LDS Freedom Forum

Hello,
I have a question about trials and prayers being answered. I'm currently experiencing a trial. Let's say that for whatever reason, I'm supposed to experience this trial for 4 months. No matter how much I pray or fast to overcome this, it will continue for that long. Then what is the point of praying about it if His will is not to be for 4 months? I don't know if you see my point, but its something I think about while going through trials. Please excuse my infantile reasoning, but I am wanting insight on this.
Thanks!

Jamie

I think anyone who has experienced on-going trials feels the same way. Again, it's a matter of faith...expressing faith in the Lord, no matter the outcome. We know that He knows of our needs before we even ask. So we might think it's not necessary to ask. But when we do that, we are not acknowledging Him. We become fatalistic instead of faithful. Continuing to pray keeps us closer to the Lord than if we just ask one time and think that's enough.

The hardest part is doing things on the Lord's timetable instead of our own. Several times when I was in a desperate situation, the answer or solution to the problem never came until the last possible moment. That is indeed a trial of our faith. But "after the trial cometh the blessings". Patience has never been one of my virtues, but the Lord is doing everything He can to teach me patience.

We are going through something similar.

My wife has had a nerve problem for almost three years. I have given her a few priesthood blessings during that time, and on the most recent I felt the power of the priesthood so strongly that I expected her to be healed on the spot. I know her faith is not lacking, either, and she also has felt the prompting that she is "soon" to be healed completely but to be patient.

It is very VERY difficult as she is in pretty constant pain, we feel (know) that she is to be healed, but we also know that "soon" is relative and sometimes "soon" for the Lord is not soon for us. We try to figure out what we are meant to learn from this or what more needs to be done - the answer is always the same - stay faithful, it will happen and will be miraculous. Like you, it is VERY difficult to not feel like "if she is meant to be healed, then why not NOW? Why the need for the ongoing suffering?" and I have a hard time believing the Lord is having her go thru this simploy to learn to accept the Lord's timing.

I think that as far as why fast and pray for something when it is set to happen or not happen - I feel it is to acknowledge the Lord's hand in all things, to teach us to turn to Him and trust Him. But the training program can be tough!

Thank you both for your replies. You make it all seem so simple. I am a worry wart by nature and when experiencing trials it worsens and I let my day get ruined by my problems. I know He will not let me down, He never has. It won't be different this time around either. Its so easy to get burdened especially when we have to look to Him for basic needs.

My personal feeling on this question is this: Trials are a test to show the Lord many facets of our character and how we will rise to the occasion. It may be that healing is not in the sense that you understand it. My very personal belief is that all those who desire to follow Christ, must go through our own personal Gethsemanes. We must me tested and tried to strengthen our mettle. I am sorry that I don't know the whereabouts of this quote, but somewhere, Brigham Young (I think it was him) said that the Lord would test us pulling taut our heartstrings to the tightest they could be pulled and if we did not have strength to endure, ...I don't know it well enough to feel comfortable saying the ending. Surely, someone else will know this quote on this forum. Nevertheless, it is true, or at least my experience has taught me this. If I want to be like the Savior, if I want to live where he lives, if I want the honor of being in the Father's presence, then I must be proven in all things. Please remember with me that even Joseph Smith was put through an immense pressure of testing sometimes going for months without reprieve. I don't think that when trials come upon us, (if they are not caused by unrighteousness) are anything but a place along the road of life that we must learn to negotiate how we will deal with what is before us. Often, it is not until it is done that we can see the blessings.

I used part of my lengthy trial of 14 years determining to know the Savior better and filling my time with things that would bring me closer to Him...I grew tired and at one time, when I thought I could not do another thing to stay faithful, I actually told him that I had to back off. For 3 months, I thought of Him every day, but because of my pain, I could not pray so sure that every time I did another "bad" thing would happen to me...Lovingly, He brought me back. One day, during my cursory prayer, the Spirit rested upon me and I had an experience to let me know that He loved me, He knew I hurt, but staying away from Him was not the answer. It was THE hardest test I have ever been through, and I have often feared since then that I would be called to go through another of similar stretching. I have enjoyed about 6 years of peace, but I know, even though I have been faithful since then, that my faith must be tried and tested. I worry about my ability to stand the strain again, but hopefully, the intervening years have strengthened my "mettle".

Songbird wrote:I am sorry that I don't know the whereabouts of this quote, but somewhere, Brigham Young (I think it was him) said that the Lord would test us pulling taut our heartstrings to the tightest they could be pulled and if we did not have strength to endure, ...I don't know it well enough to feel comfortable saying the ending. Surely, someone else will know this quote on this forum.

John Taylor, in connection with this, said, "I heard the Prophet Joseph Smith say to the Twelve, 'You will have all kinds of troubles and trials to pass through. And it is quite as necessary for you to be tried, even as Abraham and other men of God.' And said he, 'God will feel after you and he will take hold of you and wrench your very heart strings. And if you cannot stand it, you will not be fit for an inheritance in the Celestial Kingdom of God.'" (John Taylor, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 24, p. 197.

The purpose of prayer and fasting is not to convince the Lord to give us what we want (like shortening a period of trial), but rather to align our will with his. It is important to make sure that we seek the spirit in our fasting and prayers so that we know what to ask for. In D&C 50:29-30 we read: "And if ye are purified and cleansed from all sin, ye shall ask whatsoever you will in the name of Jesus and it shall be done. But know this, it shall be given you what you shall ask."

Likewise we read in D&C 46:30 that, "He that asketh in the Spirit asketh according to the will of God; wherefore it is done even as he asketh." Nephi the son of Helaman exemplified this principle and because he was able to align his will exactly with the Lord's, he was promised that, "all things shall be done unto thee according to thy word, for thou shalt dnot ask that which is contrary to my will." (Hel 10:5)

Hang in there, and seek the Lord's will. If you truly surrender to his will, all things will work together for your good.

I have thought about this and struggled with it too, it can be a tough question - especially while the trial is still happening. :ymsigh: There are reasons for the trials, and reasons that they don't all disappear as soon as we would like. We may not see those reasons immediately - in fact in some cases we may not see them at all in this life - but the Lord does.

One key difference faith and trust in the Lord makes is that if we do pray/fast and stay close to the Lord, we can learn and grow a lot through our trials, even to the point that it is more than worth going through them because of those benefits. On the other hand, if we use the trials as an excuse to stop doing these things and distance ourselves from the Lord, we can't get much out of it. Again, it takes a lot of faith to keep in mind that it can all be for our benefit as long as we are faithful. Opposition and difficulty are often needed to receive the strengths, benefits, and abilities we need. This is true physically and mentally, so why not spiritually? Faith, along with many other spiritual strengths, can grow very quickly through and after trials, IF we stick with it, exercising what faith we have, "looking forward with an eye of faith to the fruit thereof". (Alma 32:40)

Christ suffered for more than our sins - He suffered everything, which means he knows exactly what we are going through, what we can handle, and what we need. He will not only help us endure those trials we must experience, He will also teach us how to get as much strength and experience out of them as possible, as long as we simply stay close to him. He is always there for us and He loves us, and He will not let us fall if we rely on Him.

CBentley wrote:

Songbird wrote:I am sorry that I don't know the whereabouts of this quote, but somewhere, Brigham Young (I think it was him) said that the Lord would test us pulling taut our heartstrings to the tightest they could be pulled and if we did not have strength to endure, ...I don't know it well enough to feel comfortable saying the ending. Surely, someone else will know this quote on this forum.

John Taylor, in connection with this, said, "I heard the Prophet Joseph Smith say to the Twelve, 'You will have all kinds of troubles and trials to pass through. And it is quite as necessary for you to be tried, even as Abraham and other men of God.' And said he, 'God will feel after you and he will take hold of you and wrench your very heart strings. And if you cannot stand it, you will not be fit for an inheritance in the Celestial Kingdom of God.'" (John Taylor, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 24, p. 197.

That's it!!! Thank you! I knew someone would know where it was. :ymapplause:

I love the question and believe it has been responded to beautifully. My only addition would be to offer, that if a trial only lasts 4 months, you might spend those four months expressing deep gratitude that God will walk with you, that the Savior bore it so you will be able to, and that it only lasts 4 months. I suspect it will beautify your soul more than anything else you have ever experienced in life. You have my thoughts and prayers as you are shaped and refined.

Although I do not look forwards to trials, I do enjoy the Lord working with me. I feel that every trial is in place to appreciate the non trial parts of our life. I also feel that our whole life is a trial, not in the scriptural sense but in the sense that every day is a trial of sorts. At times our trials are seemingly unbearable. I watched as my mother was eaten by cancer, in great pain everyday. It was a great trial for me in that I was her "nurse." I saw my mother in her very weakest moment in life, I always though my mother could take on anything. I watched as she suffered like I have seen no other suffer. I gained a great deal of compassion for her and others. I see in hindsight how difficult it was for her, my siblings, and myself. What a great blessing it was for me to be there in this most important part in her life. Other trials seem easy now, but they have not gone away just changed hats.

Childbirth was incredibly difficult for my wife, constantly ill, lots of weight gain on a little frame, heat, etc. What a blessing our children have been to us. I probably don't thank her enough for our children. Come to think of it, I probably haven't in such a frank way.

Each trial of faith, brings forth the blessing of heaven.

Ether 12:6And now, I, Moroni, would speak somewhat concerning these things; I would show unto the world that faith is things which are hoped for and not seen; wherefore, dispute not because ye see not, for ye receive no dwitness until after the etrial of your faith.

Thank you everyone. I have a lot to learn. I'm humbled by your insight and realize I can use this experience to grow closer to Him once again. Trials always seem so easy when you are on the other side of them looking back. And yes, I have always been thankful I experienced them....after I know it turned out okay. I guess its time for me to soul search and be ready to grow.

Much love dear brothers and sisters

Songbird wrote:That's it!!! Thank you! I knew someone would know where it was. :ymapplause:

Songbird,

Technically the quote was directed to the Twelve, something I had not considered until I read it in its context.

That being said, like you I'm still a believer that it applies to us, too.

President Joseph F. Smith, in his vision of the spirit world, saw "gathered together in one place an innumerable company of the spirits of the just, who had been faithful in the testimony of Jesus while they lived in mortality; And who had offered sacrifice in the similitude of the great sacrifice of the Son of God, and had suffered tribulation in their Redeemer's name" (D&C 138:12-13).

And the Lord told Joseph Smith that the Saints in Missouri were to be "chastened and tried, even as Abraham, who was commanded to offer up his only son. For all those who will not endure chastening, but deny me, cannot be sanctified" (D&C 101:4-5).

I'm hard-pressed to believe that those same passages don't apply to us. And if being tried as Abraham and offering a sacrifice in similitude of the Savior doesn't qualify has having our heartstrings wrenched, then I don't know what else does.

I certainly don't enjoy it when it's done to me, but the Lord keeps softening me with each experience, making me more fit to love and serve others.

I often remember a story about Hugh B Brown. toward the end of his life he had parkinson's. As he lay in a hospital bed, a friend came to see him, and asked him why he had to go through these trials, when he was an apostle and could do so much for the church. He answered, "I am being sanctified." No doubt he felt the need to continue praying for the strength to endure.

Great answers have been given. I can only add that our hearts must grow tender and compassionate toward others, and this will most likely happen by our own suffering coupled with fasting and prayer.

CBentley wrote:

Songbird wrote:That's it!!! Thank you! I knew someone would know where it was. :ymapplause:

Songbird,

Technically the quote was directed to the Twelve, something I had not considered until I read it in its context.

That being said, like you I'm still a believer that it applies to us, too.

President Joseph F. Smith, in his vision of the spirit world, saw "gathered together in one place an innumerable company of the spirits of the just, who had been faithful in the testimony of Jesus while they lived in mortality; And who had offered sacrifice in the similitude of the great sacrifice of the Son of God, and had suffered tribulation in their Redeemer's name" (D&C 138:12-13).

And the Lord told Joseph Smith that the Saints in Missouri were to be "chastened and tried, even as Abraham, who was commanded to offer up his only son. For all those who will not endure chastening, but deny me, cannot be sanctified" (D&C 101:4-5).

I'm hard-pressed to believe that those same passages don't apply to us. And if being tried as Abraham and offering a sacrifice in similitude of the Savior doesn't qualify has having our heartstrings wrenched, then I don't know what else does.

I certainly don't enjoy it when it's done to me, but the Lord keeps softening me with each experience, making me more fit to love and serve others.

Well, I did not know it applied to the twelve. It is sure quoted a lot. Anyway, while I am no where in their league, my heart has been stretched as if I thought it would break. While I am not currently in a "sore" trial, I am still trying to regain some of my spiritual footing from the stinging pain of the last one. I find I don't trust myself to be able to go through another "sore" trial and remain faithful. It was because the first one was so sore, that I have this feeling. Any insights to this would be greatly appreciated.

Songbird: I would recommend prayer and taking it one day at a time. If you haven't already, I would tell the Lord what you said here, and ask for the strength to face whatever comes your way.

The thing that I am learning is to trust the Lord. I really struggle with this, as my ability to trust anyone is very limited.

Nevertheless, even though my heart won't cooperate, my mind knows that this is the most important skill to develop in getting through life's rough spots.

I will pray for you Songbird! :ymhug:

Songbird wrote:Well, I did not know it applied to the twelve. It is sure quoted a lot. Anyway, while I am no where in their league, my heart has been stretched as if I thought it would break. While I am not currently in a "sore" trial, I am still trying to regain some of my spiritual footing from the stinging pain of the last one. I find I don't trust myself to be able to go through another "sore" trial and remain faithful. It was because the first one was so sore, that I have this feeling. Any insights to this would be greatly appreciated.

I hope I didn't come across wrong in my response. It is quoted a lot, and it's one that I've used many times and often reflect on myself.

When I went to go dig for the original quote, I noticed that it started off with this phrase by John Taylor: "I heard the Prophet Joseph Smith say to the Twelve," which is why I put it in my post as part of the quote.

I said it was directed to the Twelve, but I believe that it applies to all of us.

As for your being in their league or not, only the Lord knows your heart and what you are capable of. I'm sure you do better than you give yourself credit for. The fact that the first one was so sore speaks volumes about what the Lord thinks of you.

My experience is that the Lord gives us these trials so that we can confront all of the ugliness inside ourselves and through faith in Christ overcome it (Ether 12:27).

We feel like we don't deserve the trial, but looking back we begin to see that we needed it in order to overcome the weaknesses which keep us from growing.

Painful? Yes.

Desirable? No.

Necessary? Absolutely.

highfive wrote:I often remember a story about Hugh B Brown. toward the end of his life he had parkinson's. As he lay in a hospital bed, a friend came to see him, and asked him why he had to go through these trials, when he was an apostle and could do so much for the church. He answered, "I am being sanctified." No doubt he felt the need to continue praying for the strength to endure.

Great answers have been given. I can only add that our hearts must grow tender and compassionate toward others, and this will most likely happen by our own suffering coupled with fasting and prayer.

Your post made me think Elder Brown. He knew about adversity. His oldest son, Hugh Brown Jr. Was trained as a combat pilot near the beginning of WWII. His plane went down in the Atlantic and was never found. It would be easy for a General Authority to question why the Lord would allow him to lose his son.

I have benefited from the comments on this thread. I too am being dragged through a knot hole, but I am willing to admit my wife is correct when she tells me I am the worst patient on the planet. I hate to think about the education awaiting me. I have learned one trick that helps. That is to quit trying to solve things I cannot solve. That takes some of the stress out of it. I suppose it is human nature for us to ask the Lord to fix our problems even though we know we need the experience. My wife likes to say: "This too shall pass". Sometimes I hate that quote.

Songbird wrote:Well, I did not know it applied to the twelve. It is sure quoted a lot. Anyway, while I am no where in their league, my heart has been stretched as if I thought it would break. While I am not currently in a "sore" trial, I am still trying to regain some of my spiritual footing from the stinging pain of the last one. I find I don't trust myself to be able to go through another "sore" trial and remain faithful. It was because the first one was so sore, that I have this feeling. Any insights to this would be greatly appreciated.

I have learned that trials are opportunities. If we will look at them that way. I think it is a concious choice on our part, what a trial does for us. We will all have trials. But those that choose to make them an opportunity to "make an offering to God", will arrive on the other side of the trial closer to God. Those who fight it will not. Every trial is an opportunity to submit to Gods will, to prove we will, not just say we will.

Even the Savior did not want to go through His trial. He prayed to the Father asking if there was ANY other way the atonement could be accomplished. He could feel what was coming and it was scary. The key to all trials is what He did next. He said, nevertheless not my will, but thine be done. He submitted, as a child. Remember he was working out His salvation too. He had to prove Himself, through His sacrifice, as much as offer us salvation. We must reach the place where we will submit to God. We cannot hold anything back, because while we may be willing to sacrifice many things for the Lord, it is the one thing that we don't want to sacrifice, that He will ask for. This kind of sacrifice is meant to sanctify us. It is this kind of sacrifice that can bring us into His presence. But the only way to endure these kinds of sacrifices are to have our eyes squarely on the Lord and nothing else. We must cling to Him, as if our life depended upon it, because it does, eternally.

It all comes down to what you want. If you want everything God is offering us, you have to do it His way. There is no other way. It is hard. It has to be hard. But compared to what we can have in return, any sacrifice we make, is a pittance. We are getting by far, the better end of the deal. The whole point of any sacrifice is to submit our will to God.

I'm afraid to reply because then I'm going to get another really hard test to see if I mean what I say here.

My hardest trials have always not only preceded my greatest blessings, but have been a part of those blessings. I have become stronger, more confident, and more trusting in the Lord. I always hated when I was going through something difficult and someone would say, "have faith". They were right of course, but I was really fighting against the Lord's will. On the other hand, I don't believe all trials are the will of the Lord. Some trials happen because of sin... our sin and the sins of others that create a wake of suffering.

The thing I have faith in is that the Lord will assist me in all of my trials, and no matter how bad things are, I can not only survive, but I can have great joy in the process. As an added benefit, my personal relationship with the Savior is strengthened and in the future I have less fear. It's empowering to look back on things you've survived and to know you're at least that strong. I only wish I'd fought against it less, and had more joy.

loquaciousmomma wrote:Songbird: I would recommend prayer and taking it one day at a time. If you haven't already, I would tell the Lord what you said here, and ask for the strength to face whatever comes your way.

The thing that I am learning is to trust the Lord. I really struggle with this, as my ability to trust anyone is very limited.

Nevertheless, even though my heart won't cooperate, my mind knows that this is the most important skill to develop in getting through life's rough spots.

I will pray for you Songbird! :ymhug:

Dittoes LQM O:-) :ymhug:

ChelC wrote:On the other hand, I don't believe all trials are the will of the Lord. Some trials happen because of sin... our sin and the sins of others that create a wake of suffering.

I meant to correct what I said above about the Lord giving us trials. Like you, I don't mean to imply that bad things happen to us and it's because He gives them to us to grow from. I meant that He has set up the perfect laboratory of mortality, where through our own actions and because of the actions of others (both good and bad), we are able to be challenged in such a way that we are confronted with our own weaknesses to such a degree that the only way to overcome them all is to turn to God and rely on the Atonement.

Whether we cause them, others cause them, or they just happen, it's how we respond to them that will determine if we are drawing closer to God or not.

reese said it much better than I can.

I have learned that God would never allow me to have to endure something that isn't from my own stupidity or sin unless it was essential for my personal growth. He allows trials to happen that I don't chose so that I may grow. It comes from great love.
There are 3 kinds of trials
Those from our sins
those that are part of living here with a mortal body on a fallen earth
those that come from other people's sins.