sharing food storage with the unprepared and disobiedient

[ndjili]

My husband and I have discussed this at length and both feel that now is the time to make such a commitment. Will it be easy. HECK NO! But if that's whats required of us then yes. We both look at it this way. Say we decided not to share and that was our stance, well then we eat our food, hunker down and fend off everyone. Will we live? for the time being yes but what if the Lord does not bless us and something happens to said food storage and we are of the hungry people..we starve and die as well. What blessings have we earned for after our death. NONE. Say we do share and our food is gone and we starve and die. Well then we will know that we have the blessings in Heaven where it counts. This life is but a small blip in the whole grand scheme of things. I believe the phrase "if ye are prepared, ye shall not fear" is not only about temporal preparedness. I think many people are losing sight of the spiritual. Yes we are commanded to store food, but there are commandments to share. It's all over the scriptures from Jesus himself and shouldnt be denied or lost sight of. Now if someone comes to my home looking to CAUSE me and mine harm, then yes we have a right to defend ourselves but lets not lose sight of the spiritual aspect, otherwise we become nothing more than survialists and are no longer saints. Now I know you say "oh it's easy to say that now" amd yeah partially it is. I hope that when the time comes and we are hurting and hungry and world is in total chaos, I will be strong enough to make the right choices but I think going into it with a good attitude is a great way to start.

[Rosabella]

I read your posts chain puller. I was responding to your repeated requests for addresses from those who say they are willing to share. It insinuated that those that are willing to share are hypocrites or they didn't really mean it. It was offensive and it needed to be responded to. Most good deeds are done without advertising.

I'm glad we can move on now.

I see your point.

My comment regarding the posting of addresses was never intended to be offensive, but I did intend to incite feelings of uneasiness.

Why?

Because when the real tough times come, sharing one's food will be an issue of true sacrifice. I want people to realize the seriousness of some of the things they are committing to already. I want them to realize that sharing during difficult days, while admirable, can put one's own family at risk if prudent care is not taken. For it may well be that they will be referred to someday for a helping hand. I want to help these people determine beforehand if they are truly prepared emotionally to sacrifice for others at the expense of their own families.

Within this forum at large, I hope to throw gasoline on the topics at hand. I hope to pull people's chain sometimes and encourage deeper analysis and invite consideration to an alternative view. As everyone thinks a little deeper and shares their comments, we are all benefitted.


JustPullinYourChain

A question for you......................

Picture a young family of very loving righteous saints. They are a young married couple and have 3 little children, 4 year boy 3 old year girl and 1 1/2 year old baby girl. They have no family in the area they just moved into your ward. You have seen them at church every Sunday, he has given wonderful talks, and comments and is a hard working man. His wife was a kind and loving women that always smiled at you when she would see you at church. They just graduated college and barely have furniture but they have been working on a food storage with the limited means they have had. During a crisis they lose all that they have tried to gain in a food storage. They live very close to you. The broken hearted father comes to your door and humbly asks Brother/Sister ……….do you have anything you would be willing to share? I hate to ask you but my children have not eaten in 3 days. I have been trying to get food for them, I have offered to work, but no one has a job for me." You look over his shoulder the littlest is crying and suffering chewing on her blanket, the other two have hollowed looks of fear. The mother’s eyes are puffy from crying and is trying to hold back tears for her children’s suffering. The father even says “do you have just anything you can give my children, not me but them?….with tears in his eyes. You at this time have a years supply of food and your family was about to sit down for what now feels like a feast do to the economic crisis.

What do you do?

[will]

Invite them in to eat then call the Bishop. Last time I heard the Bishops store house was still in operation. When it is no longer in operation, I will consult with my preisthood leaders. However, we are not there yet.

[Rosabella]

Invite them in to eat then call the Bishop. Last time I heard the Bishops store house was still in operation. When it is no longer in operation, I will consult with my preisthood leaders. However, we are not there yet.

I agree with you Will

I would add this in the future we might see this may happen....."and be prepared for the Bishop to say, there is no food in the store house at this time,would you please assist Brother and sister .......until we have a system in place. Then when they do, we will be living the law of consecration which I feel strongly many don't seem ready for......

We need to be prepared with storages and we need to be prepared to share when asked. If there is no way to ask, then just share for it is a higher law.

[Rosabella]

I read your posts chain puller. I was responding to your repeated requests for addresses from those who say they are willing to share. It insinuated that those that are willing to share are hypocrites or they didn't really mean it. It was offensive and it needed to be responded to. Most good deeds are done without advertising.

I'm glad we can move on now.

I see your point.

My comment regarding the posting of addresses was never intended to be offensive, but I did intend to incite feelings of uneasiness.

Why?

Because when the real tough times come, sharing one's food will be an issue of true sacrifice. I want people to realize the seriousness of some of the things they are committing to already. I want them to realize that sharing during difficult days, while admirable, can put one's own family at risk if prudent care is not taken. For it may well be that they will be referred to someday for a helping hand. I want to help these people determine beforehand if they are truly prepared emotionally to sacrifice for others at the expense of their own families.

Within this forum at large, I hope to throw gasoline on the topics at hand. I hope to pull people's chain sometimes and encourage deeper analysis and invite consideration to an alternative view. As everyone thinks a little deeper and shares their comments, we are all benefitted.


JustPullinYourChain

" I want them to realize that sharing during difficult days, while admirable, can put one's own family at risk if prudent care is not taken."

If we do not help each other, we are putting the church family at risk too on many levels..........

If your concern is if we fully understand there realities of what we say when we say "I will share". I do fully. My life has taught me what it is like to be very wealthy and have plenty share and what it is like not to have food or shelter do to situations out of my control. I have seen misery and death up close that in unimaginable to most. When I say I am willing to share it is with full knowledge of my sacrifice. I am not an idealist that has never suffered and lives in some fantasy bubble. I know what the reality is of what I am doing and I know the reality of what I promised in the temple. I could not live with myself if I did not do what the Lord has taught me to do

When times get tough I will not turn into a competitive animal and lower my standards. I have tried to practice them everyday, so that part is purged out. One example: Many times at parties where food is past out, if it looked as though there was not much there, I have watched people say hey you better come get it before it all is gone..and there is a rush to the food……I stay behind. I wait to see if there is enough for everyone. I watch people pile there plates high with food knowing there will be no seconds for them so they get it all up front. Which leave nothing for the last people. I just wait. If there is something left great, if not I go hungry. But it is not worth it to me to be competitive and aggressive over a plate of food at a party. Things like this have trained me to see things differently. To look at things for the betterment of all not just myself. Those that took all they could knowing there was very little were being very selfish, their attitude was get what you can when you can get it, before someone else does…..That is not me nor has it ever been. I know that when I get home I can get some food. This is something I have always done. Looking at it now and I can see that I was practicing the sacrifice that has prepared me to be confident that I will not allow the competitive natural man come out during the times of crisis. I work on this in other areas in my life also. If you knew me you would know, I am not helpless or weak. I do not do these things out of intimidation or a feeling of unworthiness but out of Charity. As I read talks for the General Authorities on this subject of sacrifice, they say to purge out the natural man. How do you do that, how do you purge it, by trying to live the law now in your daily life. That is what prepares us to be a Zion people. We learn to be comfortable under the Celestial law of consecration. Practicing it today is the only way we will have a chance at living it totally tomorrow.

[JustPullinYourChain]

My husband and I have discussed this at length and both feel that now is the time to make such a commitment. Will it be easy. HECK NO! But if that's whats required of us then yes. We both look at it this way. Say we decided not to share and that was our stance, well then we eat our food, hunker down and fend off everyone. Will we live? for the time being yes but what if the Lord does not bless us and something happens to said food storage and we are of the hungry people..we starve and die as well. What blessings have we earned for after our death. NONE. Say we do share and our food is gone and we starve and die. Well then we will know that we have the blessings in Heaven where it counts. This life is but a small blip in the whole grand scheme of things. I believe the phrase "if ye are prepared, ye shall not fear" is not only about temporal preparedness. I think many people are losing sight of the spiritual. Yes we are commanded to store food, but there are commandments to share. It's all over the scriptures from Jesus himself and shouldnt be denied or lost sight of. Now if someone comes to my home looking to CAUSE me and mine harm, then yes we have a right to defend ourselves but lets not lose sight of the spiritual aspect, otherwise we become nothing more than survialists and are no longer saints. Now I know you say "oh it's easy to say that now" amd yeah partially it is. I hope that when the time comes and we are hurting and hungry and world is in total chaos, I will be strong enough to make the right choices but I think going into it with a good attitude is a great way to start.

AND

"If your concern is if we fully understand there realities of what we say when we say "I will share". I do fully. My life has taught me what it is like to be very wealthy and have plenty share and what it is like not to have food or shelter do to situations out of my control. I have seen misery and death up close that in unimaginable to most. When I say I am willing to share it is with full knowledge of my sacrifice. I am not an idealist that has never suffered and lives in some fantasy bubble. I know what the reality is of what I am doing and I know the reality of what I promised in the temple. I could not live with myself if I did not do what the Lord has taught me to do."

"When times get tough I will not turn into a competitive animal and lower my standards. I have tried to practice them everyday, so that part is purged out. One example: Many times at parties where food is past out, if it looked as though there was not much there, I have watched people say hey you better come get it before it all is gone..and there is a rush to the food……I stay behind. I wait to see if there is enough for everyone. I watch people pile there plates high with food knowing there will be no seconds for them so they get it all up front. Which leave nothing for the last people. I just wait. If there is something left great, if not I go hungry. But it is not worth it to me to be competitive and aggressive over a plate of food at a party. Things like this have trained me to see things differently. To look at things for the betterment of all not just myself. Those that took all they could knowing there was very little were being very selfish, their attitude was get what you can when you can get it, before someone else does…..That is not me nor has it ever been. I know that when I get home I can get some food. This is something I have always done. Looking at it now and I can see that I was practicing the sacrifice that has prepared me to be confident that I will not allow the competitive natural man come out during the times of crisis. I work on this in other areas in my life also. If you knew me you would know, I am not helpless or weak. I do not do these things out of intimidation or a feeling of unworthiness but out of Charity. As I read talks for the General Authorities on this subject of sacrifice, they say to purge out the natural man. How do you do that, how do you purge it, by trying to live the law now in your daily life. That is what prepares us to be a Zion people. We learn to be comfortable under the Celestial law of consecration. Practicing it today is the only way we will have a chance at living it totally tomorrow.

"A question for you......................

Picture a young family of very loving righteous saints. They are a young married couple and have 3 little children, 4 year boy 3 old year girl and 1 1/2 year old baby girl. They have no family in the area they just moved into your ward. You have seen them at church every Sunday, he has given wonderful talks, and comments and is a hard working man. His wife was a kind and loving women that always smiled at you when she would see you at church. They just graduated college and barely have furniture but they have been working on a food storage with the limited means they have had. During a crisis they lose all that they have tried to gain in a food storage. They live very close to you. The broken hearted father comes to your door and humbly asks Brother/Sister ……….do you have anything you would be willing to share? I hate to ask you but my children have not eaten in 3 days. I have been trying to get food for them, I have offered to work, but no one has a job for me." You look over his shoulder the littlest is crying and suffering chewing on her blanket, the other two have hollowed looks of fear. The mother’s eyes are puffy from crying and is trying to hold back tears for her children’s suffering. The father even says “do you have just anything you can give my children, not me but them?….with tears in his eyes. You at this time have a years supply of food and your family was about to sit down for what now feels like a feast do to the economic crisis.

What do you do?"


Well to start with Bella, let me have just a little bit of fun with your quote.

In your hypothetical you mentioned that the sweet wife always smiled at me at church.

Well, had she winked at me as well, I would definitely feel more inclined to help out. 8)


Ok, now on to more serious stuff.


I think at the critical moment of coming to my door I would offer something of myself immediately. After that I would make a referral to the Bishop. From there, it's up in the air.


To Ndjili and Bella:

I hope my requests for your addresses made you feel uneasy. If it did, my purpose was accomplished. I pulled your chain and I hope it made you think.


As for the heart and soul of your posts above...

Your replies to my post demonstrate your true Christlike character and I love you for it.

I am glad that this subject has become a matter of discussion within your families.

I wish more people were as sincere and generous as you.

And no, I'm not pullin your chain. I mean it.


I suppose I come across to some on the forum as a rude, cold hearted, uncaring jerk.

Thats ok.

As long as I have encouraged people to think a little deeper or maybe even helped solidify their committment to Christlike ideals, then I guess I can live with it.

When I participate in a thread, throwing a little gasoline into the mix, challenging people's opinions, and yes, pullin people's chain, KNOW that none of it is ever intended to be personal.

As for myself, I have grown from this thread. And I hope by my challenging other's opinions that they have had cause for some reflection and spiritual growth as well.



JustPullinYourChain

[Zowieink]

Its interesting to read these last few comments. However, I believe, every one of us that has the image of Christ in our countenence would not be able to turn away this young family or the yuppy church members that just bought the biggest house, most expensive car, etc. etc. Remember the Book of Mormon, 3rd Nephi, where just prior to the coming of Christ, the "good" church members refused to share food and clothing with the poor, and sent them away. I can't image anybody, with a testimony and the light of Christ within them would turn out people that humbly ask. The Lord would bless those that helped with a multiplying of their substance, similar to the loaves and fishes Christ used to feed the 5,000.

Recently our ward tried the "don't go to the store for ANYTHING" for 1 week. That meant, food, paper goods, personal items, doctors (unless its an emergency), or gas station. It was amazing what was done with bartering and sharing.

We live in a very compact ward in Arizona. Most have lived in the ward and stake for several years. So, we would have little trouble sharing together and multiplying the servings by "adding a little more water or rocks".

However, has was said earlier, if some comes to take it away by force, it ain't gonna happen. Our ward already has a plan for the protection of all the members in our ward, and stake come to think of it. This includes having the Priesthood members as guards, with guns, committed to shoot anyone with mal-intent. Generally, though, we have all (ward members) agreed that a group effort at survival is far easier and better than a one family survival effort.

Also, we need to prepare for those that come to "Zion" during those awful times with nothing but the children and what they can carry. We have to be able to help them also.

[will]

though, we have all (ward members) agreed that a group effort at survival is far easier and better than a one family survival effort.

Interesting.

[shadow]

In your hypothetical you mentioned that the sweet wife always smiled at me at church.

Well, had she winked at me as well, I would definitely feel more inclined to help out. 8)

[MercynGrace]

I want people to realize the seriousness of some of the things they are committing to already.

If you are just now realizing the seriousness of the commitment to consecrate everything you have, then you were sleeping through your temple service. Giving charitably isn't just a commitment, it is a living breathing act of faith. I believe that as I lift the hands that hang down and strengthen those with feeble knees that I will somehow have sufficient for my needs. It happens every month when I pay my tithing - so why would the heavens suddenly desert me in the desperate hour when my food storage is dwindling?

God will provide. But if not, I will share anyway. (GC May 2004 "But if not...")


*******************************************************************
When you get to the end of all the light you know and it's time to step into the darkness of the unknown, faith is knowing that one of two things shall happen: either you will be given something solid to stand on, or you will be taught how to fly.
-- Edward Teller

[NoGreaterLove]

Justpullinyourchain

I was going to add something to what you said, but what you said was well said. It needs nothing else! Your post helped me to understand a lot more about you. You are my kind of people. I stand behind what you posted 100%. I am sure there are many others who will stand behind you as well.

[JustPullinYourChain]

Justpullinyourchain

I was going to add something to what you said, but what you said was well said. It needs nothing else! Your post helped me to understand a lot more about you. You are my kind of people. I stand behind what you posted 100%. I am sure there are many others who will stand behind you as well.

Thanx NoGreaterLove.
If you are a lady, you are a sweety.
If you are a guy, you are cool. 8)


But maybe I revealed a little too much. And maybe I will need to pull people's chain a little harder in the future. But you know it's nothing personal.


Lastly, I would feel tremendously disappointed if Shadow was the only one to get a good laugh out of my response to Bella's hypothetical.

In your hypothetical you mentioned that the sweet wife always smiled at me at church.

Well, had she winked at me as well, I would definitely feel more inclined to help out. 8)

JustPullinYourChain

[NoGreaterLove]

I will just put it this, way: My wife loves me.................and I love her too!

[p51-mustang]

I really got chastised for what I said earlier in this post about possibly not sharing. I am not saying that I wont share. I am just saying that I will be careful how I do share and with whom. I just want people to be realistic about this topic. Is it really fair to your children to let them starve while feeding someone that laughed in your face when your warned them years ago to get prepared?

If you share have you considered that perhaps your would be thwarting the plans of the Lord?

Should the Lord decide at this time to cleanse the Church -- and the need for that cleansing seems to be increasing – a famine in this land of one year's duration could wipe out a large percentage of slothful members, including some ward and stake officers. Yet we cannot say we have not been warned.” (ET Benson God, Family, Country, p. 383.)

[English Saint]

See all this sharing lark, I'm not sure how it's going to work. I've decided to buy in extra food just in case I am asked to share.

Suppose we are asked to share with the lazy. Don't you think the lazy people we're sharing with will open their mouths and speak to their family and friends who are also hungry and starving? They'll say Bro and Sis X have loads of food and they're giving us some; their address is xxxx....

Food could be collected and distributed via the bishop, then it'll be his problem.

My biggest worry is other people finding out that I may have some food after shops have been looted and there is nothing to eat. They will tell their friends and word will spread until mobs take everything and we are left with zero food storage only 2 weeks into the famine.

[MercynGrace]

I really got chastised for what I said earlier in this post about possibly not sharing. I am not saying that I wont share. I am just saying that I will be careful how I do share and with whom. I just want people to be realistic about this topic. Is it really fair to your children to let them starve while feeding someone that laughed in your face when your warned them years ago to get prepared?

If you share have you considered that perhaps your would be thwarting the plans of the Lord?

Should the Lord decide at this time to cleanse the Church -- and the need for that cleansing seems to be increasing – a famine in this land of one year's duration could wipe out a large percentage of slothful members, including some ward and stake officers. Yet we cannot say we have not been warned.” (ET Benson God, Family, Country, p. 383.)

P-51, do you really think that we could thwart the plans of the Lord?

[NoGreaterLove]

All these worries and concerns about food supply are legitimate. When to share, who to share with, who will know about my food, how to share, etc..
My answer to this is something we already know, but need to be reminded of.

God knows our concerns. He has it all planned out. He will require different things from different people at different times. So if we are spiritually prepared, he will show us how to use the temporally prepared items. All we need to do it quit worrying, give our hearts to Him, be willing to sacrifice all, and he will take care of the rest. We are his children:

The soul that on Jesus hath leaned for repose
I will not, I cannot, desert to his foes;
That soul, through all hell should endeavor to shake.
I’ll never, no never, I’ll never, no never.
I’ll never, no never, no never forsake!

[p51-mustang]

MG, good point. No we cant thwart his plans. But in light of the earlier quote by Benson, the church needs to be cleansed and he alludes to it being done by famine. Just sayin'

NGL, I like what you say about spriritual preparation and going by that. I believe in that and will use that as my guide as to who I share with. I for one wont be sharing with everyone aand anyone. I am working to get more food than I need so I can help others. but I will be selective as to who I help. And I will make sure my family is taken care of first as this is my charge from the Lord as a father to provide for their temporal needs in days of plenty and days of famine. Just because a famine hits does not mean I no longer need to provide for them. A fathers wife and children come first and if everyone in the church looked at it this way things would work much beter when the famine hits.