Polygamy - the unnecessary distraction of Carnal mans attempt to define God being in and through all things?

[BrotherOfMahonri]

Pondering on the topic that I feel is one that we indeed must not be lukewarm on, lest we be spewed out for being not hot or cold, I continue to get the feeling that from God's perspective, who is IN ALL THINGS and THROUGH ALL THINGS (See D&C 88, esp. vs. 41) - polygamy is a man-made version of a spiritual reality mere mortal man hasn't a clue about nor can he until he reaches even unto God through Christ.

If God is IN ALL THINGS and THROUGH ALL THINGS, then does he not already have all our wives as his own? Or the opposite would be true, if we are to have all the father hath, then won't we eventually, through Christ's grace, be IN ALL AND THROUGH ALL THINGS - having a perfect knowledge, via the light that brings all truth to a God, we would be living a "polygamous" life being in each other and each other's wives?

If we are in and through all things (a beautiful eternal concept that if pondered can bring amazing mysteries and revelations to ones heart via the Spirit, sacred insights that I don't feel should be shared here or with most people) - why in the world would we need more than one wife in the hereafter? Wouldn't we be content that we would be one with the Father & the Son, such that he would know our joy (with our eternal spouse) and we would know his joy (with His eternal spouse) without ever having to physically be with them?

I am looking for thoughtful insights along the same line of thought. Polygamy is not condemned by the Lord in word specifically (just the practices of carnal lusts, which indeed are part of polygamy) because polygamy is a man made erroneous byword, a concept that is so barbarically mortal it is most likely laughable to exalted beings, or so unholy that it is dropped from exalted vocab, or the very topic is unnecessary in Heaven's politics if you will, with beings who have all, are in and through all, including all women and men.

If we are to be as He is, one with Christ and God, in and through all things, why in Heaven (pun intended) would polygamy even exist, in fact it seems funny to think about once you ponder upon the reality that God is already in and through all our spouses and ourselves, which makes sense why he would not want to dwell in unholy (speaking specifically of the carnal natural man of lust, and maybe why marriage and procreation will not continue with most of His children after this life) temples (us) or marriages.

Polygamy would be a word that maybe doesn't exist in heaven with God, because it is unnecessary if one is exalted in the highest degree of Glory, unnecessary to those who are in and through all things with their God, and His Christ, an exalted monogamous couple who will go wherever they please and already have all the wives or husbands they want as they are in and through them all already, but never need to have more than one spouse by their side because they already have all the father hath, and need not any more than the pattern of Adam and Eve, for they already are in and through all the wives or husbands that could exist, enjoying the joy of other "Gods" without ever having to be physically there, for God is everywhere via the light we have yet to comprehend, being in and through it all.

So, is the very word and deeds of polygamy simply man's weak erroneous attempt to put a word on what the Gods might call, being in and through all things via the highest degrees of glory in Heaven, only available to monogamous couples sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise by God himself?

[Fiannan]

[Melissa]

It makes sense but some wording is a poor choice and it's said by a man (meaning a human) so it has some "natural man" angle to it. Thought you did a good job explaining something that is usually un-obtainable in thought by most. I don't completely agree with all that you said, or more accurately how you said it.

I don't think using the word enjoy when talking about going in and through everyone was wise being that we are talking about polygamy. I DO however agree with the grander idea here. God indeed knows us intimately, even our very thoughts and intentions.

If we become all knowing then we can also know those things about those we are allowed (maybe under our stewardship) or maybe all because light is light after all- and that would cause an intimacy far surpassing anything "man made" which would make us (the family of God) most effective with eachother. This idea in no way can be compared to polygamy or sex or marital earthly experiences. Because, yes as you put it - it would be laughable.

God's ways are WAY higher than ourways. I'm not sure people apply that knowledge with regard to polygamy or eternal procreation. Us telling God that we know how to eternally procreate and it's just like here, is like a 3 year old telling his dad that he knows more about something in life. Or a teenager thinking they know it all already- ya, we can laugh at that.

[Fiannan]

God's ways are WAY higher than ourways. I'm not sure people apply that knowledge with regard to polygamy or eternal procreation. Us telling God that we know how to eternally procreate and it's just like here, is like a 3 year old telling his dad that he knows more about something in life. Or a teenager thinking they know it all already- ya, we can laugh at that.

Or like a 40 year old who watches CBS news every night and is convinced they know what is going on in the world?

Look, people are generally slaves to the dominant paradigm of their culture. Social learning theory sums it up in that people grow up thinking that whatever they are taught must be the right way. That is why you generally don't have a great deal of cognitive dissonance in the Christian world when people read about polygamy in the Old Testament. They assume it is wrong because the Roman church declared it wrong centuries ago. To think otherwise would make someone a heretic and thus they put their trust in what everyone else believes.

Yet truth is not statistical.

[Melissa]

God's ways are WAY higher than ourways. I'm not sure people apply that knowledge with regard to polygamy or eternal procreation. Us telling God that we know how to eternally procreate and it's just like here, is like a 3 year old telling his dad that he knows more about something in life. Or a teenager thinking they know it all already- ya, we can laugh at that.

Or like a 40 year old who watches CBS news every night and is convinced they know what is going on in the world?

Look, people are generally slaves to the dominant paradigm of their culture. Social learning theory sums it up in that people grow up thinking that whatever they are taught must be the right way. That is why you generally don't have a great deal of cognitive dissonance in the Christian world when people read about polygamy in the Old Testament. They assume it is wrong because the Roman church declared it wrong centuries ago. To think otherwise would make someone a heretic and thus they put their trust in what everyone else believes.

Yet truth is not statistical.

So in other words Fiannan, our conscience is cultural? There is no ultimate right or wrong, just social learning theory?

So, our conscience (the light of Christ in all of us, some nurtured more than others) is not stable? Or does culture affect the conscience.

There is ultimate and universal truth. We don't usually understand it though because of our social learning and our culture - It's the lens to see the world through. We see the world differently based on the lens we wear.

Sometimes I wonder if you live too much in the world and fail to see with spiritual eyes. Yes, the world and people are facinating and it is truly rewarding to understand and research all things dealing with and affecting people's actions and psyches - but there is something beyond all of that, that when seen through that eternal lens helps one see more clearly and sift through varying human states. But, you must see eternal lens first and not see eternity through a socially constructed lens.

God says his ways are higher. See what he sees not what we see being a tiny glimpse in the ever changing human state.

[Zathura]

God's ways are WAY higher than ourways. I'm not sure people apply that knowledge with regard to polygamy or eternal procreation. Us telling God that we know how to eternally procreate and it's just like here, is like a 3 year old telling his dad that he knows more about something in life. Or a teenager thinking they know it all already- ya, we can laugh at that.

Or like a 40 year old who watches CBS news every night and is convinced they know what is going on in the world?

Look, people are generally slaves to the dominant paradigm of their culture. Social learning theory sums it up in that people grow up thinking that whatever they are taught must be the right way. That is why you generally don't have a great deal of cognitive dissonance in the Christian world when people read about polygamy in the Old Testament. They assume it is wrong because the Roman church declared it wrong centuries ago. To think otherwise would make someone a heretic and thus they put their trust in what everyone else believes.

Yet truth is not statistical.

Yet Rewcox frequently uses statistics and the number of members in the various Mormon branches to prove polygamy is in fact from God..

"If most of the members went with Brigham and the church grew faster, that means the Spirit was there, and everything taught by him is true"

You'd do well to share that simple truth with everyone.
Truth is not statistical

[Fiannan]

So in other words Fiannan, our conscience is cultural? There is no ultimate right or wrong, just social learning theory?

So, our conscience (the light of Christ in all of us, some nurtured more than others) is not stable? Or does culture affect the conscience.

On basic questions of right and wrong I believe we are born with an innate morality. However, polygamy does not fall into that compass from our pre-existence. Most people cringe when shown a person being hurt, even as very young toddlers. Yet a culture can even influence that -- many Americans on my Facebook are making comments about the two women boxers from the other night but come on, America is a warlike nation (we have had Church leaders condemn women's fighting sports) and getting more warlike as it follows the path of the Nephites. Conscience can be affected by the society. Yet polygamy merely involves a man and two women making a decision to live as a married unit. What is morally wrong about that? The Bible says it is okay as well. So ultimately if a person sees it as wrong that is their personal taste fashioned within a particular culture, not an element of moral reasoning.

[Melissa]

So in other words Fiannan, our conscience is cultural? There is no ultimate right or wrong, just social learning theory?

So, our conscience (the light of Christ in all of us, some nurtured more than others) is not stable? Or does culture affect the conscience.

On basic questions of right and wrong I believe we are born with an innate morality. However, polygamy does not fall into that compass from our pre-existence. Most people cringe when shown a person being hurt, even as very young toddlers. Yet a culture can even influence that -- many Americans on my Facebook are making comments about the two women boxers from the other night but come on, America is a warlike nation (we have had Church leaders condemn women's fighting sports) and getting more warlike as it follows the path of the Nephites. Conscience can be affected by the society. Yet polygamy merely involves a man and two women making a decision to live as a married unit. What is morally wrong about that? The Bible says it is okay as well. So ultimately if a person sees it as wrong that is their personal taste fashioned within a particular culture, not an element of moral reasoning.

So right and wrong is basic. Yes, it is. But people make it confusing because of the various situations we produce for ourselves. We as people seem to try to use our arm and strenghth too much that we weave a mess. And if we come into the middle of someone's (cultures) mess they have weaved it is nearly impossible to sort it out because of the complicated gymnastics people perform. For example, laws. We create laws then create more laws and then more till we have law built ontop of law built ontop of more law and it no longer really works and people find loop holes to escape the man made laws. God's law is simple.

Yes, polygamy can be defended as a good thing by many people and it can be defended as a bad thing by many people. This to me sounds exactly like what the OP mentioned as it being a man made institution. If it can be both good and bad to various "righteous" people, then it will not be lasting and is temporary. And you prove that by stating (in your opinion) that we were not given monogamy/polygamy/anything like it as a pre-existance moral compass. Truth is eternal and pierces through all existance through all eternity.

Maybe that is why God allows it if men want it. The same as he allows adultery and drugs and slavery etc. We must have agency and learn. I don't believe for a second that polygamy is God's design. It is man's design. Get to the bottom of why and it makes sense (for our situations on earth). It is man's desire.

[Sarah]

We live in a culture that has taught us that anything unfair is "wrong." So of course, if you look at polygamy and how it is unfair to women, then it would be immoral in someone's eyes.

Many people on the left who want freedom from traditional morality want law to enforce their version of morality which is to create a world where things are fair. So they fight for socialistic income distribution. The Lord has not made it his goal to create equality and fairness in this life. That will all be taken care of in the next. So, I believe however the Order of Marriage is in heaven, it will be fair and equal for both sexes. But inequalities are part of our testing here on earth. The poor and the rich, the slave and the slave owner, the husband and the wife, all have to face inequalities and are tested. One side usually enjoys more freedom than the other. Those on one side must learn to forgive and endure, and they will be recompensed, and those who had dominion over others are being tested to see if they can love the way Christ loves.

I actually think the OP is on to something. I believe men and women will all have multiple spouses (eternal lives), but now is the time for men through the priesthood to bless women and enable them to gain eternal live. Imagine if you took sex out of marriage. Would you have a problem of sharing your spouse. Now, I don't think sex will be taken out of marriage necessarily, but I think the way we think about it will be so much different. We will all be one big family.

So, polygamy is unfair, I'll agree with that. It is the reality of multiple woman having to share the attention of one man, vs. a man receiving the attention of many women. But we have to admit that many things that are approved of God are unfair/unequal, and no doubt some people must bear more grief and sorrow in this world than others.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

This may be due to what I'm speaking of is completely anti-alpha male, anti animal-mark-of-the beast inspired.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

It makes sense but some wording is a poor choice and it's said by a man (meaning a human) so it has some "natural man" angle to it. Thought you did a good job explaining something that is usually un-obtainable in thought by most. I don't completely agree with all that you said, or more accurately how you said it.
Thanks! I'm not sure which part I sounded like I said polygamy even exists in heaven, nor do I mean in any way shape or form sex is part of it, what I am saying that I'm feeling is, lik eyou said, we don't understand it, nor can we, we are man as you state, and polygamy therefor is in huge error, MAN doing things their OWN way, which way is in error.

I don't think using the word enjoy when talking about going in and through everyone was wise being that we are talking about polygamy.Agreed. I hope I didn't come across as enjoy meaning anything sexual, but something Holy, that I couldn't even write more on it as I mentioned.. lots to invite one to ponder upon though. I DO however agree with the grander idea here. God indeed knows us intimately, even our very thoughts and intentions. Yes

If we become all knowing then we can also know those things about those we are allowed (maybe under our stewardship) or maybe all because light is light after all- and that would cause an intimacy far surpassing anything "man made" which would make us (the family of God) most effective with eachother. This idea in no way can be compared to polygamy or sex or marital earthly experiences. Because, yes as you put it - it would be laughable. <--- Nailed it!

God's ways are WAY higher than ourways. I'm not sure people apply that knowledge with regard to polygamy or eternal procreation. Us telling God that we know how to eternally procreate and it's just like here, is like a 3 year old telling his dad that he knows more about something in life. Or a teenager thinking they know it all already- ya, we can laugh at that.

Thanks for those thoughts! Agreed. It is something sacred that I, as a man, feel that this ongoing and very decisive issues of polygamy are marks of mortal man's attempt to put meaning on something we can't understand, nor will we partake of (speaking of being in and through all things, all that the father has) unless we put off what I have been told by God is one viewpoint of the mark of the beast, which includes polygamy, in that what does a beast do? and how are we to be not enemies of God by putting off that carnal natural man, a symbol of a mark of a beast, which some beasts actually do better than us humans do, so those intelligences will be in their own glory for their obedience to their own sphere of eternal laws adapted to their intelligence.

[Melissa]

We live in a culture that has taught us that anything unfair is "wrong." So of course, if you look at polygamy and how it is unfair to women, then it would be immoral in someone's eyes.

Many people on the left who want freedom from traditional morality want law to enforce their version of morality which is to create a world where things are fair. So they fight for socialistic income distribution. The Lord has not made it his goal to create equality and fairness in this life. That will all be taken care of in the next. So, I believe however the Order of Marriage is in heaven, it will be fair and equal for both sexes. But inequalities are part of our testing here on earth. The poor and the rich, the slave and the slave owner, the husband and the wife, all have to face inequalities and are tested. One side usually enjoys more freedom than the other. Those on one side must learn to forgive and endure, and they will be recompensed, and those who had dominion over others are being tested to see if they can love the way Christ loves.

I actually think the OP is on to something. I believe men and women will all have multiple spouses (eternal lives), but now is the time for men through the priesthood to bless women and enable them to gain eternal live. Imagine if you took sex out of marriage. Would you have a problem of sharing your spouse. Now, I don't think sex will be taken out of marriage necessarily, but I think the way we think about it will be so much different. We will all be one big family.

So, polygamy is unfair, I'll agree with that. It is the reality of multiple woman having to share the attention of one man, vs. a man receiving the attention of many women. But we have to admit that many things that are approved of God are unfair/unequal, and no doubt some people must bear more grief and sorrow in this world than others.

Many an old and wise women have stated that women bear the cross in this life....it's the thought of that continuing that is repulsive.

We really shouldn't base eternity on our incredibly flawed and limited knowledge.

By the way, I completely disagree that we will have many spouses in the eternities. That just doesn't make sense either.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

We live in a culture that has taught us that anything unfair is "wrong." So of course, if you look at polygamy and how it is unfair to women, then it would be immoral in someone's eyes.

Many people on the left who want freedom from traditional morality want law to enforce their version of morality which is to create a world where things are fair. So they fight for socialistic income distribution. The Lord has not made it his goal to create equality and fairness in this life. That will all be taken care of in the next. So, I believe however the Order of Marriage is in heaven, it will be fair and equal for both sexes. But inequalities are part of our testing here on earth. The poor and the rich, the slave and the slave owner, the husband and the wife, all have to face inequalities and are tested. One side usually enjoys more freedom than the other. Those on one side must learn to forgive and endure, and they will be recompensed, and those who had dominion over others are being tested to see if they can love the way Christ loves.

I actually think the OP is on to something. I believe men and women will all have multiple spouses (eternal lives), but now is the time for men through the priesthood to bless women and enable them to gain eternal live. Imagine if you took sex out of marriage. Would you have a problem of sharing your spouse. Now, I don't think sex will be taken out of marriage necessarily, but I think the way we think about it will be so much different. We will all be one big family.

So, polygamy is unfair, I'll agree with that. It is the reality of multiple woman having to share the attention of one man, vs. a man receiving the attention of many women. But we have to admit that many things that are approved of God are unfair/unequal, and no doubt some people must bear more grief and sorrow in this world than others.

Just to make clear, by no means does my OP mean anything close to having more than one spouse, as in my limited man-view, that would be entirely unnecessary and is the creation of man, whose ways are indeed not God's ways.

[Sarah]

We live in a culture that has taught us that anything unfair is "wrong." So of course, if you look at polygamy and how it is unfair to women, then it would be immoral in someone's eyes.

Many people on the left who want freedom from traditional morality want law to enforce their version of morality which is to create a world where things are fair. So they fight for socialistic income distribution. The Lord has not made it his goal to create equality and fairness in this life. That will all be taken care of in the next. So, I believe however the Order of Marriage is in heaven, it will be fair and equal for both sexes. But inequalities are part of our testing here on earth. The poor and the rich, the slave and the slave owner, the husband and the wife, all have to face inequalities and are tested. One side usually enjoys more freedom than the other. Those on one side must learn to forgive and endure, and they will be recompensed, and those who had dominion over others are being tested to see if they can love the way Christ loves.

I actually think the OP is on to something. I believe men and women will all have multiple spouses (eternal lives), but now is the time for men through the priesthood to bless women and enable them to gain eternal live. Imagine if you took sex out of marriage. Would you have a problem of sharing your spouse. Now, I don't think sex will be taken out of marriage necessarily, but I think the way we think about it will be so much different. We will all be one big family.

So, polygamy is unfair, I'll agree with that. It is the reality of multiple woman having to share the attention of one man, vs. a man receiving the attention of many women. But we have to admit that many things that are approved of God are unfair/unequal, and no doubt some people must bear more grief and sorrow in this world than others.

Just to make clear, by no means does my OP mean anything close to having more than one spouse, as in my limited man-view, that would be entirely unnecessary and is the creation of man, whose ways are indeed not God's ways.

Yes, I should have clarified. I didn't mean to imply that that was what you were saying. I think your point about believing in monogamy only in heaven came across, and I realize I'm the only one around that has voiced this different point of view. When I said I thought you were on to something I meant the part about the Father, and all of us, being in and through all things, having all that the Father hath etc. To me that is a manifestation of living the Law of Consecration and having all things in common. I actually am puzzled how most here on this forum who oppose the thought of plural marriage in heaven can not see how that principle could apply to marriage also. We are all too possessive I guess. Maybe it's because I know my Dad loves both his wives he is sealed to - my mom, and his new wife, and I know my Dad and how pure his love and motives are. He really does love and cherish them both and deserves to continue his Kingdom with each of them.

[Sarah]

We live in a culture that has taught us that anything unfair is "wrong." So of course, if you look at polygamy and how it is unfair to women, then it would be immoral in someone's eyes.

Many people on the left who want freedom from traditional morality want law to enforce their version of morality which is to create a world where things are fair. So they fight for socialistic income distribution. The Lord has not made it his goal to create equality and fairness in this life. That will all be taken care of in the next. So, I believe however the Order of Marriage is in heaven, it will be fair and equal for both sexes. But inequalities are part of our testing here on earth. The poor and the rich, the slave and the slave owner, the husband and the wife, all have to face inequalities and are tested. One side usually enjoys more freedom than the other. Those on one side must learn to forgive and endure, and they will be recompensed, and those who had dominion over others are being tested to see if they can love the way Christ loves.

I actually think the OP is on to something. I believe men and women will all have multiple spouses (eternal lives), but now is the time for men through the priesthood to bless women and enable them to gain eternal live. Imagine if you took sex out of marriage. Would you have a problem of sharing your spouse. Now, I don't think sex will be taken out of marriage necessarily, but I think the way we think about it will be so much different. We will all be one big family.

So, polygamy is unfair, I'll agree with that. It is the reality of multiple woman having to share the attention of one man, vs. a man receiving the attention of many women. But we have to admit that many things that are approved of God are unfair/unequal, and no doubt some people must bear more grief and sorrow in this world than others.

Many an old and wise women have stated that women bear the cross in this life....it's the thought of that continuing that is repulsive.

We really shouldn't base eternity on our incredibly flawed and limited knowledge.

By the way, I completely disagree that we will have many spouses in the eternities. That just doesn't make sense either.

Yes, I agree with you on the point about women bearing many crosses, and the thought of that continuing to be repulsive. We just see the Lord's way of recompense differently. But the inequality is really there for a reason, just like every other inequality we see. The Jews receiving the gospel, and not being able to share it, or even mingle with the Gentiles. And then Peter has this vision of the unclean animals, which he is told to eat. The Lord says to not call something which he has cleansed unclean. Peter then goes to Cornelius and the gospel goes forth to the gentiles. What I find interesting about this story is how something that was "unclean" was now cleansed, and deserving of every blessing that was once denied. Women, as you may remember were also considered unclean after they delivered a baby, and also at other times, and they had to make an offering of some sort to become clean again, thus signifying the Lord's power to cleanse that which was unclean. Women have many things going against them that make them the weaker sex, but they can be cleansed, or made equal with men and with Christ because of the atonement.

[BrotherOfMahonri]

We live in a culture that has taught us that anything unfair is "wrong." So of course, if you look at polygamy and how it is unfair to women, then it would be immoral in someone's eyes.

Many people on the left who want freedom from traditional morality want law to enforce their version of morality which is to create a world where things are fair. So they fight for socialistic income distribution. The Lord has not made it his goal to create equality and fairness in this life. That will all be taken care of in the next. So, I believe however the Order of Marriage is in heaven, it will be fair and equal for both sexes. But inequalities are part of our testing here on earth. The poor and the rich, the slave and the slave owner, the husband and the wife, all have to face inequalities and are tested. One side usually enjoys more freedom than the other. Those on one side must learn to forgive and endure, and they will be recompensed, and those who had dominion over others are being tested to see if they can love the way Christ loves.

I actually think the OP is on to something. I believe men and women will all have multiple spouses (eternal lives), but now is the time for men through the priesthood to bless women and enable them to gain eternal live. Imagine if you took sex out of marriage. Would you have a problem of sharing your spouse. Now, I don't think sex will be taken out of marriage necessarily, but I think the way we think about it will be so much different. We will all be one big family.

So, polygamy is unfair, I'll agree with that. It is the reality of multiple woman having to share the attention of one man, vs. a man receiving the attention of many women. But we have to admit that many things that are approved of God are unfair/unequal, and no doubt some people must bear more grief and sorrow in this world than others.

Just to make clear, by no means does my OP mean anything close to having more than one spouse, as in my limited man-view, that would be entirely unnecessary and is the creation of man, whose ways are indeed not God's ways.

Yes, I should have clarified. I didn't mean to imply that that was what you were saying. I think your point about believing in monogamy only in heaven came across, and I realize I'm the only one around that has voiced this different point of view. When I said I thought you were on to something I meant the part about the Father, and all of us, being in and through all things, having all that the Father hath etc. To me that is a manifestation of living the Law of Consecration and having all things in common. I actually am puzzled how most here on this forum who oppose the thought of plural marriage in heaven can not see how that principle could apply to marriage also. We are all too possessive I guess. Maybe it's because I know my Dad loves both his wives he is sealed to - my mom, and his new wife, and I know my Dad and how pure his love and motives are. He really does love and cherish them both and deserves to continue his Kingdom with each of them.

Thanks for clarifying as well. That is very indeed puzzling. A man who has a wife pass away, and then marries anew. Something I pray often about but don't understand either. Again, God's ways are higher than mans ways... is where I am left to ponder on this side topic.

Here is what bothers me most about that topic, not trying to insinuate anything but seeking truth in the matter.

SCENARIO 1
My dad, is on his third temple marriage (my mom, 2nd wife didn't work out, and now 3rd wife working out great for years now). All those marriages are approved (has to be) by the 1st presidency, even with my mom (his first wife) writing a heart felt letter about his unrepeated of abuse to her per her right to do so.

According to scripture, my dad has married two other women who were also once married, put away my mom (not for fornication) and therefor is committing adultery according to the scriptures, am I mistaken in this? I lean towards his ignorance in this because he is still like a teenage boy in my view in understanding marriage and relationships, and has some maturing he is working through, which can be pointed to an upbringing that wasn't all roses either.

SCENARIO 2
Elder Scott, period. I don't know about many others, but there is a uniqueness with Elder Scott and his marriage and how the spirit has communicated to me personally of the kind of love that exists with he and his one wife, including the veil being thin enough that she let him know to not remarry - so there is a sacredness there, something I felt ever so powerfully coming home from my mission where I met with Elder Scott, and watched the movie, The Other Side of Heaven, which had a feel of a child like innocence that to this day, if I ponder upon it, it brings my heart to a sacred space that transcends this world.

Elder Scott is the ONLY one of the brethren who I have ever heard say that he and his wife (he spoke this while his wife had passed on for some time) had ecstasy of joy in their intimacy and marriage, ecstasy that transcends this world and what the world understand about intimacy, because of virtue. He used the word ecstasy to describe his spiritual bond with his wife. I don't know anyone else who has shared such other than him, and I believe him because I feel it powerfully.

SCENARIO 3
A man takes a 2nd wife after first passed on (like your dad), a woman who had never been married before, and loves her tenderly. I have a hard time with this, because the consent of the first wife is absent, either because she doesn't care, it is only a mortal issue, the man hasn't the spiritual sensitivity to seek his first wife's consent, or she came back and told him to go ahead? I can't judge anyone I guess in this, although I have said some things about Elder Nelsen taking a wife many years the younger... but even that bothers me because we don't know of the consent from the first, and from what I can discern, I don't feel such was sought for, but can't judge that for sure.

Any thoughts to those three scenarios? Scriptural basis against my analysis of scenario 2 and adultery? This is serious business according to scripture, and it feels like mankind, (man pun intended) treats it lightly enough that they seek not permission from God or previous spouses but go forward because some other "men" (key in the gender here) in authority approved of it (counsel with fellow man and trusting in the arm of flesh seems to be the reason for polygamy in my heart's speaking to me, and I wonder if there isn't false traditions in remarrying because of trusting also in man's authority and counsel).

[Melissa]

Elder Scott....what an absolute awesome man. He loved his wife! He had a special spirit about him for sure.

[Melissa]

So what does it mean when the scriptures talk about the 144,000 not being defiled by women?

We know that the act of getting married and having children and being in a faithful and committed marriage is not "defiled". So, what does it mean? Could this play in here in this conversation? Maybe with the divorces and remarrying without the approval of God's word, and taking multiple wives?

Also, I think that maybe Elder Scott was such an awesome man because he was truly "one" with his wife...i.e. not "defiled by woman", but edified by woman.

His wife completed him and he was better with her as she brought out (gave opportunity to display) his ability to devote and love a woman. That is the opposite of defiled.

I also, personally think that the phrase could be referencing an immoral heart and pornographic thinking/actions. There is a spirit that accompanies all immorality and it is a strong spirit, it is a very powerful one too.

[rewcox]

Opinions are worthless when they are against God and His church.

Why did your church previously practice plural marriage (polygamy)?

Official Answer
At various times, the Lord has commanded His people to practice plural marriage. For example, He gave this command to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Moses, David, and Solomon (Doctrine and Covenants 132:1). At other times the Lord has given other instructions. In the Book of Mormon, the Lord told the prophet Jacob “for there shall not any man among you have save it be one wife: and concubines he shall have none... for if I will, saith the Lord of Hosts, raise up seed unto me, I will command my people; otherwise they shall hearken unto these things” (Jacob 2:27-30).

In this dispensation, the Lord commanded some of the early Saints to practice plural marriage. The Prophet Joseph Smith and those closest to him, including Brigham Young and Heber C. Kimball, were challenged by this command, but they obeyed it. Church leaders regulated the practice. Those entering into it had to be authorized to do so, and the marriages had to be performed through the sealing power of the priesthood. In 1890, President Wilford Woodruff received a revelation that the leaders of the Church should cease teaching the practice of plural marriage (Official Declaration 1).

The Lord’s law of marriage is monogamy unless he commands otherwise to help establish the House of Israel (see Encyclopedia of Mormonism Vol. 3, pp. 1091-1095).

[Melissa]

And the house has been established....so no further need. Again, and EARTHLY practice.

[rewcox]

It's good none of us practice it today, although a widower can be sealed to anther woman.

Do you dislike President Nelson and Elder Oaks being sealed to other woman?

And the house has been established....so no further need. Again, and EARTHLY practice.

[shadow]

And the house has been established....so no further need. Again, and EARTHLY practice.

Well, except the husband of the Mother of Christ, Christ's Father.

[Melissa]

It's good none of us practice it today, although a widower can be sealed to anther woman.

Do you dislike President Nelson and Elder Oaks being sealed to other woman?

And the house has been established....so no further need. Again, and EARTHLY practice.

I don't really care about their marriages.

[Melissa]

And the house has been established....so no further need. Again, and EARTHLY practice.

Well, except the husband of the Mother of Christ, Christ's Father.

The house was established in 1830

Plus, God did not have intercourse with Mary. There is a weirdness to believing that God's breed with mortals. Mary is married to Joseph as far as I and almost everyone I know is concerned.

[rewcox]

It's clear you don't like polygamy.

It is also clear that it was practiced with God's authorization in biblical times, and also in our church's early days.

Whether we like it or not.

It's good none of us practice it today, although a widower can be sealed to anther woman.

Do you dislike President Nelson and Elder Oaks being sealed to other woman?

And the house has been established....so no further need. Again, and EARTHLY practice.

I don't really care about their marriages.