Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
- shadow
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 10542
- Location: St. George
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Is sniffer in with the remnant? I thought it was a different group. I need to get out more.
- caddis
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1196
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
shadow wrote:Is sniffer in with the remnant? I thought it was a different group. I need to get out more.
That much was obvious long ago.
- A Random Phrase
- Follower of Christ
- Posts: 6468
- Location: Staring at my computer, not sure whether to laugh or cry.
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Seriously, whatever should show up and she should ask, "What? Did you call me?"Bee Prepared wrote:Whatever.Obrien wrote:It is kinda funny, Tony. Perhaps the 14,997,965 who have not signed will be the "innumerable" denizens of the telestial world. After all, only a few (2,035) found the strait gate that leads to exaltation. Your selected scriptures more fully convince me of the correctness of signing the petition.
- A Random Phrase
- Follower of Christ
- Posts: 6468
- Location: Staring at my computer, not sure whether to laugh or cry.
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
This post is more spot on than you know.
Tony wrote:The herd is thinned as time goes by, but make no mistake about it, people are anxious to run with the herd because those who receive exaltation at the last day will be all that remains of what was once a herd. It is those who can endure all the trials who make it, not those who think God has revealed to them that there is a different way. Most of the herd will be thinking like you at the last day, thinking that God has revealed to them that there is a different way.Obrien wrote:The majority are also sinners, does that justify your sin?
Majorities are a sucker's game...who cares what the herd is doing?
- Sirocco
- Praise Me!
- Posts: 3808
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
samizdat wrote:There are quite a few Indian givers on this board.
When I give monetary gifts, I don't then ask the people who receive the money what they are going to spend it on. If anything, I give counsel like: Don't spend it all in one place.
If you don't want to give Church tithing because you don't trust the Church to do the right thing, it is simple. Don't give tithing, and don't complain about it. But if you do trust the Church to do the right thing, then by all means give your tithing.
Indian Giver... Yeah that's not an acceptable term anymore...
Even if I was a member I'd not give it to them, but I still would complain because that's who I am.
- A Random Phrase
- Follower of Christ
- Posts: 6468
- Location: Staring at my computer, not sure whether to laugh or cry.
- LDSNZ
- captain of 100
- Posts: 275
- Location: Te Ika a Māui
Info source?
Hi Boo,boo wrote:Look at the report of the April 1950 and 1951 general Conference. They contain a multi page financial disclosure and continue the tradition established in the beginning of the church .It then became a hidden issue when the church almost ran out f money because of financial mismanagement by people like Henry D Moyle. Nathan Eldon Tanner ( Hugh B Browns nephew ) was called to fix the financial mess that had been created and very thing has been secret ever since. I am signing up.
Do you have official links to your info source?
- Obrien
- Up, up and away.
- Posts: 4951
I never thought of that before!
Wow - that was a great idea LDSNZ. I never thought of changing the thread title, in your quote, to clarify your post. That's clever.LDSNZ wrote:Hi Boo,boo wrote:Look at the report of the April 1950 and 1951 general Conference. They contain a multi page financial disclosure and continue the tradition established in the beginning of the church .It then became a hidden issue when the church almost ran out f money because of financial mismanagement by people like Henry D Moyle. Nathan Eldon Tanner ( Hugh B Browns nephew ) was called to fix the financial mess that had been created and very thing has been secret ever since. I am signing up.
Do you have official links to your info source?
Good questions, too.
- Obrien
- Up, up and away.
- Posts: 4951
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Although you refuse to believe it, I'm not really a snuffer-guy.shadow wrote:Is sniffer in with the remnant? I thought it was a different group. I need to get out more.
Slept well last night.
Thx for the clarification, Caddis.
- inho
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 3286
- Location: in a galaxy far, far away
Re: Info source?
boo wrote:Look at the report of the April 1950 and 1951 general Conference. They contain a multi page financial disclosure and continue the tradition established in the beginning of the church .It then became a hidden issue when the church almost ran out f money because of financial mismanagement by people like Henry D Moyle. Nathan Eldon Tanner ( Hugh B Browns nephew ) was called to fix the financial mess that had been created and very thing has been secret ever since. I am signing up.
Annual financial report for the year 1949LDSNZ wrote: Do you have official links to your info source?
Annual financial report for the year 1950
In this article, Quinn writes something about Moyle spending a lot of money on new buildings based on the projected church growth and persuading McKay not to publish accounting from 1960 onward. You can check his sources.
- Obrien
- Up, up and away.
- Posts: 4951
Re: Info source?
Great post inho. What do we get now as an accounting? "Our auditors, who are totally independent, say everything is cool. Don't sweat it." B-) or something like that...inho wrote:boo wrote:Look at the report of the April 1950 and 1951 general Conference. They contain a multi page financial disclosure and continue the tradition established in the beginning of the church .It then became a hidden issue when the church almost ran out f money because of financial mismanagement by people like Henry D Moyle. Nathan Eldon Tanner ( Hugh B Browns nephew ) was called to fix the financial mess that had been created and very thing has been secret ever since. I am signing up.Annual financial report for the year 1949LDSNZ wrote: Do you have official links to your info source?
Annual financial report for the year 1950
In this article, Quinn writes something about Moyle spending a lot of money on new buildings based on the projected church growth and persuading McKay not to publish accounting from 1960 onward. You can check his sources.
- jbalm
- The Third Comforter
- Posts: 5348
Re: Info source?
Baghdad Bob wrote:"Our auditors, who are totally independent, say everything is cool. Don't sweat it."
- inho
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 3286
- Location: in a galaxy far, far away
Re: Info source?
Even if they gave us no numbers, they could give us at least some details, like "last year we caught a bishop embezzling funds in Spain, but other than that everything is okay."Obrien wrote: Great post inho. What do we get now as an accounting? "Our auditors, who are totally independent, say everything is cool. Don't sweat it." B-) or something like that...
- shadow
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 10542
- Location: St. George
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
I didn't even bring him up, caddis did. And I didn't accuse you of being a snuffer-guy.Obrien wrote:Although you refuse to believe it, I'm not really a snuffer-guy.shadow wrote:Is sniffer in with the remnant? I thought it was a different group. I need to get out more.
Slept well last night.
Thx for the clarification, Caddis.
- caddis
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1196
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
8-| :-BDshadow wrote:I didn't even bring him up, caddis did. And I didn't accuse you of being a snuffer-guy.Obrien wrote:Although you refuse to believe it, I'm not really a snuffer-guy.shadow wrote:Is sniffer in with the remnant? I thought it was a different group. I need to get out more.
Slept well last night.
Thx for the clarification, Caddis.
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 2536
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
=)) Your sincere apologies are touching.shadow wrote:Yup. Only apostates are right. They are a part of the "remnant of the once true church" and everyone else is wrong. Got it.
Oh crap, sorry again Obrien.
hehehe!
-
- captain of 1,000
- Posts: 1559
- Location: Arizona
Re: Info source?
Just noted your question . go to Archive .org and search LDS Conference Reports. Look for the statistical report for any year prior to 1959 and you will see it . It is only in the April report. If you need more help let me know.LDSNZ wrote:Hi Boo,boo wrote:Look at the report of the April 1950 and 1951 general Conference. They contain a multi page financial disclosure and continue the tradition established in the beginning of the church .It then became a hidden issue when the church almost ran out f money because of financial mismanagement by people like Henry D Moyle. Nathan Eldon Tanner ( Hugh B Browns nephew ) was called to fix the financial mess that had been created and very thing has been secret ever since. I am signing up.
Do you have official links to your info source?
- Tony
- captain of 100
- Posts: 850
- Location: I'm on earth living out my probationary period.
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Jesus Christ's Church has appointed His servants to keep a record of who is a full tithe payer, and the leaders of His Church are accountable to Him, as are all the people of the world are accountable to Jesus Christ. The leaders of His Church are certainly not accountable to the members.Obrien wrote:Good job Mr. Sandman. The church wants accountability for your tithing habits each year at tithing settlement, it is high time we got some accountability from the leadership.
- Obrien
- Up, up and away.
- Posts: 4951
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Disagree. Ever hear of common consent and disapproving of leaders (DC 124:144).Tony wrote:Jesus Christ's Church has appointed His servants to keep a record of who is a full tithe payer, and the leaders of His Church are accountable to Him, as are all the people of the world are accountable to Jesus Christ. The leaders of His Church are certainly not accountable to the members.Obrien wrote:Good job Mr. Sandman. The church wants accountability for your tithing habits each year at tithing settlement, it is high time we got some accountability from the leadership.
-
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 8533
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Christ already knows who is a full-tithe payer. He doesn't need fallible men to tell Him.Tony wrote:Jesus Christ's Church has appointed His servants to keep a record of who is a full tithe payer, and the leaders of His Church are accountable to Him, as are all the people of the world are accountable to Jesus Christ. The leaders of His Church are certainly not accountable to the members.Obrien wrote:Good job Mr. Sandman. The church wants accountability for your tithing habits each year at tithing settlement, it is high time we got some accountability from the leadership.
To think that He does is ridiculous.
- Tony
- captain of 100
- Posts: 850
- Location: I'm on earth living out my probationary period.
Re: Info source?
How about something that coroborates your claim that "the church almost ran out of money because of financial mismanagement," specifficlly by people like Henry D Moyle, and your claim that N. Eldon Tanner had to fix things?boo wrote:Just noted your question . go to Archive .org and search LDS Conference Reports. Look for the statistical report for any year prior to 1959 and you will see it . It is only in the April report. If you need more help let me know.LDSNZ wrote:Hi Boo,boo wrote:Look at the report of the April 1950 and 1951 general Conference. They contain a multi page financial disclosure and continue the tradition established in the beginning of the church .It then became a hidden issue when the church almost ran out f money because of financial mismanagement by people like Henry D Moyle. Nathan Eldon Tanner ( Hugh B Browns nephew ) was called to fix the financial mess that had been created and very thing has been secret ever since. I am signing up.
Do you have official links to your info source?
-
- Level 34 Illuminated
- Posts: 8533
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Tony, the fact that the Church was in trouble financially, and tasked Bro Tanner with helping it get back on track, is well documented in many biographies and other accounts in reliable, approved church publications. It's something I've read in many places, is not considered a controversy or conspiracy theory, and given some time I can find accounts. It's too late for me to do so tonight, however.
Okay, it took two minutes to find my first source in my bookcase.
The book is David O McKay and the Rise of Modern Mormonism by Gregory A Prince.
Pages 214-221, subtitled Restoring Financial Order. That chapter is titled The Building Program. The entire book is excellent, and meticulously footnoted and sourced.
Okay, it took two minutes to find my first source in my bookcase.
The book is David O McKay and the Rise of Modern Mormonism by Gregory A Prince.
Pages 214-221, subtitled Restoring Financial Order. That chapter is titled The Building Program. The entire book is excellent, and meticulously footnoted and sourced.
Last edited by Lizzy60 on June 9th, 2015, 8:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Tony
- captain of 100
- Posts: 850
- Location: I'm on earth living out my probationary period.
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
So, the 15 million members of Jesus Christ's Church all have to agree on how Jesus Christ's chosen and anointed servants should spend the tithing money, is that correct?Obrien wrote:Disagree. Ever hear of common consent and disapproving of leaders (DC 124:144).Tony wrote:Jesus Christ's Church has appointed His servants to keep a record of who is a full tithe payer, and the leaders of His Church are accountable to Him, as are all the people of the world are accountable to Jesus Christ. The leaders of His Church are certainly not accountable to the members.Obrien wrote:Good job Mr. Sandman. The church wants accountability for your tithing habits each year at tithing settlement, it is high time we got some accountability from the leadership.
- Tony
- captain of 100
- Posts: 850
- Location: I'm on earth living out my probationary period.
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
Christ also knows when someone is baptized for the dead. Yet, he has instructed that a "fallible man" be a recorder and an eye-witness.Lizzy60 wrote:Christ already knows who is a full-tithe payer. He doesn't need fallible men to tell Him.Tony wrote:Jesus Christ's Church has appointed His servants to keep a record of who is a full tithe payer, and the leaders of His Church are accountable to Him, as are all the people of the world are accountable to Jesus Christ. The leaders of His Church are certainly not accountable to the members.Obrien wrote:Good job Mr. Sandman. The church wants accountability for your tithing habits each year at tithing settlement, it is high time we got some accountability from the leadership.
To think that He does is ridiculous.
Doctrine and Covenants 127:6 states, "Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you concerning your dead: When any of you are baptized for your dead, let there be a recorder, and let him be eye-witness of your baptisms; let him hear with his ears that he may testify of a truth, saith the Lord."
- jockeybox
- captain of 100
- Posts: 620
- Location: McKinney, TX
Re: Go Sign Up (it doesn't hurt)
You do realize common consent doesn't have to be unanimous. That's partly why it's called "common". Or you can think of it general consensus.Tony wrote: So, the 15 million members of Jesus Christ's Church all have to agree on how Jesus Christ's chosen and anointed servants should spend the tithing money, is that correct?
The lord wants you and I to think for ourselves and vote according to the dictates off our conscience.
It's not intended to be a follow the leader mentality.