Israel

[Col. Flagg]

OK, I'm curious to get everyone's thoughts about the state of Israel - Glenn Beck said this morning that we, as Americans, should be doing everything in our power to defend Israel at all costs. While I love the Israeli people, its government has become as corrupt as ours and its intelligence service (Mossad) has now been proven to be the main player in 9/11. I also know that the Israeli lobby in Washington, DC is very powerful and uses blackmail to strong-arm DC politicos into doing its bidding. I am of the opinion that we should be defending the Israeli people, but when it comes to its government and the Mossad, absolutely not, however, you can't have one without the other and with our government being as corrupt as it is, what do you do? What's everyone else's opinion here?

[Mark]

OK, I'm curious to get everyone's thoughts about the state of Israel - Glenn Beck said this morning that we, as Americans, should be doing everything in our power to defend Israel at all costs. While I love the Israeli people, its government has become as corrupt as ours and its intelligence service (Mossad) has now been proven to be the main player in 9/11. I also know that the Israeli lobby in Washington, DC is very powerful and uses blackmail to strong-arm DC politicos into doing its bidding. I am of the opinion that we should be defending the Israeli people, but when it comes to its government and the Mossad, absolutely not, however, you can't have one without the other and with our government being as corrupt as it is, what do you do? What's everyone else's opinion here?

Nuke em all and let the Lord sort it out! :ymcowboy:

[Col. Flagg]

OK, I'm curious to get everyone's thoughts about the state of Israel - Glenn Beck said this morning that we, as Americans, should be doing everything in our power to defend Israel at all costs. While I love the Israeli people, its government has become as corrupt as ours and its intelligence service (Mossad) has now been proven to be the main player in 9/11. I also know that the Israeli lobby in Washington, DC is very powerful and uses blackmail to strong-arm DC politicos into doing its bidding. I am of the opinion that we should be defending the Israeli people, but when it comes to its government and the Mossad, absolutely not, however, you can't have one without the other and with our government being as corrupt as it is, what do you do? What's everyone else's opinion here?

Nuke em all and let the Lord sort it out! :ymcowboy:

Woo-hoo!!!

[creator]

A Common belief among conservatives, especially mainstream Republicans, is that the United States has a responsibility to support and defend Israel... There has even been a lot of hype over the Glenn Beck “Restoring Courage” rally being held in Israel on 8/24/11. According to glennbeck.com, “Restoring Courage is an opportunity to demonstrate to the world that Israel does not stand alone.”

Is this the proper stance to take? Should we stand for Israel, no matter what? Are we not alienating other nations? Just because something is popular, and everyone is doing it, or thinking it, doesn’t make it right. As with all issues we should base our support on correct principles. In this article we will examine teachings from the scriptures and words of modern Church leaders to see if there is any justification for U.S. support and defense of the modern State of Israel.

I wrote an article to address this very topic... including statements from latter-day day prophets and apostles...

Should Latter-day Saints Support the Modern State of Israel?

[AussieOi]

bible says god will bring nations in to cleanse israel
then he will gather his true zion from the remnants
its just another nation of political luciferians, like your, and mine, gadiantons with some serious power
praise god, he'll pass the ammunition for us

insert quote by LDS president about we have no right to use citizens money to nation build other nations, nor a constitutional justification to do so

they will be thrown in the hole they are digging to murder palestinians in. irony. wicked will punish the wicked etc

[sbsion]

a like such stand should be for Libya and Syria......what think ye?

[Oldemandalton]

I stand with Glenn Beck in supporting the Nation of Israel along with;

GOD
Elder Orson Hyde’s Dedicatory Prayer for the return of the Jews to Palestine in 1841, “…"Now, O Lord! Thy servant has been obedient to the heavenly vision which Thou gavest him in his native land; and under the shadow of Thine outstretched arm, he has safely arrived in this place to dedicate and consecrate this land unto Thee, for the gathering together of Judah's scattered remnants, according to the predictions of the holy Prophets..”
Soon after this prayer the Zionist movement began in earnest and thousands of the diaspora Jews began to settle in Palestine.

D&C 133:13
13 And let them who be of Judah flee unto Jerusalem, unto the mountains of the Lord’s house.

D&C 109:61-64
61 But thou knowest that thou hast a great love for the children of Jacob, who have been scattered upon the mountains for a long time, in a cloudy and dark day.
62 We therefore ask thee to have mercy upon the children of Jacob, that Jerusalem, from this hour, may begin to be redeemed;
63 And the yoke of bondage may begin to be broken off from the house of David;
64 And the children of Judah may begin to return to the lands which thou didst give to Abraham, their father.

3 Nephi 29:8
8 Yea, and ye need not any longer hiss, nor spurn, nor make game of the Jews, nor any of the remnant of the house of Israel; for behold, the Lord remembereth his covenant unto them, and he will do unto them according to that which he hath sworn.

2 Nephi 29:3-5
3 And because my words shall hiss forth—many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible.
4 But thus saith the Lord God: O fools, they shall have a Bible; and it shall proceed forth from the Jews, mine ancient covenant people. And what thank they the Jews for the Bible which they receive from them? Yea, what do the Gentiles mean? Do they remember the travails, and the labors, and the pains of the Jews, and their diligence unto me, in bringing forth salvation unto the Gentiles?
5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.

Also Elder Ezra Taft Benson
In a Conference talk, April 1950, Elder Benson describes the establishment of the State of Israel as fulfillment of prophecy,
“As Latter-day Saints, familiar with ancient and modern prophecies, we of course do not agree that some other more suitable place should be and will be found for the descendants of Judas. We believe in the over-ruling power of Providence in the affairs of men and nations. We believe that the Old Testament prophets clearly predicted the dispersion and scattering of Israel and the eventual lathering of Judah in the land given to their fathers.”

And President Joseph Fielding Smith
In an April 1966 Conference Talk by President Joseph Fielding Smith, entitled, Stand With Israel also describes the creation of the nation of Israel as fulfillment of prophecy. He said “Jesus said the Jews would be scattered among all nations and Jerusalem would be trodden down by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles were fulfilled. (Luke 21:24.) The prophecy in Section 45, verses 24-29, of the Doctrine and Covenants regarding the Jews was literally fulfilled. Jerusalem, which was trodden down by the Gentiles, is no longer trodden down but is made the home for the Jews. They are returning to Palestine, and by this we may know that the times of the Gentiles are near their close.”

And President Wilford Woodruff
“President Wilford Woodruff uttered a very important prophecy, prayer, and testimony with reference to this people, in which he said,
. . . the Lord has decreed that the Jews should be gathered from all the Gentile nations where they have been driven, into their own land, in fulfillment of the words of Moses. their law-giver. And this is the will of your great Elohim, O house of Judah... Then he said further that the time would come when the armies of the Gentiles would be gathered against them, but he promised further that the time is not far distant when the rich men among the Jews would be called upon to use their abundant wealth to gather the dispersed of Judah and purchase the ancient dwelling places of their fathers in and about Jerusalem, and rebuild the holy city and temple.”

Even with W. Cleon Skousen
In W. Cleon Skousen’s book “Fantastic Victory: Israel's Rendezvous With Destiny”
Bro Skousen explains very well the Arab Israeli conflict and the history of the Jew’s return to Palestine. This book is a must read for the Israel/Jew doubters.

It is interesting that under the heading, Zionism, Bruce R. McConkie, in “Mormon Doctrine” stated;
“One of the living miracles of the ages is the preservation of the Jewish people as a distinct race and the restless anxiety in the hearts of so many of them to return to the land of their fathers. This modern movement to resettle the house of Judah in Palestine is called Zionism. It gains impetus from the many Old Testament prophecies which tell of the latter-day return of Judah to their homeland.”

So yes, I will stand with Israel along with, God, Pres. Benson, President Joseph Fielding Smith, President Wilford Woodruff, Bro. Skousen and yes, Glenn Beck .

Consider that God has had a hand in the creation of only two nations here on Earth today, the U.S.A. and the Nation of Israel. Neither is perfect, but I will stand to defend both nation’s right to exist and try and to improve the one I live in.



Old Man

[Like]

OMD,

Good to see you around!!!!! Welcome back!!! I was beginning to think you crossed over to the other side )

[NoGreaterLove]

I stand with Glenn Beck in supporting the Nation of Israel along with;

GOD
Elder Orson Hyde’s Dedicatory Prayer for the return of the Jews to Palestine in 1841, “…"Now, O Lord! Thy servant has been obedient to the heavenly vision which Thou gavest him in his native land; and under the shadow of Thine outstretched arm, he has safely arrived in this place to dedicate and consecrate this land unto Thee, for the gathering together of Judah's scattered remnants, according to the predictions of the holy Prophets..”
Soon after this prayer the Zionist movement began in earnest and thousands of the diaspora Jews began to settle in Palestine.

D&C 133:13
13 And let them who be of Judah flee unto Jerusalem, unto the mountains of the Lord’s house.

D&C 109:61-64
61 But thou knowest that thou hast a great love for the children of Jacob, who have been scattered upon the mountains for a long time, in a cloudy and dark day.
62 We therefore ask thee to have mercy upon the children of Jacob, that Jerusalem, from this hour, may begin to be redeemed;
63 And the yoke of bondage may begin to be broken off from the house of David;
64 And the children of Judah may begin to return to the lands which thou didst give to Abraham, their father.

3 Nephi 29:8
8 Yea, and ye need not any longer hiss, nor spurn, nor make game of the Jews, nor any of the remnant of the house of Israel; for behold, the Lord remembereth his covenant unto them, and he will do unto them according to that which he hath sworn.

2 Nephi 29:3-5
3 And because my words shall hiss forth—many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible.
4 But thus saith the Lord God: O fools, they shall have a Bible; and it shall proceed forth from the Jews, mine ancient covenant people. And what thank they the Jews for the Bible which they receive from them? Yea, what do the Gentiles mean? Do they remember the travails, and the labors, and the pains of the Jews, and their diligence unto me, in bringing forth salvation unto the Gentiles?
5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.

Also Elder Ezra Taft Benson
In a Conference talk, April 1950, Elder Benson describes the establishment of the State of Israel as fulfillment of prophecy,
“As Latter-day Saints, familiar with ancient and modern prophecies, we of course do not agree that some other more suitable place should be and will be found for the descendants of Judas. We believe in the over-ruling power of Providence in the affairs of men and nations. We believe that the Old Testament prophets clearly predicted the dispersion and scattering of Israel and the eventual lathering of Judah in the land given to their fathers.”

And President Joseph Fielding Smith
In an April 1966 Conference Talk by President Joseph Fielding Smith, entitled, Stand With Israel also describes the creation of the nation of Israel as fulfillment of prophecy. He said “Jesus said the Jews would be scattered among all nations and Jerusalem would be trodden down by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles were fulfilled. (Luke 21:24.) The prophecy in Section 45, verses 24-29, of the Doctrine and Covenants regarding the Jews was literally fulfilled. Jerusalem, which was trodden down by the Gentiles, is no longer trodden down but is made the home for the Jews. They are returning to Palestine, and by this we may know that the times of the Gentiles are near their close.”

And President Wilford Woodruff
“President Wilford Woodruff uttered a very important prophecy, prayer, and testimony with reference to this people, in which he said,
. . . the Lord has decreed that the Jews should be gathered from all the Gentile nations where they have been driven, into their own land, in fulfillment of the words of Moses. their law-giver. And this is the will of your great Elohim, O house of Judah... Then he said further that the time would come when the armies of the Gentiles would be gathered against them, but he promised further that the time is not far distant when the rich men among the Jews would be called upon to use their abundant wealth to gather the dispersed of Judah and purchase the ancient dwelling places of their fathers in and about Jerusalem, and rebuild the holy city and temple.”

Even with W. Cleon Skousen
In W. Cleon Skousen’s book “Fantastic Victory: Israel's Rendezvous With Destiny”
Bro Skousen explains very well the Arab Israeli conflict and the history of the Jew’s return to Palestine. This book is a must read for the Israel/Jew doubters.

It is interesting that under the heading, Zionism, Bruce R. McConkie, in “Mormon Doctrine” stated;
“One of the living miracles of the ages is the preservation of the Jewish people as a distinct race and the restless anxiety in the hearts of so many of them to return to the land of their fathers. This modern movement to resettle the house of Judah in Palestine is called Zionism. It gains impetus from the many Old Testament prophecies which tell of the latter-day return of Judah to their homeland.”

So yes, I will stand with Israel along with, God, Pres. Benson, President Joseph Fielding Smith, President Wilford Woodruff, Bro. Skousen and yes, Glenn Beck .

Consider that God has had a hand in the creation of only two nations here on Earth today, the U.S.A. and the Nation of Israel. Neither is perfect, but I will stand to defend both nation’s right to exist and try and to improve the one I live in.



Old Man

Good job!

[cboyack]

I believe it's mistaken to interpret those scriptures and quotes to mean that we must give financial, tactical, and moral support to a government that shares the name of its ancestral society. I elaborate here:

http://www.connorboyack.com/blog/foreig ... ith-israel" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[NoGreaterLove]

I posted a thread on the Assyrian being used by Christ to do his work in carrying out his wrath upon the U.S. and Jerusalem. The Assyrian is by no means the good guy in this picture, but is the rod in the Lord's hands to carry our his work.
I think even though the U.S. is by no means the good guy nor is Israel for that matter, both are rods in the Lord's hands to accomplish both the gathering of the saints to America to receive their endowments and the Jews to Jerusalem to fulfill God's covenant with Abraham.
So I vote yes and support Glen Beck's position.

[pjbrownie]

NGL, I agree. Like America, Israel uses its government to do wicked things. However, Assyria, which will be used to cleanse both Israels, is much more wicked. In essence, I always say, Israel does not propose the genocide of Arabs while many Arabs propose the genocide of Jews. When you drill it down, it is as simple as that.

[AussieOi]

i read once that god gave the land to the nephites too
look what they became
i read that what was it, the law from jerusalem and the word from zion (usa)
and um, what did the USA do it mormons? and joseph smith?
why oh why do people assume that the politicians who run the knesset, and mossad, and military, are any different than the US congress and LDS?

and can people finally wake up and accept that there have been 2600 years since the scattering of israel, and 2000 years since christs family were there

ya dont think that maybe those who are blood israel might be what we call palestinians today? or must israel be a JEW with a yarmulke?

i mean for the 10,000th time, go look at http://www.truetorahjews.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.jewsagainstzionism.org" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

glen beck is an idiot

republicans cant help but go hard for israel
mormons are pretty well all republicans

[Oldemandalton]

The USA and Israel will be the seats of God’s governance over the earth during the Millennium, Jerusalem and the New Jerusalem. Satan knows this and will try to thwart God’s plans by attempting to destroy these two nations. Israel is in the cross hairs first.

Ezekiel 38:13 has “the merchants of Tarshish,” complaining to the armies attacking Israel in the last days but do nothing to help them. Who helps keep the armies of Gog and Magog at bay for 3 ½ years? God will send Two Prophets who will defend Israel. Where is the USA? Will the propaganda of hatred against Israel and the Jews succeed in leaving her alone to defend themselves against all her enemies?

2 Ne29:5
5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.

If God has prophesied that the JEWS must return to Palestine, dedicated the land for this purpose, inspired millions of Jews to return, inspired world leaders to help in this return and the miraculous creation of the State of Israel, then does not this indicate to us the responsibility we have to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land and to help defend them against their enemies. Or shall we just sit back and let evil succeed? If so then he will “return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.”


OMD

[AussieOi]

you miss the forest for the trees, but you are an old man, and most old men are like old dogs, so i can't get through to you

but ok i'll let you humour me. just think. do you think satan might have gotten into israel like he got into the USA?

do you think maybe he controls the politicians, and gets them to do things to stir up people to make them HATE Israel? wow. never thought of that eh

[Etosha]

"If God has prophesied that the JEWS must return to Palestine, dedicated the land for this purpose, inspired millions of Jews to return, inspired world leaders to help in this return and the miraculous creation of the State of Israel, then does not this indicate to us the responsibility we have to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land and to help defend them against their enemies. Or shall we just sit back and let evil succeed? If so then he will “return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.”

EXCELLENT!

[AussieOi]

im sorry, i thought god mad a covenant with Abraham? fancy that

oh, and what about the USA, isn't that one dedicated to the sons of Lehi? you know, the LAMANITES? so do you head out to your local reservation and pow wow with them


>>>responsibility we have

we have no responsibility or obligation here

>>>>to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land

help + gods....so sweet, like they are helpless little sheep


>>>>and to help defend them against their enemies
well you've given them enough NUkes, and of course they are the only natoin in the region with the nukes.
and of course notice how our nation didn't have any of those enemies until after the "state" of israel arrives and dispossessed the local inhabitants

but then your nation and mine knows all about subjugatin, and conquest, and genocide
aboriginals
indians
palestinians

funny that- does Orson Hydes prayer mean the locals had to leave did it? no room to co-exist?
i guess if you want to make them leave then your own people want to get out of the north america and give it back to the lamanites. or mexicans. i once saw a map that said utah was mexico.

might is right, just ask god

as i've said 20,000 times, what makes peopel think that those imposters calling themselves israelis are Jews?

why dont people go and read up on what Christ said about these people 2000 years ago.

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

so yeah the pharisees and sadducees and sanhedrin, hey, THEY were ALL evil, and murdered christ

but yes, all these jews are good.

and all palestinians are terrorists

wake up

promised land does not = military subjugation

plus, the land is our right now anyway, it belongs to the LDS. WE are israel more than them, all they are is jews.
you want to read up on who inherited the birthright. didn't joseph get it along the way? didn't it go to ephraim?

aren't I israel? aren't i physically transformed into Israel?

or is the birthright Judah exclusively?

lest we forget, only because they are republican, and god is a republican who loves peace and hates democrats because they want allow abortion and permit gay marriage

[Etosha]

"responsibility we have

we have no responsibility or obligation here

to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land "

I don't believe he said that!

[AussieOi]

"responsibility we have

we have no responsibility or obligation here

to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land "

I don't believe he said that!

sigh. OMD said or quoted

"If God has prophesied that the JEWS must return to Palestine, dedicated the land for this purpose, inspired millions of Jews to return, inspired world leaders to help in this return and the miraculous creation of the State of Israel, then does not this indicate to us the responsibility we have to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land and to help defend them against their enemies. Or shall we just sit back and let evil succeed? If so then he will “return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.”

And you said EXCELLENT!

So, this is the rub. Im assuming you and OMD are LDS right

On this basis, why are you so gullible to the propaganda?

Why do you think god needs us to fight his battles?

Why don't we just read gods proclamation in regards to fighting and "peace" and "defence from enemies"


D&C 98: 14


14 Therefore, be not afraid of your enemies, for I have decreed in my heart, saith the Lord, that I will prove you in all things, whether you will abide in my covenant, even unto death, that you may be found worthy.

16 Therefore, renounce war and proclaim peace, and seek diligently to turn the hearts of the children to their fathers, and the hearts of the fathers to the children;


32 Behold, this is the law I gave unto my servant Nephi, and thy afathers, Joseph, and Jacob, and Isaac, and Abraham, and all mine ancient prophets and apostles.

33 And again, this is the law that I gave unto mine ancients, that they should not go out unto battle against any nation, kindred, tongue, or people, save I, the Lord, commanded them.

(okay, just going through recent Ensign and GC talks to see if I missed any earthshattering announcements recently...nope)

So HOW can we work to protect Israel? and protect her from her enemies?

maybe By doing missionary work and converting them to Christ. oh, hang on

17 And again, the hearts of the Jews unto the prophets, and the prophets unto the Jews; lest I come and smite the whole earth with a curse, and all flesh be consumed before me.

Giving them bombs and machinery to subjugate the palestinians is Satans method

If the LDS will only every wake up, grow up, and embrace the celestial law, they will stop relying on the arm of flesh to protect them from enemies real, imagined or created

37 And I, the Lord, would fight their battles, and their children’s battles, and their children’s children’s, until they had avenged themselves on all their enemies, to the third and fourth generation.

38 Behold, this is an ensample unto all people, saith the Lord your God, for justification before me.



Alas, we don't like Sec98, we don't want to accept the lord at face value, we'd rather interpret what rating movies we should watch, or whether Cola is part of the Word of Wisdom, without actually recognising that the Word of Wisdom has 10 verses on what we SHOULD partake of, and 2 or 3 on what we should NOT. I love receiving Sunday School lessons on the WoW from mordibly obese non drinkers and non-smokers who abstain from coffee tee and tattoos.

Same as Its usually warmongers who want to "fight for peace"

[Mark]

ya dont think that maybe those who are blood israel might be what we call palestinians today? or must israel be a JEW with a yarmulke?

You have single-handedly contradicted what all the modern day Prophets have taught about the Jews in one fell swoop mate. ) I bet you think Yassar Arafat was just an inspired freedom fighter modeled after Captain Moroni and Hamas and Hezbollah are just in reality true patriot organizations fighting only for God and the defense of family and freedom from bondage. @-) Aussie your ignorance of reality knows no bounds.

[Mark]

you miss the forest for the trees, but you are an old man, and most old men are like old dogs, so i can't get through to you

but ok i'll let you humour me. just think. do you think satan might have gotten into israel like he got into the USA?

do you think maybe he controls the politicians, and gets them to do things to stir up people to make them HATE Israel? wow. never thought of that eh

He might be old mate but at least he still has a bit of common sense left in that frontal lobe section of his brain. (Unlike a certain un-named Aussie) Let me get this straight mate. The Israeli's just want to stir up all the billions of Muslims and their allies around the world so as to get them to all pledge Jihad against the Jewish nation to fulfill prophesy that the Jewish lands will be overrun and decimated.

But wait the real covenant house of Israel are actually the Palestinians and they are the ones who will be overcome by the armies of Gog and Magog and rescued by the power of the Lord thru the 2 latter day prophets? I'm so confused! (

[Silas]

We need to exercise a non-interventionist foreign policy even when it comes to Israel. They need to work out their issues with their neighbors that is not our job.

[reese]

"responsibility we have

we have no responsibility or obligation here

to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land "

I don't believe he said that!

sigh. OMD said or quoted

"If God has prophesied that the JEWS must return to Palestine, dedicated the land for this purpose, inspired millions of Jews to return, inspired world leaders to help in this return and the miraculous creation of the State of Israel, then does not this indicate to us the responsibility we have to help God’s covenant people to retain the promised land and to help defend them against their enemies. Or shall we just sit back and let evil succeed? If so then he will “return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.”

And you said EXCELLENT!

So, this is the rub. Im assuming you and OMD are LDS right

On this basis, why are you so gullible to the propaganda?

Why do you think god needs us to fight his battles?

Why don't we just read gods proclamation in regards to fighting and "peace" and "defence from enemies"


D&C 98: 14


14 Therefore, be not afraid of your enemies, for I have decreed in my heart, saith the Lord, that I will prove you in all things, whether you will abide in my covenant, even unto death, that you may be found worthy.

16 Therefore, renounce war and proclaim peace, and seek diligently to turn the hearts of the children to their fathers, and the hearts of the fathers to the children;


32 Behold, this is the law I gave unto my servant Nephi, and thy afathers, Joseph, and Jacob, and Isaac, and Abraham, and all mine ancient prophets and apostles.

33 And again, this is the law that I gave unto mine ancients, that they should not go out unto battle against any nation, kindred, tongue, or people, save I, the Lord, commanded them.

(okay, just going through recent Ensign and GC talks to see if I missed any earthshattering announcements recently...nope)

So HOW can we work to protect Israel? and protect her from her enemies?

maybe By doing missionary work and converting them to Christ. oh, hang on

17 And again, the hearts of the Jews unto the prophets, and the prophets unto the Jews; lest I come and smite the whole earth with a curse, and all flesh be consumed before me.

Giving them bombs and machinery to subjugate the palestinians is Satans method

If the LDS will only every wake up, grow up, and embrace the celestial law, they will stop relying on the arm of flesh to protect them from enemies real, imagined or created+1

37 And I, the Lord, would fight their battles, and their children’s battles, and their children’s children’s, until they had avenged themselves on all their enemies, to the third and fourth generation.

38 Behold, this is an ensample unto all people, saith the Lord your God, for justification before me.



Alas, we don't like Sec98, we don't want to accept the lord at face value, we'd rather interpret what rating movies we should watch, or whether Cola is part of the Word of Wisdom, without actually recognising that the Word of Wisdom has 10 verses on what we SHOULD partake of, and 2 or 3 on what we should NOT. I love receiving Sunday School lessons on the WoW from mordibly obese non drinkers and non-smokers who abstain from coffee tee and tattoos.

Same as Its usually warmongers who want to "fight for peace"

Aussie, I love it when you comment!

I am sure you are aware of the little "discrepancy" in the BofM where Nephi says that the jews will actually come to believe that Jesus is the Christ BEFORE they are restored to the lands of their inheritance.(2 Nephi10:5-8) And that is the gathering that the gentiles will assist in.

I read something interesting that Gileadi wrote, talking about a scipture in D&C that says Christ will come save the Jews at Jerusalem, and they will ask about the marks on His hands, and then they will know that He was the Christ, and they will mourn that their fathers crucified him. Obviously that contradicts the verses above in 2 Nephi.

Gileadi said that they don't contradict at all. He said there are two kinds of Jews in the last days(whom he identifies in Old Testament prophecies). Those who are among those converted at Jerusalem when the Lord comes to save them, after most are destroyed. And the Lord's elect who will believe that he is the Christ BEFORE they return to Jerusalem, after it is cleasned I assume.

Wouldn't it be ironic if the Palastinians are part of that humble group who will accept him as the Christ, who are protected "from the storm" as Isaiah says, and then given Jerusalem as their rightful inheritance!

[Mark]

Wouldn't it be ironic if the Palastinians are part of that humble group who will accept him as the Christ, who are protected "from the storm" as Isaiah says, and then given Jerusalem as their rightful inheritance!

Umm.. "Those who don't learn the lessons of history are condemned to repeat them."

http://christianactionforisrael.org/gogmagog.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The Approaching Battle for Jerusalem and the War of Gog and Magog
Source: The Temple Mount and Land of Israel Faithful Movement

As we have previously stated in our news-letter, Israel is now living in the most critical time in her history. On the one hand Israel is in the midst of her godly end-time redemption while on the other hand she is in the midst of the political and violent attacks of he Arab enemies in the Middle East together with their backing of many Islamic nations as well as their supporters all over the world led by the UN and the President of the United States, Bill Clinton.

Using the false and evil Oslo so-called "Peace" agreements, they cut off piece after piece from the body of the land of Israel and give them to the foreign so-called "Palestinian Authority" which was planted by them in the midst of the land of Israel and which grows like a cancer in the midst of the body of the Holy Land of Israel. These agreements were signed by the weak and secular government of Israel under the pressure of the above powers. Now these powers are putting pressure on Israel to give away more parts of the land and the main pressure is now on Jerusalem, the capital of the G d and people of Israel.

The terrorist and murderer, Yasser Arafat, has stated that there will never be peace and that he will renew the Intifada, the battle against Israel, unless Israel agrees to give him Jerusalem as the capital of a "Palestinian" state and give up her sovereignty over Jerusalem. More than this, he is demanding all the area of Judea, Samaria and Gaza to be immediately given to him and that on 13th September, or earlier, he will declare a "Palestinian" state in those areas with Jerusalem as its capital which he knows that the UN and all the nations will recognise. President Clinton is now acting to hold a summit in Washington DC together with the Prime Minister Barak and Yasser Arafat and there to put further pressure on Barak and force him to agree to Arafat's demands.

The agents of Arafat on the Temple Mount are now in the midst of an intensive, violent campaign to destroy and remove all the remains of the First and Second Temples and to change the identity of the Temple Mount into an Islamic site. They realise that, whether they want it or not, the Third Temple is going to be built on the Temple Mount as a major event in G d's end-time prophetic plans. By this barbaric violence against the G d and people of Israel they try to prevent this even through such a terrible revolt and violence against G d and His holy house. As we have stated, they bitter illusions if they think that they can succeed in doing so but it is a terrible sin and a shame for them and that the weak Israeli Government and everyone in the world allows them to do this.

In a speech which Arafat gave in Ramallah (the Biblical city of the Hill of G d, Givat Elohim, and was a Jewish city settled by Jews but occupied by the Arabs in 630 CE) he stated that he is ready for a war and that he is not afraid of the Israeli tanks and aircraft. The same threats of war are coming closer and closer to Israel from the north from the Hisb'allah terrorist organisation in Lebanon which has stated that their battle will not stop until they have occupied Jerusalem. The same spirit of war is coming form Syria, Iraq, Iran and Egypt, all these enemies of Israel who are preparing their weapons including nuclear, biological and chemical warheads and who are preparing their forces to destroy Israel. The UN and the European Union have stated on more than one occasion and made resolutions that Jerusalem is not the capital of Israel but occupied territory and that Israel should withdraw from Judea, Samaria, Gaza and the Golan Heights.

All of this brings Israelis to the conclusion that the time is very critical and that the prophecies of the prophet Ezekiel about the War of Gog and Magog against Israel and Zechariah's and other prophets' prophecies about the war of all the nations against the land of Israel and Jerusalem are soon to be fulfilled. Never since the foundation of the State of Israel in 1948 has Israel felt that the black clouds of this terrible war were so close to Jerusalem. This war will not be a simple war and Israel will pay a high price because of the sinful weakness over her leadership in signing false agreements with the agents of the devil and not with the G d of Israel. Zechariah states that half of the population of Jerusalem will go into exile. However, the Israelis, after great disappointment in the behaviour of their leadership, are coming closer to the G d of Israel and understanding that they can only trust in their One Father, the G d of Israel, Who saved has repeatedly saved them over the last 4000 years and Who will save them again now from all those powers and nations who will attack them and that He will severely judge all their enemies as He promised in His Word. "Son of man, set your face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him, And say, Thus says the Lord God: Behold, I am against you, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal; ... After many days you shall be called upon; in the latter years you shall come against the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered from many peoples, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste; but it is brought out from the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them. You shall ascend and come like a storm, you shall be like a cloud to cover the land, you, and all your bands, and many people with you. ... And you shall come up against my people of Israel, like a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring you against my land, that the nations may know me, when I shall be sanctified in you, O Gog, before their eyes. ... And it shall come to pass on that day, when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, says the Lord God, that my fury shall be roused. For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel; ... And I will contend with him by pestilence and by blood; and I will rain down upon him, and upon his bands, and upon the many people that are with him, a torrential rain, and great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will make myself known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the Lord. ... You shall fall upon the mountains of Israel, you, and all your bands, and the peoples that are with you; I will give you to the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured. ... And I will send a fire on Magog, and among those who dwell securely in the islands; and they shall know that I am the Lord. And I will make my holy name known in the midst of my people Israel; and I will not let them profane my holy name any more; and the nations shall know that I am the Lord, the Holy One in Israel." (Ezekiel 38:2,3,8,9,16,18,19,22,23; 39:4,6,7) "For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women raped; and half of the city shall go into exile, and the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city. Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. ... Behold, I will make Jerusalem a cup of reeling to all the people around, and it shall also be against Judah in the siege against Jerusalem. And on that day I will make Jerusalem a burdensome stone for all the peoples; all who burden themselves with it shall be grievously hurt. And all the peoples of the earth shall be gathered together against it. ... And the Lord shall be king over all the earth; on that day the Lord shall be one, and his name one. All the land shall be changed like the Arabah from Geba to Rimmon south of Jerusalem; and she shall be lifted up, and remain in her place, from the Gate of Benjamin to the place of the first gate, to the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananeel to the king's wine presses. ... And men shall dwell in it, and there shall be no more utter destruction; but Jerusalem shall dwell secure." (Zechariah 14:2,3;12:2,3,6,9; 14:9,11)

The prophet Zechariah states that the weapons (the nuclear, chemical and biological weapons) used against Israel will backfire and will hurt the enemies of Israel and not Israel: "And this shall be the plague with which the Lord will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their sockets, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth. And it shall come to pass on that day, that a great panic from the Lord shall be among them; and they shall lay hold everyone on the hand of his neighbour, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbour." (Zechariah 14:12,13)

We know that the coming time will not be an easy time in Israel. This will be the climax of all the end-time troubles which Israel through which Israel is now passing. Israel must trust in G d and be strong and, together with the G d of Israel, we will overcome these terrible events. The G d of Israel is determined to accomplish the redemption of Israel and all the universe and nothing can or will prevent Him.

The Temple Mount and Land of Israel Faithful Movement and all the others in Israel who are with the G d of Israel and who are in His army to serve and fight with all their devotion and dedication for Him and His end-time plans are ready to face these events and their challenges as they have been up to this time. We do not fear the enemies of the G d and people of Israel but only G d and we trust and love Him and we shall continue to serve Him and His prophetic plans with all the strength which He gave us.

We warn all the enemies of Israel and their allies all over the world that G d will severely judge and punish them because of their violence and there battles to destroy Israel.

To all the wonderful friends of Israel all over the world who decided to be with the G d and people of Israel at this great and critical time we send our sincerest thanks and love and the deep appreciation of the G d and people of Israel. Exactly as the prophets prophesied, you will be redeemed together with the people of Israel whom you love and support with such devotion. It is so good to know that, together with the G d of Israel, we have righteous friends and brothers and sisters like you who have placed themselves together with Israel at a time when it is so needed. You are an important sign, example and a great hope for this prophetic, godly time in which we are now living. Continue to be strong with the G d and people of Israel and the G d of Israel and the Universe will continue to bless you richly.

[reese]

Wouldn't it be ironic if the Palastinians are part of that humble group who will accept him as the Christ, who are protected "from the storm" as Isaiah says, and then given Jerusalem as their rightful inheritance!

Umm.. "Those who don't learn the lessons of history are condemned to repeat them."

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Mark I'm missing your point. I only read about 1/2 of what you posted, maybe it was in the 2nd half.

My point is that there are scriptures that say that the "jews" will come to believe that Jesus is the Christ BEFORE they return to the lands of their inheritance. That means that the jews that are there now are NOT the ones Nephi was talking about. Personally I could care less if the palistinians are the jews who will accept Christ. I do know enough however, not to assume anything when it comes to the Lord and His ways.