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The only instance where I would forbid an individual from attending sacrament meeting is if they were openly threatening the safety of other church members (i.e. waving a gun around) or otherwise intentionally disrupting the meeting (yelling or screaming so no speaker can continue.) These instances are very extreme and infrequent.reese wrote:Alright all of you with experience in bishoprics, I have a question. Is there ever a time when someone could be forbidden to attend regular church meetings, especially sacrament meeting?
Depends if they're naked or not.reese wrote:Alright all of you with experience in bishoprics, I have a question. Is there ever a time when someone could be forbidden to attend regular church meetings, especially sacrament meeting?
What do you think? I am having a hard time believing that this is happening. But maybe I am missing something important here.3Nephi 18-
22 And behold, ye shall meet together oft; and ye shall not forbid any man from coming unto you when ye shall meet together, but suffer them that they may come unto you and forbid them not;
23 But ye shall pray for them, and shall not cast them out; and if it so be that they come unto you oft ye shall pray for them unto the Father, in my name.
24 Therefore, hold up your alight that it may shine unto the world. Behold I am the light which ye shall hold up—that which ye have seen me do. Behold ye see that I have prayed unto the Father, and ye all have witnessed.
25 And ye see that I have commanded that none of you should go away, but rather have commanded that ye should come unto me, that ye might feel and see; even so shall ye do unto the world; and whosoever breaketh this commandment suffereth himself to be led into temptation.
26 And now it came to pass that when Jesus had spoken these words, he turned his eyes again upon the Disciples whom he had chosen, and said unto them:
27 Behold verily, verily, I say unto you, I give unto you another commandment, and then I must go unto my Father that I may fulfil bother commandments which he hath given me.
28 And now behold, this is the commandment which I give unto you, that ye shall not suffer any one knowingly to partake of my flesh and blood unworthily, when ye shall minister it;
29 For whoso eateth and drinketh my flesh and ablood unworthily eateth and drinketh damnation to his soul; therefore if ye know that a man is unworthy to eat and drink of my flesh and blood ye shall forbid him.
30 Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out from among you, but ye shall minister unto him and shall pray for him unto the Father, in my name; and if it so be that he repenteth and is baptized in my name, then shall ye receive him, and shall minister unto him of my flesh and blood.
31 But if he repent not he shall not be numbered among my people, that he may not destroy my people, for behold I know my sheep, and they are numbered.
32 Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out of your synagogues, or your places of worship, for unto such shall ye continue to minister; for ye know not but what they will return and repent, and come unto me with full purpose of heart, and I shall heal them; and ye shall be the means of bringing salvation unto them.
33 Therefore, keep these sayings which I have commanded you that ye come not under condemnation; for wo unto him whom the Father condemneth.
34 And I give you these commandments because of the disputations which have been among you. And blessed are ye if ye have no disputations among you.
I would think that there is more to it than the ward knows about in general.reese wrote:Well a few weeks ago an individual announced during his testimony, that he is gay. Then in ward council we were informed that this man has been told he is walking on "very thin ice", and is in danger of not being allowed to attend our meetings any more. He is an excommunicated member, and has not been rebaptized because he disagrees with the church's stance on gays. Other than that he is fairly active in church attendance. He is now no longer allowed to sing in the choir, answer questions during preisthood/sunday school, and of course no longer share his testimony. In fact we were told to "tell the bishop" if he tries to make any comments in classes, and "not get into a fist fight with him over it during class".
Now I obviously think he was out of line to say what he did during fast and testimony meeting, but I am having a very hard time understanding the "threatening not to allow him to attend our meetings" approach that our bishop and stake pres. are taking. I too would say if peoples safety or ability to hear what is said, is being threatened then someone should not be allowed to attend, but this seems a bit harsh to me. Here are Christs own words concerning us NOT forbiding anyone to attend our meetings.What do you think? I am having a hard time believing that this is happening. But maybe I am missing something important here.3Nephi 18-
22 And behold, ye shall meet together oft; and ye shall not forbid any man from coming unto you when ye shall meet together, but suffer them that they may come unto you and forbid them not;
23 But ye shall pray for them, and shall not cast them out; and if it so be that they come unto you oft ye shall pray for them unto the Father, in my name.
24 Therefore, hold up your alight that it may shine unto the world. Behold I am the light which ye shall hold up—that which ye have seen me do. Behold ye see that I have prayed unto the Father, and ye all have witnessed.
25 And ye see that I have commanded that none of you should go away, but rather have commanded that ye should come unto me, that ye might feel and see; even so shall ye do unto the world; and whosoever breaketh this commandment suffereth himself to be led into temptation.
26 And now it came to pass that when Jesus had spoken these words, he turned his eyes again upon the Disciples whom he had chosen, and said unto them:
27 Behold verily, verily, I say unto you, I give unto you another commandment, and then I must go unto my Father that I may fulfil bother commandments which he hath given me.
28 And now behold, this is the commandment which I give unto you, that ye shall not suffer any one knowingly to partake of my flesh and blood unworthily, when ye shall minister it;
29 For whoso eateth and drinketh my flesh and ablood unworthily eateth and drinketh damnation to his soul; therefore if ye know that a man is unworthy to eat and drink of my flesh and blood ye shall forbid him.
30 Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out from among you, but ye shall minister unto him and shall pray for him unto the Father, in my name; and if it so be that he repenteth and is baptized in my name, then shall ye receive him, and shall minister unto him of my flesh and blood.
31 But if he repent not he shall not be numbered among my people, that he may not destroy my people, for behold I know my sheep, and they are numbered.
32 Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out of your synagogues, or your places of worship, for unto such shall ye continue to minister; for ye know not but what they will return and repent, and come unto me with full purpose of heart, and I shall heal them; and ye shall be the means of bringing salvation unto them.
33 Therefore, keep these sayings which I have commanded you that ye come not under condemnation; for wo unto him whom the Father condemneth.
34 And I give you these commandments because of the disputations which have been among you. And blessed are ye if ye have no disputations among you.
P.S. Shadow, he was definitley NOT naked when he made the " I'm gay" announcement.
Maybe, maybe not. The point it Christ was quite clear in us not forbidding anyone to attend our meetings. My husband knows this man from his hometown. When this man moved into our ward a few years ago, we of course knew about him, long before the bishopric knew anything. We have talked to him many times. I can't see any public behavior that should exempt him from attending church, aside from making his announcement, and that was dealt with. I am not "sympathizing" with this man. I am just concerned that we a disreguarding the Lord's words, and with such an air of "we will teach you a lesson!". Is there ever a time, besides someone's agency being infringed upon, that we are justified going agaisnt Christ's counsel on this in the Book of Mormon?NoGreaterLove wrote:I would think that there is more to it than the ward knows about in general.reese wrote:Well a few weeks ago an individual announced during his testimony, that he is gay. Then in ward council we were informed that this man has been told he is walking on "very thin ice", and is in danger of not being allowed to attend our meetings any more. He is an excommunicated member, and has not been rebaptized because he disagrees with the church's stance on gays. Other than that he is fairly active in church attendance. He is now no longer allowed to sing in the choir, answer questions during preisthood/sunday school, and of course no longer share his testimony. In fact we were told to "tell the bishop" if he tries to make any comments in classes, and "not get into a fist fight with him over it during class".
Now I obviously think he was out of line to say what he did during fast and testimony meeting, but I am having a very hard time understanding the "threatening not to allow him to attend our meetings" approach that our bishop and stake pres. are taking. I too would say if peoples safety or ability to hear what is said, is being threatened then someone should not be allowed to attend, but this seems a bit harsh to me. Here are Christs own words concerning us NOT forbiding anyone to attend our meetings.What do you think? I am having a hard time believing that this is happening. But maybe I am missing something important here.3Nephi 18-
22 And behold, ye shall meet together oft; and ye shall not forbid any man from coming unto you when ye shall meet together, but suffer them that they may come unto you and forbid them not;
23 But ye shall pray for them, and shall not cast them out; and if it so be that they come unto you oft ye shall pray for them unto the Father, in my name.
24 Therefore, hold up your alight that it may shine unto the world. Behold I am the light which ye shall hold up—that which ye have seen me do. Behold ye see that I have prayed unto the Father, and ye all have witnessed.
25 And ye see that I have commanded that none of you should go away, but rather have commanded that ye should come unto me, that ye might feel and see; even so shall ye do unto the world; and whosoever breaketh this commandment suffereth himself to be led into temptation.
26 And now it came to pass that when Jesus had spoken these words, he turned his eyes again upon the Disciples whom he had chosen, and said unto them:
27 Behold verily, verily, I say unto you, I give unto you another commandment, and then I must go unto my Father that I may fulfil bother commandments which he hath given me.
28 And now behold, this is the commandment which I give unto you, that ye shall not suffer any one knowingly to partake of my flesh and blood unworthily, when ye shall minister it;
29 For whoso eateth and drinketh my flesh and ablood unworthily eateth and drinketh damnation to his soul; therefore if ye know that a man is unworthy to eat and drink of my flesh and blood ye shall forbid him.
30 Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out from among you, but ye shall minister unto him and shall pray for him unto the Father, in my name; and if it so be that he repenteth and is baptized in my name, then shall ye receive him, and shall minister unto him of my flesh and blood.
31 But if he repent not he shall not be numbered among my people, that he may not destroy my people, for behold I know my sheep, and they are numbered.
32 Nevertheless, ye shall not cast him out of your synagogues, or your places of worship, for unto such shall ye continue to minister; for ye know not but what they will return and repent, and come unto me with full purpose of heart, and I shall heal them; and ye shall be the means of bringing salvation unto them.
33 Therefore, keep these sayings which I have commanded you that ye come not under condemnation; for wo unto him whom the Father condemneth.
34 And I give you these commandments because of the disputations which have been among you. And blessed are ye if ye have no disputations among you.
P.S. Shadow, he was definitley NOT naked when he made the " I'm gay" announcement.
This can definately create a problem. All are welcome to come into the Lords church and attend meetings humbly; even enemies of the church are welcome if they don't seek to disrupt or destroy and humbly seek understanding. Respect goes both ways, so if someone comes to church and respects the Lord's church and doctrines (reverence, even if it's only while they attend) I believe they should always be welcome.He is an excommunicated member, and has not been rebaptized because he disagrees with the church's stance on gays. Other than that he is fairly active in church attendance.