sharing food storage with the unprepared and disobiedient

[Rosabella]

Avid Disciple, Will and Bella. I am with you. I like the saying "we don't have to share. We get to share."
I truly believe this will be one of the greatest tests of the last days and will surely assist in the separation of the tares from among the wheat.

We are all in this together and none of us will survive if not for brotherly love and obedience. The Law of Consecration is a true principle and not just something we may be asked to do. Otherwise, the Survivalists would be the only ones left and I don't for one minute believe this is what the Lord intends.

I do believe it will go like this: First, we'll be asked to increase our offerings. Then we'll be asked to donate to and help specific families in our wards. Then we'll be asked to take others into our household and care for them. Then we may need to combine our stores at our wardhouses so that all can share. Then the real Law of Consecration begins and that's the only way we'll be able to make it. And that's when we can stand still and see power of the Lord.

If we can be of the mindset that everything is the Lord's in the first place and all he's asked is a tenth part , then it gets easier to see the material things as His and we are merely stewards. And we want to do what He asks of us.

Amen, Amen, Amem

[Rosabella]

There is one point, The Lord will start to clean with his own house, How that will happen I believe that we are about to find out.

Will have you read my posts that talk about the seperation of the wheat and tares? I met with GAs and they said that the biggest seperation will be leaving the church when the church starts to proclaim things they do not like. They did not talk about the seperation being killing off the member through starvation. But that members will follow the ideas that Lucifer is presenting instead of the church. We will lose 1/2 of the church this way. In no way am I saying I know all the ways, but I can say what they told me. Food storage will play a role I am sure too, but it may be those that are not willing to share that are the ones that leave.....

[NoGreaterLove]

I want to commend the many who have been standing up for Christ and his teachings lately. I am afraid that we are too quick to forget that this site is frequented by those who deny Christ and try to proclaim their denial of him as a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Those of us who are of Christ, know him and understand his charity and love. Some are just misguided. So let the strength of our testimony of Christ bear witness to them. That those who are weak may be strengthened and those who are the wolves be confounded.

[Rosabella]

I want to commend the many who have been standing up for Christ and his teachings lately. I am afraid that we are too quick to forget that this site is frequented by those who deny Christ and try to proclaim their denial of him as a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Those of us who are of Christ, know him and understand his charity and love. Some are just misguided. So let the strength of our testimony of Christ bear witness to them. That those who are weak may be strengthened and those who are the wolves be confounded.

Thank you for pointing that out. I was starting to think that maybe some post were "Wolf's" not really even members of our church or even believe what they are saying. I have been thinking if someone wanted to distract us, confuse us, cause discord they would come to this site, post things purposely to make us run after that bone they tossed, therefore causing discord. I have wondered if some of the extreme post are fake. If they do not preach doctrines of Christ I wish the site would just delete them. I am starting to think we have evil doers here creating these issues. I am wondering if this site has false-Christ’s posting and not lost members….which confusing some good members giving them wrong data. This is just an idea that has been going through my mind. I have seen this on Christian sites….someone will come on and pretend to be Christian and start stirring up issues and creating fights….and they have turned out to be anti-Christians, just causing problems. I wonder if that is the answer of some of the post that are soooo not Christ Like…….

[JustPullinYourChain]

Many of the things I have to say I have expressed previously on a different thread.

I must say that the attitude to do what is right as expressed by many on this thread is admirable. But what many have expressed as to what is right, I think is wrong.

Several years ago there was an article published in the ensign entitled "Sturdy Shoes And A Waterproof Tent". It is not authored by a General Authority of the Church, but I'm sure it is still available on the Church's website.

Anyway, the article uses examples from Church history when people really needed to pull together and share in times of difficulty.

One the examples from the article that really stands out in my mind involves the Saints leaving Nauvoo. The article indicates that some time prior to the evacuation of the city, Church leadership distributed a list of necessary provisions required to make the trip westward. Anyway, the Church leadership and those other prepared members of the Church departed Nauvoo several months prior to when they were expected to leave. As a result, the unprepared membership of the Church panicked. Despite being counseled to wait until they became prepared, these unprepared members set out from Nauvoo determined to follow this first group of Saints. As a result, these unprepared and disobedient members depleted the resources of the prepared and brought suffering upon everyone. (No, manna didn't fall from heaven. Those who had prepared ended up suffering equally as much as those who never prepared ! ! )

Anyway, the author of the article I have cited concludes that we should share no matter what. I can't say that I agree with his conclusion.

Now, before those of this thread who feel so inclined to give in to zealotry, sharing your supplies with the disobedient, have you determined which of your family members you will allow to suffer that you may feed a someone else.

Come on. Anyone.

Come back to this thread and state: "Yes, I have singled out several family members that I will deny food to that I may feed someone else."

Those of you who hold to this notion do not understand the gospel in my opinion.

1Timothy 5:8 paraphrased: "He who does not provide for those of his OWN house has denied the faith and is worse than an infedel."

Your FIRST priority before the LORD as I read it is to your OWN family.
If you have extra then share.

I know this may sound harsh. But your zealotry could bring undue hardship upon your own family. Are you prepared to witness your own family truly suffer?

As a People, we have been counseled for generations to be prepared.
The Lord's sheep hear his voice and follow him.

Those who are not his sheep follow another path.

I think the Lord said it best to the people in 3rd Nephi:
"How oft would I have gathered you as a hen gathereth her chicks beneath her wings, but YE WOULD NOT".

In the parable of the ten virgins, the virgins represent the membership of the Church. When the time came to use the oil did the Lord counsel the wise virgins to share with the unwise? No.

In fact, the Lord said to the unwise: Depart, I know you not.

So when push comes to shove, I hope everyone will stick by their families.

I welcome your comments.

JustPullinYourChain

[ShawnC]

Many of the things I have to say I have expressed previously on a different thread.

I must say that the attitude to do what is right as expressed by many on this thread is admirable. But what many have expressed as to what is right, I think is wrong.

Several years ago there was an article published in the ensign entitled "Sturdy Shoes And A Waterproof Tent". It is not authored by a General Authority of the Church, but I'm sure it is still available on the Church's website.

Anyway, the article uses examples from Church history when people really needed to pull together and share in times of difficulty.

One the examples from the article that really stands out in my mind involves the Saints leaving Nauvoo. The article indicates that some time prior to the evacuation of the city, Church leadership distributed a list of necessary provisions required to make the trip westward. Anyway, the Church leadership and those other prepared members of the Church departed Nauvoo several months prior to when they were expected to leave. As a result, the unprepared membership of the Church panicked. Despite being counseled to wait until they became prepared, these unprepared members set out from Nauvoo determined to follow this first group of Saints. As a result, these unprepared and disobedient members depleted the resources of the prepared and brought suffering upon everyone. (No, manna didn't fall from heaven. Those who had prepared ended up suffering equally as much as those who never prepared ! ! )

Anyway, the author of the article I have cited concludes that we should share no matter what. I can't say that I agree with his conclusion.

Now, before those of this thread who feel so inclined to give in to zealotry, sharing your supplies with the disobedient, have you determined which of your family members you will allow to suffer that you may feed a someone else.

Come on. Anyone.

Come back to this thread and state: "Yes, I have singled out several family members that I will deny food to that I may feed someone else."

Those of you who hold to this notion do not understand the gospel in my opinion.

1Timothy 5:8 paraphrased: "He who does not provide for those of his OWN house has denied the faith and is worse than an infedel."

Your FIRST priority before the LORD as I read it is to your OWN family.
If you have extra then share.

I know this may sound harsh. But your zealotry could bring undue hardship upon your own family. Are you prepared to witness your own family truly suffer?

As a People, we have been counseled for generations to be prepared.
The Lord's sheep hear his voice and follow him.

Those who are not his sheep follow another path.

I think the Lord said it best to the people in 3rd Nephi:
"How oft would I have gathered you as a hen gathereth her chicks beneath her wings, but YE WOULD NOT".

In the parable of the ten virgins, the virgins represent the membership of the Church. When the time came to use the oil did the Lord counsel the wise virgins to share with the unwise? No.

In fact, the Lord said to the unwise: Depart, I know you not.

So when push comes to shove, I hope everyone will stick by their families.

I welcome your comments.

JustPullinYourChain

http://kunaprepare.blogspot.com/2009/01 ... house.html

[ChelC]

Shawn, I think you secretly like this topic.

[ChelC]

18. "Should I expect you on your knees crying or in a mob with a pitchfork?!"

That was my favorite one. I think I'll start using it on my BIL.

[Steve]

Many of the things I have to say I have expressed previously on a different thread.

I must say that the attitude to do what is right as expressed by many on this thread is admirable. But what many have expressed as to what is right, I think is wrong.


I hope you are just pulling our Chain…..You think but what does God think Lets look at the later verses....


Several years ago there was an article published in the ensign entitled "Sturdy Shoes And A Waterproof Tent". It is not authored by a General Authority of the Church, but I'm sure it is still available on the Church's website.

Anyway, the article uses examples from Church history when people really needed to pull together and share in times of difficulty.

One the examples from the article that really stands out in my mind involves the Saints leaving Nauvoo. The article indicates that some time prior to the evacuation of the city, Church leadership distributed a list of necessary provisions required to make the trip westward. Anyway, the Church leadership and those other prepared members of the Church departed Nauvoo several months prior to when they were expected to leave. As a result, the unprepared membership of the Church panicked. Despite being counseled to wait until they became prepared, these unprepared members set out from Nauvoo determined to follow this first group of Saints. As a result, these unprepared and disobedient members depleted the resources of the prepared and brought suffering upon everyone. (No, manna didn't fall from heaven. Those who had prepared ended up suffering equally as much as those who never prepared ! ! )

Anyway, the author of the article I have cited concludes that we should share no matter what. I can't say that I agree with his conclusion.

…hmmmm why would it be allowed in the ensign if it was sooo wrong? Just a thought…

Now, before those of this thread who feel so inclined to give in to zealotry, sharing your supplies with the disobedient, have you determined which of your family members you will allow to suffer that you may feed a someone else.

Come on. Anyone.
Come back to this thread and state: "Yes, I have singled out several family members that I will deny food to that I may feed someone else."

Yes I have decided who will suffer in my family to share with others….all of us!

Those of you who hold to this notion do not understand the gospel in my opinion.

I don't know what Gospel you are reading but mine says things very different than yours.

1Timothy 5:8 paraphrased: "He who does not provide for those of his OWN house has denied the faith and is worse than an infedel."

I have done this. But where does it say I can not share what I have provided with others in need?

Your FIRST priority before the LORD as I read it is to your OWN family.
If you have extra then share.

What is considered extra...that is really a hard question. That can mean you have ten years food storage...but are not sure how long the the tribulation will last...so you still cannot share.

Selfless giving is not just your leftovers after dinner from your plate. It is setting a plate of equal portion at the table for them.

I know this may sound harsh. But your zealotry could bring undue hardship upon your own family. Are you prepared to witness your own family truly suffer?

Yes of course I will be willing to have myself and my family suffer to lessen the suffering of others. That will be a great blessing and my family will be blessed for our love, kindness, selflessness and Charity in this life or the next it matters not. Did Christ not set that example for us. Did Joseph Smith not suffer, Moroni, on and on.....The example to follow is not to make yourself as comfortable as you can and not care about others...

As a People, we have been counseled for generations to be prepared.
The Lord's sheep hear his voice and follow him.

Those who are not his sheep follow another path.

Yes I agree you are on a different path than those on this site that have posted that they will share. Lets look at what the Lord has to say about that path .......here are some Christ’s words that I follow and others have said:

Matthew 25

31 ¶ When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
33 And he shall set the sheep on his aright hand, but the goats on the left.
34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:
36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.
37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.
46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

He does not say, well done my faithful miser of food, you held on to your food and saved it for your family, you have followed my council well? He calls them Goats.

I for one do not want to be a Goat!

John 15:13

13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

This means if we die, giving of our substance there is not greater love.

(Mosiah 4:16–26.)

“And also, ye yourselves will succor those that stand in need of your succor; ye will administer of your substance unto him that standeth in need; and ye will not suffer that the beggar putteth up his petition to you in vain, and turn him out to perish.

“Perhaps thou shalt say: The man has brought upon himself his misery; therefore I will stay my hand, and will not give unto him of my food, nor impart unto him of my substance that he may not suffer, for his punishments are just.”

18 But I say unto you, O man, whosoever doeth this the same hath great cause to repent; and except he repenteth of that which he hath done he perisheth forever, and hath no interest in the kingdom of God.
19 For behold, are we not all beggars? Do we not all depend upon the same Being, even God, for all the substance which we have, for both food and raiment, and for gold, and for silver, and for all the riches which we have of every kind?
20 And behold, even at this time, ye have been calling on his name, and begging for a remission of your sins. And has he suffered that ye have begged in vain? Nay; he has poured out his Spirit upon you, and has caused that your hearts should be filled with cjoy, and has caused that your mouths should be stopped that ye could not find utterance, so exceedingly great was your joy.
21 And now, if God, who has created you, on whom you are dependent for your lives and for all that ye have and are, doth grant unto you whatsoever ye ask that is right, in faith, believing that ye shall receive, O then, how ye ought to impart of the substance that ye have one to another.
22 And if ye judge the man who putteth up his petition to you for your substance that he perish not, and condemn him, how much more just will be your condemnation for withholding your substance, which doth not belong to you but to God, to whom also your life belongeth; and yet ye put up no petition, nor repent of the thing which thou hast done.
23 I say unto you, wo be unto that man, for his substance shall perish with him; and now, I say these things unto those who are rich as pertaining to the things of this world.
24 And again, I say unto the poor, ye who have not and yet have sufficient, that ye remain from day to day; I mean all you who deny the beggar, because ye have not; I would that ye say in your hearts that: I give not because I have not, but if I had I would give.
25 And now, if ye say this in your hearts ye remain guiltless, otherwise ye are condemned; and your condemnation is just for ye covet that which ye have not received.
26 And now, for the sake of these things which I have spoken unto you—that is, for the sake of retaining a remission of your sins from day to day, that ye may walk guiltless before God—I would that ye should impart of your substance to the poor, every man according to that which he hath, such as feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, visiting the sick and administering to their relief, both spiritually and temporally, according to their wants.


Matt 25:40
40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have adone it unto one of the bleast of these my cbrethren, ye have done it unto me.


Mark 12:43-44
43 And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury:
44 For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.

Psalms 41

1 BLESSED is he that considereth the poor: the LORD will deliver him in time of trouble.
2 The LORD will preserve him, and keep him alive; and he shall be blessed upon the earth: and thou wilt not deliver him unto the will of his enemies.
3 The LORD will strengthen him upon the bed of languishing: thou wilt make all his bed in his sickness.


Vaughn J. Featherstone, “I Have a Question,” Ensign, Oct. 1976, 31–32 Question

Are the Saints advised to share their food storage items with unprepared households during crises of indeterminable length? The parable of the ten virgins seems to indicate not.

Bishop Vaughn J. Featherstone, second counselor in the Presiding Bishopric In the general conference welfare meeting on Saturday morning, April 3, 1976, I discussed this subject. My exact quote regarding that statement is as follows:

“I should like to address a few remarks to those who ask, ‘Do I share with my neighbors who have not followed the counsel? And what about the nonmembers who do not have a year’s supply? Do we have to share with them?’ No, we don’t have to share—we get to share! Let us not be concerned about silly thoughts of whether we would share or not. Of course we would share! What would Jesus do? I could not possibly eat food and see my neighbors starving. And if you starve after sharing, ‘greater love hath no man than this …’ (John 15:13.)

“Now, what about those who would plunder and break in and take that which we have stored for our families’ needs? Don’t give this one more idle thought. There is a God in heaven whom we have obeyed. Do you suppose he would abandon those who have kept his commandments? He said, ‘If ye are prepared ye shall not fear.’ (D&C 38:30.) Prepare, O men of Zion, and fear not.” (Ensign, May 1976, pp. 117–18.)

This idea not to share and say that it is good reminds me of the scriptures that say Good will be called evil and evil good. When did being selfish become good??? Selflessness is what Christ taught.



I think the Lord said it best to the people in 3rd Nephi:
"How oft would I have gathered you as a hen gathereth her chicks beneath her wings, but YE WOULD NOT".


Yes this is true, those that will live the law of consecration will be gathered and protected. Those that are not willing will not gather with the saints.

In the parable of the ten virgins, the virgins represent the membership of the Church. When the time came to use the oil did the Lord counsel the wise virgins to share with the unwise? No.

In fact, the Lord said to the unwise: Depart, I know you not.


The parable of the ten virgins has never been used in the church by General Authorities or Prophets to say not to share. It has though been again and again used as an example of spiritual prepardness. It has been used to show we need to have the Holy Ghost. Many will say I did all these good works yet the Lord will say he did not know them. That is because they do not have the Holy Ghost, for they are prideful and selfish.


The March ensign is clearly states what it means. It says:

"The oil in parable represents out faith and testimony, our purity and dedication, our good works and our keeping of covenants-all of the ways in which we have “taken the Holy Spirit for our guide. (D&C 45-57) The Wise virgins could not share their oil with the foolish virgins because the oil of spiritual preparedness can not be shared."

The Lord said "depart" to them not because the did not have a temporal storage, he said depart to those that did not have faith, testimony, purity, dedication and good works, did not keep covenants, and did not have the Holy Ghost.

The next article talks about spiritual as physical preparedness It says:
"As a people become self-reliant, they are better prepared to endure adversities and are better able to care for others in need.
President Marion G Romney (1897-1988) taught;
Without self-reliance one cannot exercise these innate desires to serve. How can we give if there is nothing to there? Food for the hungry cannot come from empty shelves."

It said nothing at all about not sharing……in fact it said we have the innate desires to serve which meant in the context about ….share our food.





So when push comes to shove, I hope everyone will stick by their families.


When push comes to shove I hope we live the higher law of consecration and live as a Zion people. For those that are unwilling to share and live the law of consicration will not live in ZION. This was tried before during the time of Joseph Smith and it failed because of the pride and selfishness of the saints and their unwillingness to share, so they did not get to build Zion. This time Zion will be built and those that cannot accept the higher laws of selflessness that they promised in the temple will not live in Zion and will be call Goats when Christ comes.


I welcome your comments.


I do not intend to be a Goat but a Sheep. I hear my Shepherd's voice and follow him and his example.

JustPullinYourChain

I hope you are just pulling our chains with this idea that being selfish is good.

Lucifer will be pulling the chains of all the goats to hell with him as Christ says they are Goats not Sheep. His definition was very clear of which was which.

[JustPullinYourChain]

Steve,

You are sooo kind.

Please post your address.

I am sure that myself and others will be able to send you many referrals for a meal.


JustPullinYourChain

[Steve]

Steve,

You are sooo kind.

Please post your address.

I am sure that myself and others will be able to send you many referrals for a meal.


JustPullinYourChain

Have no fear all those that you send away will come to Zion and be feed with food and the true word of God. We will not cast them out like you and others will. You will be left alone with all the others unwilling to share. When your storage runs out before the time or you are robbed of it.....what will you do, where will you go, if no one will help you?....I hope Zion will still be able to take you in. Even though you have turned others away, if you came to my door I would still share with you.

[JustPullinYourChain]

Alright !!! Sounds like a plan.

Everybody, lets head on over to Steve's place.

He's throwin a party.

We'll eat all HIS supplies then ours will last longer.



JustPullinYourChain

[ShawnC]

Actually the party is already planned for those of us going to hell. You may still be able to get in on it if you hurry.

Otherwise, it seems pretty obvious that neither will change each others opinions by force (Satan's way?), so may as well not fight about it.

[Avid Disciple]

I don’t see how anything Steve said was amiss. Yeah, he had little bit of sarcasm, but nothing like the spice I have seen in the postings of those with whom he is disagreeing. He quoted a lot of good scriptures that really support the commandment to share and not judge the reasons why your petitioner is in need. Actually I can think of no better way of encouraging the genuine repentance of a lazy church member who has not saved any food, than to willingly and generously share with him when he is in need. Consider the words of the apostle Paul in Romans 12:

17 Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.
18 If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.
20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.
21 Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

My understanding of these verses is that by giving good for evil, we exercise the power to changes hearts by example. What have we gained if we survive a famine, but lose our souls in the process? The Lord and his prophets have always taught us to share and be generous, even if we give the last morsel of food away. March’s ensign gave an example of a woman who only had a half cup of rice and some oil yet offered to feed the home teachers. Miraculously, all of them were fed adequately. Consider the widow and Elijah. She gave him her last morsel and then she and her son were fed miraculously until the famine came to an end.

The only reason not to share your food storage is the fear of physical death. I fear spiritual death far more than physical death. I would rather be guilty of sharing and starve to death for my choice, than to be guilty of hoarding my storage and lose my soul. I would rather my children saw this example and would rather they perished too in this knowledge than to live because I was selfish. Of course, I really do not believe that the majority of those who selflessly share their storage will be allowed to starve to death by God. God can and will miraculously feed those who loved their neighbor as themselves. Those who do not share will eat their own storage in silence and may find that it is not enough. They will find the Lord is turning a deaf ear to them when they ask him to feed them.

I believe that at some point the Lord is going to command his prophet to gather the saints under the united order. They are going to be invited to consecrate all that they possess to the common good and to “own all things in common” as those of ancient Enoch’s city and those of the first-century Church of Christ. Refusal to do so will leave a person outside the pale of Zion and will leave them in their own strength (recall the proud and faithless Nephites who were left in their own strength and perished by thousands against the Lamanites. I know that even if I had a 10-years storage, I would still need the Lord to survive. I could not even bring myself to ask the Lord for help if I had not willingly helped others in needs, regardless of whether they had brought that need upon themselves. I liked Steve’s quote from Mosiah Chapter 4. It is very apropos. Indeed we are warned against judging that people deserve their sufferings and turning them away for that reason.

I choose to share. I choose to suffer alongside the saints, both those that have faithfully prepared and those who have procrastinated. I choose to cast my lot with them and will not repent of this commitment unless the prophet himself commanded me otherwise. I will share my storage, even if I and my children suffer hunger for it because I want to teach my children to emulate the Savior. I would rather all of us died in the Lord, living principles of charity than survive by selfishness only to die unto God and be cast out of Heaven. If I err by choosing to share and perish for it, no matter, I will be saved in the celestial kingdom. If, however, I err by hoarding my storage and God condemns me for it, then I will have lost far more than a mere extension of my mortal life. Nevertheless I believe with all my heart that God will sustain and feed those who unite with Zion and share with others, but if God wills it, I am willing to die a martyr’s death for my choice to share, rather than live and have to face the Lord in the day of judgment in the knowledge that I had not kept the law of charity. I don’t care if people think I am wrong in this. I know that this God’s will. He has abundantly testified of it in the scriptures and in the teachings of modern prophets.

Again, I choose to share. Some of you choose not to. We cannot resolve this by fighting about it and I do not wish to fight with anyone over issues of personal belief. But we will ultimately see who was right and who is dead (or damned).

[Rosabella]

Great scriptures references in the posts above!

I personally believe in self-reliance and helping those in need. I think both are vital to our obedience in all things. I can not find anything in talks of the Prophets, Apostles or scriptures that say different then that. I will obey the Prophet in all that he commands even if at the time I don’t know why he is commanding it. I will not lean on the arm of flesh and my own understanding, I will cling to the iron rod and the follow the Prophet. The reasons I say this is once you have a true testimony then you know you are to follow with Faith not just our own understanding. I constantly pray to understand these things. But I am well aware that I am limited and that God sees the big picture and will not let the Prophet lead us astray.

When it comes to life and death are we not all going to die anyway……I would rather die doing what I was ask of the Lord then doing what my will was.

Thy will not mine.

No matter what this costs me I will live by this principle. Christ took on the sins of the world and suffered for all of us. He was sinless and suffered for us, could I not in this sinful state be willing to suffer for my brothers and sisters in Christ? And say as He did not my will by Thine be done. It is very hard to do that for we are all sinners in pride, we are all selfish, none are with out sin. We can do all the great works in this life but not just works saves us, the mercy of God does. He will only give mercy to those that are merciful that have lived the law of Charity.

This is why I believe that we are told the law of Charity the supreme law of the Celestial kingdom and its chief manifestation is the law of consecration. The Law of Consecration is the putting of God and our Brothers and Sisters ahead of ourselves.

[kathyn]

Steve. Bella and Avid Disciple, I would be honored to share my goods with you at any time. The rest of you that pooh-poohed the idea of sharing....I will share with you as well. I pray that your hearts will be softened before the time comes and you'll be asked to share. We are all our brothers' (and sisters') keepers, are we not?

Let's purge our minds of these selfish thoughts and try to get as much of the Spirit and goodness in our lives as we can before the tribulations begin in earnest so that we are worthy to stand. It's foolish for us to become contentious and snide about such important principles. It doesn't become us as true Latter-Day Saints to give in to belittling others.

[MercynGrace]

Actually I can think of no better way of encouraging the genuine repentance of a lazy church member who has not saved any food, than to willingly and generously share with him when he is in need.

I love that you said this Avid Disciple!

Paul also taught that we love the Savior because He first loved us. I believe there is an eternal principle at work there. Threats of hellfire and damnation (or even starvation) inspire only momentarily (Laman and Lemuel). True charity changes lives.

The best way to get someone to prepare is by loving them into compliance. When they know that you are as concerned for their welfare as you are for your own, they will be inspired to do the right thing. We can't create Zion if we aren't of one heart and one mind. That means that what matters to you, matters to me. If your family is your number one priority then it should be a priority for me. I should try never to offend your family. I should try to encourage your children when I see them at church or in the community. I should help you out any time I am able.

You know, I wonder what would happen if you went up to someone who clearly hadn't caught the vision of food storage and said sincerely (you might have to pray for the give of charity for a while first ) "Brother So-and-so, I know that you are having a hard time catching the vision of food storage and emergency preparedness. I have all that I need and so every month I am going to set aside $10 to buy a couple of cans of wheat for your family. You see, Brother So-and-so, I love you and I want you to have what you need should a difficult time arise."

Then month after month you smile and embrace brother so-and-so and tell him. "John, I am so pleased this month I was able to get a can of rice (or beans or whatever) for your family." It wouldn't take long before he felt a profound sense of gratitude for your love and started contributing. The Spirit would work on him constantly, reminding him of your generosity and Christ-like charity.

Maybe, I'll try that for a few months and see how it goes....

IMO, we spend too much time trying to convince people when the real converting is done without words.

[kathyn]

MercynGrace:

You know, I wonder what would happen if you went up to someone who clearly hadn't caught the vision of food storage and said sincerely (you might have to pray for the give of charity for a while first ) "Brother So-and-so, I know that you are having a hard time catching the vision of food storage and emergency preparedness. I have all that I need and so every month I am going to set aside $10 to buy a couple of cans of wheat for your family. You see, Brother So-and-so, I love you and I want you to have what you need should a difficult time arise."

Actually, I did this with one of my neighbors last month. I knew she was having a hard time, so I "helped" her a bit. Only she was very grateful. I haven't tried it with a neighbor who isn't interested but I'd like to. Your idea is wonderful. I had printed out suggested reasons and lists of what storage would be wise to have for some of my neighbors but I haven't figured out a way to approach them without sounding like a goody-two-shoes Molly Mormon. I think if this info came with a can or two of food "to get them started", perhaps they'll think more seriously about it. Thank you.

[NoGreaterLove]

To focus so much on food is not the point. To get a years supply of food is not about the food! It is about obeying Heavenly Fathers commandments. So to bicker, be sarcastic, worry or fret about whether to share or not to share is ridiculous. The answer is simple. Did Abraham offer Isaac, Heavenly Father his Son, Christ his own life, the poor widow her last meal, Joseph Smith his life, and on and on. What is the life of you or your family worth if you save it due to selfishness, not following the great example of Jesus Christ who had no sin and yet offered his life for all sinners. Are we willing to offer our lives for sinners?

[Rosabella]

Steve. Bella and Avid Disciple, I would be honored to share my goods with you at any time. The rest of you that pooh-poohed the idea of sharing....I will share with you as well. I pray that your hearts will be softened before the time comes and you'll be asked to share. We are all our brothers' (and sisters') keepers, are we not?

Let's purge our minds of these selfish thoughts and try to get as much of the Spirit and goodness in our lives as we can before the tribulations begin in earnest so that we are worthy to stand. It's foolish for us to become contentious and snide about such important principles. It doesn't become us as true Latter-Day Saints to give in to belittling others.

Kathyn

I as well would be honored to open my home and my goods to you if you ever needed them. I would feel blessed to have such a loving sweet spirit to share with. I think we would have a great time together doing so! It truly is a blessing to share not a burden. I like what Elder Featherstone said " We don't have to share we Get to Share! I am blessed to have known him personally. He is an incredible man, he has such a vast amount of love for everyone. He is a great example of Charity. Charity was his main focus of his life reseach and books he wrote. Everyone has there area that they love to research that was his and I am sure it is still. I have not talk with him for some years now. May be I should change that.

I for one look forward to building zion together and working close with like-minded and like-hearted members. I know it will be hard but it will be worth it. We can do it together, but we can not do it alone.

[Rosabella]

To focus so much on food is not the point. To get a years supply of food is not about the food! It is about obeying Heavenly Fathers commandments. So to bicker, be sarcastic, worry or fret about whether to share or not to share is ridiculous. The answer is simple. Did Abraham offer Isaac, Heavenly Father his Son, Christ his own life, the poor widow her last meal, Joseph Smith his life, and on and on. What is the life of you or your family worth if you save it due to selfishness, not following the great example of Jesus Christ who had no sin and yet offered his life for all sinners. Are we willing to offer our lives for sinners?

Very well said, this is just the simple basic truths of the Gospel. It is not anymore comlicated than that. It is the fundmental doctrine of Christianity. Charity.

[Rosabella]

Actually I can think of no better way of encouraging the genuine repentance of a lazy church member who has not saved any food, than to willingly and generously share with him when he is in need.

I love that you said this Avid Disciple!

Paul also taught that we love the Savior because He first loved us. I believe there is an eternal principle at work there. Threats of hellfire and damnation (or even starvation) inspire only momentarily (Laman and Lemuel). True charity changes lives.

The best way to get someone to prepare is by loving them into compliance. When they know that you are as concerned for their welfare as you are for your own, they will be inspired to do the right thing. We can't create Zion if we aren't of one heart and one mind. That means that what matters to you, matters to me. If your family is your number one priority then it should be a priority for me. I should try never to offend your family. I should try to encourage your children when I see them at church or in the community. I should help you out any time I am able.

You know, I wonder what would happen if you went up to someone who clearly hadn't caught the vision of food storage and said sincerely (you might have to pray for the give of charity for a while first ) "Brother So-and-so, I know that you are having a hard time catching the vision of food storage and emergency preparedness. I have all that I need and so every month I am going to set aside $10 to buy a couple of cans of wheat for your family. You see, Brother So-and-so, I love you and I want you to have what you need should a difficult time arise."

Then month after month you smile and embrace brother so-and-so and tell him. "John, I am so pleased this month I was able to get a can of rice (or beans or whatever) for your family." It wouldn't take long before he felt a profound sense of gratitude for your love and started contributing. The Spirit would work on him constantly, reminding him of your generosity and Christ-like charity.

Maybe, I'll try that for a few months and see how it goes....

IMO, we spend too much time trying to convince people when the real converting is done without words.

You and Avid are soooo right. This is how you bring people to the truth. Judgement. anger. threats don't work, Love and setting an example do. Christ showed that through His examples. He showed us not to get caught up in the letter of the law but to look to the spirit of the law, which is charity.

[DOZ]

I didn't want to write anymore on this thread but I decided to write this one last thing...I hope

My food storage is not mine, it belongs to Heavenly Father.
All that I possess belongs to Heavenly Father.
I have made that covenant with Him and I will honor it.
If I am asked to share then I shall and will trust in his infinite wisdom.

Ok...I'm good now...I have written what I needed to.

You all have a great Valentines day tomorrow and just pig out on the chocolate and kisses !!!

[Rosabella]

I didn't want to write anymore on this thread but I decided to write this one last thing...I hope

My food storage is not mine, it belongs to Heavenly Father.
All that I possess belongs to Heavenly Father.
I have made that covenant with Him and I will honor it.
If I am asked to share then I shall and will trust in his infinite wisdom

Thank you for bring up that point again.....that message gets lost. All that we have is the Lord's. He is who gave it to us in the first place...So it is His. We just get to chose if we use it for our Will or His Will..... I personal chose His. He can take it away too if He decides to we forget that too. All we have is a Blessing from Him, not from ourselves. We take too much forgranted. We must count our blessings and know that is what they are. Nothing is ours, everything is His regardless how we try to justify that.

Great point....I am glad you posted again! You added something that needed to be said. Thank you! It is so sad to see all the “mine mine mine....”

Humorous note….. I know this is a strange comparison but this whole “mine mine mine” makes me remember a cartoon.

Daffy Duck and Bugs Bunny find a Ali Baba's great treasure. Tons and tons of gold and jewels, so much you could not spend in a lifetime. Daffy is so worried that Bugs Bunny is going to get more then his share…he is going crazy, where Bugs Bunny does not care. The funniest part was when Daffy was wiping off a lamp and a Genie came out. (the Genie would have given him wishes) but he is so obsessed with fighting a non existent foe for his share of the wealth that when the Genie appears out of the lamp he see him as a threat. His stomps on the genie’s head! The next scene shows Bugs Bunny sitting in a bit of heaven along a beach front, happy, content. Bugs Bunny finds a Oyster shell, he opens it and inside is a pretty pearl. All of a sudden Daffy comes up but he is now just about an inch tall. (the genie had gotten mad at him and shrunk him) Daffy climbs inside the oyster shell and wraps his tiny little arms around the pearl saying “Mine, Mine Mine…..” Bugs Bunny just kind of shakes his head sadly and shuts the oyster shell.

I never forgot this cartoon. What I gained from it as a child and ponder as an adult was this:

Bugs Bunny is not perfect but he was willing to share. Daffy was so worried that he would not get his fair share he became obsessed with making sure he did and ended up with nothing. He was blinded by greed and fear, he could not longer see things for what they are. His view became skewed and so myopic he could not see past his own greed. If he could have stepped back and seen the whole picture he would have seen that there was nothing to fear and known to share would be in his own best interests. He was so obsessed to the point when he found a lamp with a Genie that could grant him even more wonderful things…he rejects him out of fear and competitive zeal. He then loses all that he could have gained and is shrunk to a small parody of his former self. (Greed is a soul-shrinking choice). He then still had not learned the lesson when Bugs Bunny opens the oyster shell. He screams “mine mine mine…” Bugs shut the shell. I see the similarity between the shutting of the shell and the separation of the selfish from Zion and ultimately from God. Bugs Bunny ends up living in peace for he was not competitive. The treasure was not theirs they were given it they were being blessed.....but the one that did not worry about what they gained ...possibley gained it all.

[kathyn]

Bella, you and Bugs rock!!