a box.

No & no. I’m more of a universalist zen Mormon with open-minded skepticism & tons of spiritual experience to boot. Don’t try to figure it out.
I don't mean to put you in a box. I'm sorry, its just odd to me and I have trouble understanding it. Kind of like feminist muslims, I just don't get it and maybe it's my fault.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 14th, 2019, 11:07 pm
by Jesef
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 10:53 pm
Jesef wrote: February 14th, 2019, 10:37 pm
[email protected] wrote: February 14th, 2019, 10:18 pm
Jesef wrote: February 14th, 2019, 9:33 pm Cultural marxism? Huh? I don't think so.

There's no cognitive dissonance, not anymore. I've resolved to accept reality, not just idealistic or spiritual fantasy. As such, I acknowledge that the "scriptures" are very likely wrong about many things, & that they were affected by the imperfect/mortal biases of the prophets & writers & translators who produced them. What is culturally Marxist about that?
So, are you an agnostic or athiest? Because that is how these comments appear to paint you. I wouldn't be offended or otherwise bothered if you were but it does strike me as incredibly inconsistent if coming from a self-identified Mormon.
Man, you really seem to want to label me & put me in a box.

No & no. I’m more of a universalist zen Mormon with open-minded skepticism & tons of spiritual experience to boot. Don’t try to figure it out.
I don't mean to put you in a box. I'm sorry, its just odd to me and I have trouble understanding it. Kind of like feminist muslims, I just don't get it and maybe it's my fault.
No worries. Sometimes I don’t understand myself. I’m not a feminist. Just trying to understand history & what I observe. Reality is truth. Women seem ruled over by men, predominantly, throughout history, for the most part. Occasionally, royalty gave them an edge over males. But other times they were treated like property, or subjects, lesser rights, less power, less influence, & thus more vulnerable to abuse (not unlike children to authority figures/adults). I’m not saying the whole system of patriarchy is evil. I’m just saying that idealistically, moral equality is better. I don’t think that’s feminist. I’m pro freedom. Women being free choose & live as they wish, as any man would, for example. If they want to be a professional & become a CEO & they can earn their way to that, great. If they want to be a stay at home pioneer mother of 12, go for it. All human beings should be free & safe. Peace & Love for all. I hope that helps.

Re: I am bothered by recent Temple Endowment changes.

Posted: February 15th, 2019, 12:00 am
MMbelieve wrote: February 11th, 2019, 10:21 am
[email protected] wrote: February 10th, 2019, 11:09 pm
Sarah wrote: February 10th, 2019, 10:33 pm Do you think Heavenly Father is concerned about Heavenly Mother obeying him? When Adam and Eve were married in the GofE, did HF tell Eve her role was to obey Adam?
Well...yes? How can Heavenly Father BE Heavenly Father if his own spouse doesn't obey him and he doesn't care? This is what I'm talking about with authority being undermined by having two co-equal individuals running a home, it makes no sense. Another way to look at it, can a company or business have two CEOs? Can a country have two Kings or two Presidents? No. The way that has always made sense to me is if the home were a company or corporation the mother would be the CEO and the father the Chairman of the Board of Directors. The CEO manages the day to day tasks and empoyees (children so to speak) of the organization but the highest authority is the Chairman of the Board. Just some of my thoughts. Also I don't believe in a matriarcy (neither did Bruce R. McConkie) in fact a patriarchy and matriarchy are mutually exclusive. One of God the other is not. Equality as we understand it today is a modern 20th and 21st century notion derived from cultural marxism as taught in our western academic institutions and reinforced in western literature and media going back to roughly the 1930s. It is not of God but I am convinced this is source of much of the "hurtful feelings" with regard to the pre-2019 Temple Endowment ceremony.
Your viewing this whole thing as power. Sorry, but your way off.
FYI, there is no patriarch without a matriarch.

Heavenly father and Heavenly mother are Gods together, he is no God without her ALSO being a God. He is not a God over her, she already has one of those and will not have 2 Gods. What your not seeing is that once people become truly one and perfected and exalted there is zero need to rule OVER someone else who has obtained this WITH you, not despite of you or because of you.

To insinuate that women are to be eternally ruled over and never be free to think or be or act on her own merit then your asking for a host of problems. Its as bad as saying women are perpetually pregnant for eternity placed in Harems of the “gods”.

I suggest you stop thinking you have an ounce of power over your wife. You are to serve her if you want to be more accurate about it, not rule over her as her father.
No its not about power perse so much as its about authority. I am told I am responsible for my family, if my family fails, falls apart, if my kids or wife go astray it will be MY fault...at least to a certain extent. This is what I was taught. If this is true then I have to be able to exercise some authority in certain spirtual and family matters otherwise that just makes me a slave and I will not be a slave. If you were given responsibility for a farm and all the food it produces but given no authority over how its run or shared authority with someone that doesn't have the same responsibility or accountability for the success of that farm that then would make YOU the subordinate slave. I don't know where you get this idea that you can't have a Patriarch without a matriarch, in fact the two are usually mutually exclusive. Do we have Stake Matriarchs? Do we gave Matriarchial blessings? We do not. We do have a division of labor along gender lines in the church, we have men in charge of authoritative, executive and administrative tasks in the church, and we women serving the support roles for those tasks. Its worked fine for thousands of years accross the globe until third wave feminism took hold and told us it was supposedly bad.

Ultimately though, nobody has anymore authority over you than you allow. Not husbands, Bishops, Prophets, Popes, Kings, Presidents, Prime Ministers or even God himself. You and I like every man and woman have our own free agency. That is supreme. But if we want to reap the benefits of certain institutions we have to be willing to defer to the authority of others. When we no longer see a benefit from our participation we can cease our participation and leave. That is an option EVERYONE has.