The greatest lie ever told, that vaccines are safe and effective.

[The Airbender]

I do not believe our bodies were ever meant to have anything injected into them through a needle. Our bodies are meant to take things in through the mouth, through the skin, through the nose. There are barriers and defenses in place and injections bypass those.

[JohnnyL]

Interestingly, in March of 2008, the U.S. government conceded that childhood vaccines were responsible for the autism in 9-year-old Hannah Poling. This unprecedented concession was in response to one of three test cases that allege thimerosal caused autism in children.

I still want a source for this. I'm somewhat on the fence about vaccines. I know that they're pushed far too much, too quickly, too early, and that there is an element of financial exploitation and fear-mongering. But I also believe that at least some of them are good and helpful to have. I think that some of the science behind the immunity it claims is valid, even if not flawless.

I don't like the biased and occasionally "half-truthy" way that opponents of vaccines present their claims with, it reminded me of marijuana proponents who exaggerate whatever benefits they're trying to sell people on while , but I also don't like the brainwashed-level of accusation and finger-pointing that its proponents use, or that their paranoia over it is often enough that they would seek to enforce their idea of what is best for a child on people who disagree with them, whether or not that disagreement is well-founded according to a given government-sponsored body.

As for the Amnish? I'm not sure we medically track enough of them to say that they do or do not develop cancer, polio, or whatever else.

www.whale.to

[setyourselffree]

I do not believe our bodies were ever meant to have anything injected into them through a needle. Our bodies are meant to take things in through the mouth, through the skin, through the nose. There are barriers and defenses in place and injections bypass those.

Okay!!!

[eddie]

Just to be clear, ingesting aluminum is much different than injecting aluminum. The body has a system set up to reject the aluminum that someone ingests - when injected subcutaneously or into the muscle, the body no longer has those defenses. Additionally, certain ingredients within vaccines like Polysorbate 80 can actually open up (in laman's terms) the blood brain barrier allowing aluminum to enter into the brain. I don't think anyone is arguing that some people are fine when injected with vaccines, but there are certainly and exorbitant amount of injuries (both minor and major) that are occurring that might not have occurred because of vaccines. Furthermore, vaccines may not be the sole cause of these injuries, but they might merely be the straw that breaks the camel's back, so-to-say because of other factors. The amount of testing that goes into vaccinations is abhorrent, in that there is very little testing. Most vaccines do not offer lifetime immunity and the majority of the American population is likely under-vaccinated because their "vaccine immunity" has worn off. As an aside, whether you vaccinate or not should be a parental or personal choice and with the exception of the Hep B vaccine (which in my opinion is pointless unless you use drugs -with needles- and were a crack whore or your small just-born child is sexually active and will be so for the next 10 years or so) vaccines are almost completely ineffective for children under the age of 1 especially when being fed breast milk.

I disagree. Vaccines are one of the most tested piece of medicine that we have. They are tested over and over and over, proven safe. Then there will be one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr and people believe we have a conspiracy on our hands. Pediatricians and immunologists like humans, children in particular. They are not out to get us. As vaccinations have gone up, our world population has soared. A lot of your data is just wrong. At least according to reputable scientists who are experts on the subject. There is so much misinformation about vaccines out there and some know just the trigger words to make vulnerable people doubt established science.

Wow! Speaking of mis-information, this response couldn't be more wrong. How dare you say one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr, are you calling us stupid? We who have seen first hand a child who is normal and even saying a few words go from normal to a little boy with blank eyes who never speaks again, right after receiving the MMR vaccine? A little boy who was so sick, who within a short time was gone, blank, never to be potty trained, parents who look 10 years older than they are. A neighborhood with autistic children, parents and teachers struggling to figure out these children. Vulnerable people or vulnerable children? Trigger words? Nope, real life, you know not of what you speak.

[The Airbender]

There are so many things wrong with vaccines. Heavy metals are just one part. For another, vaccines are grown on human tissue. Injecting human brain tissue, for instance, can make a child allergic to their own brain tissue. Sounds safe to me.

[setyourselffree]

Just to be clear, ingesting aluminum is much different than injecting aluminum. The body has a system set up to reject the aluminum that someone ingests - when injected subcutaneously or into the muscle, the body no longer has those defenses. Additionally, certain ingredients within vaccines like Polysorbate 80 can actually open up (in laman's terms) the blood brain barrier allowing aluminum to enter into the brain. I don't think anyone is arguing that some people are fine when injected with vaccines, but there are certainly and exorbitant amount of injuries (both minor and major) that are occurring that might not have occurred because of vaccines. Furthermore, vaccines may not be the sole cause of these injuries, but they might merely be the straw that breaks the camel's back, so-to-say because of other factors. The amount of testing that goes into vaccinations is abhorrent, in that there is very little testing. Most vaccines do not offer lifetime immunity and the majority of the American population is likely under-vaccinated because their "vaccine immunity" has worn off. As an aside, whether you vaccinate or not should be a parental or personal choice and with the exception of the Hep B vaccine (which in my opinion is pointless unless you use drugs -with needles- and were a crack whore or your small just-born child is sexually active and will be so for the next 10 years or so) vaccines are almost completely ineffective for children under the age of 1 especially when being fed breast milk.

I disagree. Vaccines are one of the most tested piece of medicine that we have. They are tested over and over and over, proven safe. Then there will be one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr and people believe we have a conspiracy on our hands. Pediatricians and immunologists like humans, children in particular. They are not out to get us. As vaccinations have gone up, our world population has soared. A lot of your data is just wrong. At least according to reputable scientists who are experts on the subject. There is so much misinformation about vaccines out there and some know just the trigger words to make vulnerable people doubt established science.

Wow! Speaking of mis-information, this response couldn't be more wrong. How dare you say one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr, are you calling us stupid? We who have seen first hand a child who is normal and even saying a few words go from normal to a little boy with blank eyes who never speaks again, right after receiving the MMR vaccine? A little boy who was so sick, who within a short time was gone, blank, never to be potty trained, parents who look 10 years older than they are. A neighborhood with autistic children, parents and teachers struggling to figure out these children. Vulnerable people or vulnerable children? Trigger words? Nope, real life, you know not of what you speak.

I think it's the opposite. You have no clue. Nor will you listen to study after study debunking vaccinations cause autism.

[eddie]

Just to be clear, ingesting aluminum is much different than injecting aluminum. The body has a system set up to reject the aluminum that someone ingests - when injected subcutaneously or into the muscle, the body no longer has those defenses. Additionally, certain ingredients within vaccines like Polysorbate 80 can actually open up (in laman's terms) the blood brain barrier allowing aluminum to enter into the brain. I don't think anyone is arguing that some people are fine when injected with vaccines, but there are certainly and exorbitant amount of injuries (both minor and major) that are occurring that might not have occurred because of vaccines. Furthermore, vaccines may not be the sole cause of these injuries, but they might merely be the straw that breaks the camel's back, so-to-say because of other factors. The amount of testing that goes into vaccinations is abhorrent, in that there is very little testing. Most vaccines do not offer lifetime immunity and the majority of the American population is likely under-vaccinated because their "vaccine immunity" has worn off. As an aside, whether you vaccinate or not should be a parental or personal choice and with the exception of the Hep B vaccine (which in my opinion is pointless unless you use drugs -with needles- and were a crack whore or your small just-born child is sexually active and will be so for the next 10 years or so) vaccines are almost completely ineffective for children under the age of 1 especially when being fed breast milk.

I disagree. Vaccines are one of the most tested piece of medicine that we have. They are tested over and over and over, proven safe. Then there will be one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr and people believe we have a conspiracy on our hands. Pediatricians and immunologists like humans, children in particular. They are not out to get us. As vaccinations have gone up, our world population has soared. A lot of your data is just wrong. At least according to reputable scientists who are experts on the subject. There is so much misinformation about vaccines out there and some know just the trigger words to make vulnerable people doubt established science.

Wow! Speaking of mis-information, this response couldn't be more wrong. How dare you say one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr, are you calling us stupid? We who have seen first hand a child who is normal and even saying a few words go from normal to a little boy with blank eyes who never speaks again, right after receiving the MMR vaccine? A little boy who was so sick, who within a short time was gone, blank, never to be potty trained, parents who look 10 years older than they are. A neighborhood with autistic children, parents and teachers struggling to figure out these children. Vulnerable people or vulnerable children? Trigger words? Nope, real life, you know not of what you speak.

I think it's the opposite. You have no clue. Nor will you listen to study after study debunking vaccinations cause autism.

And who do you listen to? The FDA and the CDC? How gullible can a person be!
History is replete with examples of drugs causing far more harm than good. Vioxx is one classic example. It killed about 60,000 people before being withdrawn from the market.

[JohnnyL]

Just to be clear, ingesting aluminum is much different than injecting aluminum. The body has a system set up to reject the aluminum that someone ingests - when injected subcutaneously or into the muscle, the body no longer has those defenses. Additionally, certain ingredients within vaccines like Polysorbate 80 can actually open up (in laman's terms) the blood brain barrier allowing aluminum to enter into the brain. I don't think anyone is arguing that some people are fine when injected with vaccines, but there are certainly and exorbitant amount of injuries (both minor and major) that are occurring that might not have occurred because of vaccines. Furthermore, vaccines may not be the sole cause of these injuries, but they might merely be the straw that breaks the camel's back, so-to-say because of other factors. The amount of testing that goes into vaccinations is abhorrent, in that there is very little testing. Most vaccines do not offer lifetime immunity and the majority of the American population is likely under-vaccinated because their "vaccine immunity" has worn off. As an aside, whether you vaccinate or not should be a parental or personal choice and with the exception of the Hep B vaccine (which in my opinion is pointless unless you use drugs -with needles- and were a crack whore or your small just-born child is sexually active and will be so for the next 10 years or so) vaccines are almost completely ineffective for children under the age of 1 especially when being fed breast milk.

I disagree. Vaccines are one of the most tested piece of medicine that we have. They are tested over and over and over, proven safe. Then there will be one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr and people believe we have a conspiracy on our hands. Pediatricians and immunologists like humans, children in particular. They are not out to get us. As vaccinations have gone up, our world population has soared. A lot of your data is just wrong. At least according to reputable scientists who are experts on the subject. There is so much misinformation about vaccines out there and some know just the trigger words to make vulnerable people doubt established science.

Wow! Speaking of mis-information, this response couldn't be more wrong. How dare you say one anecdotal case or one nut job Dr, are you calling us stupid? We who have seen first hand a child who is normal and even saying a few words go from normal to a little boy with blank eyes who never speaks again, right after receiving the MMR vaccine? A little boy who was so sick, who within a short time was gone, blank, never to be potty trained, parents who look 10 years older than they are. A neighborhood with autistic children, parents and teachers struggling to figure out these children. Vulnerable people or vulnerable children? Trigger words? Nope, real life, you know not of what you speak.

I think it's the opposite. You have no clue. Nor will you listen to study after study debunking vaccinations cause autism.

Sources, please.

[JohnnyL]

I am pro vaccine after careful research. There are chemicals in everything. There is more aluminum in breast milk than a vaccine. The number of vaccines has gone up, but the number of antigens in each vaccine has gone lower, so they are much less reactive than older vaccines. I have had all 6 of mine vaccinated with everything they can have as soon as it's available, and I have 6 healthy and happy kids. No allergies, no auto-immune disorders.

The Hannah Poling case is so rare, which is why it made the news. She had a rare metabolically disorder which made her extra vulnerable. Vaccines aren't 100% safe, but they are safer than most of our daily activities. Your child is more likely to choke to death on a grape or killed in a care accident than to be vaccine injured.

I honestly don't understand anti-vaccine conservatives and preppers. If society does collapse, all the fancy hospitals and antibiotics are going away. Measles is the 1800s, was way more deadly than it is now. Can you imagine measles, polio, diptheria going around a refugee camp or evacuation center? My great uncle died from tetanus. Venezuala is experiencing a lot of these problems right now.

It's better to get the vaccines during the good times in case the bad times ever come. It would take one generation of kids not getting vaccinated and these diseases would return. I am happy my kids are safe in that scenario.

I am anti-vaccine after little careful research--the research is so evident (IF you can find the right sites), careful research is not really needed.
It's much better research than any pro-vaccine, which is pretty much non-existent.

There are many reasons to avoid vaccines. You might not have read some of them.

The Hannah Poling case is so rare because there was no way they could sneak out of it.

Source for safer than grapes, please.

Because many of us don't use fancy hospitals and antibiotics. Or maybe, because we know they will go away.

Yes, I can imagine it going around. If it's like now, most of the vaccinated will catch it, and others might not. Because these weren't due to vaccines, but washing hands, etc. How about you vaccinated for polio, then go into that camp for a week? What do you believe will happen?
Why do these outbreaks/ pandemics hit the vaccinated the hardest?

Let me ask: how many articles have you read on www.whale.to?

[markharr]

Genetic sequencing science breakthrough just proved that measles “outbreaks” are caused by the measles vaccine

https://www.naturalnews.com/2019-03-06- ... ccine.html

[mtm411]

This thread is so full of misinformation and bad science resources. It seems critical thinking skills missed a few people. Natural news isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

[mtm411]

You do realize the church is paying to vaccinate many against measles, and the first presidency issued a statement in support of vaccination? They often don't take a stand on much, but they are quite clear on vaccine support.

[JohnnyL]

You do realize the church is paying to vaccinate many against measles, and the first presidency issued a statement in support of vaccination? They often don't take a stand on much, but they are quite clear on vaccine support.

The members force it. It's for legal purposes. You can opt out, as you can also with pulling wisdom teeth.
How much research have they done? I'd say, little, and almost no research on a good con-vaccine website. Besides, not many years ago, when they were taught, it wasn't easy to know vaccinations were bad.

[JohnnyL]

This thread is so full of misinformation and bad science resources. It seems critical thinking skills missed a few people. Natural news isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

I agree with you on this about 1/4 of the time.

(Luckily, it's printed digitally. )

[abijah]

I have multiple cousins with autism. Pretty severe too, they’re well known in the community. The transformation of one post-vaccination was staggering. I was actually living with my uncle at the time so I saw it firsthand. He was a sociable, playful, normal toddler.

Literally days afterward he was gone. Like outer-space gone. Severe autism, he’s a preteen now and still won’t talk or interact at all save a few words here & there.

I’m not very knowledgeable about vaccines, but that turned me off for them from a pretty early age. I don’t see myself vaccinating my children.

[mtm411]

I have multiple cousins with autism. Pretty severe too, they’re well known in the community. The transformation of one post-vaccination was staggering. I was actually living with my uncle at the time so I saw it firsthand. He was a sociable, playful, normal toddler.

Literally days afterward he was gone. Like outer-space gone. Severe autism, he’s a preteen now and still won’t talk or interact at all save a few words here & there.

I’m not very knowledgeable about vaccines, but that turned me off for them from a pretty early age. I don’t see myself vaccinating my children.

I mean this with all due condolences for your family member's condition, but the anecdotal experiences of children turning autistic after vaccines are myth. Autism is genetic and runs in families. It's increasing because more autistic people are successful and having families these days than they did in the past. A lot of the milder traits are actually really good in today's economy. Another big risk factor is paternal age at birth. Men are having babies older on average than they did in the past.

It just so happens that the first symptoms of autism aren't super apparent until about the age a child is vaccinated. Parents are just watching the child more when they are vaccinated, and first notice the symptoms. It's human nature to blame something not related if they happen close together, which is why we need scientific studies and not rely on anecdotes.

Many autistic toddlers practice mimicking behaviors making them look like they are interacting socially. It isn't until they get just slightly older that you realize they aren't quite like other kids their age, and it becomes more apparent the older they get.

https://annals.org/aim/fullarticle/2727 ... hort-study

This study was just conducted in Denmark. It's very large and proves that MMR vaccine does not cause autism. Strangley, kids were slightly more likely to be diagnosed with autism if they weren't vaccinated. MMR still didn't make kids autistic who had autistic siblings. There was absolutely no correlation.

People who preach against vaccines are trying to sell essential oils, Energy healing, books and other products. Big pharma is real, but so is big naturopathy.

[setyourselffree]

I have multiple cousins with autism. Pretty severe too, they’re well known in the community. The transformation of one post-vaccination was staggering. I was actually living with my uncle at the time so I saw it firsthand. He was a sociable, playful, normal toddler.

Literally days afterward he was gone. Like outer-space gone. Severe autism, he’s a preteen now and still won’t talk or interact at all save a few words here & there.

I’m not very knowledgeable about vaccines, but that turned me off for them from a pretty early age. I don’t see myself vaccinating my children.

Sounds like genetics. Not vaccinations.

[FattyArBeltBuckle]

Autism is genetic and runs in families. It's increasing because more autistic people are successful and having families these days than they did in the past.

Not true.

[markharr]

This thread is so full of misinformation and bad science resources. It seems critical thinking skills missed a few people. Natural news isn't worth the paper it's printed on.

Weak argument because you cant refute the findings published in the journal of clinical microbiology it was referenced in the article, but you would have to actually read it to know that.

https://jcm.asm.org/content/55/3/735