Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

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BrotherOfMahonri
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Posts: 1751

Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

The Holy Spirit has been upon me for some time as I have pondered, studied out, and prayed sincerely about this topic, and I now prophesy in the workings of the Holy Spirit in my heart and the common sense he has given me to understand truth by the Holy Spirit, even the blessing of the potential to know the truth of all things, that Joseph Smith never practiced polygamy, and the LDS Church will renounce such historical untruths, false affidavits, etc. of him having ever established and practiced polygamy in the not too distant future, which will bring upon the church a blessing that has been withheld because of this unbelief.

The LDS Church will state that polygamy was never practiced by the Prophet, Seer and Revelator, Joseph Smith Jr., clearing the good name of the man who has done more for our salvation save the Savior himself, and showing to the world in effect, Satan has more power upon the hearts and minds of the people than we realize or give thought towards - as he has stuck his foot into the restoration and due to man's weakness has succeeded in promulgating the false history of Joseph's supposed polygamy.

Praise God that he reveals his truths to babes and to those who think not that they are learned, wise, and scholarly.

BrotherOfMahonri
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Posts: 1751

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

A Parable Joseph Wrote of himself:
It came to pass that as I went forth like a young fawn, one day, to feed upon the green grass in my pasture, an @#$ saw me, and brayed, and made a great noise; which a neighboring lion hearing roared, even as a lion roareth when he beholds his prey: at the sound of his voice the beasts of the field were alarmed, and the lions in the adjoining jungles pricked their ears and roared in their turn; and behold all the lions of the forest, alarmed by the noise, opened their mouths and uttered forth their voice which was as the roaring of a cataract, or as the voice of thunder; so tremendous was their roaring that the trees of the forest shook, as if they were shaken by a mighty wind; and all the beasts of the forest trembled, as if a whirlwind were passing. I lifted up mine eyes with astonishment when I heard the voice of the lions, and saw the fury of their rage. I asked, is it possible that so many lords of the forest, such noble beasts, should condescend to notice one solitary fawn, that is feeding alone upon his pasture; without attempting to excite either their jealousy or anger? I have not strayed from the fold, nor injured the trees of the forest, nor hurt the beasts of the field, nor trampled upon their pasture, nor drunk of their streams; why then their rage against me? When lo! and behold! they again uttered their voices, as the voice of great thunderings, and there was given unto them the voice of men; but it was difficult for me to distinguish what was said, among so many voices; but ever and anon I heard a few broken, incoherent sentences, like the following:— Murder! Desolation!! Bloodshed!!! Arson!!! Treason!!! Joe Smith and the Mormons!... I then lifted up my voice and said, hear me, ye beasts of the forest! and all ye great lions pay attention! I am innocent of the things whereof ye accuse me. I have not been guilty of violating your laws, nor of trespassing upon your rights. My hands are clean from the blood of all men, and I am at the defiance of the world to substantiate the crimes whereof I am accused; wherefore, then, should animals of your noble mein stoop to such little jealousies, such vulgar language, and lay such unfounded charges at the door of the innocent (italics added)? It is true that I once suffered an @#$ to feed in my pasture; he ate at my crib and drank at my waters, but possessing the true nature of an @#$, he began to foul the water with his feet, and to trample under foot the green grass, and destroy it. I therefore put him out of my pasture, and he began to bray. Many of the lions in the adjoining jungles mistaking his braying for the roaring of a lion, commenced roaring. When I proclaimed this abroad many of the lions began to enquire into the matter.... And they felt ashamed of themselves for being decoyed into such base ribaldry, and foul-mouthed slander. But there were many that lost sight of their dignity, and continued to roar.... Among these was a great lion, whose den was on the borders of the eastern sea.... His might, his influence were felt to the ends of the earth; when he lashed his tail the beasts of the forest trembled; and when he roared all the great lions and the young lions crouched down at his feet.*
This great lion lifting up himself and beholding the fawn afar off, he opened his mouth, and joining in the common roar, uttered the following...
JOE SMITH IN TROUBLE.—By a letter which we published on Sunday, from Springfield, Illinois, it appears that Joe Smith, the great Mormon Prophet, has at last given himself up to the authorities of Illinois.... why does not Joe try his power at working a miracle or two? Now's the time to prove his mission—besides being very convenient for himself."
When I heard it, I said poor fellow! How has thy dignity fallen!...
And now, friend B. allow me to whisper a word in thine ear. Dost thou not know that there is a God in the heavens that judgeth? that setteth up one and putteth down another according to the counsel of his own will? That if thou possesses! any influence, wisdom, dominion, or power, it comes from God, and to him thou art indebted for it? That he holds the destinies of men in his power, and can as easily put down as he has raised up? Tell me when hast thou treated a subject of religious and eternal truth with that seriousness and candor that the importance of the subject demands from a man in thy standing, possessing thy calling and influence? As you seem to be quite a theologist, allow me to ask a few questions, why did not God deliver Micaiah from the hands of his persecutors? Why did not Jeremiah "work a miracle or two," to help him out of the dungeon? It would have been "very convenient." Why did not Zacheriah, by a miracle prevent the people from slaying him? Why did not our Saviour come down from the cross? The people asked him to do it; and besides he had "saved others," and could not save himself, so said the people. Why did he not prove his mission by working a miracle and coming down? Why did not Paul by a miracle prevent the people from stoning and whipping him? It would have been "very convenient." Or why did the saints of God, in every age, have to wander about in sheep skins and goat skins? Being tempted, tried, and sawn asunder; of whom the world was not worthy....
I listened, and lo! I heard a voice, and it was the voice of my shepherd, saying, listen all ye lions of the forest; and all the beasts of the field give ear; ye have sought to injure the innocent; and your hands have been lifted against the weak, the injured and the oppressed. Ye have pampered the libertine, the calumniator, and the base. Ye have winked at vice, and trodden under foot the virtuous and the pure. Therefore hear, all ye lions of the forest. The Lord God will take from you your teeth, so that you shall no longer devour. He will pluck out your claws, so that you can no longer seize upon you're prey. Your strength will fail you in the day of trouble, and your voice will fail, and not be heard afar off; but mine elect will I uphold with mine arm, and my chosen shall be supported by my power. And when mine annointed shall be exalted, and all the lions of the forest shall have lost their strength, then shall they remember that the Lord he is God.
JOSEPH SMITH.
(Times and Seasons 4 [February 15, 1843]: 97–98)
http://voiceofanearthquake.blogspot.com ... idden.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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rewcox
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by rewcox »

I don't think so.

Jacob 2 gives some information on plural wives. Abraham actually practiced it, he is a God now.

If the church said JS did not, then they would have the problem that BY and others did.

Which would say that the church lost it since JS.

This is what DS wants you to believe. And others. The spirit thing you will need to work out for yourself.

Fiannan
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Posts: 12983

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by Fiannan »

Praise God that he reveals his truths to babes...
;)

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inho
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Location: in a galaxy far, far away

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by inho »

rewcox wrote:I don't think so.

Jacob 2 gives some information on plural wives. Abraham actually practiced it, he is a God now.

If the church said JS did not, then they would have the problem that BY and others did.

Which would say that the church lost it since JS.

This is what DS wants you to believe. And others. The spirit thing you will need to work out for yourself.
I agree.

Even if JS never practised it, we still have the issue of biblical polygamy. In the Bible polygamy is everywhere (Abraham, Jacob, Moses, regulations of law of Moses etc.) In addition, we have Jacob 2, as rewcox pointed out. It is clear to me that at some times in some situations God allows polygamy.
I don't like it, but I can't deny it.

EdGoble
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Posts: 1077

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by EdGoble »

BrotherOfMahonri wrote:The Holy Spirit has been upon me for some time as I have pondered, studied out, and prayed sincerely about this topic, and I now prophesy in the workings of the Holy Spirit in my heart and the common sense he has given me to understand truth by the Holy Spirit, even the blessing of the potential to know the truth of all things, that Joseph Smith never practiced polygamy, and the LDS Church will renounce such historical untruths, false affidavits, etc. of him having ever established and practiced polygamy in the not too distant future, which will bring upon the church a blessing that has been withheld because of this unbelief.

The LDS Church will state that polygamy was never practiced by the Prophet, Seer and Revelator, Joseph Smith Jr., clearing the good name of the man who has done more for our salvation save the Savior himself, and showing to the world in effect, Satan has more power upon the hearts and minds of the people than we realize or give thought towards - as he has stuck his foot into the restoration and due to man's weakness has succeeded in promulgating the false history of Joseph's supposed polygamy.

Praise God that he reveals his truths to babes and to those who think not that they are learned, wise, and scholarly.
Workings of which spirit in your heart? Surely not the Holy Ghost that is in me.

I know by the Holy Ghost and by common sense that is in me that he who rejects this doctrine when it is duly authorized is Anti-Christ. Of course it is not authorized or commanded now. But that doesn't change who commanded it or permitted it at the times in history that it was either commanded or permitted.

samizdat
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Posts: 3511

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by samizdat »

BrotherOfMahonri wrote:The Holy Spirit has been upon me for some time as I have pondered, studied out, and prayed sincerely about this topic, and I now prophesy in the workings of the Holy Spirit in my heart and the common sense he has given me to understand truth by the Holy Spirit, even the blessing of the potential to know the truth of all things, that Joseph Smith never practiced polygamy, and the LDS Church will renounce such historical untruths, false affidavits, etc. of him having ever established and practiced polygamy in the not too distant future, which will bring upon the church a blessing that has been withheld because of this unbelief.

The LDS Church will state that polygamy was never practiced by the Prophet, Seer and Revelator, Joseph Smith Jr., clearing the good name of the man who has done more for our salvation save the Savior himself, and showing to the world in effect, Satan has more power upon the hearts and minds of the people than we realize or give thought towards - as he has stuck his foot into the restoration and due to man's weakness has succeeded in promulgating the false history of Joseph's supposed polygamy.

Praise God that he reveals his truths to babes and to those who think not that they are learned, wise, and scholarly.
Considering that the LDS Church JUST THIS LAST YEAR released a Gospel Topic Essay detailing the 40 wives of Joseph Smith, it simply is NOT going to happen.

BrotherOfMahonri
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1751

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

inho wrote: I agree.

Even if JS never practised it, we still have the issue of biblical polygamy. In the Bible polygamy is everywhere (Abraham, Jacob, Moses, regulations of law of Moses etc.) In addition, we have Jacob 2, as rewcox pointed out. It is clear to me that at some times in some situations God allows polygamy.
I don't like it, but I can't deny it.
This should help you start clearing up the unbelief the latter day saints are so thickly under (and I don't blame us, i was one of them) with this false, anti-Christ (if you will per someone's response) teaching of Polygamy.
).

BIBLE AFFIRMS ONE MAN AND ONE WOMAN (God’s unchanging Pattern)
Let’s start with our first parents and look for God’s pattern, as he gives us patterns in ALL THINGS that we may not be deceived (see D&C 52:14), Adam and Eve (this could easily be a primary lesson of innocence and virtue putting to rest anything else that occurred afterwards with an unchanging God we both believe in):

When God created the universe, He did things in a very specific manner. Those descriptions are provided for us in Genesis 1–2. At the end of His creative activity, God pronounced the things He had made as being “very good” (Genesis 1:31). In Genesis 2 we learn the details of the creation of mankind. After creating Adam from the dust of the ground, God presented the beasts of the field and the birds of the air to Adam to name. When Adam found no suitable helper, God formed the first woman from Adam’s side.

Let’s look closely at this passage and note several key phrases that indicate God’s intent for marriage to be monogamous—one man for one woman. First, God intended to make “a helper” for Adam, not several helpers. Second, from one rib God made one woman for Adam. Genesis 2:24 reveals the pattern (God works in patterns so as to not be deceived, like with polygamy see D&C 52:14) of a man leaving his family to “be joined to his wife,” not wives. This union is then described as becoming “one flesh.”

Jesus confirmed this understanding of marriage when he was asked about divorce by the Pharisees. This is recorded in Mark 10:1–12 and Matthew 19:1–12. In His response Jesus quoted from Genesis 2, confirming that His understanding of marriage was one man for one woman. Confirming the covenantal nature of marriage, Jesus said that divorce was only allowed because of the hardness of the hearts of man. God intended, from the beginning, for marriages to consist of one man and one woman for the duration of their lives. Divorce and polygamy were regulated in the laws given to Moses, but polygamy was recorded long before then.

POLYGAMY is of the Doctrine of the Line of Cain:
The first reference to polygamy is found in Genesis 4 in the lineage of Cain. Of Lamech, a descendant of Cain, we read:

Then Lamech took for himself two wives: the name of one was Adah, and the name of the second was Zillah. And Adah bore Jabal. He was the father of those who dwell in tents and have livestock. His brother’s name was Jubal. He was the father of all those who play the harp and flute. And as for Zillah, she also bore Tubal-Cain, an instructor of every craftsman in bronze and iron. And the sister of Tubal-Cain was Naamah.

Then Lamech said to his wives:
“Adah and Zillah, hear my voice;
Wives of Lamech, listen to my speech!
For I have killed a man for wounding me,
Even a young man for hurting me.
If Cain shall be avenged sevenfold,
Then Lamech seventy-sevenfold.” (Genesis 4:19–25)

Before the Flood, we have a clear distortion of what God had intended for marriage. To compound Lamech’s sin, he brags of his murderous deeds. The Flood was brought upon the earth to judge the sinfulness of mankind, including the sins committed by Lamech.

After the Flood, there are many mentions of polygamous relationships—including among the patriarchs of Israel. Abraham, Jacob, David, and Solomon all had multiple wives. It is interesting to note that there are no passages in Scripture that clearly state, “No man should have more than one wife.” However, polygamous relationships are never mentioned in a positive light, and, indeed, the problems of such relationships are presented.

Consider the consequences revealed in Scripture in each of the following cases: Abraham—led to bitterness between Sarah and her maid, Hagar, and the eventual dismissal of Hagar and Ishmael; Jacob—led to Rachel’s jealousy of Leah and to Joseph being betrayed and sold by his half-brothers; David—led to the rape of one of his daughters (Tamar) by one of his sons (Tamar’s half-brother Amnon) and Amnon’s subsequent murder by Tamar’s brother Absalom; Solomon—his many wives “turned away his heart” from the Lord and to the worship of false gods (1 Kings 11:1–8). Just because the Bible records polygamous relationships does not mean that God approves of such things.

The only direct command against polygamy is given to the kings that were to rule Israel, as they are told not to “multiply wives” to themselves (Deuteronomy 17:17). It is also interesting to note that polygamous relationships seem to be regulated in the commands Moses gave to the nation of Israel. Leviticus 18:18 instructs that a man should not marry sisters, and Deuteronomy 21:15 talks of assigning an heir to a man with two wives. Many commentators suggest that the passages do not endorse polygamy but rather prohibit it. Deuteronomy 21:15 may also be translated as “has had two wives” in succession rather than at the same time. The sisters in Leviticus 18:18 are understood by some to be any Israelite women. Regardless of the interpretation of these passages, the taking of multiple wives is not in accord with God’s design or pattern from the beginning.

Moving to the New Testament, there are several passages that can be understood to speak against polygamous relationships. The first to come to the mind of many would be the qualifications for leaders in the church given by the Apostle Paul to Timothy and Titus. In 1 Timothy 3:2 and 12 and Titus 1:6, we are told that leaders of the church must be the “husband of one wife.”

In 1 Corinthians 7:1–16 Paul answered questions that the Corinthian church had about marriage. In this passage Paul used the singular form of wife and husband throughout the passage. In fact, this is true of the New Testament writers in general.

Scripture compares the relationship of husband and wife to that of Christ and the church. InEphesians 5:25–33 Paul explained this relationship and referred back to Genesis 2:24. Once again, God’s standard for marriage is defined as one man and one woman. Paul finished this analogy by stating, “let each one of you in particular so love his own wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband” (Ephesians 5:33).

Adapted from this site, as I have not put it all down in sequence as well as this author did:
https://answersingenesis.org/family/mar ... the-bible/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


An invite to sit back and maybe consider the possibility that indeed the Gospel restored through Joseph is and was true, but man in their ways pervert the things of the Lord (also a pattern). I fear not man, neither should you, I fear God and this unbelief is what the Holy Spirit has been working in my for my entire life, unbelief in that we believe in things that are not true, like polygamy, which leads us away from Christ’s true gospel not closer to it.

Many of you will simply tell me I’m wrong about this, that is cute and just fine, but this pattern God works in so we are not deceived by Satan, is a real pattern, discernable in the scriptures and the pattern is plain, one man and one woman. God never commands polygamy anywhere.

Again, I have a witness that such is true, and I declare it by the workings of the Holy Spirit and invite you to ask God to strip yourself of unbelief in the matter and he will mercifully open things up even further than you might currently be willing to receive because of unbelief (believing in things that are not true).

samizdat
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3511

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by samizdat »

BrotherOfMahonri wrote:
inho wrote: I agree.

Even if JS never practised it, we still have the issue of biblical polygamy. In the Bible polygamy is everywhere (Abraham, Jacob, Moses, regulations of law of Moses etc.) In addition, we have Jacob 2, as rewcox pointed out. It is clear to me that at some times in some situations God allows polygamy.
I don't like it, but I can't deny it.
This should help you start clearing up the unbelief the latter day saints are so thickly under (and I don't blame us, i was one of them) with this false, anti-Christ (if you will per someone's response) teaching of Polygamy.
).

BIBLE AFFIRMS ONE MAN AND ONE WOMAN (God’s unchanging Pattern)
Let’s start with our first parents and look for God’s pattern, as he gives us patterns in ALL THINGS that we may not be deceived (see D&C 52:14), Adam and Eve (this could easily be a primary lesson of innocence and virtue putting to rest anything else that occurred afterwards with an unchanging God we both believe in):

When God created the universe, He did things in a very specific manner. Those descriptions are provided for us in Genesis 1–2. At the end of His creative activity, God pronounced the things He had made as being “very good” (Genesis 1:31). In Genesis 2 we learn the details of the creation of mankind. After creating Adam from the dust of the ground, God presented the beasts of the field and the birds of the air to Adam to name. When Adam found no suitable helper, God formed the first woman from Adam’s side.

Let’s look closely at this passage and note several key phrases that indicate God’s intent for marriage to be monogamous—one man for one woman. First, God intended to make “a helper” for Adam, not several helpers. Second, from one rib God made one woman for Adam. Genesis 2:24 reveals the pattern (God works in patterns so as to not be deceived, like with polygamy see D&C 52:14) of a man leaving his family to “be joined to his wife,” not wives. This union is then described as becoming “one flesh.”

Jesus confirmed this understanding of marriage when he was asked about divorce by the Pharisees. This is recorded in Mark 10:1–12 and Matthew 19:1–12. In His response Jesus quoted from Genesis 2, confirming that His understanding of marriage was one man for one woman. Confirming the covenantal nature of marriage, Jesus said that divorce was only allowed because of the hardness of the hearts of man. God intended, from the beginning, for marriages to consist of one man and one woman for the duration of their lives. Divorce and polygamy were regulated in the laws given to Moses, but polygamy was recorded long before then.

POLYGAMY is of the Doctrine of the Line of Cain:
The first reference to polygamy is found in Genesis 4 in the lineage of Cain. Of Lamech, a descendant of Cain, we read:

Then Lamech took for himself two wives: the name of one was Adah, and the name of the second was Zillah. And Adah bore Jabal. He was the father of those who dwell in tents and have livestock. His brother’s name was Jubal. He was the father of all those who play the harp and flute. And as for Zillah, she also bore Tubal-Cain, an instructor of every craftsman in bronze and iron. And the sister of Tubal-Cain was Naamah.

Then Lamech said to his wives:
“Adah and Zillah, hear my voice;
Wives of Lamech, listen to my speech!
For I have killed a man for wounding me,
Even a young man for hurting me.
If Cain shall be avenged sevenfold,
Then Lamech seventy-sevenfold.” (Genesis 4:19–25)

Before the Flood, we have a clear distortion of what God had intended for marriage. To compound Lamech’s sin, he brags of his murderous deeds. The Flood was brought upon the earth to judge the sinfulness of mankind, including the sins committed by Lamech.

After the Flood, there are many mentions of polygamous relationships—including among the patriarchs of Israel. Abraham, Jacob, David, and Solomon all had multiple wives. It is interesting to note that there are no passages in Scripture that clearly state, “No man should have more than one wife.” However, polygamous relationships are never mentioned in a positive light, and, indeed, the problems of such relationships are presented.

Consider the consequences revealed in Scripture in each of the following cases: Abraham—led to bitterness between Sarah and her maid, Hagar, and the eventual dismissal of Hagar and Ishmael; Jacob—led to Rachel’s jealousy of Leah and to Joseph being betrayed and sold by his half-brothers; David—led to the rape of one of his daughters (Tamar) by one of his sons (Tamar’s half-brother Amnon) and Amnon’s subsequent murder by Tamar’s brother Absalom; Solomon—his many wives “turned away his heart” from the Lord and to the worship of false gods (1 Kings 11:1–8). Just because the Bible records polygamous relationships does not mean that God approves of such things.

The only direct command against polygamy is given to the kings that were to rule Israel, as they are told not to “multiply wives” to themselves (Deuteronomy 17:17). It is also interesting to note that polygamous relationships seem to be regulated in the commands Moses gave to the nation of Israel. Leviticus 18:18 instructs that a man should not marry sisters, and Deuteronomy 21:15 talks of assigning an heir to a man with two wives. Many commentators suggest that the passages do not endorse polygamy but rather prohibit it. Deuteronomy 21:15 may also be translated as “has had two wives” in succession rather than at the same time. The sisters in Leviticus 18:18 are understood by some to be any Israelite women. Regardless of the interpretation of these passages, the taking of multiple wives is not in accord with God’s design or pattern from the beginning.

Moving to the New Testament, there are several passages that can be understood to speak against polygamous relationships. The first to come to the mind of many would be the qualifications for leaders in the church given by the Apostle Paul to Timothy and Titus. In 1 Timothy 3:2 and 12 and Titus 1:6, we are told that leaders of the church must be the “husband of one wife.”

In 1 Corinthians 7:1–16 Paul answered questions that the Corinthian church had about marriage. In this passage Paul used the singular form of wife and husband throughout the passage. In fact, this is true of the New Testament writers in general.

Scripture compares the relationship of husband and wife to that of Christ and the church. InEphesians 5:25–33 Paul explained this relationship and referred back to Genesis 2:24. Once again, God’s standard for marriage is defined as one man and one woman. Paul finished this analogy by stating, “let each one of you in particular so love his own wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband” (Ephesians 5:33).

Adapted from this site, as I have not put it all down in sequence as well as this author did:
https://answersingenesis.org/family/mar ... the-bible/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


An invite to sit back and maybe consider the possibility that indeed the Gospel restored through Joseph is and was true, but man in their ways pervert the things of the Lord (also a pattern). I fear not man, neither should you, I fear God and this unbelief is what the Holy Spirit has been working in my for my entire life, unbelief in that we believe in things that are not true, like polygamy, which leads us away from Christ’s true gospel not closer to it.

Many of you will simply tell me I’m wrong about this, that is cute and just fine, but this pattern God works in so we are not deceived by Satan, is a real pattern, discernable in the scriptures and the pattern is plain, one man and one woman. God never commands polygamy anywhere.

Again, I have a witness that such is true, and I declare it by the workings of the Holy Spirit and invite you to ask God to strip yourself of unbelief in the matter and he will mercifully open things up even further than you might currently be willing to receive because of unbelief (believing in things that are not true).

Polygamy was a fact in several dispensations, especially in the beginning of the dispensation in order to get seed for the covenant.

The Lord's standard is monogamy. But he has allowed for exceptions. That is consistent with the "most correct book" in Jacob 2.

Faith
captain of 10
Posts: 37

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by Faith »

Wouldn't that be nice.

This subject had rocked my world, shaken my core, and caused me great sorrow. I even got to the point where I thought my very God and Father must be an awful and perverted womanizer.

Tis not so! He is everything pure and Holy and His righteousness reigns forever.

It is prophesied in the Book of Mormon, and also the bible, that after the cleansing there will be many women left, and not enough men. Polygamy will once again need to return to the earth ( I believe during the millennium )

The answers that I kept receiving - that finally gave my troubled soul some perspective and peace on the matter was this:

" perhaps it is all we've ever known, and when something is all you've ever known- it isn 'to the least bit odd or strange. It is comfortable. It is peaceful. It is happiness. God will never leave us unhappy with the final way things turn out. He will not leave us in an unhappy situation."

Polygamy was most definitely practiced in this final dispensation by the prophet Joseph Smith. (Despite the Chocranite/ Brigham Young started it theory.).

Polygamy is continually practiced today in the church, as multiple women are sealed to eternity to a man for eternity. The world doesn't care -/ because the previous wife has already died.

In my current ward however-- there is a man who's grandmother is sealed to her two husbands for eternity. She loved her first, and he was quickly taken home to God through war. She spent her whole lifetime loving her next husband and raising a beautiful family with him. The Brothern approached her, and asked if she would like to be sealed to this amazing marriage and family for eternity. She was!!

I recently sat down with my Stake President to talk about this very subject. I told him the answers I believed I had found ( although they didn't make me very happy) He agreed that we have many Heavenly mothers, and that polygamy most likely would need to return in the end.

Don't loose your faith anyone! I used to be in the depths of hell over this subject- and even would threaten divorce in advance if my husband dare love another after I die- or follow the Counsel to take on another wife if it were ever asked of us again.

But there are answers, there is peace to your souls if you but hang in there. I promise!

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durangout
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Posts: 2835
Location: Bugged out man, WAY out

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by durangout »

See, this is why I bother to lurk here still. The entertainment value of posts by BoM are off-the-charts. Keep posting!

marktheshark
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Posts: 509

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by marktheshark »

I think someone needs to study D&C 132

BrotherOfMahonri
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Posts: 1751

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

samizdat wrote: Polygamy was a fact in several dispensations, especially in the beginning of the dispensation in order to get seed for the covenant.

The Lord's standard is monogamy. But he has allowed for exceptions. That is consistent with the "most correct book" in Jacob 2.
I must say you are sincere, but you need to be careful, just as I need to be, as you are doing what is starting to occur in the church of late, twisting something to fit a doctrine not of God nor did God ever state anything close to "except when I command it". (I get you are not doing it, but it is a false tradition that is damning in relation to this Jacob 2 and polygamy).

If I may enlighten us all on this Jacob 2, with a different view I hope each of you take and REREAD this chapter with prayer and even fasting, which chapter indeed is from the most correct book on earth - which means WE BEST GET IT RIGHT HERE, making polygamy even more a doctrine of man or of devils, or if you read my above post, doctrine of Cain's lineage. (Genesis 4:19–25)

Interpreting Jacob 2:22-35
In my experience of understanding the scriptures, I have found that proper interpretation of a verse comes from the meaning of the verses surrounding it.

Jacob 2:30 must be interpreted in light of the meaning of the surrounding verses. To do otherwise could render a meaning opposed to the meaning of the surrounding text and thus would make no sense.

It is clear from reading Jacob 2:22-35 above that the scriptures before and after Jacob 2:30 plainly state that having many wives as well as having concubines is a whoredom and an abomination before the Lord.

And He forbade Jacob's people to have concubines and more than one wife.

The Lord was not pleased with David and Solomon for doing these things and He was not pleased with the people in Jacob's time for also doing these things and justifying their actions by what David and Solomon did.

In addition, the Lord stated that these actions were breaking the hearts of their wives and daughters and indicated that if they continued to pursue such activities, He would "visit them with a sore curse, even unto destruction..." (verse 33).

Thus, to take verse 30 out of the middle of this entire passage, which strongly states that polygamy is evil, and render the meaning of verse 30 to be that "Polygamy is ... to be practiced ... only when commanded by God," is ridiculous.

Such an interpretation is out of context with the meaning of the surrounding verses. Even more, it makes God changeable, which He is not.

So, if Jacob 2:30 shouldn't be interpreted that polygamy is acceptable when God commands it, then what is the meaning of this verse? Verse 25 says that the Lord led these people out of Jerusalem to give them an opportunity to become righteous.

In this context, verse 30 means that if these people are going to become righteous, He must give them commandments to obey Him. If He doesn't, "they shall harken unto these things," or in other words they will commit these whoredoms and not become a righteous people. This interpretation of verse 30 is in context with the meaning of the surrounding verses and can be the only plausible meaning given to it.

Thus, in my opinion, Jacob 2:22-35 supports the position that polygamy is evil. Knowing this, Joseph would have never engaged in this activity. And the Lord, being unchangeable, would have never given him a revelation telling His people to practice polygamy.
Adapted from:
http://www.defendingjoseph.com/2008/11/ ... ygamy.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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durangout
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by durangout »

Faith wrote:This subject had rocked my world, shaken my core, and caused me great sorrow.
How exactly?

BrotherOfMahonri
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

marktheshark wrote:I think someone needs to study D&C 132
Having studied D&C 132, without the help or even knowing DS or Rock, I felt as the Lord lead me to whom that revelation was introduced and edited by, and when it was introduced. You should know this by now. I will not even go there with you, per your lack of sincerity with me, but for the sake of all those who are heeding the Spirit in this matter,

an invite to study the history of section 132, the only place where the Lord supposedly commands polygamy, a "revelation" kept in a drawer secretly by Brigham, which was a supposed copy of the original Emma burned (according to Brigham), which Brigham revealed as the Lord's will to Joseph, and only revealed 8 years after Joseph's death when Brigham felt it was time to reveal it to the church and live it.

I trust those seeking will be lead here and elsewhere by the Lord and let the Spirit do the teaching with these opposite understandings, of which I used to be exactly where most here are at in regards to the confusing (which confusion comes of the Devil mind you) doctrines taught &practiced, doctrines Joseph in part gave his life fighting and preaching against to his last days.

You have two choices in this matter in my view. Trust endless scholarly work and accept the "traditions" of our fathers, or ask the Lord to lead you to the truth as a child and let common sense come to you beautifully through the Holy Spirit of the Lord, even his voice guiding you outside the control of man's interpretations, doctrines, or philosophies, and those things the adversary has designed to distort your thinking to get us to err and wander in darkness.

I guarantee this knowledge will never come by scholarly work or proving or disproving documents, but by God's voice each of us has the opportunity to take as our guide and ask sincerely about this topic and any other.

marktheshark
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by marktheshark »

BrotherOfMahonri wrote:
marktheshark wrote:I think someone needs to study D&C 132
Having studied D&C 132, without the help or even knowing DS or Rock, I felt as the Lord lead me to whom that revelation was introduced and edited by, and when it was introduced. You should know this by now. I will not even go there with you, per your lack of sincerity with me, but for the sake of all those who are heeding the Spirit in this matter,

an invite to study the history of section 132, the only place where the Lord supposedly commands polygamy, a "revelation" kept in a drawer secretly by Brigham, which was a supposed copy of the original Emma burned (according to Brigham), which Brigham revealed as the Lord's will to Joseph, and only revealed 8 years after Joseph's death when Brigham felt it was time to reveal it to the church and live it.

I trust those seeking will be lead here and elsewhere by the Lord and let the Spirit do the teaching with these opposite understandings, of which I used to be exactly where most here are at in regards to the confusing (which confusion comes of the Devil mind you) doctrines taught &practiced, doctrines Joseph in part gave his life fighting and preaching against to his last days.

You have two choices in this matter in my view. Trust endless scholarly work and accept the "traditions" of our fathers, or ask the Lord to lead you to the truth as a child and let common sense come to you beautifully through the Holy Spirit of the Lord, even his voice guiding you outside the control of man's interpretations, doctrines, or philosophies, and those things the adversary has designed to distort your thinking to get us to err and wander in darkness.

I guarantee this knowledge will never come by scholarly work or proving or disproving documents, but by God's voice each of us has the opportunity to take as our guide and ask sincerely about this topic and any other.

Get off your high horse.

Joseph Smith had many wives. The end.

ebenezerarise
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by ebenezerarise »

God's voice is quite peculiar to you,. BOM.

He speaks differently to me. I look forward to hearing Him explain this more to me but for now I'm satisfied it is doctrine, Joseph practiced it and many of us will someday be called to do the same.

BrotherOfMahonri
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

marktheshark wrote:
Get off your high horse.

Joseph Smith had many wives. The end.
And it will be obvious to those viewing this profound statement by marktheshark to simply walk on by such, nothing here but empty statements and insincerity - discussion, perspective, sharing, and considering other's perspectives is not your strength I gather?

FYI - You are on my ignore list, and I was hoping, just holding out any form of sincerity like those others on this post, but alas, I have been disappointed yet again by marktheshark.

AGStacker
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by AGStacker »

There is no proof Joseph slept with other women. Sealing someone to you doesn't make them your sexual partner. God forbid there is truth outside the Mormon correlated material.

BrotherOfMahonri
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

ebenezerarise wrote:God's voice is quite peculiar to you,. BOM.

He speaks differently to me. I look forward to hearing Him explain this more to me but for now I'm satisfied it is doctrine, Joseph practiced it and many of us will someday be called to do the same.
Thanks for sharing your perspective. Please, expound some, what gave you such an understanding? was it accepting tradition? Did you or have you ever taken it as one might the Book of Mormon, sincerely asking and seeking if it is true and of God? If so, what was the result?

Was it a witness of the Holy Ghost telling you?
Did the Lord's voice give you this clear revelation?

Please expound.

Also, for all those who believe and even ignorantly blaspheme the name of a truly anointed of the Lord, even the prophet of Christ's restoration Joseph Smith, one of his last sermons given:
Come on! Ye prosecutors! ye false swearers! All hell boil over! Ye burning mountains, roll down your lava! For I will come out on the top at last.... What a thing it is for a man to be accused of committing adultery, and having seven wives, when I can only find one... I am the same man, and as innocent as I was fourteen years ago; and I can prove them all perjurers. I labored with these apostates myself until I was out of all manner of patience
http://www.utlm.org/onlineresources/ser ... denial.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Not to forget one of his passionate parables defending himself against the soon-to-be murderers for being accused of polygamy:
http://voiceofanearthquake.blogspot.com ... idden.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Those who are stating they believe in the doctrine of polygamy (and that it will return) and that he introduced it per God's commandment are ignorantly stating that Joseph Smith was a deceiving lier up to his death, and that God is the author of polygamy. You and I best be sure of what we are stating, as man or woman cannot be saved in ignorance.

Ten righteous couples will always raise up more generations of righteous posterity than one man and 10 wives will ever be able to do.

BrotherOfMahonri
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by BrotherOfMahonri »

durangout wrote:
Faith wrote:This subject had rocked my world, shaken my core, and caused me great sorrow.
How exactly?
Faith, an invite to waste not your time here, as this user as well as marktheshark has provev insincere more oft than not... I suggest you ask these kinds of users first to share their perspective entirely before pouring your time and energies into these users' profound questions and respectful responses.

An invite to go read their posts and responses to sincere people before putting your time into them, see how they treat others before subjecting yourself to them.

Pearls before swine is an understatement here, with users who prove to treat others like these users have proven more oft than not with sincerity.

It has little to do with disagreement and opposing views, but much to do with respect and sincerity.
faith wrote:...
Last edited by BrotherOfMahonri on May 20th, 2015, 11:12 am, edited 2 times in total.

marktheshark
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by marktheshark »

BrotherOfMahonri wrote:
marktheshark wrote:
Get off your high horse.

Joseph Smith had many wives. The end.
And it will be obvious to those viewing this profound statement by marktheshark to simply walk on by such, nothing here but empty statements and insincerity - discussion, perspective, sharing, and considering other's perspectives is not your strength I gather?

FYI - You are on my ignore list, and I was hoping, just holding out any form of sincerity like those others on this post, but alas, I have been disappointed yet again by marktheshark.

FYI, I'm being completely sincere.

marktheshark
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by marktheshark »

BrotherofMahonri,

I don't think sincere means what you think it means.

Someone disagreeing with you doesn't mean insincerity. In fact, it shows quite the opposite. Disagreement is a strong sign of sincerity.

marktheshark
captain of 100
Posts: 509

Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by marktheshark »

So what if Joseph Smith practiced polygamy or didn't?

It doesn't change my standing before the Lord one bit whether I think he did or did not.

Since the amount of evidence was compelling enough that the Church released an official statement about it, I think it's legitimate.

Fiannan
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Re: Common Sense Prophecy: Polygamy will be renounced by the LDS Church

Post by Fiannan »

Before the Flood, we have a clear distortion of what God had intended for marriage. To compound Lamech’s sin, he brags of his murderous deeds. The Flood was brought upon the earth to judge the sinfulness of mankind, including the sins committed by Lamech.
Oh yeah, clear message - as clear as saying that we should only consume meat as Cain's sacrifice to God was rejected since it did not involve killing animals.

Okay, if the message is so clear then tell me, out of a population of, what I have heard Jewish scholars speculate, 35 million people in Noah's civilization can you tell me what their religion was? What about their technology; after all we know that they worked with iron since the Bible points that out so were they at the industrial age or post-industrial development? Now how about races -- were all human races represented - Blavastsky speculated 7 root races existed then. How about the weird parts of the Books of Jasher and Enoch about biotechnology, and the weird parts in those, and the Bible, of Sons of God reproducing with the human women? Tell me more about these as you say the messages are clear. Out of 35 million people you say that Lamech was the only one who practiced polygamy? Not mentioned perhaps? Well, Adam's family practiced incest and that is not mentioned. Oh, one other thing, where was Noah's civilization located?

Careful trying to obtain any clear principle about marriage in Noah's day if you don't have all the facts.

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