Characteristics of a worthy Priesthood "Practitioner"...

[Amore Vero]

I think you are all correct. AV, these covenants are very difficult to annul. I have great admiration for the stance you have taken. I think this is a little like the counsel in the DC on forgiving your enemy his trespasses. After, was it three times, the lord will deliver them into your hands to do what you will with them. If you choose to deal kindly with them after that, it will add to your rewards in the next life. Sorry, I don't have time to find the reference.

Thank you Rand. I am familiar with that scripture & it's a great one. Yes it seems this situation is a little like that.

[Samuel the Lamanite]

NGL: I respectfully disagree with you. If I have to choose from a clear statement by Jesus Christ and modifications made by ANYONE, I will stand with Christ. Everybody else can stand with later modifications made by man.

[Rand]

As I pondered this topic, it occurred to me that Abraham was commanded to do something God asked of him that was for his personal progress, that many of us may have wished God would ask of us, kill one of our teenagers. )

If any of us had been a peer of Abraham we probably would have pled with him to not do what he was asked to do by God. There were probably no statements from his current Ensign that would have supported such a brash course of action.

There is the general behavior that we can abide, there is a multitude of levels that can transcend that level of discipleship. The ultimate course is to follow what God has asked you to do, and do it with gratitude and long suffering, enduring to the end with a pure heart and a meekness similar to the Saviors. To use that course of action to teach others is a difficult thing to do.

This is an interesting discussion.

Let me bring it back to topic. My brother shared an observation of an elderly priesthood holder who has travelled the ranks in priesthood callings to just short of a 70. He is reported to sit in sacrament meeting on the edge of his chair, pays strict attention to every word from every speaker as though they were an apostle. He always adds comments in HP group that are constructive and additive to every lesson, no matter how poorly prepared the lesson or teacher. He never does the High Priest dive, looking down and reading your scriptures, because the lesson is less than inspiring. Instead, he listens until the spirit can invite him to insert a comment or observation that will lift the discussion and lesson to a higher level for all. I guess if we listen to the Spirit, it doesn't matter who is teaching, speaking or what they are saying, we can always be edified and share that with others.

[Samuel the Lamanite]

Rand: Tell this 70 year old HP that I will send him the money to move to my Ward. I sort of play a similar role here but the First Counselor does NOT in anyway deviate from the written lesson even if the question/comment is relevant. His stated goal is to make sure evry part of the lesson is covered. So, he and I clash heads quick often. I've even shown in the lesson manauls of the Church that one should always allow the spirit to guide the teacher in covering the most important parts of the lesson relevant to the students. Ironically, this Counselor is in his mid70s. O:-)

[Rand]

Rand: Tell this 70 year old HP that I will send him the money to move to my Ward. I sort of play a similar role here but the First Counselor does NOT in anyway deviate from the written lesson even if the question/comment is relevant. His stated goal is to make sure evry part of the lesson is covered. So, he and I clash heads quick often. I've even shown in the lesson manauls of the Church that one should always allow the spirit to guide the teacher in covering the most important parts of the lesson relevant to the students. Ironically, this Counselor is in his mid70s. O:-)

Sounds like a patience building experience to me. That is when I do the High Priest duck. I have to quit it. Hang in there. :ymhug:

[HeirofNumenor]

NGL: I respectfully disagree with you. If I have to choose from a clear statement by Jesus Christ and modifications made by ANYONE, I will stand with Christ. Everybody else can stand with later modifications made by man.

And thus the problem....assuming that statements/policy made/carried out by "man" are somehow invalid or opposed to Christ, when in that that "man" is called by the Lord to be His mouthpiece and is directed by Christ to make those modifications......

[reese]

NGL: I respectfully disagree with you. If I have to choose from a clear statement by Jesus Christ and modifications made by ANYONE, I will stand with Christ. Everybody else can stand with later modifications made by man.

And thus the problem....assuming that statements/policy made/carried out by "man" are somehow invalid or opposed to Christ, when in that that "man" is called by the Lord to be His mouthpiece and is directed by Christ to make those modifications......

I always thought that Joseph Smith said if a statement has "Thus saith the Lord" in it, then we could know it was from God. Otherwise we had no guarantee. Does someone know what quote I am talking about? I'll have to look around for it.

[shadow]

I always thought that Joseph Smith said if a statement has "Thus saith the Lord" in it, then we could know it was from God. Otherwise we had no guarantee. Does someone know what quote I am talking about? I'll have to look around for it.

I don't know but Ezra T. Benson taught that "Thus saith the Lord" is not required.

[reese]

I always thought that Joseph Smith said if a statement has "Thus saith the Lord" in it, then we could know it was from God. Otherwise we had no guarantee. Does someone know what quote I am talking about? I'll have to look around for it.

I don't know but Ezra T. Benson taught that "Thus saith the Lord" is not required.

Yes I know.
And here we go again, a modern leader contradicting an early leader of the church. I really wish they would quit doing that. It would make things much easier.

[Amore Vero]

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[sbsion]

2cdTMP..............suffice when recieved

[shadow]

I always thought that Joseph Smith said if a statement has "Thus saith the Lord" in it, then we could know it was from God. Otherwise we had no guarantee. Does someone know what quote I am talking about? I'll have to look around for it.

I don't know but Ezra T. Benson taught that "Thus saith the Lord" is not required.

Yes I know.
And here we go again, a modern leader contradicting an early leader of the church. I really wish they would quit doing that. It would make things much easier.

I bet if we read the quote from Joseph Smith and the one from Pres. Benson we'd come to realize they are both true. That said, I haven't seen the quote from JS that you're referring to.

[HeirofNumenor]

I bet if we read the quote from Joseph Smith and the one from Pres. Benson we'd come to realize they are both true.

Exactly. And if you do this prayerfully and humbly we'd see the synthesis and harmony of God's words, and if the later word appears to contradict or supersede the earlier - then we'd also see the necessity based on current situations and context. Otherwise we get off into deep mysteries and tangents and understanding far afield what the prophet/apostle in question ever intended.