So, why ask people questions about DS?, he has no spokesman.endlessismyname wrote:As he says so forcefully in his last blog post, "I have NO SPOKESMAN" (http://denversnuffer.com/2016/01/second-hand-rumors/)..
Jeepers man, it was a stupid speeding ticket. That's all. You're way over-analyzing this. It was verified. You could spend a few bucks if you really care to verify it for yourself but that seems like a huge waste of time. And I mean this in the nicest wayendlessismyname wrote:1) JulesGP starts off by saying that she's met the man, and that he looks NOTHING like the man in the mugshot. (HUMOR: Maybe it's because when she met him he had the countenance of Joseph Smith fall over him?)
2) Then she recants and says she "did some more checking", that the photo IS of him, but that he was booked for failure to appear for a speeding ticket. She provides no evidence that this is the case, as though her "checking" should be sufficient proof that her claim is true.
3) In the same breath she makes a remark to minimize the event... "There ya go... Denver is a criminal". Interestingly, even that last comment isn't verifiable. While there's a mugshot of Denver Snuffer in the public record, that doesn't mean he wasn't falsely accused, or found not guilty on the charges. If either of those are true, he's not a criminal. If he was found guilty or agreed to a plea deal then I guess Jules was right - he is, quite literally, a criminal. A criminal who had to be apprehended and booked into a detention center in order for the presiding authorities to be able to execute justice in relation to his crime.
So here we have a sympathetic witness who doesn't recognize the suspect but claims to have knowledge of what the charges were because she "did some checking on it".
It's also not really a unique prophecy. He is just mirroring what Joseph Smith already said about one of the signs of the Lord's coming.Jesef wrote:The one you referred to is here:
http://denversnuffer.com/2013/03/a-sign/While it sounds very prophetic, it was not given in the name of the Lord [edit: nor dictated in 1st Person like Joseph Smith's revelations/prophecies from the Lord, for example], nor was it very risky [in my opinion] since it will not supposedly be fulfilled until the Lord returns [i.e. the end of the world]. Also, of note, in it he certainly implies that he, Denver Snuffer, is "the servant" spoken of in Jacob 5, 3 Nephi 21, and D&C 85:7, a.k.a. the "one mighty and strong." Another turn-off, for me, was all the references he made to himself and his significance/importance. He did this many times in his 10 talks and apparently expanded on this in the book version "Preserving the Restoration" in which he makes reference to having Rabbis in his ancestry, qualifying himself as of the seed Jesse and Joseph, i.e. D&C 113:3-6.A Sign
March 3, 2013
When the Seed of the Woman was born, a new star appeared in the heavens. In like manner, when the Lion of Judah returns, as with his first coming, there will be a new star seen. All the world will note its appearance and shall be troubled at its meaning. When it makes its appearance, you may know His return is soon upon the world. You may also know by that sign that He has given to me the words I have faithfully taught as His servant.
Feel free to correct me if I've stated anything inaccurately.
Please don't misunderstand me. I am not saying that there is anything wrong with repeating a prophecy recorded in the scriptures, or recorded in the words of Joseph Smith, or elsewhere. I've done that myself, many times in fact. Probably most of us have (when teaching a lesson etc.), but if a repeated prophecy comes to pass, it does not prove the authority, or the veracity, of the one that repeated it. Rather, it proves the original source.then will appear one grand sign of the Son of Man in heaven. But what will the world do? They will say it is a planet, a comet, etc. But the Son of Man, which will be as the light of the morning cometh out of the east. (April 6, 1843.) DHC 5:336-337.
- TPJS 286
A revelation given in Kirtland the 22d & 23d. day of Sept AD 1832 [I added verse numbers, line breaks, and took out unnecessary spaces for readability, left everything else including misspellings]
1) A revelation of Jesus Christ unto his saints servant Joseph and six Elders as they united there hearts in lifting there voice on high,
2) yea the word of the Lord, concerning his church established in the last days. for the restoration of his people as he has spoken by the mouth of his prophets and for the gathering, of his saints to stand upon mount Zion which shall be called the city New Jerusalem, [isn't the Lord addressing the Church then, not some Church or Remnant of a church established by Snuffer in 2014?]
3) which city shall be built begining at the temple lot which is appointed by the finger of God the Lord in the western boundaries of the State of Missou[ri] and dedicated by the hand of Joseph and others with whom the Lord was will pleased, [how does this jive with Snuffer's statements about the City being built in the Rocky Mountains?]
4) verily this is the word of the Lord, that the city New Jerusalem shall be built by the gathring of the saints begining at this place, even the place of the Temple, which Temple shall be built <reared> in this generation [was this not supposed to be the Independence Missouri Temple and was not fulfilled? was "this generation" not the generation being addressed by this revelation, i.e. 1832 saints? it honestly wouldn’t make sense to address this to a future generation]
5) for verely this generation shall not all pass away untill an house shalt be built unto the Lord and a cloud shall rest upon it which cloud shall be even the glory of the Lord which shall fill the house, [is this a failed prophecy? no conditions seem to be stated or implied…]
6) and the sons of Moses according to the holy Priesthood which he received under the father in Law Jethro, [what holy priesthood? it sounds like high priesthood. by what method? sounds like laying on of hands. Didn't Snuffer say high priesthood could only be transmitted by the voice of God? how does this reconcile? if Joseph knew and believed this, would it not be reflected in this revelation on priesthood?]
7) and Jethro received it u[n]der the ha[n]d of Caleb.
8) and Caleb received it under the hand of Elihu
9) and Elihu under the hand of Jeremy
10) and Jeremy under the hand of Gad
11) and Gad under the hand of Esaias
12) and Esaius received it under the hand of God, [interesting statement, "it" definitely doesn't sound like Aaronic Priesthood since the first guy mentioned in verse 6 is Moses...]
13) Esaius lived also lived in the days of Abraham and was blessed of him
14) which Abraham received the Priesthood from Melchesedec who received it through the linage of his fathers even till Noah, [what priesthood? Melchizedek priesthood]
15) and from Noah till Enoch, through the linage of there fathers
16) and from Enoch to abel who was slain by the conspiracy of his brother who received the Priesthood by the commandment of God by the hand of his father Adam who was the first man,
17) which Priesthood continueth in the church of God in all generations and is without begining of days or end of years [confirmed by description here, Melchizedek Priesthood, doesn’t sound like priesthood is separated from “the church of God” but continues IN it in all generations]
[This is the same language used in the quotes that Denver repeatedly referred to in his Priesthood lecture but he emphasized that it can only be received by the voice of God, etc. "All the prophets had the Melchizedek priesthood and were ordained by God himself." And JST Genesis 14:26-36:
“ 26 Now Melchizedek was a man of faith, who wrought righteousness; and when a child he feared God, and stopped the mouths of lions, and quenched the violence of fire.
27 And thus, having been approved of God, he was ordained an high priest after the order of the covenant which God made with Enoch,
28 It being after the order of the Son of God; which order came, not by man, nor the will of man; neither by father nor mother; neither by beginning of days nor end of years; but of God;
29 And it was delivered unto men by the calling of his own voice, according to his own will, unto as many as believed on his name.
30 For God having sworn unto Enoch and unto his seed with an oath by himself; that every one being ordained after this order and calling should have power, by faith, to break mountains, to divide the seas, to dry up waters, to turn them out of their course;
31 To put at defiance the armies of nations, to divide the earth, to break every band, to stand in the presence of God; to do all things according to his will, according to his command, subdue principalities and powers; and this by the will of the Son of God which was from before the foundation of the world.
32 And men having this faith, coming up unto this order of God, were translated and taken up into heaven.
33 And now, Melchizedek was a priest of this order; therefore he obtained peace in Salem, and was called the Prince of peace.
34 And his people wrought righteousness, and obtained heaven, and sought for the city of Enoch which God had before taken, separating it from the earth, having reserved it unto the latter days, or the end of the world;
35 And hath said, and sworn with an oath, that the heavens and the earth should come together; and the sons of God should be tried so as by fire.
36 And this Melchizedek, having thus established righteousness, was called the king of heaven by his people, or, in other words, the King of peace.”
Can’t argue that I don’t see this type of power being manifested by MP leaders in the Church today, but I can’t think of any examples of Joseph Smith demonstrating this either, and certainly not Denver Snuffer, so if we’re going to use this as a standard by which to judge, all fail in my opinion. I also believe that Denver has taken too hard a stance on “delivered unto men by the calling of his own voice” as this is sort of ambiguous and does not preclude transmission by laying on of hands as Section 84 here clearly states (i.e. Genesis 14 doesn’t stand alone from D&C 84 which are both talking about the same Priesthood - “without beginning of days or end of years” proves that). Denver seems to be cherry-picking again. But he claims firsthand experience and implies that he has received not only this priesthood and the presence of the Son, but that he possesses the Third “Patriarchal Priesthood” and sealing power directly from the Father, so, in other words, he claims he KNOWS and that his is not merely opinion or scriptural interpretation. The only way to settle it, is to receive confirmation one way or the other from God by the power of the Holy Ghost, etc.]
[…back to D&C 84…]
18) and the Lord confirmed a priesthood also upon Aaron and his seed throughout all the generations of the Jews. which priesthood also continueth and abideth for ever with the Priesthood which is after the holiest order of God, [very clear distinction between the TWO priesthoods]
19) and this greater Priesthood adminestereth the gospel and holdeth the key of the misteries of the kingdom, even the key of the knowledge of God
20) therefore in the ordinences thereof the power of Godliness is manifest [still talking about the greater or Melchizedek priesthood]
21) and without the ordinences thereof, and the authority of the Priesthood, the power of Godliness is not manifest unto man in the flesh,
22) for without this no man can see the face of God even the father and live,
23) now this Moses plainly taught to the children of Israel in the wilderness, and saught diligently to sanctify his people that they might behold the face of God,
24) but they hardened ther hearts and could not endure his presence therefore the Lord in his wrath (for his anger was kindled against them) swore that they should not enter into his rest, which rest is the fulness of his glory
25) while in the wilderness, therefore he took Moses out of there midst and the holy Priesthood also,
26) and the lesser Priesthood continued, which Priesthood holdeth the keys of the ministring of Angels and the preparitory gospel, [very distinctive between TWO priesthoods again, Melchizedek Priesthood has been called “the greater priesthood” and “the holy priesthood”, Aaronic Priesthood is called the “lesser priesthood”]
27) which gospel is the gospel of repentence and of Baptism, and the remission of sins, and the Law of carnal commandments — which the lord in his wrath caused to continue with the house of Aaron among the children of Israel until John whom God raised up being fillid with the holy ghost from his Mothers womb, for he was baptised while he was yet in his the mothers womb
28) and was ordained by the Angel of God at the time he was eight days old unto this power to overthrow the kingdom of the Jews and to make straight the way of the Lord [p. [1]] before the face of his people to prepare them for the coming of the Lord in whose hand is given all power, [Denver implies he is like John the Baptist, overthrowing the kingdom of the Mormons and “wresting the keys” like John did from the Jews. Why wasn’t Denver then ordained by an Angel when he was young? And this is an absurd comparison because the Lord identifies the Church as His in verse 2 of this section. The Remnant loves to draw parallels, and it seems any parallel will do, even if it contradicts itself absurdly.]
29) and again, the offices of Elder & Bishop are necessary appendages belon[g]ing unto the high Priesthood, [uh, this sounds like offices are necessary appendages to the priesthood, and this ties the priesthood even more TO the Church, not independent of it, contrary to Denver’s teachings. It does not sound like he is “preserving” or continuing Joseph’s teachings, but transforming them and innovating them into a more freelance/evangelical form, de-institutionalizing, you don’t need an organization or order or leaders or offices or anything. This simply doesn’t agree with most of the D&C, including this section, and the Remnant tries to explain this by accusing the D&C of alteration and manipulation by post-JS leaders like BY - and yet it is all right here in the original handwriting if you follow the links to the Joseph Smith Papers Project… Or they say “the Lord was just giving the (wicked) Saints what they really wanted” (now they are calling it an Old Testament church, was a New Testament church) - this doesn’t hold water in my opinion, given the obvious sacrifice and dedication of the body of the Saints from this time period, many who gave up everything to gather to Joseph’s revealed locations and go on missions, etc. It’s even more absurd to question the dedication and sacrifice of BY and the 1844 Twelve, Joseph’s closest disciples. Absurdity after absurdity - I can hardly stand it! But I’ll keep going. Endure to the end, of the insanity.]
30) and again the offices of Teacher and Deacon are necessary appendages belonging to the lesser Priesthood, which priesthood was confirmed upon Aaron and his sons [more offices, now AP]
31) therefore as I said, concerning the Sons of Moses, for the sons of Moses, and also the sons of Aaron shall offer an aaceptable offering and sacrifice in the house of the Lord which house shall shalt be built unto the Lord in this generation upon the consecrated spot as I have appointed [Independence or Nauvoo?]
32) and the sons of Moses, and of Aaron shall be filled with the glory of the Lord upon mount Zion in the Lords house whose sons are ye, and also many whom I have called and sent forth to build up my church [whose Church? sounds pretty organized and governed by priesthood authority to me. If you don’t like it, you don’t like Joseph Smith. If you believe the Lord God was really speaking to Joseph Smith, it’s kinda hard to dismiss all these things…]
33) for whoso is faithful unto the attaining of these two Priesthoods of which I have spoken and the magnifying there calling are sanctified by the spirt unto the renewing of there bodies [I don’t think ordination magically imbues one with power, but Pres. Packer and LDS leaders have also taught this clearly over the years. Faith precedes magnifying and sanctification. The Spirit only honors goodness and faith, or righteousness in God. Ratifying power of the Holy Spirit of Promise is attached to everything performed in the name of God.]
34) that they become the sons of Moses and of Aaron and the seed of Abraham and the church and kingdom and the elect of God [Church and Kingdom?]
35) and also all they who receive this Priesthood receiveth me saith the Lord [receive it by the laying on of hands, by ordination? this sounds somewhat symbolic, this chain of receiving in these few verses - could become literal - doesn’t say when - but sounds very representative like “whether by mine own voice or the voice of my servants it is the same” and promised blessings kind of language. Btw, the Remnant movement has made a very big deal about receiving Christ “in the flesh” - while you are in your mortal body - that if you do not qualify for the Second Comforter, as interpreted, you are not going to be Celestial. I don’t believe this is what the word receive means there or here…]
36) for he that receiveth my servants receveth me, [who are His servants? Denver teaches almost always these are heavenly “angels” but D&C clearly contradicts this if you do a simple word search in D&C for all the instances of “servants” you will almost invariably find human names associated, like Joseph Smith and his brethren bringing forth the work.]
37) and he that receiveth me receiveth my father,
38) and he that receiveth my father, receiveth my fathers kingdom, therefore all that my father hath shall be given unto him
39) and this is according to the oath and the covenant which belongeth to the Priesthood,
40) therefore all those. who receive the Priesthood, receiveth this oath and covenant of my father which he cannot break neither can it be mooved, [Denver interprets this literally, so you are in the actual presence of God the Father receiving this covenant face to face. I believe it could happen. Denver Snuffer and Dan Rogers are the only people I know in the Remnant movement who are claiming this. The language being used is “whether in or out of the body I (they) could not tell” which sounds like a vivid/lucid dream or even an awake third-eye type vision to me. Why so few when the teaching is that everyone can and should? You all must be unworthy dross]
41) but whoso breaketh this covenant after he hath received it, and altogether turneth therefrom shall not have forgivness in this world nor in the world to come [what constitutes receiving the covenant? is it simply ordination or ratification/sealing of it by the voice of God?]
42) and all those that come not unto this Priesthood, which ye have received, which I now confirm upon you who are present this day viz the 23d. day of September AD 1832 Eleven high Priests save one by by mine own voice out of the heavens and even I have given the heavenly hosts and mine Angels charge concerning you, [Aha! Sounds like it is by ordination by the laying on of hands and then confirmed by the voice of God - did those present hear anyone’s voice besides Joseph’s dictating the revelation? If you had any doubts about who “this generation” was and whether the Lord was speaking to those present and at that time, this settles it! “According to a 14 January 1833 letter from Orson Hyde and Hyrum Smith that mentions this revelation, the high priests in attendance were the same twelve that met in a conference on 13–14 January 1833. Those high priests were JS, Sidney Rigdon, Joseph Smith Sr., Hyrum Smith, Ezra Thayer, Zebedee Coltrin, Newel K. Whitney, John Murdock, Frederick G. Williams, Joseph Coe, Samuel Smith, and Orson Hyde. However, Samuel Smith and Hyde were preaching in the eastern states in September. Subtracting them from the number leaves “Eleven high Priests save one,” if JS is included as one of the high priests.”]
43) and I now give unto you a commandment to beware concerning yourselves to give heed dilligently to the words of eternal life
44) for you shall live by evry word that procedeth forth from the mouth of God
45) for the word of the Lord is truth and whatsoever is truth is light, and whatsoever is light is spirit even the spirit of Jesus Christ,
46) and the spirit giveth light to evry man that cometh into the world, and the spirit enlightneth evry man through the world that harkneth to the voice of the spirit,
47) and evry one that harkneth to the voice of the spirit cometh unto God even the father
48) and the father teacheth him of the covenant which he hath renewed and confirmed upon you which is confirmed upon you for your sakes and and not for yours only, but for the sake of the whole world, [the covenant! these Saints received it with the greater priesthood! listed above in my notes]
49) and the whole world lieth in sin and groaneth under darkness and under the bondage of sin
50) and by this you may know they are under the bondage of sin because they come not unto me
51) for whoso cometh not unto me is under the bondage of sin,
52) and whoso receiveth not my voice is not acquanted with my word voice. and is not of me,
53) and, by this you may know the righteous from the wicked, and that the whole world groaneth under sins and darkness even now,
54) and your minds in times past have been darkened because of unbelief and because you have treated lightly the things you have received
55) which vanity and and unbelief hath brought the whole church under condemnation
56) and this condemnation resteth upon the children of Zion even all,
57) and thay shall remain [p. [2]] under this condemnation until they repent and remember the new covenant even the book of Mormon and the former commandments which I have given them, not only to say but to do according to that which I have writen [the new covenant isn’t just the Book of Mormon but also “the former commandments which I have given them”, condemnation wasn’t permanent or final or total, but until they repent and remember, etc. He calls them children, not strangers, etc. I don’t think this condemnation means what the Remnant represents it as.]
58) that they may bring forth fruit meet for there fathers kingdom otherwise there remaineth a scorge and a Judgment to be poured out upon the children of Zion [now that is a warning, and it sure seems like it was poured out with their removal west.]
59) for shall the children of the kingdom pollute my holy land verily Verily I say unto you na[y].
60) verily, verily, I say unto you who now hear my words which is my voice blessed are you inasmuch as you receive these things
61) for I will forgive you of your sins with this commandment that you remain steadfast in your minds in solemnity and the spirit of p[r]ayer in bearing testamony to all the world of those things which are communicated unto you, [what?! He will forgive them if they bear testimony? has the Church done that?]
62) therefore go ye into all the world and whatsoever place ye cannot go into ye shall send, that the testamony may go from you into all the world unto every creature,
63) and as I said unto mine apostles even so <I> says unto you, for you are mine Apostles, even Gods High priests ye are they whom my father hath given me, ye are my friends [what?! Christ is calling them his Apostles and God’s High priests and his friends! doesn’t sound like rejection to me. Maybe His servants are these guys. Maybe his injunction in D&C 1, November 1831, “& the day cometh that they who will not hear the voice of the Lord neither his servants neith[er] give heed to the words of the Prophets & Apostles shall be cut off from among the People” - maybe the definition is retroactive - who are His People? and further in D&C 1 “that every man might Speak in the name of God the Lord even the Saveiour of the world that faith also might increase in the Earth that mine everlasting Covenant might be established that the fullness of my Gospel might be proclaimed by the weak & the Simple unto the ends of the world & before kings & Rulers [this is talking to Joseph and his brethren, how are Denver and his band supposed to fulfill this?] Behold I am God & have spoken it these are commandments are of me & were given unto my Servents in their weakness [note: not heavenly angels as Denver teaches, but Joseph and his brethren, and presumably successors in the work for heaven’s sake!] after the manner of their Language that they might come to understanding & inasmuch as they erred it might be made known & inasmuch as they sought wisdom it might be made known instructed & inasmuch as they sinned they might be chastened [all the condemnation and rejection which Denver and the Remnant ascribe to the Church and Saints could be better viewed as chastening in my opinion] that they might repent & inasmuch as they were humble they might be made strong & blessed from on high & receive knowledge from time to time After they having received the record of the Nephites yea even my Servant Joseph might have power to translate through the mercy of God by the power of [God] the Book of Mormon & also those to whom these commandments were given might have power to lay the foundation of this Church & to bring it forth out of obscurity & out of darkness the only true & living Church upon the face of the whole Earth with which I [p. 126] the Lord am well pleased speaking unto the Church collectively & not individually” and “& willeth that all men shall know that the day speedily cometh the hour is not yet but is nigh at hand when peace shall be taken from the Earth & the Devil shall have power over his own dominion & also the Lord shall have power over his saints & shall reign in their midst & shall come down in Judgement upon Idumea (or the World) search these commandments for they are true & faithfull & the Prophecies & promises which are in them shall all be fulfilled what I the Lord have spoken I have spoken & I excuse not myself & though the Heaven & <the> Earth pass away my word shall not pass away but shall all be fulfilled whether by mine own voice or by the voice of my Servants it is the same for Behold & Lo the Lord is God & the Spirit beareth record & the [record] is true & the truth abideth for ever & ever Amen [p. 127]” - “my Servants” is NOT angels!]
64) therefore as I said unto mine Apostles I say unto you again that evry soul who believeth on your words and are baptized by water for the remission of there sins shall receive the holy-ghost,
65) and these signs shall follow them,
66) in my name they shall do many wonderful works,
67) in my name they shall cast out devels.
68) in my name they shall heal the sick
69) in my name they shall open the eyes of the blind and unstop the ears of the deaf,
70) and the tongue of the dumb shall speak,
71) and if any man shall administer poison unto them it shall not hurt them,
72) and the poison of the <a> serpent shall not [have] power to harm them,
73) but a commandment I give unto them that they shall not boast themselves of these things, neither speak them before the world for these things are given unto you for your proffet and for salvation, [what?! They’re not supposed to boast or blare their miraculous and powerful spiritual experiences, blessings, and signs?! someone always talks though, right? that’s one thing we learned from the Lord’s miracles…]
74) verily, verily I say unto you he who believeth not on your words, and are not baptized by water in my name for the remission of there sins, that they may receive the holy ghost shall be damned and shall not come into my fathers kingdom where my father and I am [man, what the hell?! Now we’ve got to go get rebaptized the Denver Snuffer way because God moved the ball? And all those 100’s of millions of temple baptisms and ordinances for the dead - sorry, waste of time, all rejected! And you Remnant folks are going to have to start all over and you don’t even have one temple yet… ugh!]
75) and this revelation unto you and commandment is in force from this very hour upon all the world, and this gospel is unto all who have not received it, [I’ll just point out that this seems like a pretty lame commandment if God just knows it’s all going to tank really just 12 years from then. Why bother? Why keep leading these people on?]
76) but verily I say unto all those to whom the kingdom has been given from you it must be preached unto them that they shall repent of ther former evil works for they are to be upbraded for there evil hearts of unbelief and your brethren in Zion for there rebellion against you at the time I sent you,
77) and again I say unto you my friends, for from this time forth I shall call you friends, it is expedient that I give unto you this commandment that you become even as my friends in days when I was with them in travling to preach this gospel in my power [Wow! the Lord calls them His friends again.]
78) for I suffered them not to have purse or scrip, neither two coats
79) behold I send you out to proove the world, and the Laborer is worthy of his hire
80) and any man that shall go and preach this gospel of the kingdom and fail not to continue [p. [3]] faithful in all things shall not be weary in mind neither darkened neither body limb, limb, or Joint and an hair of your heads shall not fall to the ground unnoti[c]ed and they shall not go hungry, neither athirst, [promises, promises, and “this gospel of the kingdom” - why would God need to reboot such a thing - doesn’t He know enough to do His work and make it successful?]
81) therefore take no thought for the morrow for what ye shall eat or what ye shall drink or wherewith all ye shall ye shall be clothed
82) for consider the lillies of the field how they grow they toil not neither do they spin and the kingdoms of the world in all ther glory are not arayed like one of them
83) for your father who art in heaven knoweth that you have need of all these thing
84) therefore let the morrow take thought for the things of itself,
85) neither take ye thought before hand what ye shall say but treasure up in your minds continually the words of life and it shall be given you in the very hour that po[r]tion that shall be meeted unto evry man
86) therefore let no man among you (for this commandment is unto all the faithful who are called of God in the church unto the ministry) therefore let no man from this hour take purse or scrip that goeth forth to proclaim this gospel of the kingdom [doesn’t sound like we do this anymore, just observing - it’s never been practical, so I don’t think that’s a good excuse]
87) behold I send you out to reproove the world of all there unrighteous deeds and to t[ea]ch them of a Judgment which is to come [who’d he send out? none other than those 1844 Twelve that Denver loves to castigate]
88) and whoso receiveth you there I will be also for I will go before your face I will be on your right hand and on your lift [left] and my spirit shall be in your hearts and mine Angels round about you to bear you up, [there’s that word “receive” again, and it seems very clear here that it means to accept and believe and the other stuff seems fairly figurative or at least invisible]
89) whoso receiveth you receiveth me and the same will feed you and clothe you, and give you money [there it is again, whoso receiveth them, the servants of the Lord, receiveth the Lord - again, this seems figurative not literal]
90) and he who feedeth you or chothe you or giveth you money shall in no wise loose his reward [so these emissaries represent the Lord and His church and kingdom]
91) and he that doeth not these things is not my deciple, by this you may know my deciples
92) he that receiveth you not, go away from him, alone by your selves and cleanse your feet even with water, pur water, whether in heat or in cold and bare testamony of it unto your father which is in heaven and return not again unto that man, [we don’t do this anymore either, just observing]
93) and in whatsoevr village or city ye enter do likewise,
94) nevertheless search dilligently and spare not, wo unto that house, or that village or city that rejecteth you or your words or testamony concerning me, [pretty strong language and for rejecting whom? the Lord’s truly authorized servant/Apostles/high-priests, who represent Him. God doesn’t do things in a corner. If he was going to overthrow His own kingdom, I expect a little more proof and power.]
95) wo I say again unto that house or that village or city that rejecteth you or your words or your testamony of me
96) for I the Almighty have laid my hand upon the nations to scorge them for ther wickedness
97) and plagues shall go forth and it shall not be taken from the earth untill I have completed my work which shall be cut short in righteousness [seems like this is still in progress]
98) until all shall know me who remain even from the least to the greatest and shall be filled with the knowledge of the Lord and shall see eye to eye, and shall lift up the voice, and with the voice together sing this new song, saying [sounds like this work just continues until Zion and the Millennial reign of Christ, no reboot mentioned anywhere that I can see. Sounds like Daniel, like the kingdom shall not be left to other people. There won’t be a remnant.]
99) the lord hath brought again Zion the Lord hath redeemed his people Israel, according to the election of grace which was brought to pass by the faith and covenant of ther fathers,
100) the Lord hath redeemed his people and Satan is bound and time is no longer the Lord hath gathered all things in one the Lord hath brought down Zion from above the Lord hath brought up Zion from benieth
101) the earth hath travailed and brought forth her [p. [4]]
Really think he's going to care and hear you out? I pointed out by his own statements in a previous post -Jesef wrote:Section 84 seems fairly word for word. I could detect no substantive changes or additions. This one revelation contradicts and invalidates many of Denver Snuffer’s claims and teachings, as I read it. Sorry for the length. I hope this helps. I think I may write to Denver myself, as endless did, and point him to this thread and this post. Perhaps he will respond.
You receive no witness until after the trial of your faith. It is not an easy road.6 And now, I, Moroni, would speak somewhat concerning these things; I would show unto the world that faith is things which are hoped for and not seen; wherefore, dispute not because ye see not, for ye receive no witness until after the trial of your faith.
Jesef, In fear of violating the rules of your OP limiting replies to only those who "were on the Denver Snuffer train and eventually jumped off" I feel I must reply with an alternate answer. The question you should be asking is whether Denver Snuffer is still on the Daryl train? Seriously. Or your could extend that to is obrien still on the blarsen train? Or perhaps is brlenox still on the jules train? But the most important question is of course, Is the Lord Jesus Christ on the Jesef train? Because none of this stuff matters if we don't lay down our weapons (keyboards) and become one mind.Jesef wrote: So please, if you were on the Denver Snuffer train and eventually jumped off, feel free to share your stories and experiences and discuss. I'll share mine apart from the OP very shortly.
Its time to hook up to the train, it moves fast, Jesus Christ is the conductor of the train.Daryl wrote:Jesef, In fear of violating the rules of your OP limiting replies to only those who "were on the Denver Snuffer train and eventually jumped off" I feel I must reply with an alternate answer. The question you should be asking is whether Denver Snuffer is still on the Daryl train? Seriously. Or your could extend that to is obrien still on the blarsen train? Or perhaps is brlenox still on the jules train? But the most important question is of course, Is the Lord Jesus Christ on the Jesef train? Because none of this stuff matters if we don't lay down our weapons (keyboards) and become one mind.Jesef wrote: So please, if you were on the Denver Snuffer train and eventually jumped off, feel free to share your stories and experiences and discuss. I'll share mine apart from the OP very shortly.
For now the trains are all divergent. Until we all hook up to the Lord's engine and are tugged by His strength and are are of one heart, one mind with all in common... That is what our focus should be.
As for Denver Snuffer I appreciate his works. I feel parity with him. I am at peace with who he is and who I am.
