Why I Look Forward to the Coming Collapse

[SwissMrs&Pitchfire]

I meet fear in every conversation about these things with friends and family, and yet I no longer feel it. Why? (Why) should we die before our journeys through (should it be a) happy day all is well?

I have heard statements like "I wanna catch the bomb." We don't have food strorage because we want to be the first to die, we're gonna run towards the blast!"

We then are free from toil and sorrow too! I think far too many are looking forward to these times and seing only the sunset.

I look forward to that glorious sunrise! I had this conversation with my father and my young men and expressed my feelings as follows.

Suppose you were watching a movie which pitted good versus evil. Towards the end at the pivotal crux in the story line in which evil seemingly triumphs, well, who would walk out of the theater then satisfied without waiting to see the glorious conquering victory of the good?

I told the young men that if they could pick any part of the ongoing film to watch in person, that they likely would and did pick this exact moment in time. As many patriarchal blessings say they were PERMITTED to see it.

I once had a coveted ticket at a trade show for an event in high demand and was told that the ticket was worth it's weight in gold. If so than I fail to find a suitable analogy for this front row seat! I am filled with nothing but excitement.

I know what Brigham Yound said about praying that it come too soon and no one being there for it because none of us make it, but... I look around at this wicked world and blinders now removed can see that all is definately not well in Zion!

We are as wicked as they have and do come, fully ripe in iniquity, and on our way to a big humbling! I do not glory in the downfall of so many (possibly me included) but then what kind of heaven would it be without the cleansing for those who inherit it?

I glory in the coming glory, in paradisical glory, in brotherly love, in the united order, in Adam-ondi-ahmen, in the return of those lost, in the fully blossomed Lamanites, in the reunion with children lost, in a beautiful Jerusalem, in supping with those of days past, in the glorious return of the Savior. I glory in the re/institution of good government, the best government. I anxiously await the days of the lion and lamb together, in advancements that will make our heads spin.

How can we be so deceived as to miss this point when the contrast to our day is so stark?

[SwissMrs&Pitchfire]

Of course we realize the horror to come, but the question is whether the fruit at the other side is worth the journey through the mists of darkness to reach it. Nephi says yes, and I believe him.

[sally]

I agree with you. Since I have found out about what the government is doing, I have found out how much each of us is needed to fight for freedom. I am thankful for having a cause truely worth fighting for. It is exillerating. I have become kinder to those around me, say more meaningful prayers and try to improve myself more so that I can be up to the task.

[79scholar]

I know your frustration and fearlessness.

When presenting the scenario to my own father, his response was effectively "let me just die then." This attitude of apathy comes from the adversary, and is very similar to the happy Disney bubble of "all is well in Zion" that prevails in every Relief Society meeting (heaven forbid anyone speak of anything negative there!)

The most damning thing about the "all is well in Zion" happy Disney bubble, is that it causes temple-attending members to disbelieve the prophecies of the scriptures they know to be true.

Hence why Nephi said that only in the Last Days will people understand the words of Isaiah ... as they are fulfilled. (note: 2 Nephi 12-24 is a timeline from now until Millennium. The collapse begins in chapter 13.)

We as a nation and church are ripening in iniquity unless we repent and remember the prophecies in the Book of Mormon and look forward to the Second Coming. Once we are fully ripe, 2 Nephi chapter 13 will occur. This will probably happen in about ten years, starting with the economic collapse.

[SwissMrs&Pitchfire]

I think that the economic downturn is here. Arguments can be made both ways. I think a lot of the traditional indicators cannot be used now. They provide a picture of corporate wealth, but much of that comes through outsourcing, hiring of illegal immigrants (which is ignored despite isolated prosecutions), corporate welfare etc... The true costs are to be seen in the real cost of living. Even consumer spending and consumer credit can be misleading. Much of that is dictated by the previous factors and their (consumers) flawed perception of the "economy." Bankruptcys are no longer as good an indicator as it now requires more time and is more difficult thus cannot be looked at compared to earlier figures.

How much wealth does the war bring in (Haliburton etc...) that is reported and yet never "trickles down."

I would not be surprised to find ourselves at the pit of a depression with all of the traditional ecomonic indicators brightly beeming prosperity as the Chinese and UAE, Spanish, U.S. offshore, and their U.S. subsidiaries et al. briskly rake in the take.

I know of at least two big Utah businesses that employ 90+% illegal immigrants and show good profit for the owners. One may be publicly traded, not sure, the other I doubt, but the same principle applies across the board.

Point being traditional indicators only apply in traditional circumstances.

[79scholar]

Actually I was wrong- the economic collapse is in 2 Nephi 12:20, not chapter 13. Close enough.

I've been pondering much about the economy ... and here's what I've come up with:

The adversary does NOT want a 'famine' (or economic famine) before the economic collapse. He knows that such would wake up the Saints and rupture his plans to carefully lead them down the path of "all is well in Zion."

According to all the prophecies and signs I have studied, the great calamities (starting with the economic collapse) should begin in about 10 years, plus or minus 4 years. Until then what you will see is a further gradualization in socializing America. Republican or Democratic President ... doesn't matter - both will go toward this goal.

[SwissMrs&Pitchfire]

If however he can snag most of them in the dependence and debt traps that he has crafted, he can spring his trap at any time. We are always a change in the global wind away from devalued currency.

It is the spirit of speculation that leads to the eventual bondage, I could certainly be wrong but I see that as having just peaked. Perhaps oil will continue to drop, home prices and sales will speed back up, interest rates will go back down, and hiring will increase. I am very sceptical and admit it is hard for me to imagine the scenerio playing out that way. I do hope I am wrong however in that the amount of people waking up give me some hope that others will follow.

[79scholar]

If however he can snag most of them in the dependence and debt traps that he has crafted, he can spring his trap at any time. We are always a change in the global wind away from devalued currency.

It is the spirit of speculation that leads to the eventual bondage, I could certainly be wrong but I see that as having just peaked. Perhaps oil will continue to drop, home prices and sales will speed back up, interest rates will go back down, and hiring will increase. I am very sceptical and admit it is hard for me to imagine the scenerio playing out that way. I do hope I am wrong however in that the amount of people waking up give me some hope that others will follow.

Good point. Then again, according to what we see in America today, debt and prosperity are not mutually exclusive!
(we're the most "prosperous" nation in the world and yet we're continually racking more debt)

[SwissMrs&Pitchfire]

Oh the dangerous web we weave! That is very true and a very precarious situation to be in. Just I'm sure where satan would want us. Thus all of the admonitions for debt free independence and self-sufficiency.

[Eulate]

There has to be an economic collapse after the current moral collapse. 2020 might be the year. I recommend to watch the first 9 minutes:

https://youtu.be/B6fhZzONZBc

[justme]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

[ori]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

It’s hilarious. Each day it seems, an additional years-old thread is resurrected. Not sure why.

[justme]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

It’s hilarious. Each day it seems, an additional years-old thread is resurrected. Not sure why.

Well we can say with certainty that we are 13 years closer to the end.

[Davka]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

There were 33 years between the initial sign of Christ’s birth and the destruction of the Nephites. Guaranteed “the believers” were told they were crazy many, many times.

Did you read the original post? It was a beautiful statement of hope! Why not look forward to that wonderful day rather than telling those who are to stop?

[justme]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

There were 33 years between the initial sign of Christ’s birth and the destruction of the Nephites. Guaranteed “the believers” were told they were crazy many, many times.

Did you read the original post? It was a beautiful statement of hope! Why not look forward to that wonderful day rather than telling those who are to stop?

Mea Culpa. I agree with you about the original post. I will continue to shake my head at those who run around looking for every false prophet they can find on Youtube and doing endless dubious calendrical calculations. I would rather live for the day and find what joy is possible while preparing myself for the second coming when it does eventually happen. "Live as if it is tomorrow but still plant cherry trees"

[mahalanobis]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

It’s hilarious. Each day it seems, an additional years-old thread is resurrected. Not sure why.

It's fascinating to me to read these old posts. It adds perspective.

It's also interesting to see the thoughts of people who have long since left the forum. Maybe they got a better hobby or just got sick of the relentless church-wide-apostacy claims.

[JK4Woods]

The Saints at the turn of the 19th century to the 20th century had many crying the sky is falling.

World War I had many cry it’s the end.

The Spanish Flu epidemic of 1918 again brought the sky down as the end of the earth.

Then WW II, good grief .. that one really had the whole world in commotion with war everywhere...

Then we had Korea, Vietnam, Cold War against communism. Then against Al Qaeda ....

So we’ve had 100 years of substantial events that meet requirements of ancient prophecies as end-of-the-world fulfillment’s....

Yet we are still here.... muddling along in our excrutiating human way...

And current church leadership has remade the whole preparedness program into getting more education and upward job mobility.... no more starvation and epidemics or other horrific vision ahead for current leadership.

Maybe because every financially prosperous church leader is self convinced that their righteousness has brought them wealth so the end of days is far far in the future.

(Personally I think it’s because of the old guys who lived thru the early turmoil of the 20 th century had pretty good grounding in set backs and want.

Nowadays, the younger set of leaders have only un relatable anecdotal stories in which they place no commonality with the great first world lifestyle experienced along the Wasatch front).

Personally, while there is evidence that Satan has been marshaling his forces for horrific things to come... and horrific prophetic events may be fulfilled.... we really may not experience the Second Coming for hundred and hundreds of years.... notwithstanding the incesssnt calculations of dates here an lo... dates there...

[Durzan]

The Mormon states isn’t the entirety or even the majority of the church. It’s no longer accurate to use it as the sole measuring stick for the entire body of the saints.

[harakim]

The Mormon states isn’t the entirety or even the majority of the church. It’s no longer accurate to use it as the sole measuring stick for the entire body of the saints.

I don't know if that's true if you are talking about active members.

[Juliet]

The Saints at the turn of the 19th century to the 20th century had many crying the sky is falling.

World War I had many cry it’s the end.

The Spanish Flu epidemic of 1918 again brought the sky down as the end of the earth.

Then WW II, good grief .. that one really had the whole world in commotion with war everywhere...

Then we had Korea, Vietnam, Cold War against communism. Then against Al Qaeda ....

So we’ve had 100 years of substantial events that meet requirements of ancient prophecies as end-of-the-world fulfillment’s....

Yet we are still here.... muddling along in our excrutiating human way...

And current church leadership has remade the whole preparedness program into getting more education and upward job mobility.... no more starvation and epidemics or other horrific vision ahead for current leadership.

Maybe because every financially prosperous church leader is self convinced that their righteousness has brought them wealth so the end of days is far far in the future.

(Personally I think it’s because of the old guys who lived thru the early turmoil of the 20 th century had pretty good grounding in set backs and want.

Nowadays, the younger set of leaders have only un relatable anecdotal stories in which they place no commonality with the great first world lifestyle experienced along the Wasatch front).

Personally, while there is evidence that Satan has been marshaling his forces for horrific things to come... and horrific prophetic events may be fulfilled.... we really may not experience the Second Coming for hundred and hundreds of years.... notwithstanding the incesssnt calculations of dates here an lo... dates there...

There are more signs of the times in nature every single day. I read the book of revelations when I was a girl. None of that stuff was happening. But now? Yes. Men blaspheming God because of the heat, buildings zapped and trees still standing (cough, California), fish dying and a mountain fell into the sea and killed the animals in the sea (Fukushima), the sun is 20 percent less bright because of chemtrails now a days. And I haven't seen a good set of stars because of city light pollution. Also we have had blood moons, earthquakes, the polar vortex and the jet stream offplaced so far you would think the earth is reeling like a drunkard. Most of all, people are saying that God is delaying His coming until the end of the earth.

The only thing I don't know is, that Jesus said the end of the world is the end of the wicked. So was He speaking in a literary sense, that when we have the wicked desires of our hearts plucked out, then will be the second coming as our own wicked natures are burned away? (As opposed to God striking the neighbor down the street that I always knew wasn't going to cut it)

[gruden2.0]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

It's interesting to read them, I joined the site at the time SM&P was posting. It's a very salient post, as 2 years afterward the economy very nearly collapsed. Maybe it's a good reminder to look at where we're at and consider what is coming.

The near-collapse in late 2008 was caused by Lehman Brothers' implosion, the fourth-largest investment bank in America. Treasury Sec. Hank Paulson stood before Congress and warned (threatened?) them with the specter of martial law if they didn't pass TARP, handing over untold billions of taxpayer money to bail out banks teetering on the verge of collapse due to the mountains of bad mortgage-backed securities they held, as well as pulling companies like AIG, GM, and Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac out of the fire to avoid catastrophic losses.

The Federal Reserve basically papered over the sea of red with a deluge of money to keep the system running. And here we are, 11 years later, seemingly afloat but has the danger passed? Deutsche Bank is teetering, will it be the new Lehman? Or possibly General Electric? There's really nothing to feel smug about looking back to those posts, there's some important things we should be thinking about still.

The one thing I disagreed with in SM&P's post then and now is the idea of looking forward to the collapse. There is nothing that will be remotely enjoyable about it for anyone, there will be intense suffering on ALL sides. We will all suffer intense losses and hardships as the Lord strips this land bare, paring it back to a place where a small group of people willing to listen and work together can inhabit. If you're a male, your chances of survival are very small; if you're female, your chances of survival are higher but you will go through excruciating situations you couldn't have imagined in your worst nightmares. It's nothing to look forward to, but a good opportunity for contemplation.

[GrandMasterB]

The Saints at the turn of the 19th century to the 20th century had many crying the sky is falling.

World War I had many cry it’s the end.

The Spanish Flu epidemic of 1918 again brought the sky down as the end of the earth.

Then WW II, good grief .. that one really had the whole world in commotion with war everywhere...

Then we had Korea, Vietnam, Cold War against communism. Then against Al Qaeda ....

So we’ve had 100 years of substantial events that meet requirements of ancient prophecies as end-of-the-world fulfillment’s....

Yet we are still here.... muddling along in our excrutiating human way...

And current church leadership has remade the whole preparedness program into getting more education and upward job mobility.... no more starvation and epidemics or other horrific vision ahead for current leadership.

Maybe because every financially prosperous church leader is self convinced that their righteousness has brought them wealth so the end of days is far far in the future.

(Personally I think it’s because of the old guys who lived thru the early turmoil of the 20 th century had pretty good grounding in set backs and want.

Nowadays, the younger set of leaders have only un relatable anecdotal stories in which they place no commonality with the great first world lifestyle experienced along the Wasatch front).

Personally, while there is evidence that Satan has been marshaling his forces for horrific things to come... and horrific prophetic events may be fulfilled.... we really may not experience the Second Coming for hundred and hundreds of years.... notwithstanding the incesssnt calculations of dates here an lo... dates there...

There are more signs of the times in nature every single day. I read the book of revelations when I was a girl. None of that stuff was happening. But now? Yes. Men blaspheming God because of the heat, buildings zapped and trees still standing (cough, California), fish dying and a mountain fell into the sea and killed the animals in the sea (Fukushima), the sun is 20 percent less bright because of chemtrails now a days. And I haven't seen a good set of stars because of city light pollution. Also we have had blood moons, earthquakes, the polar vortex and the jet stream offplaced so far you would think the earth is reeling like a drunkard. Most of all, people are saying that God is delaying His coming until the end of the earth.

The only thing I don't know is, that Jesus said the end of the world is the end of the wicked. So was He speaking in a literary sense, that when we have the wicked desires of our hearts plucked out, then will be the second coming as our own wicked natures are burned away? (As opposed to God striking the neighbor down the street that I always knew wasn't going to cut it)

You lost me at chemtrail.

[BeNotDeceived]

This post on the coming collapse is 13 years old.

Prolly shoulda crarshed way before now, but 7rs prosperity has a few remaining.

Then Doom on, but not yet.