President Nelson visits New Zealand

[shadow]

Look where "Follow the Prophet" and "We cannot lead you Astray" has taken some people.

They are stuck defending ISLAM and ISLAMIC beliefs. They are defending the COVERING UP of paintings of Jesus Christ for Muslims to pray to their God(Our God is a jealous God by the way). They are defending the payment of monies to a Religion that kills Christians because their God tells them to.

Goodness Gracious. At this point, can I really say anything to dissuade them?

Nobody has defended islam and islamic beliefs. Don't be so dramatic

[Zathura]

Look where "Follow the Prophet" and "We cannot lead you Astray" has taken some people.

They are stuck defending ISLAM and ISLAMIC beliefs. They are defending the COVERING UP of paintings of Jesus Christ for Muslims to pray to their God(Our God is a jealous God by the way). They are defending the payment of monies to a Religion that kills Christians because their God tells them to.

Goodness Gracious. At this point, can I really say anything to dissuade them?

Nobody has defended islam and islamic beliefs. Don't be so dramatic

My wife does like to call me drama queen

[captainfearnot]

Look where "Follow the Prophet" and "We cannot lead you Astray" has taken some people.

For me it's not about defending Islam or following the prophet. I just like being part of a pluralistic society.

[nvr]

From Religion News:

https://religionnews.com/2019/05/20/new ... r-mormons/

"For his part, Nelson sounds like he was a bit bowled over by everything Ardern has achieved. (Jacindamania is a real thing, even for a guy more than half a century her senior.) He singled out her compassionate, strong leadership in the aftermath of the Christchurch attacks and offered some thoughts on her multiple roles:

She’s courageous. The world will discover they’ve got a real leader here. It’s an unlikely scenario, a young mother leading a great nation, a peacemaker, a policymaker, a consensus-builder. We’re very confident she’ll have a great future."

It seems like removing firearms from a populace should disqualify a person from being considered a strong leader. Well, maybe they are strong in the sense of Mao, Stalin, Hitler, or Chavez.

[JK4Woods]

The previous day we welcomed President Nelson to Australia, we did not expect, ask for, nor receive financial assistance. Islam is the Church of Lucifer. I find it offensive to in any way support Muslims, financially or otherwise.

That is your opinion. I have several wonderful friends who are Muslim. They are more devout to God than some members of our church.

Picture the Book of Mormon.
Now Picture the Lamanites forming an organized religion, rather than the disorganized belief in some "Great Spirit" that they have in the BoM.
Picture the Lamanite religion believing what Muslims believe. Picture a solid 20% of them being extreme. More than extreme, extremely extreme. Picture a huge chunk of the rest of them, at least 50% don't practice what the extreme ones practice, but they support the unrighteous teachings that the extreme lamanites are spreading with fire and war.

Now picture Nephi, Alma, Mosiah visiting them and giving them money to put into the building of their abominable churches. Picture Alma allowing those Lamanites into his home. Picture Alma covering a picture of Jesus Christ so that the Lamanites could pray to their own God without feeling offended by the presence of any worship of the Son of God(Jesus Christ).

Nah. I also find it offensive.

It's just money my friend. Money is not doctrine, it's just something temporal. If this can bring more Muslim's to have a more positive experience with the Church then it's a means to an end. The next great wave of converts will come from the Muslim faith.

What does Lucifer say in the Garden of Eden?
“I will use gold and silver and the treasures of the earth to buy up armies and navies and rule with blood and horror on the earth...”

Think money is immaterial..??
It’s the medium where Satan carries forward his nefarious plan.

What did the early Apotles do..?? “... travel without purse or scrip...” depending on God in Heaven to provide day by day.

Don’t ever think money is benign.

[setyourselffree]

That is your opinion. I have several wonderful friends who are Muslim. They are more devout to God than some members of our church.

Picture the Book of Mormon.
Now Picture the Lamanites forming an organized religion, rather than the disorganized belief in some "Great Spirit" that they have in the BoM.
Picture the Lamanite religion believing what Muslims believe. Picture a solid 20% of them being extreme. More than extreme, extremely extreme. Picture a huge chunk of the rest of them, at least 50% don't practice what the extreme ones practice, but they support the unrighteous teachings that the extreme lamanites are spreading with fire and war.

Now picture Nephi, Alma, Mosiah visiting them and giving them money to put into the building of their abominable churches. Picture Alma allowing those Lamanites into his home. Picture Alma covering a picture of Jesus Christ so that the Lamanites could pray to their own God without feeling offended by the presence of any worship of the Son of God(Jesus Christ).

Nah. I also find it offensive.

It's just money my friend. Money is not doctrine, it's just something temporal. If this can bring more Muslim's to have a more positive experience with the Church then it's a means to an end. The next great wave of converts will come from the Muslim faith.

What does Lucifer say in the Garden of Eden?
“I will use gold and silver and the treasures of the earth to buy up armies and navies and rule with blood and horror on the earth...”

Think money is immaterial..??
It’s the medium where Satan carries forward his nefarious plan.

What did the early Apotles do..?? “... travel without purse or scrip...” depending on God in Heaven to provide day by day.

Don’t ever think money is benign.

When the Church starts buying armies and navies to rule with horror then we can talk about this.

[shadow]

What does Lucifer say in the Garden of Eden?
“I will use gold and silver and the treasures of the earth to buy up armies and navies and rule with blood and horror on the earth...”

Think money is immaterial..??
It’s the medium where Satan carries forward his nefarious plan.

What did the early Apotles do..?? “... travel without purse or scrip...” depending on God in Heaven to provide day by day.

Don’t ever think money is benign.

When the church starts ruling with blood and horror, let me know.

Also, the apostles relied on the members for an income. This is OT and NT stuff. Joseph Smith even relied on the church and made sure that Bishops were paid, along with council members and patriarchs- all paid out of church coffers.

We all use money, you too. It's the intent you use it with that matters.

[Elizabeth]

Islam is Lucifers Church. Anyone who professes to be a Muslim and follows the Koran is an enemy to any Christian and non Muslim and to their countries. The Koran encourages Muslims to kill anyone who does not agree with their "religion" and to lie whenever it suits them to further that cause. ALL Muslims should be sent to a Muslim country and refused entry to non Muslim countries.

[Sunain]

Prime Minister Arden supports homosexuals, muslims, refugee immigration, is an unmarried mother living with the father of her baby... even though she attended BYU and was raised LDS.

He singled out her compassionate, strong leadership in the aftermath of the Christchurch attacks and offered some thoughts on her multiple roles: She’s courageous. The world will discover they’ve got a real leader here. It’s an unlikely scenario, a young mother leading a great nation, a peacemaker, a policymaker, a consensus-builder. We’re very confident she’ll have a great future."

She supports gun control, abortion and mass surveillance as well. These and the ideals in the quote above are all statutes of Satan. There is nothing righteous about her currently. No wonder President Nelson gave her a Book of Mormon. He's giving her a pretty big hint that she needs to read it. I believe this is a direct prophetic warning to her, one she should not ignore.

[setyourselffree]

Islam is Lucifers Church. Anyone who professes to be a Muslim and follows the Koran is an enemy to any Christian and non Muslim and to their countries. The Koran encourages Muslims to kill anyone who does not agree with their "religion" and to lie whenever it suits them to further that cause. ALL Muslims should be sent to a Muslim country and refused entry to non Muslim countries.

The Old Testament does the same thing. In fact if you cross reference all versus in Quran vs the Old Testament the OT condones violence much more. Have you read the Quran? How much do you actually know of the Muslim religion?

[Elizabeth]

I have read Jihad Watch, and some news of Islamic violence which has received media coverage.
That is more than enough.

Islam is Lucifers Church. Anyone who professes to be a Muslim and follows the Koran is an enemy to any Christian and non Muslim and to their countries. The Koran encourages Muslims to kill anyone who does not agree with their "religion" and to lie whenever it suits them to further that cause. ALL Muslims should be sent to a Muslim country and refused entry to non Muslim countries.

How much do you actually know of the Muslim religion?

[Fiannan]

The Old Testament does the same thing. In fact if you cross reference all versus in Quran vs the Old Testament the OT condones violence much more. Have you read the Quran? How much do you actually know of the Muslim religion?

Everyone should read the Koran.

[sushi_chef]

"prophetic warning" ?!
`

(2:03~ month of june)
~
isnt he maori elder lds?!
`
""A terrible earthquake is going to hit Wellington. I have seen body bags in the streets of Wellington. I have seen houses on the hills of Wellington – seen them disappear. I have seen the roof of the Beehive lying in the debris of the streets of Wellington... month of june"
http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/46 ... eventually


~

[Muslim Brother]

The equivalent would be this:

Do you believe in God, that great Creator?

-I believe in a great Allah, is this what you mean?

Yes, that Allah is Jesus Christ.


These conversations with Muslims don't go this way. Instead of showing them that the picture of Jesus Christ IS ALLAH, they cover the picture of Christ and let them worship another God.

Muslims believe in one, unique, incomparable God, Who has no son nor partner, and that none has the right to be worshipped but Him alone. He is the true God, and every other deity is false. He has the most magnificent names and sublime perfect attributes. No one shares His divinity, nor His attributes. In the Quran, God describes Himself:

Say, “He is God, the One. God, to Whom the creatures turn for their needs. He begets not, nor was He begotten, and there is none like Him.” (Quran, 112:1-4)

No one has the right to be invoked, supplicated, prayed to, or shown any act of worship, but God alone.

On the other hand, Muslims respect and revere Jesus (peace be upon him). They consider him one of the greatest of God’s messengers to mankind. The Quran confirms his virgin birth, and a chapter of the Quran is entitled ‘Maryam’ (Mary). During his prophetic mission, Jesus performed many miracles.

Neither Muhammad nor Jesus came to change the basic doctrine of the belief in one God, brought by earlier prophets, but rather to confirm and renew it.

[Muslim Brother]

Islam is Lucifers Church. Anyone who professes to be a Muslim and follows the Koran is an enemy to any Christian and non Muslim and to their countries. The Koran encourages Muslims to kill anyone who does not agree with their "religion" and to lie whenever it suits them to further that cause. ALL Muslims should be sent to a Muslim country and refused entry to non Muslim countries.

Interesting perspective

[Muslim Brother]

I have read Jihad Watch, and some news of Islamic violence which has received media coverage.
That is more than enough.

Do not study the Quran deeply. Best to rely on websites that cherry pick verses out of context to make their point, or weave together the most offensive quotations available from Imams or rulings of Islamic jurors over time. How hard can it be to grasp the ins and outs of a 1500-year-old religious tradition whose texts are written mostly in languages you don’t understand, which spans countries and continents and has billions of adherents? Judaism could be well understood after several hours on anti-Semitic websites, right? And Atheist websites would be a great guide to the history of Christianity? Right. So stick to anti-Islam websites for your information. What could go wrong?

[thestock]

The equivalent would be this:

Do you believe in God, that great Creator?

-I believe in a great Allah, is this what you mean?

Yes, that Allah is Jesus Christ.


These conversations with Muslims don't go this way. Instead of showing them that the picture of Jesus Christ IS ALLAH, they cover the picture of Christ and let them worship another God.

Muslims believe in one, unique, incomparable God, Who has no son nor partner, and that none has the right to be worshipped but Him alone. He is the true God, and every other deity is false. He has the most magnificent names and sublime perfect attributes. No one shares His divinity, nor His attributes. In the Quran, God describes Himself:

Say, “He is God, the One. God, to Whom the creatures turn for their needs. He begets not, nor was He begotten, and there is none like Him.” (Quran, 112:1-4)

No one has the right to be invoked, supplicated, prayed to, or shown any act of worship, but God alone.

On the other hand, Muslims respect and revere Jesus (peace be upon him). They consider him one of the greatest of God’s messengers to mankind. The Quran confirms his virgin birth, and a chapter of the Quran is entitled ‘Maryam’ (Mary). During his prophetic mission, Jesus performed many miracles.

Neither Muhammad nor Jesus came to change the basic doctrine of the belief in one God, brought by earlier prophets, but rather to confirm and renew it.

So are your messengers from God in the habit of proclaiming themselves to be the Son of God, begotten in the flesh? You seem to conveniently overlook this fact. So either 1) Jesus is who he says he is, which is literal offspring of God the Father, come to Earth in the flesh to perform the atonement, or 2) He is a fraud, not sent by God at all, and lying.

It would seem that to revere him as something in the middle when he himself claims nothing of the sort is misguided and also deceitful. What say ye?

[gkearney]

Welcome to the LDSFF where no middle ground is ever to tolerated.

[Zathura]

Welcome to the LDSFF where no middle ground is ever to tolerated.

What middle ground to you think should be tolerated here? (Btw I frequently take the middle ground on other topics).

You think we should cover paintings of Jesus for Muslims to pray to another God? You think we should give them money to build up their churches?

Do you not think some topics don’t deserve middle ground?

[setyourselffree]

I have read Jihad Watch, and some news of Islamic violence which has received media coverage.
That is more than enough.

Do not study the Quran deeply. Best to rely on websites that cherry pick verses out of context to make their point, or weave together the most offensive quotations available from Imams or rulings of Islamic jurors over time. How hard can it be to grasp the ins and outs of a 1500-year-old religious tradition whose texts are written mostly in languages you don’t understand, which spans countries and continents and has billions of adherents? Judaism could be well understood after several hours on anti-Semitic websites, right? And Atheist websites would be a great guide to the history of Christianity? Right. So stick to anti-Islam websites for your information. What could go wrong?

Welcome! I know a lot of people on here consider you to be an enemy. I do not, I hope you come here often and share your perspective. Most Latter Day Saints are about love, unfortunately some are not as loving.

[setyourselffree]

Welcome to the LDSFF where no middle ground is ever to tolerated.

What middle ground to you think should be tolerated here? (Btw I frequently take the middle ground on other topics).

You think we should cover paintings of Jesus for Muslims to pray to another God? You think we should give them money to build up their churches?

Do you not think some topics don’t deserve middle ground?

Can you give me an article or some type of proof of covering paintings?

[EmmaLee]

Muslims praying in RS room Christ covered.jpg (55.5 KiB) Viewed 533 times

Muslims praying in LDS room.jpg (38.96 KiB) Viewed 533 times

Muslims praying in LDS gym.jpg (104.29 KiB) Viewed 533 times

[thestock]

Muslims praying in RS room Christ covered.jpg


Muslims praying in LDS room.jpg


Muslims praying in LDS gym.jpg

I had heard about the covering of the Christ picture but to actually see a photo of it is something else. I dont understand this. I am all for embracing diversity and encouraging others in their beliefs etc, but why the need to cover up or hide our own beliefs in the process? This reminds me of when Obama bowed to the Saudi king and apologized for America. Just seems wrong.

[EmmaLee]

Welcome to the LDSFF where no middle ground is ever to tolerated.

What middle ground to you think should be tolerated here? (Btw I frequently take the middle ground on other topics).

You think we should cover paintings of Jesus for Muslims to pray to another God? You think we should give them money to build up their churches?

Do you not think some topics don’t deserve middle ground?

There is no "middle ground" when it comes to Christ and his gospel.

The book of Revelation declares: “I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.

“So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth” (Rev. 3:15–16).

"This is His work. He established it. He has revealed its doctrine. He has outlined its practices. He created its government. It is His work and His kingdom, and He has said, “They who are not for me are against me” (2 Ne. 10:16). Each of us has to face the matter—either the Church is true, or it is a fraud. There is no middle ground. It is the Church and kingdom of God, or it is nothing." ~~ President Hinckley

"Before you joined this Church you stood on neutral ground. When the gospel was preached, good and evil were set before you. You could choose either or neither. There were two opposite masters inviting you to serve them. When you joined this Church you enlisted to serve God. When you did that you left the neutral ground, and you never can get back on to it. Should you forsake the Master you enlisted to serve, it will be by the instigation of the evil one, and you will follow his dictation and be his servant.” ~~ Joseph Smith (“Recollections of the Prophet Joseph Smith,” Juvenile Instructor, Aug. 15, 1892, pp. 491–92)

"With the right of choice comes the responsibility to choose. We cannot be neutral; there is no middle ground. The Lord knows this; Lucifer knows this. As long as we live upon this earth, Lucifer and his hosts will never abandon the hope of claiming our souls." ~~ President Monson https://www.lds.org/general-conference/ ... e?lang=eng

[justme]

This is indeed shocking to us at first glance and disturbing. But Muslims take the commandment of no images very seriously if I understand correctly. You won't find a picture of any form of Allah or Mohammed in their services. They would probably cover any picture, this just happened to be of Jesus (probably).