LDS Freedom Forum

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRPP_AHsCjo" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This is the leader of Sweden -- and he is considered one of the most dynamic and charismatic politicians to come along in Sweden in recent years! At least men in America aren't scared to raise their voices above a whisper in the USA...yet.

It's in Swedish - I guess, so I don't know what he's saying.

Ideally, a nation is led by both masculin and feminine principles & energies, as we were all created.
Realistically, it seems that one feels compelled to dominate over the other, in unrighteous dominion.

Fiannan wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRPP_AHsCjo

This is the leader of Sweden -- and he is considered one of the most dynamic and charismatic politicians to come along in Sweden in recent years! At least men in America aren't scared to raise their voices above a whisper in the USA...yet.

What is a feminist " Fiannan"?

Is it someone who thinks women should have equal rights as men\?

Is it someone who absolutely loathes and hates men. They hate men and all that is masculine with all their strength. They hate men to the core of their being?


Feminism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Feminism is a collection of movements and ideologies aimed at defining, establishing, and defending equal political, economic, and social rights for women.

Do they think they are better than men?


A person who supports female rights, often to an extreme?

An obese, bossy, woman?

As a rule, I am very wary of groups that advocate for "equal" rights for some subset of the population. By their very nature they can only go in one direction, until they become a more hateful and oppressive beast than the one they formed to fight. And all the while they're crushing others underfoot they'll whine about how oppressed they are.

I have lived in Sweden and know enought Swedish to follow the interview. He is talking about an effort to equalize the pension payments of men and women to account for the fact that many women do not work full time for part of their live due to children. The reporter was a bit pushy I must say but I think he handled himself well.

Fairminded wrote:As a rule, I am very wary of groups that advocate for "equal" rights for some subset of the population. By their very nature they can only go in one direction, until they become a more hateful and oppressive beast than the one they formed to fight. And all the while they're crushing others underfoot they'll whine about how oppressed they are.

I agree!
We see this not only in the feminist movement, but also in those with homosexual fetishes.

Still, I can see in the church, particularly, that often men tend to think they are better than women, that they can rule over women, & I've too often seen unrighteous dominion, bordering on emotional abuse from men to their wives.
Men and women are both needed, not only to continue our species, but to benefit societies best.

gkearney wrote:I have lived in Sweden and know enought Swedish to follow the interview. He is talking about an effort to equalize the pension payments of men and women to account for the fact that many women do not work full time for part of their live due to children. The reporter was a bit pushy I must say but I think he handled himself well.

Gkearney,
Thanks for the recap.

I like the idea of women being praised for actually being full time parents.
IMO, most of society's issues are rooted in family issues.
Children need a mother & father - & generally, mothers (giving milk & being more nurturing) would be the best primarily care giver - at least until children are in school.
It seems silly to me for parents to intentionally have children only to give them to strangers (day care workers) to raise.

gkearney wrote:I have lived in Sweden and know enought Swedish to follow the interview. He is talking about an effort to equalize the pension payments of men and women to account for the fact that many women do not work full time for part of their live due to children. The reporter was a bit pushy I must say but I think he handled himself well.

The point is not the interview topic itself but the idea that a man should try to be like the proverbial church mouse and barely raise his voice. I posted this thread due to listening to an Alex Jones observation of men being passive and quiet and their wives becoming the dominant force in all things. Sweden is already there. Oh, and I saw an article about a dating site in Sweden that only matches married people who want to cheat with other married people. With a population of a little over 9 million over 200,000 Swedes are members. A survey was conducted with a sample of the membership. Some of the top reasons given for men wanting to find someone else to spend some time with were naturally that their wives were nagging, picking at them or were out of shape or hairy. Women gave reasons like the man being lazy and such but also many listed being loud. Swedish males are not supposed to have opinions, be aggressive or loud. And in their daycare system, which the tax burden forces both men and women to work so most children are enrolled in it, teachers are supposed to work to eradicate gender roles. Boys should play with dolls and girls should play with tanks.

In regards to feminism I think it gets into the ying and yang thing -- you have to have balance. Maybe its also like unions and management. Unions work to protect the interests of the workers but if they get too powerful they wind up destroying the production center. If management had its way workers would be crawling around naked in mines and scratching coal the way they did in British mines in the 1800s. You have to have balance. Sadly Sweden has lost that balance and I suspect we can see why liberals in America see Sweden as the shining example of socialist Utopia. Believe me it is anything but.

Oh for goodness sakes. A man remains composed and collected in an interview and gets critical comments for his trouble. I would say that remaining in control is the mark of a real man. What did you want him to do take a swing at her?

gkearney wrote:Oh for goodness sakes. A man remains composed and collected in an interview and gets critical comments for his trouble. I would say that remaining in control is the mark of a real man. What did you want him to do take a swing at her?

You still don't get my point. I used Freddie as an example to illustrate a point. If you lived in Sweden you would know that if you have a group of men and women who are ethnic Swedes the women are the ones who assume the alpha role. If you do see a man with a strong opinion who looks Swede then he is probably Finnish or Russian ethnically.

Men are discouraged from being men in Sweden yet when they do conform to their socialist-feminist elite's wishes what do they get for it? Many of the young Swedish women gravitate to the immigrant men (Arabs, North Africans, Turks. etc.) because while they were brought up to expect men to be mild-mannered they want men who are more like Vikings deep down.

I lived in Sweden for a time. I speak Swedish. I've never noticed that trait and I surly don't think that interview demonstrates what you refer to.

gkearney wrote:I lived in Sweden for a time. I speak Swedish. I've never noticed that trait and I surly don't think that interview demonstrates what you refer to.

I would love to post something to show just how wrong you are but if I google "Swedish males emasculated" many of the comments make references that should not be linked to.

Here is a couple of interesting links though:

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2011/06/52870.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/mother ... -that.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Fiannan wrote:

gkearney wrote:I lived in Sweden for a time. I speak Swedish. I've never noticed that trait and I surly don't think that interview demonstrates what you refer to.

I would love to post something to show just how wrong you are but if I google "Swedish males emasculated" many of the comments make references that should not be linked to.

Here is a couple of interesting links though:

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2011/06/52870.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/mother ... -that.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You might be right or not but the interview you use as proof does not demonstrate your point at all.

gkearney wrote:

Fiannan wrote:

gkearney wrote:I lived in Sweden for a time. I speak Swedish. I've never noticed that trait and I surly don't think that interview demonstrates what you refer to.

I would love to post something to show just how wrong you are but if I google "Swedish males emasculated" many of the comments make references that should not be linked to.

Here is a couple of interesting links though:

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/2011/06/52870.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/mother ... -that.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

You might be right or not but the interview you use as proof does not demonstrate your point at all.

Except as an example.

Fiannan wrote: The point is not the interview topic itself but the idea that a man should try to be like the proverbial church mouse and barely raise his voice.

I would prefer this over a man who is loud and overshouts what I am trying to say until I have to back down and not express my own opinion no matter how benign. A man can be soft-spoken without being a wuss. A man can be kind to women without being a wuss.

Except as an example.

An example of what exactly? The man answered her questions calmly and without ranker. He remained composed and in control of himself, a mark no only of your typical Swede but I would contend of a real man as well.

Really what did you want him to do? Ramble on like some kind of Swedish version of Rush? Insult the woman? Storm off in some kind of a fit?

The only thing this video shows is that the Prime Minister of Sweden is able to remain dignified as befitting of the holder of his high office. A real man if you ask me.

A Random Phrase wrote:

Fiannan wrote: The point is not the interview topic itself but the idea that a man should try to be like the proverbial church mouse and barely raise his voice.

I would prefer this over a man who is loud and overshouts what I am trying to say until I have to back down and not express my own opinion no matter how benign. A man can be soft-spoken without being a wuss. A man can be kind to women without being a wuss.

:ymapplause:
Propagating the idea that soft-spokeness is effeminate actually furthers the homosexual agenda, when soft-spoken little boys are mocked in school and called "girl" and "gay" (as what happened to me).

gkearney wrote:

Except as an example.

An example of what exactly? The man answered her questions calmly and without ranker. He remained composed and in control of himself, a mark no only of your typical Swede but I would contend of a real man as well.

Really what did you want him to do? Ramble on like some kind of Swedish version of Rush? Insult the woman? Storm off in some kind of a fit?

The only thing this video shows is that the Prime Minister of Sweden is able to remain dignified as befitting of the holder of his high office. A real man if you ask me.

Freddie was only used as an example of the non-aggressive, beta or gamma male that is promoted in Sweden. Sure you can say that being soft-spoken and submissive is a manly trait but any analysis of biology would tend to counter that. And again, Freddie may actually be alpha in real life and only working to sound this way -- after all, you don't get in good with the Bilderbergers by being a pansy I suppose. But all I did was use him as an example of the tone a man is supposed to take there -- the women are allowed to be loud and aggressive...I suppose someone has to be.

Our society has been lied to. Back to Sweden, which sort of man would a natural woman want, one like a Viking or one like the ideal feministic-created eunuch of today? Oh sure, I suppose in the harems, even in the Bible, eunuchs were great for the women to socialize with. Eshter was mentored by a eunuch in how to make the king happy, and win out in the competition with 400 other women. However, does a woman really want one for a lifetime relationship? Might this explain why many Swedish women prefer Muslim men -- because they display what real men are supposed to be like? And even in the USA I have noticed that the typical guy in his 30s, even in the Church, if he is heterosexual but single is an unassuming, shy guy. If you want grandkids it is better to raise your sons to be aggressive and manly, and to seek goals at any and all costs, than to raise them submissive. It is, after all, the men like Romney and Reid who gain power in the world, and even the admiration (or respect) of the leaders of our Church in the long run. And if Romney had been a little more aggressive, a little more of a warrior, he today would be president. One could say Obama knew how to get the young women, even LDS women, to go his way...and that proves my point I believe.

If anyone is interested in a rather frank examination of this issue you could search for
"Social Construction of Eunuchs" by Maggie McNeill but I will not link it due to some of the political stands towards legalization of prostitution on the blog. The topic of the article is dealing with the war against men who are men in Sweden. And I might note that many liberals see Sweden as a template for the future of the USA.

President Theodore Roosevelt, athe most macho president as we ever had most famouse quote was

"Speak softly but carry a big stick"

Regards,

George Clay

gclayjr wrote:President Theodore Roosevelt, athe most macho president as we ever had most famouse quote was

"Speak softly but carry a big stick"

Regards,

George Clay

Except carrying a big stick in Sweden, for self defense, would be illegal. It is also illegal for a woman to carry pepper spray. Oh, and if you are a woman being raped, and you smack the rapist in the head with a nearby rock and kill him, you will be charged since you used far greater force to stop an attack than was warranted if he showed no signs of wanting to kill you.

Fiannan wrote:
Except carrying a big stick in Sweden, for self defense, would be illegal. It is also illegal for a woman to carry pepper spray. Oh, and if you are a woman being raped, and you smack the rapist in the head with a nearby rock and kill him, you will be charged since you used far greater force to stop an attack than was warranted if he showed no signs of wanting to kill you.

Fiannan, you talk a lot about Sweden. How long have you lived there? Which cities did you live in and for what years?

Hm. I wish we had a video of Jesus. That way, we would know if he was ever soft-spoken. Perhaps He was always aggressive, loud, and rude - like a TRUE man should be. Perhaps we should erase all references to soft answers turning away wrath and such like, in the scriptures. Obviously, they only apply to women.

A Random Phrase wrote:Hm. I wish we had a video of Jesus. That way, we would know if he was ever soft-spoken. Perhaps He was always aggressive, loud, and rude - like a TRUE man should be. Perhaps we should erase all references to soft answers turning away wrath and such like, in the scriptures. Obviously, they only apply to women.

Not sure, seems like Jesus had his Viking moments:

Gad wrote:

Fiannan wrote:
Except carrying a big stick in Sweden, for self defense, would be illegal. It is also illegal for a woman to carry pepper spray. Oh, and if you are a woman being raped, and you smack the rapist in the head with a nearby rock and kill him, you will be charged since you used far greater force to stop an attack than was warranted if he showed no signs of wanting to kill you.

Fiannan, you talk a lot about Sweden. How long have you lived there? Which cities did you live in and for what years?

Let's just say I have more than one passport.

Fiannan wrote:

Gad wrote:

Fiannan wrote:
Except carrying a big stick in Sweden, for self defense, would be illegal. It is also illegal for a woman to carry pepper spray. Oh, and if you are a woman being raped, and you smack the rapist in the head with a nearby rock and kill him, you will be charged since you used far greater force to stop an attack than was warranted if he showed no signs of wanting to kill you.

Fiannan, you talk a lot about Sweden. How long have you lived there? Which cities did you live in and for what years?

Let's just say I have more than one passport.

So you are saying you are Swedish citizen? I am trying to determine your credibility when discussing Swedish culture. We have one person on this thread that has clearly stated he has lived in Sweden for a while who disagrees with you. You have not responded in any direct manner about your qualifications. The evasiveness does not help your argument.