Progression from Telestial Kingdom

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Silver
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Silver »

Telestial Kingdom
From The Encyclopedia of Mormonism

Author: Williams, Clyde J.

The Telestial Kingdom in Latter-day Saint understanding is the lowest of the three degrees of glory to be inhabited by God's children in the afterlife following the resurrection. The Doctrine and Covenants is the only known scriptural source for the word "telestial" (see D&C 76:88, 98, 109;88:21). Paul spoke of the differing glories, comparing them to the differences in light we see from the sun, moon, and stars (1 Cor. 15:40-42), mentioning the celestial and terrestrial by name. Although the term "telestial" does not occur in biblical accounts, latter-day revelation cites telestial as the kingdom of glory typified by the lesser light we perceive from the stars (D&C 76:98). The Celestial Kingdom and Terrestrial Kingdom are typified by the light we perceive from the sun and moon, respectively.

Within the telestial glory there will be varying degrees of glory even as the stars vary in brightness as we see them. It embraces those who on earth willfully reject the gospel of Jesus Christ, and commit serious sins such as murder, adultery, lying, and loving to make a lie (but yet do not commit the unpardonable sin), and who do not repent in mortality. They will be cleansed in the postmortal spirit world or spirit prison before the resurrection (D&C 76:81-85, 98-106; Rev. 22:15). Telestial inhabitants as innumerable as the stars will come forth in the last resurrection and then be "servants of the Most High; but where God and Christ dwell they cannot come" (D&C 76:112). Although the least of the degrees of glory, yet the Telestial Kingdom "surpasses all understanding" (D&C 76:89).

HappyCamper8
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Silver wrote: January 25th, 2018, 3:22 pm Telestial Kingdom
From The Encyclopedia of Mormonism

Author: Williams, Clyde J.

The Telestial Kingdom in Latter-day Saint understanding is the lowest of the three degrees of glory to be inhabited by God's children in the afterlife following the resurrection. The Doctrine and Covenants is the only known scriptural source for the word "telestial" (see D&C 76:88, 98, 109;88:21). Paul spoke of the differing glories, comparing them to the differences in light we see from the sun, moon, and stars (1 Cor. 15:40-42), mentioning the celestial and terrestrial by name. Although the term "telestial" does not occur in biblical accounts, latter-day revelation cites telestial as the kingdom of glory typified by the lesser light we perceive from the stars (D&C 76:98). The Celestial Kingdom and Terrestrial Kingdom are typified by the light we perceive from the sun and moon, respectively.

Within the telestial glory there will be varying degrees of glory even as the stars vary in brightness as we see them. It embraces those who on earth willfully reject the gospel of Jesus Christ, and commit serious sins such as murder, adultery, lying, and loving to make a lie (but yet do not commit the unpardonable sin), and who do not repent in mortality. They will be cleansed in the postmortal spirit world or spirit prison before the resurrection (D&C 76:81-85, 98-106; Rev. 22:15). Telestial inhabitants as innumerable as the stars will come forth in the last resurrection and then be "servants of the Most High; but where God and Christ dwell they cannot come" (D&C 76:112). Although the least of the degrees of glory, yet the Telestial Kingdom "surpasses all understanding" (D&C 76:89).
Thanks. Who is Clyde J. Williams?

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Robin Hood
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Robin Hood »

Progression from one kingdom to another is clearly laid out in the endowment ceremony. In many temples physically moving from the telestial to the terrestrial room is part of the ordinance.

As for this world being the telestial kingdom; not only is it directly stated, but it is pretty obvious. Imagine this world without Lucifer and his cohorts and you have a telestial kingdom of "glory".

That is why Pres. Kimball stated that those who spend their lives here building up a worldly kingdom, will inherit exactly that.

Spaced_Out
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:42 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:35 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:29 pm Awesome. Thanks. Sounds like what I was saying. But still not sure why if you believe you can be sealed in the telestial kingdom, you can't in the terrestrial. Thanks!
The ordinances of salvation have to be done on this earth - which can also be accomplished during the millennium when the earth will be terrestrial. Again it has nothing to do with the state the earth is in - they are celestial laws and ordinances that require a person live a celestial law in order to be worthy and performed in a place that represents celestial.
Thanks. Where are people getting the idea that Joseph taught in Nauvoo that we are in the telestial kingdom right now and the millenium will be the terrestrial kingdom? I'd like to see reference to it but haven't seen it myself. Thanks.
Here is one reference speaking of the earth during the millennium that it changes as it was in the days prior to the fall of Adam (paradise). We also know from scripture that those entering the celestial and terrestrial kingdoms will be on earth during the millennium those inheriting the Telestial kingdom will be in spirit prison during the millennium.

10 We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.

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iWriteStuff
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by iWriteStuff »

Robin Hood wrote: January 25th, 2018, 3:31 pm Progression from one kingdom to another is clearly laid out in the endowment ceremony. In many temples physically moving from the telestial to the terrestrial room is part of the ordinance.

As for this world being the telestial kingdom; not only is it directly stated, but it is pretty obvious. Imagine this world without Lucifer and his cohorts and you have a telestial kingdom of "glory".

That is why Pres. Kimball stated that those who spend their lives here building up a worldly kingdom, will inherit exactly that.
Curious how you interpret the progression statement. Progression pre-Resurrection or post? Adam and Eve aren't dead yet in the temple ordinances - they are learning the covenants necessary to progress spiritually while in their mortal bodies. It is the process of separating from the world while gradually learning celestial law, line upon line. How do you get from there to movement between kingdoms of glory post-Resurrection?

Not saying you're wrong, I'm just not sure I understand how one extrapolates one from the other.

Spaced_Out
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

There is no progression between kingdoms of Glory - we are not now currently in a kingdom of glory - it might be said we are in a kingdom representative of telestial - but it is not a kingdom of glory. Once resurrected that is the end of our state - and we are judged by the law we live. We are placed in the greatest state of happiness we are able to receive.

Moron 9:2 Behold, will ye believe in the day of your visitation—behold, when the Lord shall come, yea, even that great day when the earth shall be rolled together as a scroll, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, yea, in that great day when ye shall be brought to stand before the Lamb of God—then will ye say that there is no God?
3 Then will ye longer deny the Christ, or can ye behold the Lamb of God? Do ye suppose that ye shall dwell with him under a consciousness of your guilt? Do ye suppose that ye could be happy to dwell with that holy Being, when your souls are racked with a consciousness of guilt that ye have ever abused his laws?
4 Behold, I say unto you that ye would be more miserable to dwell with a holy and just God, under a consciousness of your filthiness before him, than ye would to dwell with the damned souls in hell.
5 For behold, when ye shall be brought to see your nakedness before God, and also the glory of God, and the holiness of Jesus Christ, it will kindle a flame of unquenchable fire upon you.

Spaced_Out
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

iWriteStuff wrote: January 25th, 2018, 3:38 pm
Robin Hood wrote: January 25th, 2018, 3:31 pm Progression from one kingdom to another is clearly laid out in the endowment ceremony. In many temples physically moving from the telestial to the terrestrial room is part of the ordinance.

As for this world being the telestial kingdom; not only is it directly stated, but it is pretty obvious. Imagine this world without Lucifer and his cohorts and you have a telestial kingdom of "glory".

That is why Pres. Kimball stated that those who spend their lives here building up a worldly kingdom, will inherit exactly that.
Curious how you interpret the progression statement. Progression pre-Resurrection or post? Adam and Eve aren't dead yet in the temple ordinances - they are learning the covenants necessary to progress spiritually while in their mortal bodies. It is the process of separating from the world while gradually learning celestial law, line upon line. How do you get from there to movement between kingdoms of glory post-Resurrection?

Not saying you're wrong, I'm just not sure I understand how one extrapolates one from the other.
It is progression from being born into a telestial world then living on a terrestrial world (millennium) then inheriting the celestial at the conclusion of the millennium. The endowment is promise of future blessings - to be raised and inherit accordingly.

It is not referencing a kingdom of glory or progression between kingdoms of glory - there is no such thing as progression between kingdoms of glory. In the endowment is specific this is the current world we find ourselves in.

HappyCamper8
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 3:32 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:42 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:35 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:29 pm Awesome. Thanks. Sounds like what I was saying. But still not sure why if you believe you can be sealed in the telestial kingdom, you can't in the terrestrial. Thanks!
The ordinances of salvation have to be done on this earth - which can also be accomplished during the millennium when the earth will be terrestrial. Again it has nothing to do with the state the earth is in - they are celestial laws and ordinances that require a person live a celestial law in order to be worthy and performed in a place that represents celestial.
Thanks. Where are people getting the idea that Joseph taught in Nauvoo that we are in the telestial kingdom right now and the millenium will be the terrestrial kingdom? I'd like to see reference to it but haven't seen it myself. Thanks.
Here is one reference speaking of the earth during the millennium that it changes as it was in the days prior to the fall of Adam (paradise). We also know from scripture that those entering the celestial and terrestrial kingdoms will be on earth during the millennium those inheriting the Telestial kingdom will be in spirit prison during the millennium.

10 We believe in the literal gathering of Israel and in the restoration of the Ten Tribes; that Zion (the New Jerusalem) will be built upon the American continent; that Christ will reign personally upon the earth; and, that the earth will be renewed and receive its paradisiacal glory.
Thanks. Something to think about in relation to kingdoms etc.

HappyCamper8
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Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 3:42 pm There is no progression between kingdoms of Glory - we are not now currently in a kingdom of glory - it might be said we are in a kingdom representative of telestial - but it is not a kingdom of glory. Once resurrected that is the end of our state - and we are judged by the law we live. We are placed in the greatest state of happiness we are able to receive.

Moron 9:2 Behold, will ye believe in the day of your visitation—behold, when the Lord shall come, yea, even that great day when the earth shall be rolled together as a scroll, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, yea, in that great day when ye shall be brought to stand before the Lamb of God—then will ye say that there is no God?
3 Then will ye longer deny the Christ, or can ye behold the Lamb of God? Do ye suppose that ye shall dwell with him under a consciousness of your guilt? Do ye suppose that ye could be happy to dwell with that holy Being, when your souls are racked with a consciousness of guilt that ye have ever abused his laws?
4 Behold, I say unto you that ye would be more miserable to dwell with a holy and just God, under a consciousness of your filthiness before him, than ye would to dwell with the damned souls in hell.
5 For behold, when ye shall be brought to see your nakedness before God, and also the glory of God, and the holiness of Jesus Christ, it will kindle a flame of unquenchable fire upon you.
I'm not quite sure exactly what you are saying here. Are you saying we are not in the telestial kingdom?
Or, that we are in the telestial kingdom, but don't have telestial glory, but that we can progress from kingdom to kingdom, but not glory to glory?

If so, I need to think about that some. I wonder if that is semantics also? Not sure.

Where are you getting this part from?
"Once resurrected that is the end of our state"

Thanks.

ps. Thanks everybody for answering questions. Not sure why but it seemed like before when asking questions, nobody would answer, but just attack me. Was trying to figure out what was going on.

HappyCamper8
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Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Robin Hood wrote: January 25th, 2018, 3:31 pm Progression from one kingdom to another is clearly laid out in the endowment ceremony. In many temples physically moving from the telestial to the terrestrial room is part of the ordinance.

As for this world being the telestial kingdom; not only is it directly stated, but it is pretty obvious. Imagine this world without Lucifer and his cohorts and you have a telestial kingdom of "glory".

That is why Pres. Kimball stated that those who spend their lives here building up a worldly kingdom, will inherit exactly that.
Are you in agreement with spaced_out that we are in a kingdom but not glory and that we can progress from kingdom to kingdom, but not glory to glory? (If I understood what he was saying correctly).

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gclayjr
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by gclayjr »

HappyCamper8,
I'm not quite sure exactly what you are saying here. Are you saying we are not in the telestial kingdom?
That is correct we are on A telestial Earth, but not in THE Telestial Kingdom.

The earth is currently telestial, in that the quality of life and "glory" we are living is telestial. It is NOT THE testial kingdom, which is another place, with a similar level pain and glory.

Those Kingdoms are places we go AFTER Judgment. I did a topic here where I explained that the most important thing to do in this 2nd estate is to chose which direction we are going. It is important to make progress and get to a better place, however this is nowhere nearly as important as choosing who we will follow. The key reason for this 2nd estate is to choose who we will follow. This 2nd estate lasts from this mortal life, through the spirit world until judgment. During our stay here, and during our stay in the spirit world, we can choose, and change our minds as to who we are going to follow. However, after the judgment, your course is set. There is no changing it. You can progress in whichever kingdom,. you are judged to go, but you cannot change your kingdom.

So choose wisely, for this is the time to choose who you will serve.

Regards,

George Clay

HappyCamper8
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Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

gclayjr wrote: January 25th, 2018, 5:49 pm HappyCamper8,
I'm not quite sure exactly what you are saying here. Are you saying we are not in the telestial kingdom?
That is correct we are on A telestial Earth, but not in THE Telestial Kingdom.

The earth is currently telestial, in that the quality of life and "glory" we are living is telestial. It is NOT THE testial kingdom, which is another place, with a similar level pain and glory.

Those Kingdoms are places we go AFTER Judgment. I did a topic here where I explained that the most important thing to do in this 2nd estate is to chose which direction we are going. It is important to make progress and get to a better place, however this is nowhere nearly as important as choosing who we will follow. The key reason for this 2nd estate is to choose who we will follow. This 2nd estate lasts from this mortal life, through the spirit world until judgment. During our stay here, and during our stay in the spirit world, we can choose, and change our minds as to who we are going to follow. However, after the judgment, your course is set. There is no changing it. You can progress in whichever kingdom,. you are judged to go, but you cannot change your kingdom.

So choose wisely, for this is the time to choose who you will serve.

Regards,

George Clay
Thanks for your comments! Holland actually said THE telestial kingdom. Do you think he misspoke?

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gclayjr
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by gclayjr »

HappyCamper8,

I'm not sure of the exact quote and context you are referring to, however, it is possible that he did not use the term imprecisely



Talk from Russel M. Nelson
It is true that scriptures foretell the final days of the earth’s temporal existence as a telestial sphere. The earth will then be renewed and receive its paradisiacal, or terrestrial, glory. (See A of F 1:10.) Ultimately, the earth will become celestialized. (See Rev. 21:1; D&C 77:1; D&C 88:25–26.) But its last days must be preceded by its latter days!

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... d?lang=eng

Regards,

George Clay

PS: I quickly checked this thread and did not see a reference. If you post the link to Pres Holland's talk I would be glad to read it.

Spaced_Out
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 4:53 pm I'm not quite sure exactly what you are saying here. Are you saying we are not in the telestial kingdom?
Or, that we are in the telestial kingdom, but don't have telestial glory, but that we can progress from kingdom to kingdom, but not glory to glory?

If so, I need to think about that some. I wonder if that is semantics also? Not sure.

Where are you getting this part from?
"Once resurrected that is the end of our state"

Thanks.

ps. Thanks everybody for answering questions. Not sure why but it seemed like before when asking questions, nobody would answer, but just attack me. Was trying to figure out what was going on.
We came down from the preexistence to the earth that is in a fallen state telestial- then in the millennium earth is changed to terrestrial state. The earth is later changed to celestial state, which is the final state the earth will be in.

The big problem is the disconnect between the state the earth is in and our spiritual state or the state of our progression. They are simply not the same thing. Abraham is already and exalted God the city of Enoch was taken up to heaven - All the righteous from Adam down to Jesus have already been resurrected to their final state. Jesus is also an exalted God in a celestial body but will live on earth for 1,000y while the earth is in a terrrestrial state.

It is a 3 lap race for us preexistence and mortal life then resurrection to a body of glory. God's entire purpose is the immortality and eternal life of man. Resurrection is to immortality and that is the final state never a separation of body and spirit again...
The Time to Prepare
Joseph B. Wirthlin
Of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... e?lang=eng
This is the day of our mortal probation. We might compare our eternal journey to a race of three laps around the track. We have completed the first lap successfully and have made wonderful progress. We have started on the second lap. Can you imagine a world-class runner stopping along the track at this point to pick flowers or chase a rabbit that crossed his path? Yet this is what we are doing when we occupy our time with worldly pursuits that do not move us closer to the third lap toward eternal life, the greatest of all the gifts of God.9
By Elder Paul V. Johnson
Of the Seventy. https://www.lds.org/liahona/2016/05/sun ... country=au
After resurrection, the spirit will never again be separated from the body because the Savior’s Resurrection brought total victory over death. In order to obtain our eternal destiny, we need to have this immortal soul—a spirit and body—united forever. With spirit and immortal body inseparably connected, we can “receive a fulness of joy.”7 In fact, without the Resurrection we could never receive a fulness of joy but would be miserable forever.8 Even faithful, righteous people view the separation of their bodies from their spirits as captivity. We are released from this captivity through the Resurrection, which is redemption from the bands or chains of death.9 There is no salvation without both our spirit and our body.
D&C1:37 Search these commandments, for they are true and faithful, and the prophecies and promises which are in them shall all be fulfilled.
Alma 11:45
45 Now, behold, I have spoken unto you concerning the death of the mortal body, and also concerning the resurrection of the mortal body. I say unto you that this mortal body is raised to an immortal body, that is from death, even from the first death unto life, that they can die no more; their spirits uniting with their bodies, never to be divided; thus the whole becoming spiritual and immortal, that they can no more see corruption.

HappyCamper8
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Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

gclayjr wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:18 pm HappyCamper8,

I'm not sure of the exact quote and context you are referring to, however, it is possible that he did not use the term imprecisely



Talk from Russel M. Nelson
It is true that scriptures foretell the final days of the earth’s temporal existence as a telestial sphere. The earth will then be renewed and receive its paradisiacal, or terrestrial, glory. (See A of F 1:10.) Ultimately, the earth will become celestialized. (See Rev. 21:1; D&C 77:1; D&C 88:25–26.) But its last days must be preceded by its latter days!

https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... d?lang=eng

Regards,

George Clay

PS: I quickly checked this thread and did not see a reference. If you post the link to Pres Holland's talk I would be glad to read it.
Sorry, you are correct. I never put the link.
Be Ye Therefore Perfect—Eventually - By Elder Jeffrey R. Holland - The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
(Not at my computer so hope that works)

HappyCamper8
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:22 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 4:53 pm I'm not quite sure exactly what you are saying here. Are you saying we are not in the telestial kingdom?
Or, that we are in the telestial kingdom, but don't have telestial glory, but that we can progress from kingdom to kingdom, but not glory to glory?

If so, I need to think about that some. I wonder if that is semantics also? Not sure.

Where are you getting this part from?
"Once resurrected that is the end of our state"

Thanks.

ps. Thanks everybody for answering questions. Not sure why but it seemed like before when asking questions, nobody would answer, but just attack me. Was trying to figure out what was going on.
We came down from the preexistence to the earth that is in a fallen state telestial- then in the millennium earth is changed to terrestrial state. The earth is later changed to celestial state, which is the final state the earth will be in.

The big problem is the disconnect between the state the earth is in and our spiritual state or the state of our progression. They are simply not the same thing. Abraham is already and exalted God the city of Enoch was taken up to heaven - All the righteous from Adam down to Jesus have already been resurrected to their final state. Jesus is also an exalted God in a celestial body but will live on earth for 1,000y while the earth is in a terrrestrial state.

It is a 3 lap race for us preexistence and mortal life then resurrection to a body of glory. God's entire purpose is the immortality and eternal life of man. Resurrection is to immortality and that is the final state never a separation of body and spirit again...
The Time to Prepare
Joseph B. Wirthlin
Of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles, https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... e?lang=eng
This is the day of our mortal probation. We might compare our eternal journey to a race of three laps around the track. We have completed the first lap successfully and have made wonderful progress. We have started on the second lap. Can you imagine a world-class runner stopping along the track at this point to pick flowers or chase a rabbit that crossed his path? Yet this is what we are doing when we occupy our time with worldly pursuits that do not move us closer to the third lap toward eternal life, the greatest of all the gifts of God.9
By Elder Paul V. Johnson
Of the Seventy. https://www.lds.org/liahona/2016/05/sun ... country=au
After resurrection, the spirit will never again be separated from the body because the Savior’s Resurrection brought total victory over death. In order to obtain our eternal destiny, we need to have this immortal soul—a spirit and body—united forever. With spirit and immortal body inseparably connected, we can “receive a fulness of joy.”7 In fact, without the Resurrection we could never receive a fulness of joy but would be miserable forever.8 Even faithful, righteous people view the separation of their bodies from their spirits as captivity. We are released from this captivity through the Resurrection, which is redemption from the bands or chains of death.9 There is no salvation without both our spirit and our body.
D&C1:37 Search these commandments, for they are true and faithful, and the prophecies and promises which are in them shall all be fulfilled.
Alma 11:45
45 Now, behold, I have spoken unto you concerning the death of the mortal body, and also concerning the resurrection of the mortal body. I say unto you that this mortal body is raised to an immortal body, that is from death, even from the first death unto life, that they can die no more; their spirits uniting with their bodies, never to be divided; thus the whole becoming spiritual and immortal, that they can no more see corruption.
I'm pretty sure that's not correct. (All righteous from Adam to Christ are resurrected). Otherwise, all ancient bones are wicked people. Including children.

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gclayjr
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by gclayjr »

happyCamper8,

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865 ... ually.html

I read this 2X and didn't find what you were referring to. I live in Pa... 2hrs ahead of you (Assuming you live in Utah) so I will not be reading anything more today. Maybe when you get a chance, you can check either your reference, or my reading and post a clearer reference, and I will be glad to read it.

Regards,

George clay

HappyCamper8
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Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

gclayjr wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:43 pm happyCamper8,

https://www.deseretnews.com/article/865 ... ually.html

I read this 2X and didn't find what you were referring to. I live in Pa... 2hrs ahead of you (Assuming you live in Utah) so I will not be reading anything more today. Maybe when you get a chance, you can check either your reference, or my reading and post a clearer reference, and I will be glad to read it.

Regards,

George clay
What you linked to is an article/commentary on his talk. You would need to go to the talk on lds.org or the gospel library.

It doesn't look like my link worked. I'll have to fix that when I'm at my computer.

Spaced_Out
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:38 pm I'm pretty sure that's not correct. (All righteous from Adam to Christ are resurrected). Otherwise, all ancient bones are wicked people. Including children.
There are a few scriptures on the event.
D&C 138:14 All these had departed the mortal life, firm in the hope of a glorious resurrection, through the grace of God the Father and his Only Begotten Son, Jesus Christ.
15 I beheld that they were filled with joy and gladness, and were rejoicing together because the day of their deliverance was at hand.
16 They were assembled awaiting the advent of the Son of God into the spirit world, to declare their redemption from the bands of death.
17 Their sleeping dust was to be restored unto its perfect frame, bone to his bone, and the sinews and the flesh upon them, the spirit and the body to be united never again to be divided, that they might receive a fulness of joy.
18 While this vast multitude waited and conversed, rejoicing in the hour of their deliverance from the chains of death, the Son of God appeared, declaring liberty to the captives who had been faithful;
19 And there he preached to them the everlasting gospel, the doctrine of the resurrection and the redemption of mankind from the fall, and from individual sins on conditions of repentance.
Matthew 27:53
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the aholy city, and appeared unto many.
Helaman 14:25
25 And many agraves shall be opened, and shall yield up many of their dead; and many saints shall appear unto many.
3 Nephi 23:9,11
9 Verily I say unto you, I commanded my servant Samuel, the Lamanite, that he should testify unto this people, that at the day that the Father should glorify his name in me that there were many saints who should arise from the dead, and should appear unto many, and should minister unto them. And he said unto them: Was it not so?

HappyCamper8
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Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 8:00 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:38 pm I'm pretty sure that's not correct. (All righteous from Adam to Christ are resurrected). Otherwise, all ancient bones are wicked people. Including children.
There are a few scriptures on the event.
D&C 138:14 All these had departed the mortal life, firm in the hope of a glorious resurrection, through the grace of God the Father and his Only Begotten Son, Jesus Christ.
15 I beheld that they were filled with joy and gladness, and were rejoicing together because the day of their deliverance was at hand.
16 They were assembled awaiting the advent of the Son of God into the spirit world, to declare their redemption from the bands of death.
17 Their sleeping dust was to be restored unto its perfect frame, bone to his bone, and the sinews and the flesh upon them, the spirit and the body to be united never again to be divided, that they might receive a fulness of joy.
18 While this vast multitude waited and conversed, rejoicing in the hour of their deliverance from the chains of death, the Son of God appeared, declaring liberty to the captives who had been faithful;
19 And there he preached to them the everlasting gospel, the doctrine of the resurrection and the redemption of mankind from the fall, and from individual sins on conditions of repentance.
Matthew 27:53
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the aholy city, and appeared unto many.
Helaman 14:25
25 And many agraves shall be opened, and shall yield up many of their dead; and many saints shall appear unto many.
3 Nephi 23:9,11
9 Verily I say unto you, I commanded my servant Samuel, the Lamanite, that he should testify unto this people, that at the day that the Father should glorify his name in me that there were many saints who should arise from the dead, and should appear unto many, and should minister unto them. And he said unto them: Was it not so?
Those seem to say many not all though. Which would make more sense otherwise all those skeletons we could judge to be not righteous.

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 4:53 pm ps. Thanks everybody for answering questions. Not sure why but it seemed like before when asking questions, nobody would answer, but just attack me. Was trying to figure out what was going on.
There are very many anit-LDS on this site and the war that was started in heaven rages on in full fury on LDSFF. Progressions within kingdoms of glory is one of the key issues that distinguish many anti-LDS. As soon as a person is thought to be dishonest and not really seeking answers but stirring up trouble - it is full on attack and things go nuclear very quickly.

Many anti -LDS are sent here to overrun the forum with rubbish questions like progression between kingdoms of Glory There are so many scriptures and teachings from LDS prophets on the subject - there is no much to discuss...

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 8:03 pm Those seem to say many not all though. Which would make more sense otherwise all those skeletons we could judge to be not righteous.
Yeah there are other qualification requirements like baptism - the work for the dead had not started. D&C 138 describe those waiting in the spirit word for their resurrection as righteous - so I use the same language as the scripture.

Silver
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5247

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Silver »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 8:16 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 4:53 pm ps. Thanks everybody for answering questions. Not sure why but it seemed like before when asking questions, nobody would answer, but just attack me. Was trying to figure out what was going on.
There are very many anit-LDS on this site and the war that was started in heaven rages on in full fury on LDSFF. Progressions within kingdoms of glory is one of the key issues that distinguish many anti-LDS. As soon as a person is thought to be dishonest and not really seeking answers but stirring up trouble - it is full on attack and things go nuclear very quickly.

Many anti -LDS are sent here to overrun the forum with rubbish questions like progression between kingdoms of Glory There are so many scriptures and teachings from LDS prophets on the subject - there is no much to discuss...
Sadly, you're right. If Elder Holland had really wanted to say that this earth in its present state is the ultimate destination for all those bound for The Telestial Kingdom, he would have done so with much more explanation. But wait, he wouldn't do that in the first place because it wouldn't be true. However, when he says we live in the telestial kingdom, pointedly with a little "t" and clarifying that we are not in the celestial (with a little "c") kingdom he was merely referring to the fallen nature of both us (and especially the hypocritical heretics among us) and the world upon which we live.

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 8:19 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 8:03 pm Those seem to say many not all though. Which would make more sense otherwise all those skeletons we could judge to be not righteous.
Yeah there are other qualification requirements like baptism - the work for the dead had not started. D&C 138 describe those waiting in the spirit word for their resurrection as righteous - so I use the same language as the scripture.
Are you saying all the righteous from the time of Adam to Christ have been resurrected? I've never heard anyone argue that before. I'll have to think and research that one more. Thanks

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Silver wrote: January 25th, 2018, 8:21 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 8:16 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 4:53 pm ps. Thanks everybody for answering questions. Not sure why but it seemed like before when asking questions, nobody would answer, but just attack me. Was trying to figure out what was going on.
There are very many anit-LDS on this site and the war that was started in heaven rages on in full fury on LDSFF. Progressions within kingdoms of glory is one of the key issues that distinguish many anti-LDS. As soon as a person is thought to be dishonest and not really seeking answers but stirring up trouble - it is full on attack and things go nuclear very quickly.

Many anti -LDS are sent here to overrun the forum with rubbish questions like progression between kingdoms of Glory There are so many scriptures and teachings from LDS prophets on the subject - there is no much to discuss...
Sadly, you're right. If Elder Holland had really wanted to say that this earth in its present state is the ultimate destination for all those bound for The Telestial Kingdom, he would have done so with much more explanation. But wait, he wouldn't do that in the first place because it wouldn't be true. However, when he says we live in the telestial kingdom, pointedly with a little "t" and clarifying that we are not in the celestial (with a little "c") kingdom he was merely referring to the fallen nature of both us (and especially the hypocritical heretics among us) and the world upon which we live.
I will choose to listen to the words of the brethren. When we go against their words or try to wrest what they say we are on the wrong path.
Thanks for your comments.

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