LDS Freedom Forum

If a man declares that he knows by the power of God that something is true, the natural man will call it foolishness.
If someone claims that the power of God wrought upon him, and gave him knowledge concerning a topic, what good are your quotes and memorized verses? You will reject the things of God unless you endeavor to also receive an answer by the power of God as well.

1 Corinthians 2:12-14
12. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual
14. But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15. But he that is spiritual judgeth[Greek: Examine, Try(taste)] all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16. For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

What is the mind of Christ? It is the Spirit of God. If a person truly receives pure intelligence through the Spirit of God, which is the mind of Christ, who are you to instruct the Lord concerning the things of the Lord?

What good is it to try and convince someone that they haven't received the Holy Ghost and been Born of God? What purpose is there in trying to tell someone their revelation is false? If they truly did receive a revelation, the natural man in you will call that revelation foolishness.

Seek to receive an answer yourself, and quit using quotes and twisted interpretations of verses to support your opinion. Only then will you know the truth concerning these things.

Stahura wrote: Seek to receive an answer yourself, and quit using quotes and verses to support your opinion. Only then will you know the truth concerning these things.

Wait, wasn't this your thread?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=40329" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Where you said this?

"It makes no difference what is written or what anyone has said, if what has been said is in conflict with what the Lord has revealed, we can set it aside. My words, and the teaching of any other member of the Church, high or low, if they do not square with the revelations, we need not accept them. Let us have this matter clear. We have accepted the four standard works as the measuring yardsticks, or balances, by which we measure every man’s doctrine.
.”
(Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3 vols., edited by Bruce R. McConkie [Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1954-1956], 3: 203.)

"If any man preaches to you, doctrines contrary to the Bible, the Book of Mormon, or the Book of Doctrine & Covenants, set him down as an imposter... Try them by the principles contained in the acknowledged word of God; if they preach, or teach, or practice contrary to that, disfellowship them; cut them off from among you as useless and dangerous branches."
Joseph Smith, Times & Seasons, 5:490-491, April, 1, 1844.

Any further explanation needed?

So which is it? We HAVE to use the scriptures or we shouldn't use them at all?

Seems awfully inconsistent to me.

iWriteStuff wrote:

Stahura wrote: Seek to receive an answer yourself, and quit using quotes and verses to support your opinion. Only then will you know the truth concerning these things.

Wait, wasn't this your thread?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=40329" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Where you said this?

"It makes no difference what is written or what anyone has said, if what has been said is in conflict with what the Lord has revealed, we can set it aside. My words, and the teaching of any other member of the Church, high or low, if they do not square with the revelations, we need not accept them. Let us have this matter clear. We have accepted the four standard works as the measuring yardsticks, or balances, by which we measure every man’s doctrine.
.”
(Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, 3 vols., edited by Bruce R. McConkie [Salt Lake City: Bookcraft, 1954-1956], 3: 203.)

"If any man preaches to you, doctrines contrary to the Bible, the Book of Mormon, or the Book of Doctrine & Covenants, set him down as an imposter... Try them by the principles contained in the acknowledged word of God; if they preach, or teach, or practice contrary to that, disfellowship them; cut them off from among you as useless and dangerous branches."
Joseph Smith, Times & Seasons, 5:490-491, April, 1, 1844.

Any further explanation needed?

So which is it? We HAVE to use the scriptures or we shouldn't use them at all?

Seems awfully inconsistent to me.

What was the context that this quote was posted in?

Someone claimed that we are supposed to compare everything that is taught to the words of the living prophet. I posted that showing that we are not supposed to do that, we are supposed to compare the words of living prophets to the books of scripture that we already have that the scriptures are the bar by which we compare everything, if they don't match up then you can lay aside that teaching.

That's a whole different situation with a different context. I wasn't using quotes to support my opinion. I posted a quote from Joseph Smith that another person directly contradicted.

I edited it to be more clear. Quit using Twisted Interpretations of scriptures to support your opinion.

Sure, the context in which you used it is different, but the quotes mean the same thing. Compare the doctrine or quotes of ANY member of the church to the scriptures and you will know truth from falsehood. That is still true. So if we use scriptures to back up what we're saying, clearly that is a proper yardstick to measure the truth and the onus is on the person teaching contrary to prove their claims/statements.

Seriously, I think you lost some credibility on this one with a such a self serving contradiction. Can't have it both ways.

iWriteStuff wrote:Sure, the context in which you used it is different, but the quotes mean the same thing. Compare the doctrine or quotes of ANY member of the church to the scriptures and you will know truth from falsehood. That is still true. So if we use scriptures to back up what we're saying, clearly that is a proper yardstick to measure the truth and the onus is on the person teaching contrary to prove their claims/statements.

Seriously, I think you lost some credibility on this one with a such a self serving contradiction. Can't have it both ways.

I agree, with the way I put it before, it looks very hypocritical and I see that I would lose credibility. I edited it to better portray what I mean. I made the post in haste.

What i mean is that we need to quit using twisted interpretations of scriptures.

Would I really believe and claim that we cannot use scriptures? Jesus taught with written scriptures over and over and over. Using the words from the Old Testament to teach.(Of course they were already his own words that he gave to the Prophets, but that's beside the point)

Correction noted and approved :ymapplause:

You had me very worried.

iWriteStuff wrote:Correction noted and approved :ymapplause:

You had me very worried.

hehe. :-ss

In addition to that, in this OP I created a scenario with certain conditions.

The condition is that a man makes a claim that he received knowledge when the Spirit of God wrought upon him. If the Spirit of God, which is the mind of Christ, gave him this answer, then it is the truth, it cannot be wrong. So in this scenario, the man is NOT wrong, God truly gave him the answer.

IF this is the case, THEN how will quotes and your interpretations of the scriptures ever change the truth of his answer? In this scenario, your interpretation is simply wrong.
IF he is claiming it is true because the spirit says so, and you are claiming it's not because of your interpretation of the scriptures says so, you're not gonna get far. If what he said is true, then you'll only know it's true when you pray and receive an answer in the same manner.
Obviously if what a man says doesn't not match any known written scripture, it can be much easier to write it off. The problem is that often a claim is made by someone matches with many scriptures, and contradicts the interpretation of many other scriptures.That's why there's disagreements.

IF that man truly received knowledge from the Spirit, THEN the only true way to understand that is the same way that this man received his knowledge. From the Spirit of God.

IF that man truly received knowledge from the Spirit, THEN the natural man will call it foolishness, even though it's true.

I hope I'm being clear in what I mean.. It's awfully difficult for me to express my thoughts. Just like Moses and Enoch said they were slow of speech, I'm not very good at communicating.