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When I was involved with the Denver Snuffer movement, one thing that brought me back to the church was the element of patience; something I think is lacking in the DS movement, and it seems the devil is taking advantage of it. There seems to be this self-fulfilling prophecy mindset taking place, as is seen in the failing scripture project. One thing that is also missing from one claiming to be the one mighty and strong is the element of power. I think most everyone outside the movement can see that the movement is failing. There is no evidence of power manifest, no legitimate prophecy fulfillment, and failing leadership.
The scriptures are an "authority". Denver Snuffer is an "authority". You appear to be contradicting yourself and special pleading.Thomas wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 9:46 am The situation we find ourselves in today has scriptural precedent. Almost all people get it wrong. Why? Because they rely on authority or authorities. God has used the scriptures to explain to me how Denver Snuffer conforms to the pattern of prophets from the past. And he has explained to me how the leaders of the church do not even come close to the pattern of true prophets. Snuffer leads us into compliance with the word of God. The leaders of the church do not.
Some corrections. Because we don't have it recorded doesn't mean that Abinadi did not perform any miracles. Also, Abinadi did give a sign. He prophesied that those who murdered him would suffer the same fate as he and they would be driven as wild beast and would burn as he is being burned. This sign was confirmed later in the Book of Mormon.
I have and continue to ask those very questions. It is one reason I have arrived at the tentative conclusion that many things may not mean what we think (or claim we "KNOW") they mean. God is over All, They are the loving spiritual parents of every soul on earth, and I do not believe (in my heart of hearts, the core of my soul) that they capriciously favor and love and bless (eternally speaking) some of their children over others. They are still sending innocent babes down into Muslims families, Hindu families, Buddhist families, non-Mormon/Restoration Christian families, atheist families, etc., etc.
Good afternoon Finrock,Finrock wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:58 am A couple of things that I find which are inconsistent in your paradigm.
The scriptures are an "authority". Denver Snuffer is an "authority". You appear to be contradicting yourself and special pleading.Thomas wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 9:46 am The situation we find ourselves in today has scriptural precedent. Almost all people get it wrong. Why? Because they rely on authority or authorities. God has used the scriptures to explain to me how Denver Snuffer conforms to the pattern of prophets from the past. And he has explained to me how the leaders of the church do not even come close to the pattern of true prophets. Snuffer leads us into compliance with the word of God. The leaders of the church do not.
Some corrections. Because we don't have it recorded doesn't mean that Abinadi did not perform any miracles. Also, Abinadi did give a sign. He prophesied that those who murdered him would suffer the same fate as he and they would be driven as wild beast and would burn as he is being burned. This sign was confirmed later in the Book of Mormon.
-Finrock
Agreed, I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses, Enoch, or Melchizedek (as recorded), or Nephi/Lehi (3 Nephi) either - and they were the prophets who preceded Christ in the BoM scenario.Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:55 amWhen I was involved with the Denver Snuffer movement, one thing that brought me back to the church was the element of patience; something I think is lacking in the DS movement, and it seems the devil is taking advantage of it. There seems to be this self-fulfilling prophecy mindset taking place, as is seen in the failing scripture project. One thing that is also missing from one claiming to be the one mighty and strong is the element of power. I think most everyone outside the movement can see that the movement is failing. There is no evidence of power manifest, no legitimate prophecy fulfillment, and failing leadership.
On the other hand, there is still the opportunity to come back to the church which Joseph Smith restored, and from which will birth the very thing the DS movement is trying to create.
Comments in blue above.Jesef wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:33 am Finrock, you make an excellent point there about the scriptures. And there's some doublethink involved here too. Those believing and following Snuffer actually believe he has authority from Christ/God to do and say what he has and is. Yet they oft quote this "cursed is he that putters his trust in man" from Nephi and apply it to the LDS Prophet/Apostles, but it doesn't apply to how they hold/view Denver. The full quote in context is of monumental importance: Cursed is he that putteth his trust in man, or maketh flesh his arm, or shall hearken unto the precepts of men, save their precepts shall be given by the power of the Holy Ghost." And yes, this would apply to Denver today. He teaches this all the time. He says he trusts no man. He says he is a man. Therefore to not trust him 100%. The key is, as Nephi says, to discern if the teaching is given by the power of the Holy Ghost, and obviously a good barometer would be whether it conforms with Scripture. They also fall back to the scriptures as their gold standard of authoritative truth - but the scriptures, themselves were produced via the same pattern we are talking about: the Lord basically inspiring or revealing words to chosen servants/men/prophets - the only difference is they are written words and the guys who wrote them are dead. Also, it is plain to see that nearly any argument can be made and supported using scriptures This is true! - Joseph made that very point in recounting his search for the right church, James 1:5, etc. Also, as I've pointed out, many scriptures can simply be ignored or re-worked if they don't fit one's paradigm - like "for the last time" - why didn't the Lord say "the most recent time" to end all confusion and ambiguity? Because, clearly, in context, it means "the final time"! Some of these things are so ridiculous I'm just stunned. What quote are you speaking of? I think I know, but it's important to scruitinize the origin. For example if it appeared on the scene many years (even decades) after it was actually said, and "remembered" by an old leader seeking to support their argument, then doubt as to the veracity obviously creeps in.
Jesef, you ask what appear to be sincere questions and make many reasonable comments.Jesef wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:40 amAgreed, I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses, Enoch, or Melchizedek (as recorded), or Nephi/Lehi (3 Nephi) either - and they were the prophets who preceded Christ in the BoM scenario.Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:55 amWhen I was involved with the Denver Snuffer movement, one thing that brought me back to the church was the element of patience; something I think is lacking in the DS movement, and it seems the devil is taking advantage of it. There seems to be this self-fulfilling prophecy mindset taking place, as is seen in the failing scripture project. One thing that is also missing from one claiming to be the one mighty and strong is the element of power. I think most everyone outside the movement can see that the movement is failing. There is no evidence of power manifest, no legitimate prophecy fulfillment, and failing leadership.
On the other hand, there is still the opportunity to come back to the church which Joseph Smith restored, and from which will birth the very thing the DS movement is trying to create.
One incident is worth mentioning. The night before Denver's 10th talk in Phoenix/Mesa, it rained more in the area in a single draught than in 100 years of recorded rainfall. All the water retention basins were like 2 feet under water. The followers interpreted this as a sign and confirmation of Denver's call to be re-baptized. But flooding is more commonly interpreted as a curse, not a sign of favor. Rainfall is often interpreted as a sign of divine favor. In any case, that is a fact - I live here and can verify that, just not the meaning of it - if it was a sign or a coincidence. It happened prior to Denver's talk and arrival, not following it or during it, so there's that, too, when factoring in the timing. Maybe Mesa was so wicked it needed a good cleansing before allowing a chosen servant to set foot on it.
I'll interject my opinion.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:11 pmJesef, you ask what appear to be sincere questions and make many reasonable comments.Jesef wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:40 amAgreed, I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses, Enoch, or Melchizedek (as recorded), or Nephi/Lehi (3 Nephi) either - and they were the prophets who preceded Christ in the BoM scenario.Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:55 amWhen I was involved with the Denver Snuffer movement, one thing that brought me back to the church was the element of patience; something I think is lacking in the DS movement, and it seems the devil is taking advantage of it. There seems to be this self-fulfilling prophecy mindset taking place, as is seen in the failing scripture project. One thing that is also missing from one claiming to be the one mighty and strong is the element of power. I think most everyone outside the movement can see that the movement is failing. There is no evidence of power manifest, no legitimate prophecy fulfillment, and failing leadership.
On the other hand, there is still the opportunity to come back to the church which Joseph Smith restored, and from which will birth the very thing the DS movement is trying to create.
One incident is worth mentioning. The night before Denver's 10th talk in Phoenix/Mesa, it rained more in the area in a single draught than in 100 years of recorded rainfall. All the water retention basins were like 2 feet under water. The followers interpreted this as a sign and confirmation of Denver's call to be re-baptized. But flooding is more commonly interpreted as a curse, not a sign of favor. Rainfall is often interpreted as a sign of divine favor. In any case, that is a fact - I live here and can verify that, just not the meaning of it - if it was a sign or a coincidence. It happened prior to Denver's talk and arrival, not following it or during it, so there's that, too, when factoring in the timing. Maybe Mesa was so wicked it needed a good cleansing before allowing a chosen servant to set foot on it.
You say that you're looking for a sign when you say, "I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses,..."
I know you know the obvious Sunday School answer that faithless people seek a sign, or worse, people like Korihor. And so I wouldn't lump you in with those type of folks. But as to whether expect to see visible signs, I must ask? Should we, sooner or later?
I tend to think YES, we should expect them sooner or later. But what if it's "later"? As in "too late"? When the rain started and the ark was shut, you'd agree that it was too late, right?
But there's a good question to ask oneself: WHAT IF God doesn't want to make it that easy on people, esp on the faithless? What if God doesn't want sign-seekers (people with whimsical faith) joining with folks seeking to establish Zion?
What if Zion was for the pure in heart? What if Zion was for people with deep and abiding faith? What if it was meant for people who could discern without being told what to do? What if Zion required a people who could love one another, and get along? What if Zion was for people who truly loved the Lord and were willing to sacrifice for the Lord even without being commanded in all things, as in via "a sign" that would get people's attention? What if in fact things were playing out right now in our lifetime at this very moment where the Lord's design is to specifically AVOID signs?
If you grant that is a possibility, then you must realize that DISCERNMENT is the name of the game. And that game is afoot!
Jonesy,Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:25 pmI'll interject my opinion.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:11 pmJesef, you ask what appear to be sincere questions and make many reasonable comments.Jesef wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:40 amAgreed, I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses, Enoch, or Melchizedek (as recorded), or Nephi/Lehi (3 Nephi) either - and they were the prophets who preceded Christ in the BoM scenario.Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:55 am
When I was involved with the Denver Snuffer movement, one thing that brought me back to the church was the element of patience; something I think is lacking in the DS movement, and it seems the devil is taking advantage of it. There seems to be this self-fulfilling prophecy mindset taking place, as is seen in the failing scripture project. One thing that is also missing from one claiming to be the one mighty and strong is the element of power. I think most everyone outside the movement can see that the movement is failing. There is no evidence of power manifest, no legitimate prophecy fulfillment, and failing leadership.
On the other hand, there is still the opportunity to come back to the church which Joseph Smith restored, and from which will birth the very thing the DS movement is trying to create.
One incident is worth mentioning. The night before Denver's 10th talk in Phoenix/Mesa, it rained more in the area in a single draught than in 100 years of recorded rainfall. All the water retention basins were like 2 feet under water. The followers interpreted this as a sign and confirmation of Denver's call to be re-baptized. But flooding is more commonly interpreted as a curse, not a sign of favor. Rainfall is often interpreted as a sign of divine favor. In any case, that is a fact - I live here and can verify that, just not the meaning of it - if it was a sign or a coincidence. It happened prior to Denver's talk and arrival, not following it or during it, so there's that, too, when factoring in the timing. Maybe Mesa was so wicked it needed a good cleansing before allowing a chosen servant to set foot on it.
You say that you're looking for a sign when you say, "I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses,..."
I know you know the obvious Sunday School answer that faithless people seek a sign, or worse, people like Korihor. And so I wouldn't lump you in with those type of folks. But as to whether expect to see visible signs, I must ask? Should we, sooner or later?
I tend to think YES, we should expect them sooner or later. But what if it's "later"? As in "too late"? When the rain started and the ark was shut, you'd agree that it was too late, right?
But there's a good question to ask oneself: WHAT IF God doesn't want to make it that easy on people, esp on the faithless? What if God doesn't want sign-seekers (people with whimsical faith) joining with folks seeking to establish Zion?
What if Zion was for the pure in heart? What if Zion was for people with deep and abiding faith? What if it was meant for people who could discern without being told what to do? What if Zion required a people who could love one another, and get along? What if Zion was for people who truly loved the Lord and were willing to sacrifice for the Lord even without being commanded in all things, as in via "a sign" that would get people's attention? What if in fact things were playing out right now in our lifetime at this very moment where the Lord's design is to specifically AVOID signs?
If you grant that is a possibility, then you must realize that DISCERNMENT is the name of the game. And that game is afoot!
I would normally agree, but this is different. Power is supposed to accompany the one mighty and strong; and DS is already trying to perform one-mighty-and-strong type things. So, I would expect at this point that the power would be self evident. It hasn't. LDS Anarchist has done some great expositions on the one mighty and strong. The power that he will work with seems to be unprecedented. The world will know it.
underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:42 pmJonesy,Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:25 pmI'll interject my opinion.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:11 pmJesef, you ask what appear to be sincere questions and make many reasonable comments.Jesef wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:40 am
Agreed, I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses, Enoch, or Melchizedek (as recorded), or Nephi/Lehi (3 Nephi) either - and they were the prophets who preceded Christ in the BoM scenario.
One incident is worth mentioning. The night before Denver's 10th talk in Phoenix/Mesa, it rained more in the area in a single draught than in 100 years of recorded rainfall. All the water retention basins were like 2 feet under water. The followers interpreted this as a sign and confirmation of Denver's call to be re-baptized. But flooding is more commonly interpreted as a curse, not a sign of favor. Rainfall is often interpreted as a sign of divine favor. In any case, that is a fact - I live here and can verify that, just not the meaning of it - if it was a sign or a coincidence. It happened prior to Denver's talk and arrival, not following it or during it, so there's that, too, when factoring in the timing. Maybe Mesa was so wicked it needed a good cleansing before allowing a chosen servant to set foot on it.
You say that you're looking for a sign when you say, "I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses,..."
I know you know the obvious Sunday School answer that faithless people seek a sign, or worse, people like Korihor. And so I wouldn't lump you in with those type of folks. But as to whether expect to see visible signs, I must ask? Should we, sooner or later?
I tend to think YES, we should expect them sooner or later. But what if it's "later"? As in "too late"? When the rain started and the ark was shut, you'd agree that it was too late, right?
But there's a good question to ask oneself: WHAT IF God doesn't want to make it that easy on people, esp on the faithless? What if God doesn't want sign-seekers (people with whimsical faith) joining with folks seeking to establish Zion?
What if Zion was for the pure in heart? What if Zion was for people with deep and abiding faith? What if it was meant for people who could discern without being told what to do? What if Zion required a people who could love one another, and get along? What if Zion was for people who truly loved the Lord and were willing to sacrifice for the Lord even without being commanded in all things, as in via "a sign" that would get people's attention? What if in fact things were playing out right now in our lifetime at this very moment where the Lord's design is to specifically AVOID signs?
If you grant that is a possibility, then you must realize that DISCERNMENT is the name of the game. And that game is afoot!
I would normally agree, but this is different. Power is supposed to accompany the one mighty and strong; and DS is already trying to perform one-mighty-and-strong type things. So, I would expect at this point that the power would be self evident. It hasn't. LDS Anarchist has done some great expositions on the one mighty and strong. The power that he will work with seems to be unprecedented. The world will know it.
Seems like you're really hung up on the coming of the mighty and strong one. Even Denver doesn't claim that. Says that once the work is done, THEN we will know who the servant is.
The title isn't important. "Who" isn't important. The work is what is important.
How is this at all scriptural in relation to the one mighty and strong? So, the one mighty and strong completes all his work (which DS is overtaking) and then the world is blindsided by the work being all complete?Says that once the work is done, THEN we will know who the servant is.
I loved and was edified by Thomas' remarks too. Very well said.KFarber wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:39 pm Thomas
I don't know who you are but I know you know what you are sharing...... this>>>> is particularly helpful to me
The church teaches that the spirit is a feeling or an emotional experience. Joseph Smith said the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence. From my experience that is mostly true, except for when the baptism of fire happens. The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception.
Thank you for speading L I G H T and T R U T H .
Operating from emotions is such a trap. It's like the enemy is waiting below with his jaws open wide waiting to devour you when you believe hie lies.
God bless you on your path.
Thank you Thomas.
Do these words describe "pure intelligence"? When we feel we are brought closer to Christ by some knowledge we hear, THAT is pure intelligence. The opposite is of the devil.13 But behold, that which is of God inviteth and enticeth to do good continually; wherefore, every thing which inviteth and enticeth to do good, and to love God, and to serve him, is inspired of God.
14 Wherefore, take heed, my beloved brethren, that ye do not judge that which is evil to be of God, or that which is good and of God to be of the devil.
15 For behold, my brethren, it is given unto you to judge, that ye may know good from evil; and the way to judge is as plain, that ye may know with a perfect knowledge, as the daylight is from the dark night.
16 For behold, the Spirit of Christ is given to every man, that he may know good from evil; wherefore, I show unto you the way to judge; for every thing which inviteth to do good, and to persuade to believe in Christ, is sent forth by the power and gift of Christ; wherefore ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of God.
17 But whatsoever thing persuadeth men to do evil, and believe not in Christ, and deny him, and serve not God, then ye may know with a perfect knowledge it is of the devil; for after this manner doth the devil work, for he persuadeth no man to do good, no, not one; neither do his angels; neither do they who subject themselves unto him.
18 And now, my brethren, seeing that ye know the light by which ye may judge, which light is the light of Christ, see that ye do not judge wrongfully; for with that same judgment which ye judge ye shall also be judged.
19 Wherefore, I beseech of you, brethren, that ye should search diligently in the light of Christ that ye may know good from evil; and if ye will lay hold upon every good thing, and condemn it not, ye certainly will be a child of Christ.
Jonesy,Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:53 pmunderdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:42 pmJonesy,Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:25 pmI'll interject my opinion.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:11 pm
Jesef, you ask what appear to be sincere questions and make many reasonable comments.
You say that you're looking for a sign when you say, "I have seen no real power of scriptural or mythological proportions, nothing to indicate Denver is actually like Moses,..."
I know you know the obvious Sunday School answer that faithless people seek a sign, or worse, people like Korihor. And so I wouldn't lump you in with those type of folks. But as to whether expect to see visible signs, I must ask? Should we, sooner or later?
I tend to think YES, we should expect them sooner or later. But what if it's "later"? As in "too late"? When the rain started and the ark was shut, you'd agree that it was too late, right?
But there's a good question to ask oneself: WHAT IF God doesn't want to make it that easy on people, esp on the faithless? What if God doesn't want sign-seekers (people with whimsical faith) joining with folks seeking to establish Zion?
What if Zion was for the pure in heart? What if Zion was for people with deep and abiding faith? What if it was meant for people who could discern without being told what to do? What if Zion required a people who could love one another, and get along? What if Zion was for people who truly loved the Lord and were willing to sacrifice for the Lord even without being commanded in all things, as in via "a sign" that would get people's attention? What if in fact things were playing out right now in our lifetime at this very moment where the Lord's design is to specifically AVOID signs?
If you grant that is a possibility, then you must realize that DISCERNMENT is the name of the game. And that game is afoot!
I would normally agree, but this is different. Power is supposed to accompany the one mighty and strong; and DS is already trying to perform one-mighty-and-strong type things. So, I would expect at this point that the power would be self evident. It hasn't. LDS Anarchist has done some great expositions on the one mighty and strong. The power that he will work with seems to be unprecedented. The world will know it.
Seems like you're really hung up on the coming of the mighty and strong one. Even Denver doesn't claim that. Says that once the work is done, THEN we will know who the servant is.
The title isn't important. "Who" isn't important. The work is what is important.How is this at all scriptural in relation to the one mighty and strong? So, the one mighty and strong completes all his work (which DS is overtaking) and then the world is blindsided by the work being all complete?Says that once the work is done, THEN we will know who the servant is.
You're right, it doesn't matter who it is. The problem is that DS is attempting to perform the work set aside for the one mighty and strong. And he's failing; something the one mighty and strong won't do.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:12 pmJonesy,Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:53 pmunderdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:42 pmJonesy,Jonesy1982 wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:25 pm
I'll interject my opinion.
I would normally agree, but this is different. Power is supposed to accompany the one mighty and strong; and DS is already trying to perform one-mighty-and-strong type things. So, I would expect at this point that the power would be self evident. It hasn't. LDS Anarchist has done some great expositions on the one mighty and strong. The power that he will work with seems to be unprecedented. The world will know it.
Seems like you're really hung up on the coming of the mighty and strong one. Even Denver doesn't claim that. Says that once the work is done, THEN we will know who the servant is.
The title isn't important. "Who" isn't important. The work is what is important.How is this at all scriptural in relation to the one mighty and strong? So, the one mighty and strong completes all his work (which DS is overtaking) and then the world is blindsided by the work being all complete?Says that once the work is done, THEN we will know who the servant is.
Let me ask it this way: Who really cares in the least bit who the mighty and strong one is? Why does it even matter (to quote Hitlery...actually, her words were, "What difference does it make?)? Yes, I suppose it would be an honor. It'd be cool perhaps, in some vain way. But if the mighty and strong one is not Christ and rather a man, then that mortal, virtuous, godly, holy man will not seek such an honor, and prefer to not be recognized as such. Remember that one great lesson which virtually ALL men fail to grasp (DC 121), that many are called and not chosen because they aspire to the honors of men? In other words, who the heck cares WHO it is? It does not matter in the least bit.
I think this is where Denver is coming from. He doesn't seek to be anything, or aspire to any title, or role or mission. He may not know. He may know. Idk. But it's of such tiny, microscopic significance that it's not worth even thinking about for 3 seconds in a day, much less be consumed by it.
And yet, you've brought it up time and again, as if it's important to know who. It is not important. We're not supposed to following a man anyway. We follow the Lord. Right?
There's no light or truth from Thomas.KFarber wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:39 pm Thomas
I don't know who you are but I know you know what you are sharing...... this>>>> is particularly helpful to me
The church teaches that the spirit is a feeling or an emotional experience. Joseph Smith said the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence. From my experience that is mostly true, except for when the baptism of fire happens. The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception.
Thank you for speading L I G H T and T R U T H .
Operating from emotions is such a trap. It's like the enemy is waiting below with his jaws open wide waiting to devour you when you believe hie lies.
God bless you on your path.
Thank you Thomas.
The point I'm making is that your paradigm, from my perspective, is inconsistent. It suffers from the same socio- and egocentric dilemma that is found in the LDS faith. Denver Snuffer's Church and movement doesn't resolve the underlying issues that you have with the LDS faith. Its just a different "authority". You are abandoning your trust in one flesh and putting your trust in to another. Flesh is flesh. Authority is authority. If it is wrong here, then it is wrong there. Rationally you can't have it both ways. Of course you are free to believe how you wish. I'm just pointing out for your edification that you are presenting a problem with the LDS Church and providing a supposed solution, but your solution at a fundamental level doesn't resolve those issues because its just the same thing with a different name.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:37 amGood afternoon Finrock,Finrock wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:58 am A couple of things that I find which are inconsistent in your paradigm.
The scriptures are an "authority". Denver Snuffer is an "authority". You appear to be contradicting yourself and special pleading.Thomas wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 9:46 am The situation we find ourselves in today has scriptural precedent. Almost all people get it wrong. Why? Because they rely on authority or authorities. God has used the scriptures to explain to me how Denver Snuffer conforms to the pattern of prophets from the past. And he has explained to me how the leaders of the church do not even come close to the pattern of true prophets. Snuffer leads us into compliance with the word of God. The leaders of the church do not.
Some corrections. Because we don't have it recorded doesn't mean that Abinadi did not perform any miracles. Also, Abinadi did give a sign. He prophesied that those who murdered him would suffer the same fate as he and they would be driven as wild beast and would burn as he is being burned. This sign was confirmed later in the Book of Mormon.
-Finrock
Thomas' quote above beginning with "The situation we find ourselves in today..." makes perfect sense. The Jews (who rejected Jesus) relied on their authorities, their "brethren", the hierarchy of their day. That is one precedent Thomas refers to. Thomas says it very eloquently. He explains that a true prophet would not only conform to the pattern of prophets from the past, but that any true prophet's preaching and teaching would lead us into compliance with the word of God. Denver does this. The Brethren fail miserably and are in fact in complete apostasy from Scriptural precedent. A main and glaring precedent being that God appears to a true prophet (think Moses or Abraham, or Saul of Tarsus or Lehi or Joseph Smith) and that prophet declares the word of God which is a harsh (to the prideful) message of repentance, which results in them being cast out and persecuted by the religious hierarchy of the day. Denver checks off on every scriptural criteria. He's reviled and his reputation is mud among his own people, with the exception of the few who see through the lies and misinformation.
Yes, Denver would be an "authority", just as the Scriptures are, because what their message originated with God. There is no contradiction. That is Thomas' point!
Abinadi during his ministry didn't perform any miracles, as John the Baptist didn't, as many prophets have not. Performing miracles isn't an absolute rule when analyzing whether somebody is a true prophet. But it has happened, and frequently. Did Lehi performed a miracle? No. Did Alma the Older? No. Did Mormon or Moroni? No. Did Ether? No, not that we're aware of. But Nephi did on at least a couple of occasions (shocking his brothers and his escape feat in the wilderness come to mind, not to mention finding ore for making tools and then building a massive ship when he wasn't even a shipbuilder!).
You are correct that the absence of scriptural record doesn't mean they didn't perform miracles. But that would ALSO mean that any true prophet today could be performing miracles, but there is no record because they choose to not make it public precisely because, as Thomas said, miracles don't produce lasting faith. Which makes the point you're drawing attention to a moot point anyway, doesn't it?
Shadow,shadow wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:25 pmThere's no light or truth from Thomas.KFarber wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:39 pm Thomas
I don't know who you are but I know you know what you are sharing...... this>>>> is particularly helpful to me
The church teaches that the spirit is a feeling or an emotional experience. Joseph Smith said the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence. From my experience that is mostly true, except for when the baptism of fire happens. The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception.
Thank you for speading L I G H T and T R U T H .
Operating from emotions is such a trap. It's like the enemy is waiting below with his jaws open wide waiting to devour you when you believe hie lies.
God bless you on your path.
Thank you Thomas.
The scriptures will correct Thomas' false teaching-
8 But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.
Oh, "feel" that it's right?? Those silly feelings.
The Holy ghost works in many ways. The "David 8-| " Snuffers can't put Him in a box, despite their attempts.
The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception."
Since you and Thomas are supportive of Denver, we see acceptance of deception.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:58 pmShadow,shadow wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:25 pmThere's no light or truth from Thomas.KFarber wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:39 pm Thomas
I don't know who you are but I know you know what you are sharing...... this>>>> is particularly helpful to me
The church teaches that the spirit is a feeling or an emotional experience. Joseph Smith said the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence. From my experience that is mostly true, except for when the baptism of fire happens. The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception.
Thank you for speading L I G H T and T R U T H .
Operating from emotions is such a trap. It's like the enemy is waiting below with his jaws open wide waiting to devour you when you believe hie lies.
God bless you on your path.
Thank you Thomas.
The scriptures will correct Thomas' false teaching-
8 But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.
Oh, "feel" that it's right?? Those silly feelings.
The Holy ghost works in many ways. The "David 8-| " Snuffers can't put Him in a box, despite their attempts.
The Scriptures don't correct what Thomas said but back him up. Thomas didn't deny God using feelings, in fact, he shared a experience he FELT.
DC 8:2 teaches this: "Yea, behold, I will tell you in your mind and in your heart, by the Holy Ghost, which shall come upon you and which shall dwell in your heart."
Notice that Thomas was describing in other words what verse 2 says. Your heart is the feeling part. But God communicates "pure intelligence" to our minds. Note the word AND. So this corroborates Thomas' teaching.
But if you want to be critical, please enlighten us by telling us what is wrong with Thomas' instruction below. I find it to be valuable and spot on:
The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception."
I think your perspective is based on a false premise.Finrock wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:44 pmThe point I'm making is that your paradigm, from my perspective, is inconsistent. It suffers from the same socio- and egocentric dilemma that is found in the LDS faith. Denver Snuffer's Church and movement doesn't resolve the underlying issues that you have with the LDS faith. Its just a different "authority". You are abandoning your trust in one flesh and putting your trust in to another. Flesh is flesh. Authority is authority. If it is wrong here, then it is wrong there. Rationally you can't have it both ways. Of course you are free to believe how you wish. I'm just pointing out for your edification that you are presenting a problem with the LDS Church and providing a supposed solution, but your solution at a fundamental level doesn't resolve those issues because its just the same thing with a different name.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:37 amGood afternoon Finrock,Finrock wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:58 am A couple of things that I find which are inconsistent in your paradigm.
The scriptures are an "authority". Denver Snuffer is an "authority". You appear to be contradicting yourself and special pleading.Thomas wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 9:46 am The situation we find ourselves in today has scriptural precedent. Almost all people get it wrong. Why? Because they rely on authority or authorities. God has used the scriptures to explain to me how Denver Snuffer conforms to the pattern of prophets from the past. And he has explained to me how the leaders of the church do not even come close to the pattern of true prophets. Snuffer leads us into compliance with the word of God. The leaders of the church do not.
Some corrections. Because we don't have it recorded doesn't mean that Abinadi did not perform any miracles. Also, Abinadi did give a sign. He prophesied that those who murdered him would suffer the same fate as he and they would be driven as wild beast and would burn as he is being burned. This sign was confirmed later in the Book of Mormon.
-Finrock
Thomas' quote above beginning with "The situation we find ourselves in today..." makes perfect sense. The Jews (who rejected Jesus) relied on their authorities, their "brethren", the hierarchy of their day. That is one precedent Thomas refers to. Thomas says it very eloquently. He explains that a true prophet would not only conform to the pattern of prophets from the past, but that any true prophet's preaching and teaching would lead us into compliance with the word of God. Denver does this. The Brethren fail miserably and are in fact in complete apostasy from Scriptural precedent. A main and glaring precedent being that God appears to a true prophet (think Moses or Abraham, or Saul of Tarsus or Lehi or Joseph Smith) and that prophet declares the word of God which is a harsh (to the prideful) message of repentance, which results in them being cast out and persecuted by the religious hierarchy of the day. Denver checks off on every scriptural criteria. He's reviled and his reputation is mud among his own people, with the exception of the few who see through the lies and misinformation.
Yes, Denver would be an "authority", just as the Scriptures are, because what their message originated with God. There is no contradiction. That is Thomas' point!
Abinadi during his ministry didn't perform any miracles, as John the Baptist didn't, as many prophets have not. Performing miracles isn't an absolute rule when analyzing whether somebody is a true prophet. But it has happened, and frequently. Did Lehi performed a miracle? No. Did Alma the Older? No. Did Mormon or Moroni? No. Did Ether? No, not that we're aware of. But Nephi did on at least a couple of occasions (shocking his brothers and his escape feat in the wilderness come to mind, not to mention finding ore for making tools and then building a massive ship when he wasn't even a shipbuilder!).
You are correct that the absence of scriptural record doesn't mean they didn't perform miracles. But that would ALSO mean that any true prophet today could be performing miracles, but there is no record because they choose to not make it public precisely because, as Thomas said, miracles don't produce lasting faith. Which makes the point you're drawing attention to a moot point anyway, doesn't it?
-Finrock
To start, I don't call it Denver Snuffer's Church lightly or carelessly. Regardless of what you say or anyone else says, I've looked at the data available and based on my good sense and ability to comprehend and reason, Denver Snuffer is a leader of a Church. I also have not been convinced based on what I've read (and I've read and have informed myself sufficiently to draw a rational conclusion) that Denver Snuffer speaks for Jesus Christ and that Denver, with his particular doctrine and scriptures, represents Jesus Christ or is the mouthpiece of Christ here on earth. Further, the Spirit of Christ that is within me or the Light of Christ that I possess, does not recognize Denver Snuffer as one who is the mouthpiece of God here on the earth. I have found Denver to be quite skilled in the art of rhetoric and rhetoric devices and that portion of Light that is within me has been turned off by his subtle tactics and, to be direct, subtle manipulations.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 2:30 pmI think your perspective is based on a false premise.Finrock wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:44 pmThe point I'm making is that your paradigm, from my perspective, is inconsistent. It suffers from the same socio- and egocentric dilemma that is found in the LDS faith. Denver Snuffer's Church and movement doesn't resolve the underlying issues that you have with the LDS faith. Its just a different "authority". You are abandoning your trust in one flesh and putting your trust in to another. Flesh is flesh. Authority is authority. If it is wrong here, then it is wrong there. Rationally you can't have it both ways. Of course you are free to believe how you wish. I'm just pointing out for your edification that you are presenting a problem with the LDS Church and providing a supposed solution, but your solution at a fundamental level doesn't resolve those issues because its just the same thing with a different name.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 11:37 amGood afternoon Finrock,Finrock wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 10:58 am A couple of things that I find which are inconsistent in your paradigm.
The scriptures are an "authority". Denver Snuffer is an "authority". You appear to be contradicting yourself and special pleading.
Some corrections. Because we don't have it recorded doesn't mean that Abinadi did not perform any miracles. Also, Abinadi did give a sign. He prophesied that those who murdered him would suffer the same fate as he and they would be driven as wild beast and would burn as he is being burned. This sign was confirmed later in the Book of Mormon.
-Finrock
Thomas' quote above beginning with "The situation we find ourselves in today..." makes perfect sense. The Jews (who rejected Jesus) relied on their authorities, their "brethren", the hierarchy of their day. That is one precedent Thomas refers to. Thomas says it very eloquently. He explains that a true prophet would not only conform to the pattern of prophets from the past, but that any true prophet's preaching and teaching would lead us into compliance with the word of God. Denver does this. The Brethren fail miserably and are in fact in complete apostasy from Scriptural precedent. A main and glaring precedent being that God appears to a true prophet (think Moses or Abraham, or Saul of Tarsus or Lehi or Joseph Smith) and that prophet declares the word of God which is a harsh (to the prideful) message of repentance, which results in them being cast out and persecuted by the religious hierarchy of the day. Denver checks off on every scriptural criteria. He's reviled and his reputation is mud among his own people, with the exception of the few who see through the lies and misinformation.
Yes, Denver would be an "authority", just as the Scriptures are, because what their message originated with God. There is no contradiction. That is Thomas' point!
Abinadi during his ministry didn't perform any miracles, as John the Baptist didn't, as many prophets have not. Performing miracles isn't an absolute rule when analyzing whether somebody is a true prophet. But it has happened, and frequently. Did Lehi performed a miracle? No. Did Alma the Older? No. Did Mormon or Moroni? No. Did Ether? No, not that we're aware of. But Nephi did on at least a couple of occasions (shocking his brothers and his escape feat in the wilderness come to mind, not to mention finding ore for making tools and then building a massive ship when he wasn't even a shipbuilder!).
You are correct that the absence of scriptural record doesn't mean they didn't perform miracles. But that would ALSO mean that any true prophet today could be performing miracles, but there is no record because they choose to not make it public precisely because, as Thomas said, miracles don't produce lasting faith. Which makes the point you're drawing attention to a moot point anyway, doesn't it?
-Finrock
First it's not "Denver Snuffer's Church." That is an important detail or I wouldn't correct you. There is no corporation. There is no hierarchy. There do exist fellowships which are not regulated. And there are thousands of individuals not even part of fellowships, like myself. On the other hand, the LDS "Church" is entirely different, very corporate, top-down in nature, and in fact The Corporation of the President of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
But to your main point of confusion. It's innocent I acknowledge.
Your premise is the "underlying issue" is an "ego-centric" authority, or in other words, that the issue is man (flesh) having authority.
I don't believe authority in and of itself is bad. It is not inherently bad. Your premise seems to be that it is inherently bad. Because you say, "If it [authority] is wrong here, then it is wrong there."
Is that correct?
Denver isn't saying "authority" is bad. It is necessary. Both sides say it is necessary.
What Denver is saying is that because of unrighteous dominion the Brethren have lost their priesthood, or Amen to their priesthood, as DC 121:37 states.
The Brethren have abused it. They set themselves up as lights to the world. They seek the honors of men and praise of the world.
And if Denver's testimony is true, and if God has conferred the priesthood upon him, and if the powers of heaven are inseparably connected with the rights of the priesthood, then he is the authorized channel through which Christ is speaking.
You appear to be throwing the baby (authority) out with the dirty water (apostate Brethren).
The baby is still good and essential. Denver is just pointing out the dirty bath water.
Are you "anti authority", and therefore you don't believe God can ever talk to man and "send" him forth to declare a message?
Thomas was trying to pit the church against Joseph Smith. He failed, like usual.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:58 pmShadow,shadow wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:25 pmThere's no light or truth from Thomas.KFarber wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:39 pm Thomas
I don't know who you are but I know you know what you are sharing...... this>>>> is particularly helpful to me
The church teaches that the spirit is a feeling or an emotional experience. Joseph Smith said the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence. From my experience that is mostly true, except for when the baptism of fire happens. The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception.
Thank you for speading L I G H T and T R U T H .
Operating from emotions is such a trap. It's like the enemy is waiting below with his jaws open wide waiting to devour you when you believe hie lies.
God bless you on your path.
Thank you Thomas.
The scriptures will correct Thomas' false teaching-
8 But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.
Oh, "feel" that it's right?? Those silly feelings.
The Holy ghost works in many ways. The "David 8-| " Snuffers can't put Him in a box, despite their attempts.
The Scriptures don't correct what Thomas said but back him up. Thomas didn't deny God using feelings, in fact, he shared a experience he FELT.
DC 8:2 teaches this: "Yea, behold, I will tell you in your mind and in your heart, by the Holy Ghost, which shall come upon you and which shall dwell in your heart."
Notice that Thomas was describing in other words what verse 2 says. Your heart is the feeling part. But God communicates "pure intelligence" to our minds. Note the word AND. So this corroborates Thomas' teaching.
But if you want to be critical, please enlighten us by telling us what is wrong with Thomas' instruction below. I find it to be valuable and spot on:
The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception."
I don't know Thomas. And this isn't about him.shadow wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 3:19 pmThomas was trying to pit the church against Joseph Smith. He failed, like usual.underdog wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:58 pmShadow,shadow wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 1:25 pmThere's no light or truth from Thomas.KFarber wrote: ↑August 30th, 2017, 12:39 pm Thomas
I don't know who you are but I know you know what you are sharing...... this>>>> is particularly helpful to me
The church teaches that the spirit is a feeling or an emotional experience. Joseph Smith said the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence. From my experience that is mostly true, except for when the baptism of fire happens. The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception.
Thank you for speading L I G H T and T R U T H .
Operating from emotions is such a trap. It's like the enemy is waiting below with his jaws open wide waiting to devour you when you believe hie lies.
God bless you on your path.
Thank you Thomas.
The scriptures will correct Thomas' false teaching-
8 But, behold, I say unto you, that you must study it out in your mind; then you must ask me if it be right, and if it is right I will cause that your bosom shall burn within you; therefore, you shall feel that it is right.
Oh, "feel" that it's right?? Those silly feelings.
The Holy ghost works in many ways. The "David 8-| " Snuffers can't put Him in a box, despite their attempts.
The Scriptures don't correct what Thomas said but back him up. Thomas didn't deny God using feelings, in fact, he shared a experience he FELT.
DC 8:2 teaches this: "Yea, behold, I will tell you in your mind and in your heart, by the Holy Ghost, which shall come upon you and which shall dwell in your heart."
Notice that Thomas was describing in other words what verse 2 says. Your heart is the feeling part. But God communicates "pure intelligence" to our minds. Note the word AND. So this corroborates Thomas' teaching.
But if you want to be critical, please enlighten us by telling us what is wrong with Thomas' instruction below. I find it to be valuable and spot on:
The problem with relying on emotion is that it can come from any source. For that matter so can the voice in our head. Some people are so impressed when they receive things from the other side that they seem to forget that Satan is at work to deceive us. We are subject to equal amounts of revelation from Satan and his minions and an equal amount from God. Satan can imitate feelings of peace and love. That is why, he is called the deceiver. If all he could do was give us feelings of evil, he wouldn't have much chance of deceiving us.
We need a way to tell the difference. I have learned that if it comes from God, he is willing to explain it. The scriptures are the word of God. They are the iron rod. God will use the scriptures to explain things to you. In other words, he will use pure intelligence and not try to use emotion to influence us. God does not force. he waits for us to ask, then we must focus our thoughts on the question and let Gods thoughts enter into our minds. He will not force those thoughts upon us if we are thinking about football or something like that. Some people will believe the communications they receive from the voice in their head without testing them against the scriptures or they will accept feelings, emotions that are given to them from spiritual entities without testing them against the scriptures. This is the path to deception."
"The church teaches that the spirit is a feeling or an emotional experience. Joseph Smith said the Holy Ghost has no other effect than pure intelligence" -Thomas
What the church teaches IS correct. It isn't one vs. the other. Thomas and other false teachers and followers of Satan will mix some truth with their deception in order to try to validate their lies.