Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gileadi

Discuss liberty related books, videos, audio, as well as downloadable resources.
User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gileadi

Post by marc »

This essay serves as a testimony to modern Israel—the Latter-day Saints—that we are beginning to resemble God’s ancient covenant people in ways that conflict with our high ideals. Some parallels between the two peoples provide a yardstick by which we can judge ourselves. Unfortunately, these parallels paint a dismal picture of where we are headed and what is in store...
Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel

Very well written.
Last edited by marc on March 20th, 2018, 6:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by marc »

This is so masterfully written. Spot on. Still not done reading it, but I just can't get over how well he hits the nail squarely on the head. Oh, what a wretched man I am.

User avatar
spark_pluged
captain of 50
Posts: 56
Location: Utah

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by spark_pluged »

I think this is the first chapter out of his book "The Last Days." I agree, this is masterfully written. We need to awake to a sense of our awful situation; not the situation that surrounds us, the situation that IS us.

User avatar
spark_pluged
captain of 50
Posts: 56
Location: Utah

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by spark_pluged »

Here is the link to that book. I pulled mine out after reading your link and it is same as this books first chapter.

http://www.amazon.com/Last-Days-Avraham ... 0910511039

Lizzy60
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 8520

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by Lizzy60 »

This has been one of my favorite chapters for many years. It very clearly shows how far we are from where we need to be to become a Zion people. Just try talking about organized sports to your average LDS, especially concerning BYU sports. It is truly a sacred cow, our sports teams.

User avatar
rewcox
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5873

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by rewcox »

Way to go Coachmarc, smack me again. Everyone should read this. Here are a few quotes:
In summary, those of us who seek not the Lord to establish his righteousness, but walk every one in our own way, after the image of our own god—whose image is in the likeness of this world, whose substance is that of an idol—shall perish in Babylon, which shall fall (D&C 1:16).

the ritualistic gatherings and barbecues that many indulge in, Today's proliferation of campers, dirt bikes, dune buggies, four-wheelers, skis, snowmobiles, yachts, speedboats, gliders, and related accoutrements betoken a rampant and costly cult. When recreation becomes an end in itself, when promiscuity seeks out recreation as a means of self-expression, then there results a classic kind of idolatry.

Those who "hasten to be rich have an evil eye" and are not innocent (Proverbs 28:20, 22). They soon fall into temptations and snares, into foolish and hurtful lusts, which "drown men in destruction and perdition" (1 Timothy 6:9). Trusting in "uncertain riches" (1 Timothy 6:17), people grow wise in their own conceit (Proverbs 28:11) and wax proud (Alma 4:6). They lift up their hearts because of their riches (Ezekiel 28:5), refusing to give heed to the word of God (Alma 45:24), becoming unfruitful (Matthew 13:22).

Jacob counseled the rich to think of their brethren like unto themselves, to be familiar with all and free with their substance—"that they may be rich like unto you" (Jacob 2:17). Before people seek for riches, he advised, they should seek for the kingdom of God, obtaining first a hope in Christ (Jacob 2:18-19). A hope in Christ means that as we devote our lives to God, we at some point receive a witness by the Holy Ghost that we have obtained a remission of our sins.

Finally, the scriptures warn us that first will come the day of the rich and the learned, the wise and the noble (D&C 58:10). After that will come the day of his power, when "the poor, the lame, and the blind, and the deaf, come in unto the marriage of the Lamb, and partake of the supper of the Lord" (D&C 58:11).75

Isaiah and Jeremiah single out something about Babylon that corrupts all, including the Lord's people. Those who engage in it become "Babylon" themselves and in the end perish with it. This involves the manufacturing, promoting, and selling of idols—the works of men's hands.

By way of contrast, Zion's economy is not so structured. As Israel's prophets outline, Zion possesses a broad rural base, in which every family works its inheritance of land.77 This makes Zion a stable, self-sustaining structure. In it abide neither poor nor those who appropriate what belongs to others. Zion's people look to their Head, their cornerstone, to bless them with increase. Old Testament and Book of Mormon examples show that such a structure can weather most storms, endure most attacks, and quickly repair or rebuild itself. The direct means of sustenance— the capacity to produce foodstuffs and raw materials—is ready at hand. Even when a people must flee temporarily into the wilderness, this provides them with the greatest maneuverability.

either build up Zion or build up Babylon

davedan
captain of 1,000
Posts: 3064
Location: Augusta, GA
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by davedan »

It reminds me of Elder Bednar's talk "things as they really are" where Elder Bednar warns that many of us are choosing to live in a virtual world instead of living in the real world (Kingdom of God).

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uSoW_H9e0lg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Lizzy60
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 8520

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by Lizzy60 »

davedan wrote:It reminds me of Elder Bednar's talk "things as they really are" where Elder Bednar warns that many of us are choosing to live in a virtual world instead of living in the real world (Kingdom of God).

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uSoW_H9e0lg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
He kind of changed his mind with his recent Education Week talk, where he strongly encouraged all of us to use social media to promote the Church(tm), authentically, of course.

User avatar
aeon
captain of 50
Posts: 98
Location: France
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by aeon »

"And every dispensation entered on its pathway to apostasy when the people compromised the worship of God with the conventions of men. "
Avraham Gileadi

I love that phrase. The Devil knows that most of us are not going to watch a porn movie for instance. But he knows how to sprinckle a little pornography in a movie, some in a song or through randoms conversations at work.
Compromise is one of the greatest tool of Lucifer. He "mingles" the philosophies of men with truth. It's very difficult to make pure and straight choices, constantly.
Last edited by aeon on November 24th, 2014, 9:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

Lizzy60
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 8520

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by Lizzy60 »

Our extended family gathered for a pre-Thanksgiving Sunday dinner yesterday. Bronco fans, and Cowboy fans. I've given up on trying to have any sort of Christ-centered spirit in my home, because the interest and pull of football is too great.
Thank goodness (and God) that my husband doesn't care about sports, and actually enjoys peace and quiet on the Sabbath. Of course we are not perfect, far, far, far from it. But, sports mania has diminished many family gatherings for me.

Aeon -- I love that quote. I've not heard it before. It's a keeper.

User avatar
rewcox
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5873

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by rewcox »

Gads, I think I have problems in all 12 diatribes. :(

I did like this quote:
Hugh Nibley serves as an inspiring example of such faithfulness to the Church. Although he recognizes the great good and the many evils in the Church, he stands aloof from all disaffection. He scrupulously maintains the fine line between discontent—often voiced openly to inspire us to higher things—and malcontent. Malcontent, the sure path to apostasy, receives not so much as a whisper from him.

User avatar
rewcox
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5873

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by rewcox »

What!!!!

Is #11 the Denver scenario???

You are very sly Coachmarc!

What does #12 mean?

braingrunt
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2042

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by braingrunt »

#1, images: Gileadi seems to focus most on the TV/movies; however, it seems that he starts with a warning about all art.

We know that in israel God ordained various religious iconography: The priests robes, the various temple decorations... perhaps other things qualify such as prayer shawls, candles, mezuzah or teffilin--although maybe those are manmade innovations. Id have to study more to be sure what came from God and what came from man.

However, the point is that at least certain religious decoration is appropriate. Where is the proper line? Should we really not depict God in art?

As for TV: ouch. I didn't try to deflect most of that dart and it stung a bit. But it seems mostly right.

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by marc »

rewcox wrote:What!!!!

Is #11 the Denver scenario???

You are very sly Coachmarc!

What does #12 mean?
I haven't gotten that far. :-B

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by marc »

rewcox wrote:Way to go Coachmarc, smack me again. Everyone should read this. Here are a few quotes:
In summary, those of us who seek not the Lord to establish his righteousness, but walk every one in our own way, after the image of our own god—whose image is in the likeness of this world, whose substance is that of an idol—shall perish in Babylon, which shall fall (D&C 1:16).

the ritualistic gatherings and barbecues that many indulge in, Today's proliferation of campers, dirt bikes, dune buggies, four-wheelers, skis, snowmobiles, yachts, speedboats, gliders, and related accoutrements betoken a rampant and costly cult. When recreation becomes an end in itself, when promiscuity seeks out recreation as a means of self-expression, then there results a classic kind of idolatry.

Those who "hasten to be rich have an evil eye" and are not innocent (Proverbs 28:20, 22). They soon fall into temptations and snares, into foolish and hurtful lusts, which "drown men in destruction and perdition" (1 Timothy 6:9). Trusting in "uncertain riches" (1 Timothy 6:17), people grow wise in their own conceit (Proverbs 28:11) and wax proud (Alma 4:6). They lift up their hearts because of their riches (Ezekiel 28:5), refusing to give heed to the word of God (Alma 45:24), becoming unfruitful (Matthew 13:22).

Jacob counseled the rich to think of their brethren like unto themselves, to be familiar with all and free with their substance—"that they may be rich like unto you" (Jacob 2:17). Before people seek for riches, he advised, they should seek for the kingdom of God, obtaining first a hope in Christ (Jacob 2:18-19). A hope in Christ means that as we devote our lives to God, we at some point receive a witness by the Holy Ghost that we have obtained a remission of our sins.

Finally, the scriptures warn us that first will come the day of the rich and the learned, the wise and the noble (D&C 58:10). After that will come the day of his power, when "the poor, the lame, and the blind, and the deaf, come in unto the marriage of the Lamb, and partake of the supper of the Lord" (D&C 58:11).75

Isaiah and Jeremiah single out something about Babylon that corrupts all, including the Lord's people. Those who engage in it become "Babylon" themselves and in the end perish with it. This involves the manufacturing, promoting, and selling of idols—the works of men's hands.

By way of contrast, Zion's economy is not so structured. As Israel's prophets outline, Zion possesses a broad rural base, in which every family works its inheritance of land.77 This makes Zion a stable, self-sustaining structure. In it abide neither poor nor those who appropriate what belongs to others. Zion's people look to their Head, their cornerstone, to bless them with increase. Old Testament and Book of Mormon examples show that such a structure can weather most storms, endure most attacks, and quickly repair or rebuild itself. The direct means of sustenance— the capacity to produce foodstuffs and raw materials—is ready at hand. Even when a people must flee temporarily into the wilderness, this provides them with the greatest maneuverability.

either build up Zion or build up Babylon
I love Gileadi's work. And Nibley's. And Skousen's...

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by marc »

spark_pluged wrote:Here is the link to that book. I pulled mine out after reading your link and it is same as this books first chapter.

http://www.amazon.com/Last-Days-Avraham ... 0910511039
Thank you! My next purchase. So many books, so little time! :-ss

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by marc »

Despite the great miracles of deliverance Israel's God wrought for his people, they quickly turned to other gods. The Old Testament is full of examples of the Lord's people making images for themselves after they inherited the promised land. They made images of the god Baal and set them up in a house of Baal (1 Kings 16:32; 2 Kings 10:26-27). They set up images in their own houses (Judges 17:4; 18:30) as well as in the houses of their gods (Nahum 1:14). They made images of men and "committed whoredoms" with them (Ezekiel 16:17). They "doted" upon images of the elite of Babylonian society, images in color, images of people in splendid attire (Ezekiel 23:14-16). In homage, as it were, to a urim and thummim, Gideon made an image of an ephod, and "all Israel went whoring after it" (Judges 8:27). The worship of cleverly fashioned images became a way of life, preoccupying the craftsman and patron alike (Hosea 13:2).
Go to any ZCMI or Deseret Bookstore. Plenty of Babylonian Society and idols on display. I pick these establishments solely because we are discussing Babylon among the Lord's latter-day covenant people.

Lot's of modern day Urim & Thummims gentiles go whoring after:

Image

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by marc »

Common to all this sort of idol worship was an infatuation with the image of a thing rather than its reality. Images require time, energy, and materials to conceive and produce. When made, images represent the fruits of men's labors, something to admire and "dote" over. Meanwhile, people get distracted from what is real. God no longer forms the center of their thoughts, and they have taken the thing they emphasize out of context. Even if they realize their error, however, people still want a return on their investment. They cannot simply discard the idol. Once they make it, it is hard to get rid of. Throughout this preoccupation, people "bend down" toward their idols— away from the Most High God. The word "serve" in Hebrew (cabad)14 also means "work." Whatever people work at—spend time and resources on, set their hearts upon—that they serve.

In effect, an obsession with unreality of one kind or another forms the crux of idolatry. For those on a low spiritual plane, something tangible or corporeal, such as an image, possesses more appeal than something intangible and incorporeal. Even the golden calf supposedly represented the Lord himself.15 Aaron called the orgy that attended the calf's dedication a "feast unto the Lord" (Exodus 32:4-5).
Wow. It's like getting clobbered by M. Ali. Floats like a butterfly, stings like a bee. The hits just keep on coming! Winner by TKO. @-)

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by marc »

As the decline of Roman civilization set in, the games became the total preoccupation of the elite as well as the masses; people made no pretense at anything higher in life. They devoted exorbitant resources to the games, so much that charitable programs rated a poor second.55 Of all peoples in the Roman Empire, it seems only pious Jews shunned the games, considering them a heathen pastime.56

In our own culture, a widespread and rapidly growing preoccupation with sports—whether football, basketball, baseball, athletics, boxing, wrestling, car racing, horse racing, hunting—must make us ask whether we, too, like the Romans and Hellenists, find ourselves in a state of moral and civil decline. Although our laws prohibit bloodshed, so explicit appear the parallels of human behavior that we cannot say that we are different. The abandon and frenzy of the human spirit at such events, the foul language, anger, and even bloodlust reflect the kind of coarse disposition the Romans displayed.
BYU owned by LDS church
U of U owned by state of Utah
Attachments
HolyWar.jpg
HolyWar.jpg (130.99 KiB) Viewed 6216 times

User avatar
Elizabeth
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 11796
Location: East Coast Australia

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gildeadi

Post by Elizabeth »

(*)
coachmarc wrote:So many books, so little time! :-ss

User avatar
aeon
captain of 50
Posts: 98
Location: France
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gileadi

Post by aeon »

Maybe we could make a comment for each item ? Here's the template

1. Images

2. Violence and Sex

3. Rock Music

4. Organized Sports

5. Human Idols

6. Imaginations of the Heart

7. Nature Cults

8. Mammon

9. Babylon

10. The Arm of Flesh

11. Elitism-Pharisaism

12. Pollution of the Temple

braingrunt
captain of 1,000
Posts: 2042

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gileadi

Post by braingrunt »

I've already tried to start some discussion on #1 but no one responded :(

User avatar
marc
Disciple of Jesus Christ
Posts: 10351
Contact:

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gileadi

Post by marc »

I'm still digesting the article. There is so much to touch on.

User avatar
ajax
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 7988
Location: Pf, Texas

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gileadi

Post by ajax »

From the Intro:
Ironically, appearances of true worship persist in every stage of apostasy. A symptom of all phases of alienation is the stress that people lay on outward observance. Since false gods are the order of the day, people must scrupulously nurture the exterior of true worship, or all is lost. When people reach this point, they confuse righteousness with actively congregating and religiously performing ecclesiastical duties. In such worship, institutional convention soon becomes the enemy of spontaneity, resulting in dead, stereotypical devotion.

The writings of Isaiah, pertinent to our day, commence with his indictment of those who actively attend religious meetings, who multiply sacrifices at the temple. Because the outward form of worship remained strong in Jerusalem, Laman and Lemuel, in the hour of Judah's exile, asserted, "We know that the people who were in the land of Jerusalem were a righteous people; for they kept the statutes and judgments of the Lord, and all his commandments" (1 Nephi 17:22). Laban was an elder of the church (1 Nephi 4:22, 26), but his heart lusted after riches (1 Nephi 3:25). In actuality, the people of Jerusalem had "changed their gods" (Jeremiah 2:11). Their land was desolated because they were committing abominations, whoring after their idols (Ezekiel 6:9).

In biblical history, each experience of idol worship precedes a divine judgment, such as cataclysm, plague, famine, war, destitution, and desolation. In the last days, therefore, when all biblical types repeat themselves, we may expect "the great day of the Lord" (D&C 43:17-22)—a period of judgment upon all nations of the earth—to commence when these ancient forms of idolatry reappear among the Lord's people. There exists no biblical type or precedent of the Lord bringing on a universal judgment until his own people wallow in apostasy. Their righteousness can stay such a judgment from the earth, but their wickedness constitutes its catalyst when the balance tips in favor of wickedness. Hence the scripture, "upon my house shall it begin" (D&C 112:25).
Last edited by ajax on December 1st, 2014, 10:30 am, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
ajax
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 7988
Location: Pf, Texas

Re: Twelve Diatribes of Modern Israel, Gileadi

Post by ajax »

So what does it all mean? Practically speaking?

Can I take my kid to a ballgame? Catch one on the tube now and again? Take my sweetheart to a movie? Or nice dinner? Listen to a metal song? (which are actually more benign than most things nowadays. Some of the best lyrics are the anti-war metal songs - I mean, who can deny the hard hitting truths of Black Sabbath's War Pigs?)

There was a point in my life that outward religious expression was paramount.
There was a point in my life where the sports page was my daily scripture.
There was a point in my life where certain genre's of music ruled all musical intake.

These things no longer rule my thinking and pursuit anymore, and they are no longer necessary for my daily diet, though I may enjoy them every once in a while just as part of living.

Bad?

Post Reply