Read Handbook 2

[wolfman]

Everybody needs to read Handbook 2. They put it online for everyone to read Its how we keep the doctrines pure: http://www.lds.org/handbook/handbook-2- ... the-church" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This may come as a shock to some. In accordance with the handbook Our Stake has said they would rather see a father who is not fully temple worthy baptize his spouse or child than another priesthood holder do it who is.
Here’s what the handbook says:” Only a Melchizedek Priesthood holder who is worthy to hold a temple recommend may act as voice in confirming a person a member of the Church, conferring the Melchizedek Priesthood, ordaining a person to an office in that priesthood, or setting apart a person to serve in a Church calling.
As guided by the Spirit and the instructions in the next paragraph, bishops and stake presidents have discretion to allow priesthood holders who are not fully temple worthy to perform or participate in some ordinances and blessings. However, presiding officers should not allow such participation if a priesthood holder has unresolved serious sins.
A bishop may allow a father who holds the Melchizedek Priesthood to name and bless his children even if the father is not fully temple worthy. Likewise, a bishop may allow a father who is a priest or Melchizedek Priesthood holder to baptize his children or to ordain his sons to offices in the Aaronic Priesthood. A Melchizedek Priesthood holder in similar circumstances may be allowed to stand in the circle for the confirmation of his children, for the conferral of the Melchizedek Priesthood on his sons, or for the setting apart of his wife or children. However, he may not act as voice.”

[MelissaM]

I think reading Handbook 1 is just as important.
(edited to get replies)

[Joel]

Handbook 1: http://www.scribd.com/doc/50503206/LDS- ... Vol-1-2010" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[singyourwayhome]

I'm not quite sure what kind of response you're aiming for here, Wolfman.
Are you hoping we'll be offended that non-temple-worthy fathers can baptize their children? You only need the Aaronic priesthood (Priest) to do that to begin with.

I agree that we should all read Handbook 2, at least the first 6 sections, sections 18, 19, and 20, and anything else that applies to your current calling. I've read the whole thing at least once or twice, and some sections many times. I wish all our ward's Primary teachers would read at least sections 3 & 5, I've counselled them to do it already. (I'm the Primary president.)

[MrScience]

” Only a Melchizedek Priesthood holder who is worthy to hold a temple recommend may act as voice in confirming a person a member of the Church, conferring the Melchizedek Priesthood, ordaining a person to an office in that priesthood, or setting apart a person to serve in a Church calling.
As guided by the Spirit and the instructions in the next paragraph, bishops and stake presidents have discretion to allow priesthood holders who are not fully temple worthy to perform or participate in some ordinances and blessings. However, presiding officers should not allow such participation if a priesthood holder has unresolved serious sins.
A bishop may allow a father who holds the Melchizedek Priesthood to name and bless his children even if the father is not fully temple worthy. Likewise, a bishop may allow a father who is a priest or Melchizedek Priesthood holder to baptize his children or to ordain his sons to offices in the Aaronic Priesthood. A Melchizedek Priesthood holder in similar circumstances may be allowed to stand in the circle for the confirmation of his children, for the conferral of the Melchizedek Priesthood on his sons, or for the setting apart of his wife or children. However, he may not act as voice.”

Is there a problem with this? It seems ke words are "as guided by the spirit".

[wolfman]

No problem at all. My whole point is people often rely on tradition and misinformation when applying the gospel. We need to read the handbook and understand what the prophet has counseled us. There are people who assume they aren't worthy to baptize so they don't even bother to talk to their bishop.

[ktg]

I think reading Handbook 1 is just as important.
(edited to get replies)

Handbook 1 is restricted. I don't believe it's meant for the general public, otherwise it would be on the internet too.

[MelissaM]

I think reading Handbook 1 is just as important.
(edited to get replies)

Handbook 1 is restricted. I don't believe it's meant for the general public, otherwise it would be on the internet too.

Ah yes, the decisions that get made for us based on a book we have no access to. I'm all about full disclosure.

[EmmaLee]

I think reading Handbook 1 is just as important.
(edited to get replies)

Handbook 1 is restricted. I don't believe it's meant for the general public, otherwise it would be on the internet too.

Ah yes, the decisions that get made for us based on a book we have no access to. I'm all about full disclosure.

Handbook 1 is easily found on the internet.

[ktg]

Handbook 1 is easily found on the internet.

Of course, I was talking about on the church's web site. You can also find everything about the endowment online also. That doesn't mean the church wants everyone looking at it.

[Joel]

link to handbook 1: http://www.scribd.com/doc/50503206/LDS- ... Vol-1-2010" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



•Can we really not figure out what to teach on any given Sunday? (see book 2, page 67 for the Relief Society, and many other areas for your other auxiliaries.)

•Do we really need guidance on how to wear the garment once in the military? (see book 1, 10.8)

•Is it simply too hard to figure out what to do with a Patriarch? (see book 1, 15.1 through 15.8)

•Do we really need a handbook to tell us what to do with an infant who is “critically ill”? (see book 1, 16.2.3)

•Is the Lord so nitpicky that I need directions spelled out on how to consecrate my home? (see book 2, 20.11)

•Do we really need stipulations on getting autographs or photographs of General Authorities? (see book 1, 17.1.6) – In case you were wondering, don’t even try. “Doing so detracts from their sacred callings …”

•Does the Church™ really need to dictate what Bible I use as part of my personal studies? (see book 1, 17.1.7)

•What does the Church™ say about dating or “get acquainted” businesses? (see book 1, 17.1.15)

•Confused about how to fast, or what a fast is? (See book 1, 17.1.19)

•Want to research something on the Church™, you might want to check the handbook. (See book 1, 17.1.39)

•Need to get hypnotized, but not sure if the Church™ would approve? (see book 1, 17.2.5)

•Confused about Word of Wisdom definitions? (see book 1, 17.2.11)

•Want to serve a mission, but not sure if you’re worthy enough? (see book 1, 4.5.2)

•Starving, out of food and think the Church™ can help? (see book 1, 5.2.3, hint: you’re on thin ice here, this section is on “promoting personal responsibility.” You might want to be more responsible next time around so that you don’t need to ask for help.)

•Still not sure why you were called to a “Court of Love”? (see book 1, 6.1)

•Wondering if you, too, are defined as an apostate? (see book 1, 6.7.3)

•Not sure if you were served proper “notice” of your “Court of Love”? (see book 1, 6.10.2)

•Questioning whether a Stake President has the ability to judge your worthiness? (see book 1, 7.1)

•Still wondering what the purpose of your Priesthood Executive Council is? (see book 2, 4.3)

•Need help writing the agenda for your Sunday morning meetings? (see book 2, 4.6.2)

•Still confused about how to act on what you collectively decided to do in your Sunday morning meetings? (see book 2, 4.6.3 – “Undertaking a Course of Action”)

•Got sent to Gospel Principles Class and want to know why? (see book 2, 5.2.8)

•Want to call the Bishop as your youth sports coach team, but not sure if that is kosher with the COB™? (see book 2, 8.3.7)

•Still unsure about what your role as a parent is (hint: you probably should have asked that before having kids, but still)? (see book 2, 10.2)

•Not sure what standards of life your young woman/daughter should be living? (see book 2, 10.5 – hint: it’s in another book. For the Strength of Youth.)

•Just can’t quite get down what should or shouldn’t be shared in YW Opening Exercises? (see book 2, 10.6.1)

•Not sure how to plan Primary to fill the time such that those little rug rats aren’t running wild by the end of the 2 hours? (see book 2, 11.4.1)

•Concerned about whether your Primary program content is appropriate? (see book 2, 11.5.4 – hint: “in keeping with the sacredness of sacrament meeting, the presentation should not include visuals, costumes, or media presentations.” Whoo. And I thought it was the Sacrament and not the meeting that was sacred.)

[wolfman]

Yes some people are "slothful servants and need to be commanded in all things" -Jesus

[hsb9]

link to handbook 1: http://www.scribd.com/doc/50503206/LDS- ... Vol-1-2010" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;



•Can we really not figure out what to teach on any given Sunday? (see book 2, page 67 for the Relief Society, and many other areas for your other auxiliaries.)

•Do we really need guidance on how to wear the garment once in the military? (see book 1, 10.8)

•Is it simply too hard to figure out what to do with a Patriarch? (see book 1, 15.1 through 15.8)

•Do we really need a handbook to tell us what to do with an infant who is “critically ill”? (see book 1, 16.2.3)

•Is the Lord so nitpicky that I need directions spelled out on how to consecrate my home? (see book 2, 20.11)

•Do we really need stipulations on getting autographs or photographs of General Authorities? (see book 1, 17.1.6) – In case you were wondering, don’t even try. “Doing so detracts from their sacred callings …”

•Does the Church™ really need to dictate what Bible I use as part of my personal studies? (see book 1, 17.1.7)

•What does the Church™ say about dating or “get acquainted” businesses? (see book 1, 17.1.15)

•Confused about how to fast, or what a fast is? (See book 1, 17.1.19)

•Want to research something on the Church™, you might want to check the handbook. (See book 1, 17.1.39)

•Need to get hypnotized, but not sure if the Church™ would approve? (see book 1, 17.2.5)

•Confused about Word of Wisdom definitions? (see book 1, 17.2.11)

•Want to serve a mission, but not sure if you’re worthy enough? (see book 1, 4.5.2)

•Starving, out of food and think the Church™ can help? (see book 1, 5.2.3, hint: you’re on thin ice here, this section is on “promoting personal responsibility.” You might want to be more responsible next time around so that you don’t need to ask for help.)

•Still not sure why you were called to a “Court of Love”? (see book 1, 6.1)

•Wondering if you, too, are defined as an apostate? (see book 1, 6.7.3)

•Not sure if you were served proper “notice” of your “Court of Love”? (see book 1, 6.10.2)

•Questioning whether a Stake President has the ability to judge your worthiness? (see book 1, 7.1)

•Still wondering what the purpose of your Priesthood Executive Council is? (see book 2, 4.3)

•Need help writing the agenda for your Sunday morning meetings? (see book 2, 4.6.2)

•Still confused about how to act on what you collectively decided to do in your Sunday morning meetings? (see book 2, 4.6.3 – “Undertaking a Course of Action”)

•Got sent to Gospel Principles Class and want to know why? (see book 2, 5.2.8)

•Want to call the Bishop as your youth sports coach team, but not sure if that is kosher with the COB™? (see book 2, 8.3.7)

•Still unsure about what your role as a parent is (hint: you probably should have asked that before having kids, but still)? (see book 2, 10.2)

•Not sure what standards of life your young woman/daughter should be living? (see book 2, 10.5 – hint: it’s in another book. For the Strength of Youth.)

•Just can’t quite get down what should or shouldn’t be shared in YW Opening Exercises? (see book 2, 10.6.1)

•Not sure how to plan Primary to fill the time such that those little rug rats aren’t running wild by the end of the 2 hours? (see book 2, 11.4.1)

•Concerned about whether your Primary program content is appropriate? (see book 2, 11.5.4 – hint: “in keeping with the sacredness of sacrament meeting, the presentation should not include visuals, costumes, or media presentations.” Whoo. And I thought it was the Sacrament and not the meeting that was sacred.)

Definitely we need the handbook for over-zealous leaders who make up the gospel as they go along. The handbook keeps everyone on the same page. I vote for the handbook.

[gruden2.0]

No problem at all. My whole point is people often rely on tradition and misinformation when applying the gospel. We need to read the handbook and understand what the prophet has counseled us. There are people who assume they aren't worthy to baptize so they don't even bother to talk to their bishop.

Is it okay if I just read the scriptures and pray?

I've never felt compelled to read the (non-scriptural) handbook and don't intend to.

[gruden2.0]

Definitely we need the handbook for over-zealous leaders who make up the gospel as they go along. The handbook keeps everyone on the same page. I vote for the handbook.

Overzealous leaders (and members) will always be overzealous even if there's a handbook.

Joseph Smith said we are to teach people correct principles and let them govern themselves. Amen.

[AussieOi]

KTG- are you kidding

I am captain anti-authority

The CHOf I is a god send

Do you know how many times I shot down a philosophy of man in a bishopric of council meeting?

EVERY week

if in doubt- refer to the handbook.

it is generally right, and enables a worldwhide church to be run along consistent structures

AND it stops nutjob bishops and leaders (male and female) from applying their own little versino of "Authoritah"

IN case you hadn't notice, our church (like all) has its own long list of nutjobs in each ward

That handbook saves us from their wacko interpretations of christianity

[wolfman]

KTG- are you kidding

I am captain anti-authority

The CHOf I is a god send

Do you know how many times I shot down a philosophy of man in a bishopric of council meeting?

EVERY week

if in doubt- refer to the handbook.

it is generally right, and enables a worldwhide church to be run along consistent structures

AND it stops nutjob bishops and leaders (male and female) from applying their own little versino of "Authoritah"

IN case you hadn't notice, our church (like all) has its own long list of nutjobs in each ward

That handbook saves us from their wacko interpretations of christianity

LOL )

[HeirofNumenor]

KTG- are you kidding

I am captain anti-authority

The CHOf I is a god send

Do you know how many times I shot down a philosophy of man in a bishopric of council meeting?

EVERY week

if in doubt- refer to the handbook.

it is generally right, and enables a worldwhide church to be run along consistent structures

AND it stops nutjob bishops and leaders (male and female) from applying their own little versino of "Authoritah"

IN case you hadn't notice, our church (like all) has its own long list of nutjobs in each ward

That handbook saves us from their wacko interpretations of christianity

Great one Aussie =))

Oh - and thank you for recognizing this fact:

it is generally right, and enables a worldwide church to be run along consistent structures

Same reason for a correlation department, btw... so that the same doctrine is being taught worldwide...

[A Random Phrase]

Heck, Sun, nobody needs brains if they have those two books.

Overzealous leaders (and members) will always be overzealous even if there's a handbook.

Joseph Smith said we are to teach people correct principles and let them govern themselves. Amen.

Double Amen.

[jnjnelson]

Handbook 1: http://www.scribd.com/doc/50503206/LDS- ... Vol-1-2010" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One of the first pages of the Handbook 1 indicates that it is intended only for administrative leadership of the Church, and that it should not be duplicated or distributed otherwise. Whoever made this public on the Internet is acting in direct violation of Handbook 1, and is violating copyright law.

[hsb9]

Definitely we need the handbook for over-zealous leaders who make up the gospel as they go along. The handbook keeps everyone on the same page. I vote for the handbook.

Overzealous leaders (and members) will always be overzealous even if there's a handbook.

Joseph Smith said we are to teach people correct principles and let them govern themselves. Amen.

Except that when the way over-zealous leaders govern in a way that hurts others and then when the next person takes over they tend to continue the trend. Then later, someone who listens to the spirit is in charge and goes back to the handbook. The handbook was directed and prayed over from our prophet and apostles as to how the church is supposed to be governed, when leaders deviate, then it hurts those under their direction. It's all good and well to say we need to govern ourselves, but it hurts others when those in charge take it upon themselves to make up rules contrary to what the prophet lays out for us. I've seen it happen time and time again. Part of governing ourselves is letting go of our pride of wanting to do things our own way and actually being obedient to what the prophet asks us to do.

[MrScience]

We can govern ourselves when we know correct principles......which need to be written down (Handbook) to be dispursed to the church leaders and members. The handbook also makes clear which are rules and which are recomendations. It should make it easier for all.

[wolfman]

There are plenty of things that are up to local leaders' discretion. If its in the handbook it's not up to their discretion.

[A Random Phrase]

Handbook 1: http://www.scribd.com/doc/50503206/LDS- ... Vol-1-2010" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One of the first pages of the Handbook 1 indicates that it is intended only for administrative leadership of the Church, and that it should not be duplicated or distributed otherwise. Whoever made this public on the Internet is acting in direct violation of Handbook 1, and is violating copyright law.

It's the 2010 issue. Is that the current one? The church usually chases down and removes all copies of vol 1 it can find. If this is a current copy, I expect it will not last long.

[hsb9]

There are plenty of things that are up to local leaders' discretion. If its in the handbook it's not up to their discretion.

I whole-heartedly agree. Thanks.