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...I'm writing the church asapI stand corrected. Thanksillyume wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 9:59 pmLatter-day Saint is still fine:Hie'ing to Kolob wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 8:59 pmI thought it is also forbidden to use, "Latter-day Saint" as shorthand. Looks like the women's group is still out of compliance...
· When referring to Church members, the terms "members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" or "Latter-day Saints" are preferred. We ask that the term "Mormons" not be used.
We probably should have just kept it as it was originally named in 1830. Church of Christ.NIGHTLIGHT wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 10:15 pm They should have named it The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Disciples...
"The Choir Formally Known as the Mormon Tabernacle Choir"PressingForward wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 11:50 pm So no more Mormon Tabernacle Choir?
No more Mormonnewsroom?
Mormonandgay?
The times they are a changin’
Not sure what it will be rebranded to. I am sure it will be. BY is an extremely controversial figure and the Church will absolutely throw him under the bus if his teachings, lifestyle, etc. are the subject of controversy and public outrage/protest.EmmaLee wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 9:14 pmBaby steps, Kolob, baby steps!Hie'ing to Kolob wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 8:59 pmI thought it is also forbidden to use, "Latter-day Saint" as shorthand. Looks like the women's group is still out of compliance...To be honest, I can't keep track of what we're supposed to be calling ourselves from day to day, lol.
What do you think the rebranding of BYU would look like? It's already about as leftist as any other Babylonian uni.
You have to have Jesus in the name thoughHie'ing to Kolob wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 11:25 pmWe probably should have just kept it as it was originally named in 1830. Church of Christ.NIGHTLIGHT wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 10:15 pm They should have named it The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Disciples...
Worked for Altria, right?BruceRGilbert wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 12:27 amWith enough reformation, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints can step away from all the stigma and errant history that has been associated with "Mormonism." So much for lds.org and the google apostasy!“Mormon carries a lot of negative connotation, we know from surveys,” he said. “Mormon is even a more fraught term internationally than domestically. Maybe this is yet another part of President Nelson’s administration keeping an eye on the global church even if it causes a little discomfort or anxiety within the U.S. church.”
Updated style guide
The updated style guide states, in part:
· In the first reference, the full name of the Church is preferred: "The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints."
· When a shortened reference is needed, the terms "the Church" or the "Church of Jesus Christ" are encouraged. The "restored Church of Jesus Christ" is also accurate and encouraged.
· While the term "Mormon Church" has long been publicly applied to the Church as a nickname, it is not an authorized title, and the Church discourages its use. Thus, please avoid using the abbreviation "LDS" or the nickname "Mormon" as substitutes for the name of the Church, as in "Mormon Church," "LDS Church," or "Church of the Latter-day Saints."
· When referring to Church members, the terms "members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" or "Latter-day Saints" are preferred. We ask that the term "Mormons" not be used.
· When referring to people or organizations that practice polygamy, it should be stated that The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not affiliated with polygamous groups.
No worries. Though, to be clear I don't consider myself brainwashed and if you knew me you would know that I'm far different latter-day saint than most. As an example the last time I spoke with a born again Christian - right on temple square, no less- he told me that I wasn't "mormon" - he believed me to be christian, but not a "mormon." I make mistakes like everyone else, but I've also learned that sometimes people push extra hard against something if they have turned away from that thing. It is easier to keep separation. However, we should work to realize that there is good in tradition and culture, but cast out that which is bad. Furthermore, I think to an extent we do have our heads stuff full of some things church, but the reality is that as members of the church most of us don't really pray (I include myself in this). We say words, but don't actually talk with God. When we read the scriptures we think merely the act of reading the scriptures is enough, when it isn't the act itself, it is what you are getting out of hte scriptures - otherwise they are just meaningless words. Our intent is wrong. We worship the works of our own hands more than we worship God and His Son. To be clear I am included in this - I wish I weren't. So I don't throw stones, I merely try to teach and uplift. Our Sacrament prayers are often vain. How do I know this? Because most of the time they are merely words that are being read and not words being read with the intent to reach God. When we listen to the prayer are we including ourselves in it or are our minds wandering. We do not know the voice of the Savior and so do not seek after Him - which in turn makes it hard to teach about Him. We teach the traditions of our Father's without actually learning to know God Himself. This is why we fail. Words mean something - or at least they should. For the past two years I've not considered myself a "mormon" or "LDS" because I'm not - even though I am a baptized member of the church of Jesus Christ and I attend its meetings regularly. I view the gospel drastically different than most cultural or traditional mormons. So in my mind as I've pondered over this, it is call for me to be a saint and to bear the name of Christ, as I should have the past two years rather than to identify myself by what I am not - a "modern mormon" or "lds."Chip wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 7:03 pmI'm sorry that I offended you, Jadd. I carry the same programming as you do and am prone to respond the same way to something like the name change. I didn't mean to single you out. I've been somewhat brainwashed, myself, and I see me in your writing. I don't want to think like a codependent, anymore.jadd wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 6:01 pmYou really misread what I wrote. No mental gymnastics is needed. You seem to be approaching this with the proverbial "chip" on your shoulder as if you have some sort of personal stake in this and are looking for the worst in other members (me) They aren't calling us to repentance for calling ourselves mormons. They are calling us to repentance for forgetting the Savior - for not remembering Him always. It's intent is to remind us of what we are supposed to do. Not saying we were always wrong for referring to ourselves as mormons.Chip wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 1:17 pmTotal Mormon mental gymnastics (codependence?) here to suppose that WE members must now repent of calling ourselves "Mormons". We follow the leaders. The term "Mormonism" was strongly used since Joseph Smith and Brigham Young.jadd wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 11:43 am
Personally, I believe the idea is to make s realize and emphasize that we should be "Latter-Day Saints" and are members of the Church of Jesus Christ." When finally acknowledging that we are Members of the Church of Jesus Christ (or should be in Spirit and not just body) - it may cause an attitude shift and tonal shift in how we at towards others as well. That isn't to say that it should have been there before, but often we get so focused on acronyms and nicknames that we actually forget who we are supposed to be. I'm mormon and I'm LDS sounds a lot less sacred/impactful that I'm a member of the CHurch of Jesus Christ, or I'm a latter-day saint (or at least trying to be on both accounts). So it was President Nelson's subtle way of calling us to repentance and a subtle call for us to begin to practice what we preach - in and outside of the Church (of Jesus Christ). Unsurprisingly I think most will miss the purpose behind the intent. However, it is necessary because we all learn line upon line, precept upon precept. Thus some will see and some will hear and others will not.
I think the church is feeling the need to rebrand itself, somewhat, after making a lot of (forced) admissions about its history, which exposed a lot of rot in "Mormonism", to the understanding of members, as well as leaders. Better to move towards the savior, for sure.
I'm really thinking that there is a watershed event on the horizon where all institutions are going to be abruptly unmasked and whatever there is to know is going to become suddenly known. I think all institutions who've practiced dominion over people will be found hiding bad things. We won't be any different. I suspect that people's relationships with Christ are going to become a lot more one-on-one, as fallout, which is how it was probably supposed to be. A lot of thick cobwebs are going to be blasted out of people's minds.
I imagine that the real reason we don't think enough about the savior is because we've got our heads so stuffed full of church that, while plenty of lip service gets paid to the savior, we're kept overly busy fixating on all things church. And the word to reference it by just got turned into a nine-word phrase.
The University of the second president of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?Hie'ing to Kolob wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 9:04 pm Hold on to your hats folks because Brigham Young University will be rebranded in the near future...
Thinker, I didn't answer the latter part of your question.Thinker wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 3:45 pm
Chip,
I’ve already experienced and seen some of that, with the www. And I believe in times of judgment (each day of our lives but with more awareness after death), we will see more of what was hidden.
Are you referring to finances, history or what? Will you clarify and expand on how you think many’s eyes will be open about some of the less popular truths? Why do you think some keep their head in the sand, some focus on the negative, and some see the positive as well as negative aspects? What factors contribute to such different responses?
What the heck is the difference?Elizabeth wrote: ↑August 19th, 2018, 1:17 am He did not say "nobody is married in heaven" ... the following are the words used:
Doctrine and Covenants 132:16
16 Therefore, when they are out of the world they neither marry nor are given in marriage; but are appointed angels in heaven, which angels are ministering servants, to minister for those who are worthy of a far more, and an exceeding, and an eternal weight of glory.
Matthew 22:30
30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
Mark 12:25
25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
Some clarification is in order, here with respect to the teachings of Jacob.
Jacob 1:
15 And now it came to pass that the people of Nephi, under the reign of the second king, began to grow hard in their hearts, and indulge themselves somewhat in wicked practices, such as like unto David of old desiring many wives and concubines, and also Solomon, his son.
16 Yea, and they also began to search much gold and silver, and began to be lifted up somewhat in pride.
Jacob 2:
1 The words which Jacob, the brother of Nephi, spake unto the people of Nephi, after the death of Nephi:
2 Now, my beloved brethren, I, Jacob, according to the responsibility which I am under to God, to magnify mine office with soberness, and that I might rid my garments of your sins, I come up into the temple this day that I might declare unto you the word of God.
3 And ye yourselves know that I have hitherto been diligent in the office of my calling; but I this day am weighed down with much more desire and anxiety for the welfare of your souls than I have hitherto been.
4 For behold, as yet, ye have been obedient unto the word of the Lord, which I have given unto you.
5 But behold, hearken ye unto me, and know that by the help of the all-powerful Creator of heaven and earth I can tell you concerning your thoughts, how that ye are beginning to labor in sin, which sin appeareth very abominable unto me, yea, and abominable unto God.
6 Yea, it grieveth my soul and causeth me to shrink with shame before the presence of my Maker, that I must testify unto you concerning the wickedness of your hearts.
7 And also it grieveth me that I must use so much boldness of speech concerning you, before your wives and your children, many of whose feelings are exceedingly tender and chaste and delicate before God, which thing is pleasing unto God;
8 And it supposeth me that they have come up hither to hear the pleasing word of God, yea, the word which healeth the wounded soul.
9 Wherefore, it burdeneth my soul that I should be constrained, because of the strict commandment which I have received from God, to admonish you according to your crimes, to enlarge the wounds of those who are already wounded, instead of consoling and healing their wounds; and those who have not been wounded, instead of feasting upon the pleasing word of God have daggers placed to pierce their souls and wound their delicate minds.
10 But, notwithstanding the greatness of the task, I must do according to the strict commands of God, and tell you concerning your wickedness and abominations, in the presence of the pure in heart, and the broken heart, and under the glance of the piercing eye of the Almighty God.
11 Wherefore, I must tell you the truth according to the plainness of the word of God. For behold, as I inquired of the Lord, thus came the word unto me, saying: Jacob, get thou up into the temple on the morrow, and declare the word which I shall give thee unto this people.
12 And now behold, my brethren, this is the word which I declare unto you, that many of you have begun to search for gold, and for silver, and for all manner of precious ores, in the which this land, which is a land of promise unto you and to your seed, doth abound most plentifully.
13 And the hand of providence hath smiled upon you most pleasingly, that you have obtained many riches; and because some of you have obtained more abundantly than that of your brethren ye are lifted up in the pride of your hearts, and wear stiff necks and high heads because of the costliness of your apparel, and persecute your brethren because ye suppose that ye are better than they.
14 And now, my brethren, do ye suppose that God justifieth you in this thing? Behold, I say unto you, Nay. But he condemneth you, and if ye persist in these things his judgments must speedily come unto you.
The grosser crime, above pride:15 O that he would show you that he can pierce you, and with one glance of his eye he can smite you to the dust!
16 O that he would rid you from this iniquity and abomination. And, O that ye would listen unto the word of his commands, and let not this pride of your hearts destroy your souls!
17 Think of your brethren like unto yourselves, and be familiar with all and free with your substance, that they may be rich like unto you.
18 But before ye seek for riches, seek ye for the kingdom of God.
19 And after ye have obtained a hope in Christ ye shall obtain riches, if ye seek them; and ye will seek them for the intent to do good—to clothe the naked, and to feed the hungry, and to liberate the captive, and administer relief to the sick and the afflicted.
20 And now, my brethren, I have spoken unto you concerning pride; and those of you which have afflicted your neighbor, and persecuted him because ye were proud in your hearts, of the things which God hath given you, what say ye of it?
21 Do ye not suppose that such things are abominable unto him who created all flesh? And the one being is as precious in his sight as the other. And all flesh is of the dust; and for the selfsame end hath he created them, that they should keep his commandments and glorify him forever.
22 And now I make an end of speaking unto you concerning this pride. And were it not that I must speak unto you concerning a grosser crime, my heart would rejoice exceedingly because of you.
From the Biblical Record - David condemned himself; however, it is revealing from whom he received some of his wives.23 But the word of God burdens me because of your grosser crimes. For behold, thus saith the Lord: This people begin to wax in iniquity; they understand not the scriptures, for they seek to excuse themselves in committing whoredoms, because of the things which were written concerning David, and Solomon his son.
24 Behold, David and Solomon truly had many wives and concubines, which thing was abominable before me, saith the Lord.
25 Wherefore, thus saith the Lord, I have led this people forth out of the land of Jerusalem, by the power of mine arm, that I might raise up unto me a righteous branch from the fruit of the loins of Joseph.
26 Wherefore, I the Lord God will not suffer that this people shall do like unto them of old.
27 Wherefore, my brethren, hear me, and hearken to the word of the Lord: For there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife; and concubines he shall have none;
28 For I, the Lord God, delight in the chastity of women. And whoredoms are an abomination before me; thus saith the Lord of Hosts.
29 Wherefore, this people shall keep my commandments, saith the Lord of Hosts, or cursed be the land for their sakes.
30 For if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things.
Certainly the following DOES apply with respect to these things:2 Samuel 12:
1 And the Lord sent Nathan unto David. And he came unto him, and said unto him, There were two men in one city; the one rich, and the other poor.
2 The rich man had exceeding many flocks and herds:
3 But the poor man had nothing, save one little ewe lamb, which he had bought and nourished up: and it grew up together with him, and with his children; it did eat of his own meat, and drank of his own cup, and lay in his bosom, and was unto him as a daughter.
4 And there came a traveller unto the rich man, and he spared to take of his own flock and of his own herd, to dress for the wayfaring man that was come unto him; but took the poor man’s lamb, and dressed it for the man that was come to him.
5 And David’s anger was greatly kindled against the man; and he said to Nathan, As the Lord liveth, the man that hath done this thing shall surely die:
6 And he shall restore the lamb fourfold, because he did this thing, and because he had no pity.
7 ¶ And Nathan said to David, Thou art the man. Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, I anointed thee king over Israel, and I delivered thee out of the hand of Saul;
8 And I gave thee thy master’s house, and thy master’s wives into thy bosom, and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah; and if that had been too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things.
9 Wherefore hast thou despised the commandment of the Lord, to do evil in his sight? thou hast killed Uriah the Hittite with the sword, and hast taken his wife to be thy wife, and hast slain him with the sword of the children of Ammon.
Indeed a very good question prompts the information found in Section 132 -Doctrine and Covenants 132:
1 Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you my servant Joseph, that inasmuch as you have inquired of my hand to know and understand wherein I, the Lord, justified my servants Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as also Moses, David and Solomon, my servants, as touching the principle and doctrine of their having many wives and concubines—
2 Behold, and lo, I am the Lord thy God, and will answer thee as touching this matter.
Simply put . . . no man taketh this honor unto himself and if there is a desire by Heavenly Father, as in the case of Abraham and others, "to raise up seed unto Himself," He will call and command it to be so. The sin resides in the lusts and attempts to justify oneself in the unlawful acquisition and selfish fulfillments of the flesh.Doctrine and Covenants 132:
39 David’s wives and concubines were given unto him of me, by the hand of Nathan, my servant, and others of the prophets who had the keys of this power; and in none of these things did he sin against me save in the case of Uriah and his wife; and, therefore he hath fallen from his exaltation, and received his portion; and he shall not inherit them out of the world, for I gave them unto another, saith the Lord.
Jesus Christ was speaking to men who take part in the Second Resurrection.... those who take part in the second Resurrection are not given in marriage but they are as they were before the earth ,except they have bodies now. It reminds me of the scripture where Jesus tells the young man "Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." So is Jesus a liar????? No!!!!Chip wrote: ↑August 19th, 2018, 12:17 amThinker, I didn't answer the latter part of your question.Thinker wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 3:45 pm
Chip,
I’ve already experienced and seen some of that, with the www. And I believe in times of judgment (each day of our lives but with more awareness after death), we will see more of what was hidden.
Are you referring to finances, history or what? Will you clarify and expand on how you think many’s eyes will be open about some of the less popular truths? Why do you think some keep their head in the sand, some focus on the negative, and some see the positive as well as negative aspects? What factors contribute to such different responses?
I've realized, being Mormon, that people don't really care about truth. They love to assume they have the truth, because it feels ennobling, but what they really love is that they BELONG to a tight-thinking fellowship that gives life good meaning and structure. This sense of belonging and pleasant normality is the last thing anyone wants jeopardized. Plus, God's blessings are abundantly experienced in the church. This may have mainly to do with obedience to the Ten Commandments being taught.
In the church, there are penalties for wandering outside the cozy dome of belief, where you could become "apostate" for reasons that really have NOTHING to do with Jesus Christ, since many things of man have been heavily conflated with Christ in the church. This makes the church a trap, at some levels. We all take solace in belonging to it because it soothes our souls with notions of truth and permanence, while we instinctively avoid certain avenues of truth that could disrupt our fixed comfort in it.
If you do a lot of reading, pondering, and praying and come to the conclusion that polygamy was absolutely not of God, you've just opened a Pandora's Box that cannot be closed. Now you are screwed, as a Mormon, since you've set an unraveling into motion that cannot be stopped until all subsequent inquiries are pursued. Everything Mormon seems up-in-the-air and suspect.
In my case, I know I'm an improved person for being a Mormon, and I don't see my attitude toward my family diminishing, but I'm suspect of things like eternal marriage, exaltation, and the three Kingdoms, as Joseph Smith pitched them to get more wives, while they were completely superfluous in light of God's blessings already promised (i.e. Nobody has seen/heard/imagined the things that God has in store for those that love him.) I mean, we may get to heaven and realize that eternal marriage was a totally misguided notion. Christ said that nobody is married in heaven - just one of the many things he said that we ignore, while we carry on with some whole other construct.
Meanwhile, Christ is the preeminent matter and he is unmoved, still there, and the only man worthy of pursuit. The rest of us are verifiable turd bags, unsteady wanderers, and criminals before God.
I do believe in the divinity of the Book of Mormon, even if it was dictated from a seer stone in a hat.NIGHTLIGHT wrote: ↑August 19th, 2018, 10:39 amJesus Christ was speaking to men who take part in the Second Resurrection.... those who take part in the second Resurrection are not given in marriage but they are as they were before the earth ,except they have bodies now. It reminds me of the scripture where Jesus tells the young man "Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." So is Jesus a liar????? No!!!!Chip wrote: ↑August 19th, 2018, 12:17 amThinker, I didn't answer the latter part of your question.Thinker wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 3:45 pm
Chip,
I’ve already experienced and seen some of that, with the www. And I believe in times of judgment (each day of our lives but with more awareness after death), we will see more of what was hidden.
Are you referring to finances, history or what? Will you clarify and expand on how you think many’s eyes will be open about some of the less popular truths? Why do you think some keep their head in the sand, some focus on the negative, and some see the positive as well as negative aspects? What factors contribute to such different responses?
I've realized, being Mormon, that people don't really care about truth. They love to assume they have the truth, because it feels ennobling, but what they really love is that they BELONG to a tight-thinking fellowship that gives life good meaning and structure. This sense of belonging and pleasant normality is the last thing anyone wants jeopardized. Plus, God's blessings are abundantly experienced in the church. This may have mainly to do with obedience to the Ten Commandments being taught.
In the church, there are penalties for wandering outside the cozy dome of belief, where you could become "apostate" for reasons that really have NOTHING to do with Jesus Christ, since many things of man have been heavily conflated with Christ in the church. This makes the church a trap, at some levels. We all take solace in belonging to it because it soothes our souls with notions of truth and permanence, while we instinctively avoid certain avenues of truth that could disrupt our fixed comfort in it.
If you do a lot of reading, pondering, and praying and come to the conclusion that polygamy was absolutely not of God, you've just opened a Pandora's Box that cannot be closed. Now you are screwed, as a Mormon, since you've set an unraveling into motion that cannot be stopped until all subsequent inquiries are pursued. Everything Mormon seems up-in-the-air and suspect.
In my case, I know I'm an improved person for being a Mormon, and I don't see my attitude toward my family diminishing, but I'm suspect of things like eternal marriage, exaltation, and the three Kingdoms, as Joseph Smith pitched them to get more wives, while they were completely superfluous in light of God's blessings already promised (i.e. Nobody has seen/heard/imagined the things that God has in store for those that love him.) I mean, we may get to heaven and realize that eternal marriage was a totally misguided notion. Christ said that nobody is married in heaven - just one of the many things he said that we ignore, while we carry on with some whole other construct.
Meanwhile, Christ is the preeminent matter and he is unmoved, still there, and the only man worthy of pursuit. The rest of us are verifiable turd bags, unsteady wanderers, and criminals before God.
He was talking to somebody who did not know that He was the Christ. The kid thought he was just some new prophet.... so ,Jesus knowing this, was telling the kid not to look to man because his arm of flesh will fail him, look only to God.
I wonder.... Since you believe in the Book of Mormon ,then you believe Joseph Smith translated it through means of divinity. In this book Mormon there are prophecies of js and his calling, his high capacity of being a seer..... and This Book of Mormon tells us the Bible was gutted by evil men, many plain truth were taken from it. Chip, who is more likely to be correct..... you or Joseph Smith?
First you come to the conclusion that D&C 132 has to be fake..... Now you come to the conclusion that there might be other fake parts of D&C.... ones that speak on Eternal Marriage and levels of Glory.
Chip, the Holy Ghosts effect on a man does not leave him in confusion and in doubt. Satan has you on slow boil...
Shake him off, stick and move
Endure
The BoM is yet to be fully revealed... the majority is sealed. And it contains much of His gospel(not all)Chip wrote: ↑August 19th, 2018, 6:34 pmI do believe in the divinity of the Book of Mormon, even if it was dictated from a seer stone in a hat.NIGHTLIGHT wrote: ↑August 19th, 2018, 10:39 amJesus Christ was speaking to men who take part in the Second Resurrection.... those who take part in the second Resurrection are not given in marriage but they are as they were before the earth ,except they have bodies now. It reminds me of the scripture where Jesus tells the young man "Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." So is Jesus a liar????? No!!!!Chip wrote: ↑August 19th, 2018, 12:17 amThinker, I didn't answer the latter part of your question.Thinker wrote: ↑August 17th, 2018, 3:45 pm
Chip,
I’ve already experienced and seen some of that, with the www. And I believe in times of judgment (each day of our lives but with more awareness after death), we will see more of what was hidden.
Are you referring to finances, history or what? Will you clarify and expand on how you think many’s eyes will be open about some of the less popular truths? Why do you think some keep their head in the sand, some focus on the negative, and some see the positive as well as negative aspects? What factors contribute to such different responses?
I've realized, being Mormon, that people don't really care about truth. They love to assume they have the truth, because it feels ennobling, but what they really love is that they BELONG to a tight-thinking fellowship that gives life good meaning and structure. This sense of belonging and pleasant normality is the last thing anyone wants jeopardized. Plus, God's blessings are abundantly experienced in the church. This may have mainly to do with obedience to the Ten Commandments being taught.
In the church, there are penalties for wandering outside the cozy dome of belief, where you could become "apostate" for reasons that really have NOTHING to do with Jesus Christ, since many things of man have been heavily conflated with Christ in the church. This makes the church a trap, at some levels. We all take solace in belonging to it because it soothes our souls with notions of truth and permanence, while we instinctively avoid certain avenues of truth that could disrupt our fixed comfort in it.
If you do a lot of reading, pondering, and praying and come to the conclusion that polygamy was absolutely not of God, you've just opened a Pandora's Box that cannot be closed. Now you are screwed, as a Mormon, since you've set an unraveling into motion that cannot be stopped until all subsequent inquiries are pursued. Everything Mormon seems up-in-the-air and suspect.
In my case, I know I'm an improved person for being a Mormon, and I don't see my attitude toward my family diminishing, but I'm suspect of things like eternal marriage, exaltation, and the three Kingdoms, as Joseph Smith pitched them to get more wives, while they were completely superfluous in light of God's blessings already promised (i.e. Nobody has seen/heard/imagined the things that God has in store for those that love him.) I mean, we may get to heaven and realize that eternal marriage was a totally misguided notion. Christ said that nobody is married in heaven - just one of the many things he said that we ignore, while we carry on with some whole other construct.
Meanwhile, Christ is the preeminent matter and he is unmoved, still there, and the only man worthy of pursuit. The rest of us are verifiable turd bags, unsteady wanderers, and criminals before God.
He was talking to somebody who did not know that He was the Christ. The kid thought he was just some new prophet.... so ,Jesus knowing this, was telling the kid not to look to man because his arm of flesh will fail him, look only to God.
I wonder.... Since you believe in the Book of Mormon ,then you believe Joseph Smith translated it through means of divinity. In this book Mormon there are prophecies of js and his calling, his high capacity of being a seer..... and This Book of Mormon tells us the Bible was gutted by evil men, many plain truth were taken from it. Chip, who is more likely to be correct..... you or Joseph Smith?
First you come to the conclusion that D&C 132 has to be fake..... Now you come to the conclusion that there might be other fake parts of D&C.... ones that speak on Eternal Marriage and levels of Glory.
Chip, the Holy Ghosts effect on a man does not leave him in confusion and in doubt. Satan has you on slow boil...
Shake him off, stick and move
Endure
The Book of Mormon is said to contain the fullness of the gospel, right? And I don't detect any conflicts between it and the bible. It says the same things the bible says, but in condensed and clarified form. It DOES NOT allow for polygamy, despite what the chapter header of Jacob 2 insinuates. After the advent of the Book of Mormon, a whole bunch of stuff was added (restored?!?) that was in neither the Bible nor the Book of Mormon. How can it be said that the Book of Mormon contained the fullness of the gospel, then, when many ideas were added later via Joseph Smith, such as "plural wives", not to mention Brigham's (temporary) additions? Sounds like revisionism to me, not restoration.
My confusion and doubt have to do with a restoration. The Book of Mormon complemented the bible. What came after the Book of Mormon REDEFINED the bible AND the Book of Mormon. All this upset seems rooted in polygamy. Looks not right to me. Confusion? Doubt? Maybe they're appropriate here.
And look at the end of Joseph Smith's life: Anointed King of the World by the Council of Fifty, bragged he accomplished things even Jesus couldn't do, more wives than Emma even knew about, Jupiter talisman found on his body, killed two men in the shootout and wounded another, last words were a Masonic distress call. What are YOU going to believe? Your own tried instincts or a man who seemed to be running off the rails? I want to know the truth, and just because a lot of people believe something does not make it true.