What Tribe of Israel are you?

[StriplingWarrior]

I am taking this within the context of the LDS church and Patriarchal Blessings that state what tribe you are of. Specifically I am wondering how that is decided if we may be descended from multiple blood ancestors who were of differing tribes of Israel.

I understand that we have found those of every tribe of the House of Israel in the LDS church right?

Can't we technically be part of multiple tribes of Israel if we have multiple Israelite ancestors? Say for example, I have an ancestor that was in the tribe of Manasseh and another of Ephraim and both were related to me by blood. Technically I am of both tribes of Israel if not more right?
And doesn't that go for all of us?

Interestingly enough, I have heard of mothers and fathers being of the same tribe, Ephraim for example, but one of their children from Reuben or something.

My understanding is that you are told what tribe you are of for the purpose of learning about that tribe and understanding its role in the House of Israel. So when a child is of a different tribe then his parents, his Patriarch was inspired to tell him that he was of another tribe because the Lord specifically has a purpose for the child being told they are in that tribe rather than the tribe of their parents. Of course this is all taken within the context of what I said earlier which is that this child has multiple Israelite ancestors that he is literally descended from but his patriarchal blessing indicates he is of a different tribe than his parents.

Hard to describe my thinking but hopefully someone understands.

Anyway, what Tribe of Israel were you declared in your patriarchal blessing and what do you think of what I discussed?

[EdGoble]

I am taking this within the context of the LDS church and Patriarchal Blessings that state what tribe you are of. Specifically I am wondering how that is decided if we may be descended from multiple blood ancestors who were of differing tribes of Israel.

I understand that we have found those of every tribe of the House of Israel in the LDS church right?

Can't we technically be part of multiple tribes of Israel if we have multiple Israelite ancestors? Say for example, I have an ancestor that was in the tribe of Manasseh and another of Ephraim and both were related to me by blood. Technically I am of both tribes of Israel if not more right?
And doesn't that go for all of us?

Interestingly enough, I have heard of mothers and fathers being of the same tribe, Ephraim for example, but one of their children from Reuben or something.

My understanding is that you are told what tribe you are of for the purpose of learning about that tribe and understanding its role in the House of Israel. So when a child is of a different tribe then his parents, his Patriarch was inspired to tell him that he was of another tribe because the Lord specifically has a purpose for the child being told they are in that tribe rather than the tribe of their parents. Of course this is all taken within the context of what I said earlier which is that this child has multiple Israelite ancestors that he is literally descended from but his patriarchal blessing indicates he is of a different tribe than his parents.

Hard to describe my thinking but hopefully someone understands.

Anyway, what Tribe of Israel were you declared in your patriarchal blessing and what do you think of what I discussed?

I am Ephraim, but I have two ancestors who's patriarchal blessings are different. One says Zebulon, and the other Judah. So I am clearly a mix with Ephraim being the dominant. My opinion is that it all has to do with which tribe is dominant in a person based on which genes you get from ancestors. Like 3 out of 4 children could be brown eyed with one blue eyed. I have black hair (not brown) with silver blue eyes. My wife has brown hair with hazel eyes. I have 8 children. Most of my children have dark brown hair with hazel or brown eyes. I have two children with blonde hair and blue eyes. That blonde gene is obviously recessive in both me and my wife and manifest in two children. Clearly, tribal ancestry dominance is the same as recessive and dominant genes.

[Bananikka]

Great post, I've wivdered this very thing myself and these conclusions sound very logical! (As to us often being mixed ..) oh, and I'm ephraim ;)

[Robert Sinclair]

My blessing said of Ephraim but my mother in doing her ancestors work, found that she was a direct decendant of Massasoit who was chief of the tribe the Pilgrims had their first thanksgiving dinner with. I am exactly the 14th generation and this excited my mother saying great things happen sometimes every 14th generation as is written in the Scriptures. So their is running through my veins the blood of Manasseh as well as Ephraim. I hope to serve both houses well since deciding to cease from being a drunkard of Ephraim nor a lover of fire water of Manasseh from my Indian bloodlines. ♡

[Mormon Rabbi]

If the father is of Benjamin then the children will be of Benjamin. Israel is a patriarchal system. This part is not tradition. For example, Judah the son of Jacob was the head of the tribe. All of his children would fall under the tribal banner of Judah. If a woman of Judah marries say someone one from the Tribe of Zebulon her bloodline is still of Judah, but her inheritance would fall with her husband Zebulon. As such she and her children's land of inheritance would fall with the tribe of Zebulon. So a patriarch may declare the bloodline of multiple tribes being present but the tribal inheritance rights follow the father's line.

What I find comical is when some patriarch declares one child of one tribe and the another child of another and then the father and mother are Ephraim. Can you say make it up as we go along? This shows absolute ignorance of tribal inheritance in the House of Israel. Israel is a patriarchal society. If the father is of Ephraim, guess what, the children are of Ephraim. To mix up lineages by trying to declare one child Manasseh and another say Zebulon is a joke. All children are of the tribal inheritance of their father. When someone tells me they are of on lineage and their sibling is of another I start laughing. So Inheritance follows the Father's line, but a person may have multiple bloodlines present.

[Elias Returns]

I am a true, and literal Ephraimite. And that's from both sides Jack! ;)

[Mormon Rabbi]

Cool. That makes you an Israelite then!

[Lizzy60]

If the father is of Benjamin then the children will be of Benjamin. Israel is a patriarchal system. This part is not tradition. For example, Judah the son of Jacob was the head of the tribe. All of his children would fall under the tribal banner of Judah. If a woman of Judah marries say someone one from the Tribe of Zebulon her bloodline is still of Judah, but her inheritance would fall with her husband Zebulon. As such she and her children's land of inheritance would fall with the tribe of Zebulon. So a patriarch may declare the bloodline of multiple tribes being present but the tribal inheritance rights follow the father's line.

What I find comical is when some patriarch declares one child of one tribe and the another child of another and then the father and mother are Ephraim. Can you say make it up as we go along? This shows absolute ignorance of tribal inheritance in the House of Israel. Israel is a patriarchal society. If the father is of Ephraim, guess what, the children are of Ephraim. To mix up lineages by trying to declare one child Manasseh and another say Zebulon is a joke. All children are of the tribal inheritance of their father. When someone tells me they are of on lineage and their sibling is of another I start laughing. So Inheritance follows the Father's line, but a person may have multiple bloodlines present.

My husband and I are both Ephraim and one of our sons was told he was tribe of Dan. I found out later that several other young men his age were said to be Dan, Gad, whatever, even though all parents were Ephraim. When I've tried to discuss this with other patriarchs, they all give me some dumb story about how that happens, when I know it was just a crazy uninspired blessing.
Thank you for speaking common sense, Rabbi!

[Mormon Rabbi]

In the end I think God will sort out all the tribes, but that is not the first time I have heard this kind of thing happening. One patriarch actually told me that they had been given instructions to just declare people "of Abraham" and leave it at that. What I think would be more important than a patriarchal fortune telling session would be to teach the children their identity as Israel and then teach them how to lay hold on every single blessing available under God's covenant instead of relying on a "Patriarch" to divine a blessing about their future.

[marc]

Well, my dad was told he is of Manasseh. My mom was told she is of Ephraim. I was told I am of Ephraim. I have three sisters, two of which were told they are of Manasseh, one was told she is of Ephraim. Go figure. And someone recently told me I could be a Crypto-Jew. If so, then I might be of Judah. Very interesting.

[Reggie]

This thread has been a rude awakening for me. Maybe because I've never really given much thought than what I was initially told at age 14 when I got my blessing. Mine says Ephraim. An early conversation with and about an aunt of mine who is odd man out of all her sisters who have joined the church, she Manasseh, they Ephraim, followed something like: The tribe you are assigned to is a spiritual tribe. Because we are mostly Gentiles and some of us have no Israelite blood. When zion is built, every tribe will have it's own gate. Each tribe will help build its own section/partition/gate, if you will. Your inheritance will be with that tribe, even if your blood relatives are somewhere else. It doesn't mean you won't be able to see them. (I was very concerned about the loss of my favorite aunt.) It just means she is different. And boy is she. She was the first in the family to join the church. She is a real go getter. In her 80's now, and still going. She is the best example of a true saint that I have.

I don't believe in uninspired blessings. I believe in blessings we don't understand. My blessing says something to the effect that I will be married to a good man. It again states that the Lord will bring me and this good man together. And then it puts it together for the third time in another way. When I finally did get married, who could have figured out his name was Good man. It is spelled Goodman now; but his Cherokee ancestor supposedly chose the name and told everyone "He was 'Good Man' " as his name. My husband reverted back to telling people this because they wanted to confuse Goodwin, etc. with Goodman.

So, anyway I like the idea of the tribe being spiritual because it cuts all the confusion. Everyone gets a tribe whether you're Israeli or not. (Can you imagine assigning some folks, "Gentile Tribe"), I think we don't yet understand the real purpose of assigning tribes anyway. :ymparty:

[boo]

If the father is of Benjamin then the children will be of Benjamin. Israel is a patriarchal system. This part is not tradition. For example, Judah the son of Jacob was the head of the tribe. All of his children would fall under the tribal banner of Judah. If a woman of Judah marries say someone one from the Tribe of Zebulon her bloodline is still of Judah, but her inheritance would fall with her husband Zebulon. As such she and her children's land of inheritance would fall with the tribe of Zebulon. So a patriarch may declare the bloodline of multiple tribes being present but the tribal inheritance rights follow the father's line.

What I find comical is when some patriarch declares one child of one tribe and the another child of another and then the father and mother are Ephraim. Can you say make it up as we go along? This shows absolute ignorance of tribal inheritance in the House of Israel. Israel is a patriarchal society. If the father is of Ephraim, guess what, the children are of Ephraim. To mix up lineages by trying to declare one child Manasseh and another say Zebulon is a joke. All children are of the tribal inheritance of their father. When someone tells me they are of on lineage and their sibling is of another I start laughing. So Inheritance follows the Father's line, but a person may have multiple bloodlines present.

My husband and I are both Ephraim and one of our sons was told he was tribe of Dan. I found out later that several other young men his age were said to be Dan, Gad, whatever, even though all parents were Ephraim. When I've tried to discuss this with other patriarchs, they all give me some dumb story about how that happens, when I know it was just a crazy uninspired blessing.
Thank you for speaking common sense, Rabbi!

This is fascinating. I know personally a temple worked who was born in Hungary who was from Dan. My uncle who was a patriarch gave a replacement blessing to someone who had received one years before but the church had no record of it . as he was giving it he was inspired to declare the mans lineage as Dan . As he did so he thought wow I wonder if I am wrong. afterwards he asked the man if he could remember anything from the earlier blessing the man said "not much but I do remember I was from Dan". My uncle was very relieved.

[ElectLady]

Anyone know if it is absolutely through blood? I know blood is very important, but I haven't studied it yet. Anyway, would a sealing to parents "change" lineage? Deep, I know. My daughter is asian, so I have been waiting to see what her blessing might reveal. But if the sealing ceremony changes something, then we will have another Ephriam in the family. Anyone know about these things?

BTW- She would be Slytherin in a different poll. Edgy and lovely.

[Kingdom of ZION]

I have the birthright blessing of two Tribes, I will leave it at that.

As for a person being blessed with the birthright from the tribe of Dan. Dan was dropped from the Twelve Tribes in the latter days, and Levi was made a tribe, see John, the Beloved's book of Revelations. It is rumored that the anti-Christ will come from the Tribe of Dan, hence why Dan was being dropped.

Birthrights are like blessings, they are almost one in the same... you either earn them, fulfill them, or lose them! Esau sold his firstborn birthright, and Issac received the blessing. If you fail to live up to the birthright, the blessing will pass to another. Are they set by actual BIRTH rights? Yes, MR is right. Once they were divinely discerned, but apostasy has overtaken the Gentiles.

What if a Gentile who had no Tribe of Israel birthright was baptized and then they conferred the Holy Ghost upon them? It is said that they undergo an actual change in the blood, and are adopted and made literal seed of Abraham. What if ones already sired children, who are pure Gentile (if such a thing can exist in a Heinz 57 birthright of today). They might be adopted into a different Tribes, who can say. I know that is not what those above are talking about, but I just wanted to point out how it could happen, beside uninspired Patriarchs.

Shalom

[EdGoble]

If the father is of Benjamin then the children will be of Benjamin. Israel is a patriarchal system. This part is not tradition. For example, Judah the son of Jacob was the head of the tribe. All of his children would fall under the tribal banner of Judah. If a woman of Judah marries say someone one from the Tribe of Zebulon her bloodline is still of Judah, but her inheritance would fall with her husband Zebulon. As such she and her children's land of inheritance would fall with the tribe of Zebulon. So a patriarch may declare the bloodline of multiple tribes being present but the tribal inheritance rights follow the father's line.

What I find comical is when some patriarch declares one child of one tribe and the another child of another and then the father and mother are Ephraim. Can you say make it up as we go along? This shows absolute ignorance of tribal inheritance in the House of Israel. Israel is a patriarchal society. If the father is of Ephraim, guess what, the children are of Ephraim. To mix up lineages by trying to declare one child Manasseh and another say Zebulon is a joke. All children are of the tribal inheritance of their father. When someone tells me they are of on lineage and their sibling is of another I start laughing. So Inheritance follows the Father's line, but a person may have multiple bloodlines present.

Sorry. I don't think that dominance goes by some tribal system. I think that you are trying to apply something in a tradition foreign to Mormonism entirely, and I don't think methodologically that it will result in good results. I think it follows the plain old rules of heredity and genetics and that it is all naturalistic. I think that you are entirely wrong. With all due respect, you ought not to laugh at inspired proclamations from the Holy Ghost.

[sevenator]

Ephraim, as well as my wife, both my parents and all my siblings.

What do I win? :ymparty:

[DPeterson]

Yeah, I'm supposedly Ephraim. The family history that does trace back that far goes to Judah...so who knows. I don't necessarily believe that Ephraim is supposed to be literal, more like Reggie's line of thinking above. I almost see it as sort of an invitation to do a work and lay hold on those blessings. I don't really know, of course. I do know that my sister and I have almost identical blessings; there are a few unique lines thrown in there, but otherwise the Patriarch (who was the same for both) used almost the exact same wording throughout.

[eyenote]

This thread would be great as a poll. Although it looks like it would be overwhelmingly on the side of Ephraim.

[Robert Sinclair]

What do I win? :ymparty:[/quote]

You win the right to help bring again Zion upon the earth once more. ♡

[Zowieink]

Ephraim here. PB states "that the greatest blessings flow through those who are of Ephraim to those who are not of this blessed and favored lineage".

[gkearney]

Tribe of Dan here. I have meet only one other such person.

[theBruceGuy]

Tribe of Dan here. I have meet only one other such person.

Both my wife and her sister are of Dan. They went years apart to the Patriarch. They are both of Irish descent

I am from Ephraim. I am Scottish.

I can't remember my kids, but I think they have all been from Ephraim so far.

[abelchirino]

Manasseh for me. My case is really interesting and I don't know what to make of it. I have two older brothers. The oldest was told that he was from the Tribe of Ephraim. My second oldest brother and I were told that we were from the Tribe of Manasseh.

My mother was told she was an Ephraimite and my father was told that he was from Manasseh.

The interesting part is this. Between the three of us, the ones who looked like my father (or his family I should say) were my second oldest brother and me. My second oldest brother is almost the express image of my father. I have a lot of characteristics from my father's side of the family as well.

My oldest brother, the one who is an Ephraimite, is all my mother's side of the family. Some say that he is the express image of my grandfather (my mother's father).

Also, some things have come to light in my family's history, that points to my oldest brother (the Ephraimite), possibly being from a different father.

So I don't know what that means. We still don't know if my oldest brother is from a different father but that possibly could explain a lot.

Now I'm married. My wife is from the Tribe of Ephraim and I can't wait to see what my daughter will be told. Following what I have implied above, I hope for the sake of my marriage that my daughter will be from the Tribe of Manasseh as well ( =)) JK!).

[EdGoble]

Tribe of Dan here. I have meet only one other such person.

Any Scottish or Irish ancestry? I'm told that besides Ephraim, there is a large concentration of Dan there.

[gkearney]

Tribe of Dan here. I have meet only one other such person.

Any Scottish or Irish ancestry? I'm told that besides Ephraim, there is a large concentration of Dan there.

The family is originally from the Isle of Mann a tiny speck of a nation in the Irish Sea.