Progression from Telestial Kingdom

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HappyCamper8
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Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

If we know we can progress from the Telestial Kingdom to the Terrestrial or Celestial and we know we can be sealed for all Eternity in the Telestial Kingdom, why do some think that's not possible in the Terrestrial Kingdom?

commonwealth
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by commonwealth »

Where does it say you can progress from the telestial into the terrestrial or celestial? Who says you can be sealed in the telestial?

HappyCamper8
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.

Lizzy60
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Posts: 7611

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Lizzy60 »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
You are not actually sealed TO your wife. You are married to her, and you have had the blessings of Abraham Isaac and Jacob sealed upon each of you, and this is contingent upon your righteousness, of course. And then there is the Holy Spirit of Promise.....

The sealing ordinance of children to parents actually seals the children into the family unit. The marriage sealing ordinance does not say this. We all assume it does, but go do some proxy sealings, and listen carefully.

Lizzy60
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Posts: 7611

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Lizzy60 »

Also, any sealing ordinances done here on Earth are not valid in the eternities unless the person is worthy of the Celestial Kingdom, where the Family of Christ will reside.

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
False doctrine the LDS church is celestial as well as all the ordinances of salvation baptism receiving the HG and temple endowment and sealing. What is bound in earth is bound in heaven. Living in a telestrial world does not make any of the ordinances or commandments telestrial or terrestrial. Although we live in a telestrial state we are to live a celestial law.

This is a new worrying trend of false doctrine -the church is telestrial etc... and we are not given what is required to be saved.

When we die and the time of our resurrection comes we are resurrected with bodies celestial, telestrial or terrestrial - that is the final state of our bodies never to be acted upon again..
D&C 78:14 That through my providence, notwithstanding the tribulation which shall descend upon you, that the church may stand independent above all other creatures beneath the celestial world;

Spaced_Out
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Posts: 1795

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

Lizzy60 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:31 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
You are not actually sealed TO your wife. You are married to her, and you have had the blessings of Abraham Isaac and Jacob sealed upon each of you, and this is contingent upon your righteousness, of course. And then there is the Holy Spirit of Promise.....

The sealing ordinance of children to parents actually seals the children into the family unit. The marriage sealing ordinance does not say this. We all assume it does, but go do some proxy sealings, and listen carefully.
All the ordinances of salvation have to take place in mortality - the scriptures teach there is no marriage given in heaven. We are indeed sealed for time and all eternity on earth that is in force in the life to come.

HappyCamper8
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Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:46 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
False doctrine the LDS church is celestial as well as all the ordinances of salvation baptism receiving the HG and temple endowment and sealing. What is bound in earth is bound in heaven. Living in a telestrial world does not make any of the ordinances or commandments telestrial or terrestrial. Although we live in a telestrial state we are to live a celestial law.

This is a new worrying trend of false doctrine -the church is telestrial etc... and we are not given what is required to be saved.

When we die and the time of our resurrection comes we are resurrected with bodies celestial, telestrial or terrestrial - that is the final state of our bodies never to be acted upon again..
D&C 78:14 That through my providence, notwithstanding the tribulation which shall descend upon you, that the church may stand independent above all other creatures beneath the celestial world;
First of all it's telestial not telestrial. I only say something because you keep typing that.
Second, this isn't just some telestial world. We live in the telestial kingdom.
Third, we are resurrected first and judged after.

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Lizzy60 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:33 pm Also, any sealing ordinances done here on Earth are not valid in the eternities unless the person is worthy of the Celestial Kingdom, where the Family of Christ will reside.
True. Thanks

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Robin Hood
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Posts: 11266
Location: England

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Robin Hood »

Lizzy60 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:31 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
You are not actually sealed TO your wife. You are married to her....
Not true.
Here in England we are not permitted by law to legally marry in the temple. So we get married in the church or wherever, and go to the temple to be sealed.

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inho
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Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by inho »

HappyCamper8, let's see if I understand your reasoning correctly:
You are saying that since we now live in a telestial world and can later get into terrestrial or celestial kingdom, this implies that one can progress from telestial kingdom to a higher kingdom.


I think the problem is that even though we call this world where we live during our mortal probation telestial, it is not the Telestial kingdom. The Telestial kingdom is something much better than this mortal world:
D&C 76:89 And thus we saw, in the heavenly vision, the glory of the telestial, which surpasses all understanding;

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Lizzy60 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:31 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
You are not actually sealed TO your wife. You are married to her, and you have had the blessings of Abraham Isaac and Jacob sealed upon each of you, and this is contingent upon your righteousness, of course. And then there is the Holy Spirit of Promise.....

The sealing ordinance of children to parents actually seals the children into the family unit. The marriage sealing ordinance does not say this. We all assume it does, but go do some proxy sealings, and listen carefully.
Got it. I should have said united to my wife instead of sealed. Husband and wife are united when sealed in the temple as are children and parents. But still, not sure why people think that can't be done in the Terrestrial kingdom. Thanks.

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

inho wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:58 pm HappyCamper8, let's see if I understand your reasoning correctly:
You are saying that since we now live in a telestial world and can later get into terrestrial or celestial kingdom, this implies that one can progress from telestial kingdom to a higher kingdom.


I think the problem is that even though we call this world where we live during our mortal probation telestial, it is not the Telestial kingdom. The Telestial kingdom is something much better than this mortal world:
D&C 76:89 And thus we saw, in the heavenly vision, the glory of the telestial, which surpasses all understanding;
Not true according to Elder Holland in general conference last October.
"We are in the telestial kingdom;"
Direct quote.

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Robin Hood
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Location: England

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Robin Hood »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:51 pm
Second, this isn't just some telestial world. We live in the telestial kingdom.
I agree.
There is a part in the temple ceremony where it is announced that the lone and dreary world that we are now in is the telestial kingdom.
I would just like to know what we did to wind up here.

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Robin Hood wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:01 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:51 pm
Second, this isn't just some telestial world. We live in the telestial kingdom.
I agree.
There is a part in the temple ceremony where it is announced that the lone and dreary world that we are now in is the telestial kingdom.
I would just like to know what we did to wind up here.
Also a good point in addition to Elder Holland's statement in conference. Thanks for sharing!

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inho
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Posts: 3286
Location: in a galaxy far, far away

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by inho »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:00 pm
inho wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:58 pm HappyCamper8, let's see if I understand your reasoning correctly:
You are saying that since we now live in a telestial world and can later get into terrestrial or celestial kingdom, this implies that one can progress from telestial kingdom to a higher kingdom.


I think the problem is that even though we call this world where we live during our mortal probation telestial, it is not the Telestial kingdom. The Telestial kingdom is something much better than this mortal world:
D&C 76:89 And thus we saw, in the heavenly vision, the glory of the telestial, which surpasses all understanding;
Not true according to Elder Holland in general conference last October.
"We are in the telestial kingdom;"
Direct quote.
I disagree with your interpretation. I admit that we sometimes use the adjective telestial, when we refer to this world (as Holland did), but this world is not the telestial kingdom. Let me quote the same passage again, this time I include the next verse too:
89 And thus we saw, in the heavenly vision, the glory of the telestial, which surpasses all understanding;

90 And no man knows it except him to whom God has revealed it.
Does this sound like a reference to this world? If we live in the telestial kingdom, then all men know it.

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:51 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:46 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
False doctrine the LDS church is celestial as well as all the ordinances of salvation baptism receiving the HG and temple endowment and sealing. What is bound in earth is bound in heaven. Living in a telestrial world does not make any of the ordinances or commandments telestrial or terrestrial. Although we live in a telestrial state we are to live a celestial law.

This is a new worrying trend of false doctrine -the church is telestrial etc... and we are not given what is required to be saved.

When we die and the time of our resurrection comes we are resurrected with bodies celestial, telestrial or terrestrial - that is the final state of our bodies never to be acted upon again..
D&C 78:14 That through my providence, notwithstanding the tribulation which shall descend upon you, that the church may stand independent above all other creatures beneath the celestial world;
Second, this isn't just some telestial world. We live in the telestial kingdom.
Third, we are resurrected first and judged after.
The resurrection is a form of judgement - the scriptures are clear on this. The resurrection is a final state of the body.

Silver
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5247

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Silver »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:34 am If we know we can progress from the Telestial Kingdom to the Terrestrial or Celestial and we know we can be sealed for all Eternity in the Telestial Kingdom, why do some think that's not possible in the Terrestrial Kingdom?
This is just another heretical attempt to prove MMP, isn't it? You Snufferites don't give up easily, do you?

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:58 pm
Lizzy60 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:31 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
You are not actually sealed TO your wife. You are married to her, and you have had the blessings of Abraham Isaac and Jacob sealed upon each of you, and this is contingent upon your righteousness, of course. And then there is the Holy Spirit of Promise.....

The sealing ordinance of children to parents actually seals the children into the family unit. The marriage sealing ordinance does not say this. We all assume it does, but go do some proxy sealings, and listen carefully.
Got it. I should have said united to my wife instead of sealed. Husband and wife are united when sealed in the temple as are children and parents. But still, not sure why people think that can't be done in the Terrestrial kingdom. Thanks.
One has to live a higher law than terrestrial in order to be worth to enter the temple and receive the sealing ordinances it cant be done under a terrestrial law. It is not about the state we are living in it is about the law we keep.

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

inho wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:09 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:00 pm
inho wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:58 pm HappyCamper8, let's see if I understand your reasoning correctly:
You are saying that since we now live in a telestial world and can later get into terrestrial or celestial kingdom, this implies that one can progress from telestial kingdom to a higher kingdom.


I think the problem is that even though we call this world where we live during our mortal probation telestial, it is not the Telestial kingdom. The Telestial kingdom is something much better than this mortal world:
D&C 76:89 And thus we saw, in the heavenly vision, the glory of the telestial, which surpasses all understanding;
Not true according to Elder Holland in general conference last October.
"We are in the telestial kingdom;"
Direct quote.
I disagree with your interpretation. I admit that we sometimes use the adjective telestial, when we refer to this world (as Holland did), but this world is not the telestial kingdom. Let me quote the same passage again, this time I include the next verse too:
89 And thus we saw, in the heavenly vision, the glory of the telestial, which surpasses all understanding;

90 And no man knows it except him to whom God has revealed it.
Does this sound like a reference to this world? If we live in the telestial kingdom, then all men know it.
I'm not interpreting anything. Quote straight from Holland in general conference:
"We are in the telestial kingdom;"
I chose to follow the current brethren and not interpretations of people online. Those who say we are not in the telestial kingdom are saying so directly against an apostle.

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Silver wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:13 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:34 am If we know we can progress from the Telestial Kingdom to the Terrestrial or Celestial and we know we can be sealed for all Eternity in the Telestial Kingdom, why do some think that's not possible in the Terrestrial Kingdom?
This is just another heretical attempt to prove MMP, isn't it? You Snufferites don't give up easily, do you?
Hahahah. Go back and read my posts. I said I don't know one way or another about MMP. You Julie Rowe followers don't give up do you? Projection much?

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:13 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:58 pm
Lizzy60 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:31 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:25 pm The prophet. I was sealed to my wife in the temple.
You are not actually sealed TO your wife. You are married to her, and you have had the blessings of Abraham Isaac and Jacob sealed upon each of you, and this is contingent upon your righteousness, of course. And then there is the Holy Spirit of Promise.....

The sealing ordinance of children to parents actually seals the children into the family unit. The marriage sealing ordinance does not say this. We all assume it does, but go do some proxy sealings, and listen carefully.
Got it. I should have said united to my wife instead of sealed. Husband and wife are united when sealed in the temple as are children and parents. But still, not sure why people think that can't be done in the Terrestrial kingdom. Thanks.
One has to live a higher law than terrestrial in order to be worth to enter the temple and receive the sealing ordinances it cant be done under a terrestrial law. It is not about the state we are living in it is about the law we keep.
Sounds like you are saying you can live a higher law than terrestrial while living in the telestial kingdom AND be sealed for eternity.

Silver
Level 34 Illuminated
Posts: 5247

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Silver »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:16 pm
Silver wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:13 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:34 am If we know we can progress from the Telestial Kingdom to the Terrestrial or Celestial and we know we can be sealed for all Eternity in the Telestial Kingdom, why do some think that's not possible in the Terrestrial Kingdom?
This is just another heretical attempt to prove MMP, isn't it? You Snufferites don't give up easily, do you?
Hahahah. Go back and read my posts. I said I don't know one way or another about MMP. You Julie Rowe followers don't give up do you? Projection much?
Right.

Spaced_Out
captain of 1,000
Posts: 1795

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by Spaced_Out »

HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:18 pm
Spaced_Out wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:13 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:58 pm
Lizzy60 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 1:31 pm

You are not actually sealed TO your wife. You are married to her, and you have had the blessings of Abraham Isaac and Jacob sealed upon each of you, and this is contingent upon your righteousness, of course. And then there is the Holy Spirit of Promise.....

The sealing ordinance of children to parents actually seals the children into the family unit. The marriage sealing ordinance does not say this. We all assume it does, but go do some proxy sealings, and listen carefully.
Got it. I should have said united to my wife instead of sealed. Husband and wife are united when sealed in the temple as are children and parents. But still, not sure why people think that can't be done in the Terrestrial kingdom. Thanks.
One has to live a higher law than terrestrial in order to be worth to enter the temple and receive the sealing ordinances it cant be done under a terrestrial law. It is not about the state we are living in it is about the law we keep.
Sounds like you are saying you can live a higher law than terrestrial while living in the telestial kingdom AND be sealed for eternity.
Exactly now you have figured it out. Christ came down to this earth in its fallen state and lived a perfect law - He lived celestial. Joseph Smith would say show me the law a person lives and I will show you the Kingdom he would inherit.
During the millennium the earth will be terrestrial but Christ will live personally on the earth - what law will he be living.

The temple is represents Gods house on earth ie celestial not any other kingdom and the ordinances thereof are celestial.

HappyCamper8
captain of 50
Posts: 98

Re: Progression from Telestial Kingdom

Post by HappyCamper8 »

Silver wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:21 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:16 pm
Silver wrote: January 25th, 2018, 2:13 pm
HappyCamper8 wrote: January 25th, 2018, 7:34 am If we know we can progress from the Telestial Kingdom to the Terrestrial or Celestial and we know we can be sealed for all Eternity in the Telestial Kingdom, why do some think that's not possible in the Terrestrial Kingdom?
This is just another heretical attempt to prove MMP, isn't it? You Snufferites don't give up easily, do you?
Hahahah. Go back and read my posts. I said I don't know one way or another about MMP. You Julie Rowe followers don't give up do you? Projection much?
Right.
Funny how the only thing I know about snuffer or rowe is from you guys on this forum. Are you also going to deny we live in the telestial kingdom as stated by Holland in general conference? Unlike you and rowe, I chose to follow the brethren.

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