On Equality

[ajax]

But it is not given that one man should possess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin. (D&C 49:20)

What does this mean? Everything is divided equally? Dead level equality?

However, there is what political philosophers say is the "Day two problem", meaning that after everything is divided equally, come day two, inequalities begin again to be manifest based on the inherent inequalities of the people themselves. Orson Pratt recognized this,

You may divide the properties of the Church today, yes, if it be possible, make a perfectly equal division of it, so that every man in the whole Church should have his share, and let him call it his own; it would not be one day before there would be an inequality again introduced; and one man would possess that which is above another; it could not be otherwise; the changes, difficulties, want of judgment in the management and control of property, and all these things combined together, would serve to render these divided shares unequal; (Elder Orson Pratt, Delivered in the Tabernacle, Great Salt Lake City, September 10, 1854)

A daily re-calculation of creeping inequalities would be wasteful and top-down bureaucratic with swarms of officers keeping track. So what does the Lord really mean?

[rewcox]

I would give my beer to you, man. :ymblushing:

[Simon]

Mayby equal means that, to name an example, all get the amount of food they individually need to feel satisfied. Men usually need more than women, which means they dont get an equal amount of food, but still an equal amount of satisfaction. Since we all desire different things, equal may be quiet an individual matter.

[Bee Prepared]

But it is not given that one man should possess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin. (D&C 49:20)

What does this mean? Everything is divided equally? Dead level equality?

However, there is what political philosophers say is the "Day two problem", meaning that after everything is divided equally, come day two, inequalities begin again to be manifest based on the inherent inequalities of the people themselves. Orson Pratt recognized this,

You may divide the properties of the Church today, yes, if it be possible, make a perfectly equal division of it, so that every man in the whole Church should have his share, and let him call it his own; it would not be one day before there would be an inequality again introduced; and one man would possess that which is above another; it could not be otherwise; the changes, difficulties, want of judgment in the management and control of property, and all these things combined together, would serve to render these divided shares unequal; (Elder Orson Pratt, Delivered in the Tabernacle, Great Salt Lake City, September 10, 1854)

A daily re-calculation of creeping inequalities would be wasteful and top-down bureaucratic with swarms of officers keeping track. So what does the Lord really mean?

Or as Orson Pratt went on to say;

"A joint heir with Jesus Christ in the inheritance of the earth, and all the fulness thereof. Can you make any inequality here? If each man in the Church is a joint inheritor of all the property, and a part of it, it makes each one perfectly equal with the rest."


"There is no division of celestial glory, imparting to each one an equa- lity of dominion, and might, and power; it is not to be divided. And we will not be ignorant of it when we go into the next world, we will find there that one kingdom will not have the right to encroach upon the royalty of another and take away its right, but each one will be governed by true and holy laws. governed by God's laws; that they may see the order carried out before them in practice, that we may be looked to as a great light set upon the mountains,, when they come to learn that this people are the people of God, and they are that will reflect upon all the face of the earth, and show the people the true order by practice, and then they will see the difference between God's order of the possession of property, and the little, narrow, contracted orders established by man;

[Rose Garden]

Mayby equal means that, to name an example, all get the amount of food they individually need to feel satisfied. Men usually need more than women, which means they dont get an equal amount of food, but still an equal amount of satisfaction. Since we all desire different things, equal may be quiet an individual matter.

That is my take on it, too. Everyone has all that they want.

[ajax]

[onefour1]

The verse has to do with living the law of consecration and stewardship. I don't think the Lord means that we should be exact down to every granule of salt but that we should live on a relatively equal standard of living. There is an article that shows that by 2030 the upper 1% will own 2/3 of the world's wealth. https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... point-2030

[Michelle]

At our house equality is needs and righteous wants, just as explained in the scriptures.

When we have a dessert we give larger pieces to the older larger people and smaller pieces to the younger smaller people. We have explained that giving the younger ones larger pieces would make them sick and giving the older ones smaller pieces would defeat the purpose of the treat by not allowing them to enjoy their share.

This lesson hit home on a road trip where we bought some treats and the big kids experimented with giving the little ones the same amount as the big ones. Once the puking started the lesson was crystal clear and neither the big or little ones have complained about it since.

[MMbelieve]

But it is not given that one man should possess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin. (D&C 49:20)

What does this mean? Everything is divided equally? Dead level equality?

However, there is what political philosophers say is the "Day two problem", meaning that after everything is divided equally, come day two, inequalities begin again to be manifest based on the inherent inequalities of the people themselves. Orson Pratt recognized this,

You may divide the properties of the Church today, yes, if it be possible, make a perfectly equal division of it, so that every man in the whole Church should have his share, and let him call it his own; it would not be one day before there would be an inequality again introduced; and one man would possess that which is above another; it could not be otherwise; the changes, difficulties, want of judgment in the management and control of property, and all these things combined together, would serve to render these divided shares unequal; (Elder Orson Pratt, Delivered in the Tabernacle, Great Salt Lake City, September 10, 1854)

A daily re-calculation of creeping inequalities would be wasteful and top-down bureaucratic with swarms of officers keeping track. So what does the Lord really mean?

Perhaps it's not about food, money or subsistance?

Without diving into the chapter yet and just reading others thoughts on the matter an alternative could be something else entirely. Possess that which is above another...above is the word that's catching my attention. It could have simply said more than another but it says above. Above means the other must be below. Is it just food and other subsistance? Not sure, could be. Could be that no one is supposed to hold something over someone's head? Hold something that inherently denotes the other person...like blackmail?

I don't know, just giving some different thoughts.

[EmmaLee]

originalequityvsequality.jpg (46.71 KiB) Viewed 138 times

[Alaris]

But it is not given that one man should possess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin. (D&C 49:20)

What does this mean? Everything is divided equally? Dead level equality?

However, there is what political philosophers say is the "Day two problem", meaning that after everything is divided equally, come day two, inequalities begin again to be manifest based on the inherent inequalities of the people themselves. Orson Pratt recognized this,

You may divide the properties of the Church today, yes, if it be possible, make a perfectly equal division of it, so that every man in the whole Church should have his share, and let him call it his own; it would not be one day before there would be an inequality again introduced; and one man would possess that which is above another; it could not be otherwise; the changes, difficulties, want of judgment in the management and control of property, and all these things combined together, would serve to render these divided shares unequal; (Elder Orson Pratt, Delivered in the Tabernacle, Great Salt Lake City, September 10, 1854)

A daily re-calculation of creeping inequalities would be wasteful and top-down bureaucratic with swarms of officers keeping track. So what does the Lord really mean?

Perhaps it's not about food, money or subsistance?

Without diving into the chapter yet and just reading others thoughts on the matter an alternative could be something else entirely. Possess that which is above another...above is the word that's catching my attention. It could have simply said more than another but it says above. Above means the other must be below. Is it just food and other subsistance? Not sure, could be. Could be that no one is supposed to hold something over someone's head? Hold something that inherently denotes the other person...like blackmail?

I don't know, just giving some different thoughts.

Or above as in pride. The large and spacious is "above"

Perhaps it's how we view our own stuff in relation to others

[gardener4life]

The book of Mormon is very clear with good examples and bad examples on what happens with equality and inequality. When there was inequality the work suffered. What a coincidence...Satan created conditions of severe inequality in the country and world to disrupt the work. So you can see that there is movements to try to disrupt the work. It starts with inequality, then social castes, then greater opportunities for learning for some select elite few but not all. Then the church fails in its progress (it actually uses those words), this is quoted more than once in the book of Mormon.

It also quotes how when people were equal and love abounded things went well and the church prospered and people prospered also.