The tide is turning...

[Serragon]

We know that homosexuality is against the plan because it produces no offspring and does not join male and female into one.
If Christ was walking the streets today, I do wonder how he would address homosexuals in the church and their family members. Would he cast them off or tell them to come unto him and sin no more? Is the church being politically correct only? Or also compassionate towards an extremely pervasive problem inflicting too many families? I see the church as very strong on the marriage and gender arena and clear as to what is condoned and accepted and ideal to obtain in this life where possible.

My question (because I’m not involved in homosexuality or have immediate family that is) is why members of the church refuse to marry just because they are not physically turned on by the opposite sex. I have heard too many stories/examples of members coming out as gay after years of marriage and children. So it’s possible to create a family and not be denied children and companionship just because of homosexuality.
Not too much different than heterosexual marriages where the lust and physical attraction naturally declines overtime. I do not see why homosexuals need to suffer without a family and children in this life. But maybe I just don’t get the whole thing and don’t know what I’m talking about.

The homosexual allies in the Church will tell you that family and offspring are totally possible with adoption, surrogacy, and IVF. They teach that these possibilities that make it possible for every gay couple who want children to have them is why GOD placed so many gay kids into LDS families -- so the Church will seek for revelation and further light and knowledge that homosexuality is righteous, and will be part of the Celestial Kingdom.
Yes. They are teaching this, in classrooms, at firesides, and on podcasts.

I have heard nothing of the sort. How exactly is this being preached in classrooms and firesides? Is there seriously no one in the entire room with any conviction of right and wrong to stand up and keep things correct? If this is being taught in the church by church leaders then they need to be reported and removed. That simple. If it’s random noise from random members in random places...who gives a care. People will always have their “own opinions” when they go against the commandments to make themselves feel better. Happens constantly, everywhere. I do not worry about the noise but I would 100% put a stop to crap being preached anywhere in the church building.

There ARE a few left that would stand up. My husband is one of those. He won't even refer to homosexuals as "gay". He either calls them homosexuals, queers or perverts. In one sunday school class, he said that gay meant happy, and to think about what it was these people do to get "happy". He then said, Now go enjoy your lunch. He made the classroom feel quite uncomfortable, but I think it's a bluntness that is desperately needed.

If and when the meetings start going in the direction of justifying the perversion, then our family will walk. Plain and simple. It's already getting to the point of getting too close to the edge.

Separating the action from the word has been the homosexual activists greatest trick.

When you are told it is all about love, it is easy to feel empathy. When you realize what acts are actually occurring, it is easy to realize it is simply a perverted fetish.

It is important to remind people that it isn't about love at all, it is about sexual perversion. You can love someone of the same gender without being homosexual. We all have those relationships with parents, siblings, and close friends. Homosexuality necessarily includes perverted sex and should not be tolerated in any way, shape, or form.

[Thinker]

The goose is cooked, the Church has most certainly embraced the gay culture in order to be politically correct. Just knowing that the Washington DC gay men’s choir is performing on Temple grounds is disgusting and should merit a revolt amongst members, but nope......

They seek worldly praise. Who is willing to not just speak words but back them up with action? It is ridiculous how they cater to popular sin.

[Sunain]

The goose is cooked, the Church has most certainly embraced the gay culture in order to be politically correct. Just knowing that the Washington DC gay men’s choir is performing on Temple grounds is disgusting and should merit a revolt amongst members, but nope......
Acceptance is coming, most likely in my lifetime, Pathetic and sad to witness, but the kool aide drinkers will choke it down.

Okay. Where can I literally send an expedited letter to the First Presidency about this?

The reason there isn't a revolt is because I don't think many members of the church know about it.

This is absolutely UNACCEPTABLE for The Church of Jesus Christ to allow this to occur on Temple grounds.

This was the first time I'd heard about this performance and this sickens me to the point of being ill hearing about this performance.

https://www.eventbrite.com/e/gay-mens-c ... 4633806725

This needs to be a separate topic on the forum so people know about it!

[Lizzy60]

The goose is cooked, the Church has most certainly embraced the gay culture in order to be politically correct. Just knowing that the Washington DC gay men’s choir is performing on Temple grounds is disgusting and should merit a revolt amongst members, but nope......
Acceptance is coming, most likely in my lifetime, Pathetic and sad to witness, but the kool aide drinkers will choke it down.

Okay. Where can I literally send an expedited letter to the First Presidency about this?

The reason there isn't a revolt is because I don't think many members of the church know about it.

This is absolutely UNACCEPTABLE for The Church of Jesus Christ to allow this to occur on Temple grounds.

This was the first time I'd heard about this performance and this sickens me to the point of being ill hearing about this performance.

https://www.eventbrite.com/e/gay-mens-c ... 4633806725

This needs to be a separate topic on the forum so people know about it!

Also, according to a conversation about this event on Mormons Building Bridges, it was the Visitor's Center who extended the invitation, and the Homosexual's Choir debated on whether or not to accept, since the Church doesn't support homosexual marriage. They accepted because they felt the invitation was an attempt to move the church closer to their viewpoint.

We discussed this event in this thread (buried, I know).

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=50680&p=977490&hili ... ir#p977490

One of our forum members called the DC temple visitors canter and verified the fact the gay men's choir was singing there, as it is almost unbelievable.

[EmmaLee]

The goose is cooked, the Church has most certainly embraced the gay culture in order to be politically correct. Just knowing that the Washington DC gay men’s choir is performing on Temple grounds is disgusting and should merit a revolt amongst members, but nope......
Acceptance is coming, most likely in my lifetime, Pathetic and sad to witness, but the kool aide drinkers will choke it down.

Okay. Where can I literally send an expedited letter to the First Presidency about this?

The reason there isn't a revolt is because I don't think many members of the church know about it.

This is absolutely UNACCEPTABLE for The Church of Jesus Christ to allow this to occur on Temple grounds.

This was the first time I'd heard about this performance and this sickens me to the point of being ill hearing about this performance.

https://www.eventbrite.com/e/gay-mens-c ... 4633806725

This needs to be a separate topic on the forum so people know about it!

Also, according to a conversation about this event on Mormons Building Bridges, it was the Visitor's Center who extended the invitation, and the Homosexual's Choir debated on whether or not to accept, since the Church doesn't support homosexual marriage. They accepted because they felt the invitation was an attempt to move the church closer to their viewpoint.

We discussed this event in this thread (buried, I know).

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=50680&p=977490&hili ... ir#p977490

One of our forum members called the DC temple visitors canter and verified the fact the gay men's choir was singing there, as it is almost unbelievable.

The First Presidency could easily put the kabosh on this if they wanted to. The temples and visitor's centers are private property owned by the Corporation of the President, i.e. Nelson, and he could say no and that would be the end of it. As far as I'm aware, he has not said no, and so the concert (and who knows what else...) will occur on dedicated Church property.

[Sunain]

The First Presidency could easily put the kabosh on this if they wanted to. The temples and visitor's centers are private property owned by the Corporation of the President, i.e. Nelson, and he could say no and that would be the end of it. As far as I'm aware, he has not said no, and so the concert (and who knows what else...) will occur on dedicated Church property.

They don't want to hear from us peons. This really, really disturbs me. I'm sure that as many of us here are very disturbed by this, the Lord can't be too pleased either. What is the most concerning is that the leaders must be aware of this and as you say, don't seem to mind.

[oklds]

[quote=Serragon post_id=983611 time=1575266821 user_id=8270]
[quote=tdj post_id=983479 time=1575226231 user_id=10892]
[quote=MMbelieve post_id=983394 time=1575186026 user_id=10428]
[quote=Lizzy60 post_id=983370 time=1575162826 user_id=5597]


The homosexual allies in the Church will tell you that family and offspring are totally possible with adoption, surrogacy, and IVF. They teach that these possibilities that make it possible for every gay couple who want children to have them is why GOD placed so many gay kids into LDS families -- so the Church will seek for revelation and further light and knowledge that homosexuality is righteous, and will be part of the Celestial Kingdom.
Yes. They are teaching this, in classrooms, at firesides, and on podcasts.
[/quote]

I have heard nothing of the sort. How exactly is this being preached in classrooms and firesides? Is there seriously no one in the entire room with any conviction of right and wrong to stand up and keep things correct? If this is being taught in the church by church leaders then they need to be reported and removed. That simple. If it’s random noise from random members in random places...who gives a care. People will always have their “own opinions” when they go against the commandments to make themselves feel better. Happens constantly, everywhere. I do not worry about the noise but I would 100% put a stop to crap being preached anywhere in the church building.
[/quote]

There ARE a few left that would stand up. My husband is one of those. He won't even refer to homosexuals as "gay". He either calls them homosexuals, queers or perverts. In one sunday school class, he said that gay meant happy, and to think about what it was these people do to get "happy". He then said, Now go enjoy your lunch. He made the classroom feel quite uncomfortable, but I think it's a bluntness that is desperately needed.

If and when the meetings start going in the direction of justifying the perversion, then our family will walk. Plain and simple. It's already getting to the point of getting too close to the edge.
[/quote]

Separating the action from the word has been the homosexual activists greatest trick.

When you are told it is all about love, it is easy to feel empathy. When you realize what acts are actually occurring, it is easy to realize it is simply a perverted fetish.

It is important to remind people that it isn't about love at all, it is about sexual perversion. You can love someone of the same gender without being homosexual. We all have those relationships with parents, siblings, and close friends. Homosexuality necessarily includes perverted sex and should not be tolerated in any way, shape, or form.
[/quote]

In the Military, we have a name for people like you: CORRECT!!

[Michael Sherwin]

We are living under the mystery of iniquity. Nothing is perfect. Nothing is pure in God's sight. No one is "good" but the Father in heaven. The Church says to get a temple pass one must live up to a certain standard. That standard is of men. Under God's standard none of us is "good" enough for temple service. Who among the LDS practice keeping God's law like the Levites did to qualify for temple service? None!

Ask a thousand Christians if sex is pure in marriage and there will most likely be a thousand yeses. But that is not true. The Bible teaches that it is a necessary evil that is not counted as sin. And even then sex between married couples is not to be engaged in wantonly and without limit.

13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

Sex in marriage is honorable but that is not the same as being pure in God's sight. It means that God makes an exception in marriage because in this impure creation it is a necessary evil.

God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah not because they were gay. God's anger was kindled because some of them were rapist trying to force themselves upon the men that God had sent. Still God would have spared them had he found even ten righteous among them. Being gay does not equal being unrighteous. Being gay is an artifact of this impure creation. It exist because the mystery of iniquity is at work. We all need to be redeemed from ALL iniquity. To separate being gay into its own category of being iniquitous is a meaningless division. All iniquity is the same.

This world is twice removed from the Garden World. There was the Garden world (celestial), the pre flood world (terrestrial) and this world (telestial). At the resurrection of the dead man will once again be on the pre flood world. Jesus comes to this present world only in the clouds at the time of the resurrection/gathering. His second coming will be to the next world that is like the pre flood world.

24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

This is when the Angel of the Lord will preach the Gospel to every living soul. This is the time of the unpardonable sin which is blasphemy against the Angel of the Lord which is the Holy Ghost, God's Spirit. Remember, before the flood God's Spirit did strive with man. After the resurrection on the new earth God's Spirit will once again strive with man.

I hope that this puts the "gay question" in a better perspective.

[Luke]

I think you are concerned that the Church will change, I don't see that happening.

This didn't age well

[RocknRoll]

The Church says to get a temple pass one must live up to a certain standard. That standard is of men.

How do you know “that standard is of men”? Sounds like your opinion, and I disagree.

Under God's standard none of us is "good" enough for temple service. Who among the LDS practice keeping God's law like the Levites did to qualify for temple service? None!

We are not required to obey the Levitical law in this day. Why do you believe we are? Do you?

Ask a thousand Christians if sex is pure in marriage and there will most likely be a thousand yeses. But that is not true. The Bible teaches that it is a necessary evil that is not counted as sin.

I don’t believe in a God that would create something evil then require us to participate in it. ("Multiply and replenish the earth"). Again, this is your opinion, and it’s misguided (in my opinion).

And even then sex between married couples is not to be engaged in wantonly and without limit.
13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

Where are you getting this, because the verse you cite certainly doesn’t make that claim.

Sex in marriage is honorable but that is not the same as being pure in God's sight. It means that God makes an exception in marriage because in this impure creation it is a necessary evil.

Again, what makes you think it's "evil"?

God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah not because they were gay. God's anger was kindled because some of them were rapist trying to force themselves upon the men that God had sent. Still God would have spared them had he found even ten righteous among them. Being gay does not equal being unrighteous. Being gay is an artifact of this impure creation. It exist because the mystery of iniquity is at work. We all need to be redeemed from ALL iniquity. To separate being gay into its own category of being iniquitous is a meaningless division. All iniquity is the same.

Agreed.

This world is twice removed from the Garden World. There was the Garden world (celestial), the pre flood world (terrestrial) and this world (telestial). At the resurrection of the dead man will once again be on the pre flood world. Jesus comes to this present world only in the clouds at the time of the resurrection/gathering. His second coming will be to the next world that is like the pre flood world.
24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

So, God only found 8 righteous people (Noah and his family) on a Terrestrial world?

This is when the Angel of the Lord will preach the Gospel to every living soul. This is the time of the unpardonable sin which is blasphemy against the Angel of the Lord which is the Holy Ghost, God's Spirit. Remember, before the flood God's Spirit did strive with man. After the resurrection on the new earth God's Spirit will once again strive with man.

I hope that this puts the "gay question" in a better perspective.

Not really, but good on you for giving us your perspective.

[aaascending]

You didn't ask me, but I think the bishop and the counselor did the right thing. She didn't kill herself, and as long as someone is alive, God can work with them however he will.

Are you saying God can't work with a person who commits suicide but without having committed sins next to murder?
Would it have been better for David, Solomon, and Hezekiah to die earlier? Don't we say it's better to die early, than to live and turn from God?
Just thoughts to fit in...
I don't know which one would be a better "outcome". I hope God could work with either. In what state of mind must a suicide be? It seems both would have things to repent of.

Hezekiah? he was righteous...

[Michael Sherwin]

The Church says to get a temple pass one must live up to a certain standard. That standard is of men.

How do you know “that standard is of men”? Sounds like your opinion, and I disagree.

Under God's standard none of us is "good" enough for temple service. Who among the LDS practice keeping God's law like the Levites did to qualify for temple service? None!

We are not required to obey the Levitical law in this day. Why do you believe we are? Do you?

Ask a thousand Christians if sex is pure in marriage and there will most likely be a thousand yeses. But that is not true. The Bible teaches that it is a necessary evil that is not counted as sin.

I don’t believe in a God that would create something evil then require us to participate in it. ("Multiply and replenish the earth"). Again, this is your opinion, and it’s misguided (in my opinion).

And even then sex between married couples is not to be engaged in wantonly and without limit.
13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

Where are you getting this, because the verse you cite certainly doesn’t make that claim.

Sex in marriage is honorable but that is not the same as being pure in God's sight. It means that God makes an exception in marriage because in this impure creation it is a necessary evil.

Again, what makes you think it's "evil"?

God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah not because they were gay. God's anger was kindled because some of them were rapist trying to force themselves upon the men that God had sent. Still God would have spared them had he found even ten righteous among them. Being gay does not equal being unrighteous. Being gay is an artifact of this impure creation. It exist because the mystery of iniquity is at work. We all need to be redeemed from ALL iniquity. To separate being gay into its own category of being iniquitous is a meaningless division. All iniquity is the same.

Agreed.

This world is twice removed from the Garden World. There was the Garden world (celestial), the pre flood world (terrestrial) and this world (telestial). At the resurrection of the dead man will once again be on the pre flood world. Jesus comes to this present world only in the clouds at the time of the resurrection/gathering. His second coming will be to the next world that is like the pre flood world.
24:37 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

So, God only found 8 righteous people (Noah and his family) on a Terrestrial world?

This is when the Angel of the Lord will preach the Gospel to every living soul. This is the time of the unpardonable sin which is blasphemy against the Angel of the Lord which is the Holy Ghost, God's Spirit. Remember, before the flood God's Spirit did strive with man. After the resurrection on the new earth God's Spirit will once again strive with man.

I hope that this puts the "gay question" in a better perspective.

Not really, but good on you for giving us your perspective.

[Lizzy60]

I think you are concerned that the Church will change, I don't see that happening.

This didn't age well

This article from the Deseret News (posted by tribrac on the News thread) shows the tide has definitely turned in Utah. And as Utah goes, so goes the LDS Church.

https://www.deseret.com/utah/2022/9/29/ ... kGYsTqMwwo

Stats from the article:

Over 60% of active LDS in Utah support same-sex marriage.
72% of Utahns now support same-sex marriage.
89% of college age adults in Utah support same-sex marriage.
Over 60% of Utah Republicans support same-sex marriage.

[Christianlee]

I think you are concerned that the Church will change, I don't see that happening.

This didn't age well

This article from the Deseret News (posted by tribrac on the News thread) shows the tide has definitely turned in Utah. And as Utah goes, so goes the LDS Church.

https://www.deseret.com/utah/2022/9/29/ ... kGYsTqMwwo

Stats from the article:

Over 60% of active LDS in Utah support same-sex marriage.
72% of Utahns now support same-sex marriage.
89% of college age adults in Utah support same-sex marriage.
Over 60% of Utah Republicans support same-sex marriage.

Utah has been Californicated. And the LDS members seem to be following the example of the Catholics. The only difference is their alcohol consumption. I assume. LDS are actually sober and accepting it.