"We don't know, so it doesn't matter."

[ElizaRSkousen]

When I was little I asked my dad some question about space or dinosuars or something that kids are curious about, and he told me something along the lines of "We don't know, so it doesn't matter."

That logic seems to be popular in the mormon culture and it has always bothered me. I see it here on the forum a lot in the form of phrases like "Why do you want to know that?" "Why bother speculating?" "Youre missing the mark." "etc.

Why would the Lord even give us brains if we werent supposed to use them? Some people seem to forget the "study it out by reason" portion of the scripture. But I think this:

“A man is saved no faster than he gets knowledge, for if he does not get knowledge, he will be brought into captivity by some evil power in the other world, as evil spirits will have more knowledge, and consequently more power than many men who are on the earth. Hence it needs revelation to assist us, and give us knowledge of the things of God.”

"God has more power than all other beings, because He has greater knowledge;"

"And if a person gains more knowledge and intelligence in this life through his diligence and obedience than another, he will have so much the advantage in the world to come."

Wisdom resteth in the heart of him that hath understanding: but that which is in the midst of fools is made known.

Why do some people think it is a sin to 'think too deeply'?

[Dusty52]

I'm in your corner on this
If I belong to a religion I need to understand it
It needs to make sense to me
It needs to be able to answer questions especially about its doctrine and the claims it makes!

[Original_Intent]

My feeling is this - there are some things, that knowing now isn't going to fundamentally help us. Things like "How are spirit children made?" It's fun to speculate and I see no harm in seeking light about it, and you may even find answers, but it is highly unlikely it will ever be in the Sunday School manual or preached about at General Conference.

There are other issues that we do not have confirmed, doctrinal answers for which MAY be of use to us. When I was in my mid twenties I had a concern about progression between kingdoms. My concern could be worded something like "It doesn't seem right that someone may miss the Celestial Kingdom "by the skin of their teeth." and be forever barred from it. I spent at minimum six months studying pondering and praying about it.

One day, I got the clearest impression that everyone will be given every opportunity and all will eventually reside not only where they belong but where their nature makes them desire to be. There will be no unfairness because they will know and accept that they are where they chose to be.

That part is knowledge. I have speculated down several paths of what that MIGHT entail, things like MMP, different ways we could progress in the post- mortal state, and others. And even though I have spent years considering these things, I have gotten no answer, nor do I think it terribly important that I get those specifics. I now know what I need to know regarding the matter, and the how it works I can find out when I need to.


Whether there is MMP or some other answer, I 100% am convinced that doesn't give us any liberty to waste away our lives. Far from it, I think to embrace that is a damning doctrine and terrible spiritual habit to get into. One that I am not completely innocent of, but I don't excuse myself for the weaknesses of the flesh that I have.

[Juliet]

Part of our human side can only hold so much contradiction in our head at a time. We like the world to make sense. Did you know everyone has a blind spot right in front of your face between your eyes and above? The brain fills in the spot so it looks like we can see a whole picture. That is just what our brain does, and we all do it day after day for all kinds of things. That is why we appear to have linear lives. But in all actuality time itself is an illusion.

So if you are able to hold more contradiction in your mind you become capable of asking deeper questions. That is great and I think you can't go too deep. But not everyone is going to feel comfortable as you dive and the gravitational or conflicting pressure to understand increases.

[BeNotDeceived]

The more you know, the more you know how little you know.

[Jesef]

Speculation is fun. Proving the unprovable (akin to knowing the unknowable) is frustrating. And then there's always the spiritual and religious copout of: whatever doesn't SEEM right/good or doesn't MAKE SENSE is just trumped by spiritual/mystical confirmation (picture heavenly music playing or Ariel singing in the background in a crescendo as it brightens to blinding LIGHT). The great & incomprehensible mystery, magnum mystereum. Faith is the answer to Nonsense or Unreason.

[ElizaRSkousen]

My feeling is this - there are some things, that knowing now isn't going to fundamentally help us. Things like "How are spirit children made?" It's fun to speculate and I see no harm in seeking light about it, and you may even find answers, but it is highly unlikely it will ever be in the Sunday School manual or preached about at General Conference.

There are other issues that we do not have confirmed, doctrinal answers for which MAY be of use to us. When I was in my mid twenties I had a concern about progression between kingdoms. My concern could be worded something like "It doesn't seem right that someone may miss the Celestial Kingdom "by the skin of their teeth." and be forever barred from it. I spent at minimum six months studying pondering and praying about it.

One day, I got the clearest impression that everyone will be given every opportunity and all will eventually reside not only where they belong but where their nature makes them desire to be. There will be no unfairness because they will know and accept that they are where they chose to be.

That part is knowledge. I have speculated down several paths of what that MIGHT entail, things like MMP, different ways we could progress in the post- mortal state, and others. And even though I have spent years considering these things, I have gotten no answer, nor do I think it terribly important that I get those specifics. I now know what I need to know regarding the matter, and the how it works I can find out when I need to.


Whether there is MMP or some other answer, I 100% am convinced that doesn't give us any liberty to waste away our lives. Far from it, I think to embrace that is a damning doctrine and terrible spiritual habit to get into. One that I am not completely innocent of, but I don't excuse myself for the weaknesses of the flesh that I have.

Thanks for sharing. I also think that there are things pertinent to our immediate needs and things that we will need later. But I do believe that eventually we will need to know it all!

[ElizaRSkousen]

Part of our human side can only hold so much contradiction in our head at a time. We like the world to make sense. Did you know everyone has a blind spot right in front of your face between your eyes and above? The brain fills in the spot so it looks like we can see a whole picture. That is just what our brain does, and we all do it day after day for all kinds of things. That is why we appear to have linear lives. But in all actuality time itself is an illusion.

So if you are able to hold more contradiction in your mind you become capable of asking deeper questions. That is great and I think you can't go too deep. But not everyone is going to feel comfortable as you dive and the gravitational or conflicting pressure to understand increases.

Great insight, thank you Juliet.

My worry is that some people may never want to go deeper--ever!

[ElizaRSkousen]

Speculation is fun. Proving the unprovable (akin to knowing the unknowable) is frustrating. And then there's always the spiritual and religious copout of: whatever doesn't SEEM right/good or doesn't MAKE SENSE is just trumped by spiritual/mystical confirmation (picture heavenly music playing or Ariel singing in the background in a crescendo as it brightens to blinding LIGHT). The great & incomprehensible mystery, magnum mystereum. Faith is the answer to Nonsense or Unreason.

I agree that in many instances faith is used as a cop out. But I think it is sometimes necessary to be able to say "I don't know how to bridge this gap, but I am looking for the bridge."

[I AM]

When I was little I asked my dad some question about space or dinosuars or something that kids are curious about, and he told me something along the lines of "We don't know, so it doesn't matter."

That logic seems to be popular in the mormon culture and it has always bothered me. I see it here on the forum a lot in the form of phrases like "Why do you want to know that?" "Why bother speculating?" "Youre missing the mark." "etc.

Why would the Lord even give us brains if we werent supposed to use them? Some people seem to forget the "study it out by reason" portion of the scripture. But I think this:

“A man is saved no faster than he gets knowledge, for if he does not get knowledge, he will be brought into captivity by some evil power in the other world, as evil spirits will have more knowledge, and consequently more power than many men who are on the earth. Hence it needs revelation to assist us, and give us knowledge of the things of God.”

"God has more power than all other beings, because He has greater knowledge;"

"And if a person gains more knowledge and intelligence in this life through his diligence and obedience than another, he will have so much the advantage in the world to come."

Wisdom resteth in the heart of him that hath understanding: but that which is in the midst of fools is made known.

Why do some people think it is a sin to 'think too deeply'?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh you mean like the church.
be careful not to think to deep (out loud) in church,
you just might get thrown out.

quote

"Let’s examine several other statements of Joseph Smith:


“I stated that the most prominent difference between the Latter-Day Saints and sectarians was, that the latter were all circumscribed by some peculiar creed, which deprived its members the privilege of believing anything not contained therein, whereas the Latter- day Saints have no creed, but are ready to believe all true principles that exist as they are manifest from time to time.” (DHC 5: 215)


“I told him I had no creed to circumscribe my mind; therefore the people did not like me.” (DHC 5:214)


“I want to come up into the presence of God, and learn all things; but the creeds set up stakes, and say, ‘Hitherto shalt thou come; and no further,’ which I cannot subscribe to.” (DHC 6:57)


Brigham Young spoke in a similar vein:


“If they have not yet undivided feelings, they will be chastened until they have them; not only until every one of them shall see for themselves, and prophecy for themselves, have visions for themselves, but be made acquainted with all the principles and laws necessary for them to know, so as to supersede the necessity of anyone teaching them. Is not the time to come when I shall not say to my neighbor, know the Lord, for he will know him as well as I do?” (J. of D. 3: 89)



Notice how Joseph Smith tried to avoid setting himself up as a light above his brethren: “I explained to him that I did not profess to be a prophet any more than every man ought to who professes to be a preacher of righteousness.” (DHC 5:232)



Why did the Lord say, “My people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge ... the people that doth not understand shall fall.” (Hosea 4:6 & 14)



Notice that the Lord tells us that the people must understand. It is not enough to pin our faith on the sleeve of the leaders. Knowing this, the early prophets tried to inspire the people to be as good or better than they were. It is a great temptation for those placed in a leadership position to believe that God has chosen them for an authority rather than a servant. Many of these try to extinguish the lesser lights around them so all the light these little minds have is the radiation from the arm of flesh.


On the contrary, God has ordained that we all share the great light of God who is our source and eventually become great lights ourselves.


Yes, there is a difference in the leadership of the Latter-Day Saints today. Today they say, “Hitherto shalt thou come and no further.” You can believe the works of Joseph Fielding Smith, Talmage, and LeGrande Richards, but if you get a different interpretation out of the scriptures, you must stop and repent or get out.


Today the church does have a creed. It is the creed of the modern authorities of the Church which is essentially this: “The Brethren will never lead you astray. Do not think for yourself, but follow to the letter and think as you are told or get out.” Modern Mormons are circumscribed by this and the result is the present very low, almost nonexistent degree of spiritual manifestations in the Church.

[The Airbender]

Amen! I have ran into these kinds of comments so many times it makes me sick.

I prefer the attitude of, "Ask and ye shall receive, knock and it shall be opened unto you."

[ElizaRSkousen]

When I was little I asked my dad some question about space or dinosuars or something that kids are curious about, and he told me something along the lines of "We don't know, so it doesn't matter."

That logic seems to be popular in the mormon culture and it has always bothered me. I see it here on the forum a lot in the form of phrases like "Why do you want to know that?" "Why bother speculating?" "Youre missing the mark." "etc.

Why would the Lord even give us brains if we werent supposed to use them? Some people seem to forget the "study it out by reason" portion of the scripture. But I think this:

“A man is saved no faster than he gets knowledge, for if he does not get knowledge, he will be brought into captivity by some evil power in the other world, as evil spirits will have more knowledge, and consequently more power than many men who are on the earth. Hence it needs revelation to assist us, and give us knowledge of the things of God.”

"God has more power than all other beings, because He has greater knowledge;"

"And if a person gains more knowledge and intelligence in this life through his diligence and obedience than another, he will have so much the advantage in the world to come."

Wisdom resteth in the heart of him that hath understanding: but that which is in the midst of fools is made known.

Why do some people think it is a sin to 'think too deeply'?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh you mean like the church.
be careful not to think to deep (out loud) in church,
you just might get thrown out.

quote

"Let’s examine several other statements of Joseph Smith:


“I stated that the most prominent difference between the Latter-Day Saints and sectarians was, that the latter were all circumscribed by some peculiar creed, which deprived its members the privilege of believing anything not contained therein, whereas the Latter- day Saints have no creed, but are ready to believe all true principles that exist as they are manifest from time to time.” (DHC 5: 215)


“I told him I had no creed to circumscribe my mind; therefore the people did not like me.” (DHC 5:214)


“I want to come up into the presence of God, and learn all things; but the creeds set up stakes, and say, ‘Hitherto shalt thou come; and no further,’ which I cannot subscribe to.” (DHC 6:57)


Brigham Young spoke in a similar vein:


“If they have not yet undivided feelings, they will be chastened until they have them; not only until every one of them shall see for themselves, and prophecy for themselves, have visions for themselves, but be made acquainted with all the principles and laws necessary for them to know, so as to supersede the necessity of anyone teaching them. Is not the time to come when I shall not say to my neighbor, know the Lord, for he will know him as well as I do?” (J. of D. 3: 89)



Notice how Joseph Smith tried to avoid setting himself up as a light above his brethren: “I explained to him that I did not profess to be a prophet any more than every man ought to who professes to be a preacher of righteousness.” (DHC 5:232)



Why did the Lord say, “My people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge ... the people that doth not understand shall fall.” (Hosea 4:6 & 14)



Notice that the Lord tells us that the people must understand. It is not enough to pin our faith on the sleeve of the leaders. Knowing this, the early prophets tried to inspire the people to be as good or better than they were. It is a great temptation for those placed in a leadership position to believe that God has chosen them for an authority rather than a servant. Many of these try to extinguish the lesser lights around them so all the light these little minds have is the radiation from the arm of flesh.


On the contrary, God has ordained that we all share the great light of God who is our source and eventually become great lights ourselves.


Yes, there is a difference in the leadership of the Latter-Day Saints today. Today they say, “Hitherto shalt thou come and no further.” You can believe the works of Joseph Fielding Smith, Talmage, and LeGrande Richards, but if you get a different interpretation out of the scriptures, you must stop and repent or get out.


Today the church does have a creed. It is the creed of the modern authorities of the Church which is essentially this: “The Brethren will never lead you astray. Do not think for yourself, but follow to the letter and think as you are told or get out.” Modern Mormons are circumscribed by this and the result is the present very low, almost nonexistent degree of spiritual manifestations in the Church.

Agreed that honestly thinking for yourself has been utterly forgotten.

I think Brigham said once (poor paraphrasing here) "you should follow me not necessarially because I'm the prophet, but because I know more. And if someone else learn about more than me, then I will follow him and he can be my leader."

[brianj]

I'm not entirely confident this happens on an individual level, but collectively Heavenly Father blesses our efforts to learn and discover. I find it thrilling that a neutrino originating in another galaxy was identified and the source was identified. And yes, long before this press release I could place neutrinos in the right box of the Standard Model along with the rest of the leptons, all six flavors of quarks, and the five bosons. Probably most of us are deeply grateful for the result of medical research when we or a loved one need healthcare.

Satan didn't put bones and tracks into the planet's crust when it was being created to deceive us. Nor did Heavenly Father do so in order to make it hard for us to exercise faith. We have been blessed with curious intellects and an ability to discover because Heavenly Father wants us to use those gifts. The more mankind discovers, the more we can learn in this life. The more we learn in this life the better off we will be in the next.

I didn't grow up LDS and I had similar questions to the OP as a child. But I had no concept of a testimony and neither did my parents. The standard lines I received were "It's a sin to question God" and "You just need to believe." I think this is a way of stopping questions the person being questioned doesn't want to be confronted with.