Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

For discussion of secret combinations (political, economic, spiritual, religious, etc.) (Ether 8:18-25.)
JohnnyL
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by JohnnyL »

Telavian wrote: October 31st, 2024, 12:05 pm
larsenb wrote: October 31st, 2024, 11:56 am But what do you mean by "an organization in apostasy"? Far too nebulous and too much of an accusatory generalization. Your experience was with your immediate leaders who were, from what you said, treating you like garbage and not fulfilling their duties in a righteous manner.
Based on your other comments, yes the "church" is a collection of people with each at individual levels of apostasy. Some 0% and some 100%.

I would say the church as a whole is in apostasy, because we have generationally been led astray by well-intentioned men who advocated for their opinions. This is manifest in false doctrines, false reliance on the handbook, and false reliance on the church itself. In my experience, God is spoken about however is secondary to the church itself.

Again, yes everyone is at a different point. However, in general if people are more in the apostasy camp, then I think it is safe to say the church is in apostasy.
So if the Church is in apostacy, then it would need to be restored, not cleansed or reformed? The Church will be cleansed, yes; but not restored, because it will not be in apostasy.

Anyway, for those seeking clarification on whether the Church will end in apostasy in this dispensation, search: "this dispensation not to end in apostasy" (not 'exact words') on the Church website.

See also DC 13:1: Upon you my fellow servants, in the name of Messiah I confer the Priesthood of Aaron, which holds the keys of the ministering of angels, and of the gospel of repentance, and of baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; and this shall never be taken again from the earth, until the sons of Levi do offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness.
The Book of Mormon and Doctrine and Covenants, and many current prophets and apostles, have all made it clear that one is baptized into the Church, not just baptized; in other words, you can't have baptism without the Church of Jesus Christ.

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Telavian
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by Telavian »

JohnnyL wrote: November 12th, 2024, 9:47 am So if the Church is in apostacy, then it would need to be restored, not cleansed or reformed? The Church will be cleansed, yes; but not restored, because it will not be in apostasy.

Anyway, for those seeking clarification on whether the Church will end in apostasy in this dispensation, search: "this dispensation not to end in apostasy" (not 'exact words') on the Church website.

See also DC 13:1: Upon you my fellow servants, in the name of Messiah I confer the Priesthood of Aaron, which holds the keys of the ministering of angels, and of the gospel of repentance, and of baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; and this shall never be taken again from the earth, until the sons of Levi do offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness.
The Book of Mormon and Doctrine and Covenants, and many current prophets and apostles, have all made it clear that one is baptized into the Church, not just baptized; in other words, you can't have baptism without the Church of Jesus Christ.
So you are suggesting we trust the teachings of the LDS church to say they are not in apostasy and should be trusted?

Everyone constantly uses D&C 13 to support this. However it really seems like they don't even read it. The Aaronic priesthood was on the earth before the LDS church and is completely independent from the LDS church. There are pure Levites who continue to practice temple rites so they can be ready for the new temple. So what about D&C pertains to the LDS church never going into apostasy?

D&C 77:15 also says the restoration hasn't even happened yet.

JohnnyL
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by JohnnyL »

Telavian wrote: November 12th, 2024, 10:07 am
JohnnyL wrote: November 12th, 2024, 9:47 am So if the Church is in apostacy, then it would need to be restored, not cleansed or reformed? The Church will be cleansed, yes; but not restored, because it will not be in apostasy.

Anyway, for those seeking clarification on whether the Church will end in apostasy in this dispensation, search: "this dispensation not to end in apostasy" (not 'exact words') on the Church website.

See also DC 13:1: Upon you my fellow servants, in the name of Messiah I confer the Priesthood of Aaron, which holds the keys of the ministering of angels, and of the gospel of repentance, and of baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; and this shall never be taken again from the earth, until the sons of Levi do offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness.
The Book of Mormon and Doctrine and Covenants, and many current prophets and apostles, have all made it clear that one is baptized into the Church, not just baptized; in other words, you can't have baptism without the Church of Jesus Christ.
So you are suggesting we trust the teachings of the LDS church to say they are not in apostasy and should be trusted?

Everyone constantly uses D&C 13 to support this. However it really seems like they don't even read it. The Aaronic priesthood was on the earth before the LDS church and is completely independent from the LDS church. There are pure Levites who continue to practice temple rites so they can be ready for the new temple. So what about D&C pertains to the LDS church never going into apostasy?

D&C 77:15 also says the restoration hasn't even happened yet.
<sigh> Never mind. :)

larsenb
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

Jeff Lindsay's 4th article in Meridian Magazine covering the Book of Mormon-related topic of secret combinations. This is huge in my view! With Lindsay, we have a major LDS thought leader, who is bringing this topic into the light of day in a very big way and in a manner that is bound to raise the general awareness of this subject among the LDS population. Something many of us have been waiting for for decades. Lindsay calls the secret combination topic the most neglected topic from the Book of Mormon among present day Mormondom. He is right, in my strongly held view.

Here: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/modern-sc ... ions-pt-4/

In this, I assume final article, he delves into some of the obvious secret combinations of our day, such as the Yakusa or the 'Italian' Mafia, but he also delves into Milner's Kindergarten, or the British, Cecil Rhodes Round Table Groups and how they segued into the many CFR groups around the world, and the one extolled and outed by Carroll Quigley in his two main books: Tragedy and Hope and The Anglo-American Establishment.

He also brings in Cleon Skousen's exposition of Quigley's book in Skousen's Naked Capitalist; and even relates the activities of these related groups to what is happening today with the WEF, etc., etc.

What he avoids however, at this juncture, is the Communist connection in Skousen's book that relates the experience of Bella Dodd, a high-level NY State Communist Functionary, to this Naked Capitalist endeavor. She became disaffected in the '40s when the Party turned against Earl Browder in a big way, and she reverted back to her Italian Catholic underpinnings. She had noticed high level Capitalist connections to the Communist Party. Her story is especial intriguing to me because Earl Browder is a not-too-distant cousin of mine (my Mother's Browder grandmother's 2nd cousin)

Here is a short extract from Lindsay's peroration on the Milner Group, followed by a recap of pertinent Ether 8 passages:
The Milner Group wanted to slow down and not rush for global government until “popular opinion was ready for a world government.” With recent developments such as the WHO’s pandemic treaty that threatens to usurp national sovereignty if unelected foreign bureaucrats smell an emergency, and the Pact for the Future being promoted by the United Nations, as well as increasingly vocal calls for global governance from their allies in the World Economic Forum and the global push for increased censorship, increased government control and spending, and the weaponization of government against political enemies and expanding powers to spy on citizens, it seems those in the shadows of power may feel that the time for true global progress is now. I don’t know the reasons and force behind so much of what is happening, but there seems to be coalitions or dare I say combinations moving in lockstep. But whoever they are, whether related to the offspring of the Milner Group or any other society, secret combinations and those practicing corruption remain vulnerable. A few courageous people can make a difference, especially if we diligently seek to understand the message of the Book of Mormon, including the warning of Moroni:

And whatsoever nation shall uphold such secret combinations, to get power and gain, until they shall spread over the nation, behold, they shall be destroyed; for the Lord will not suffer that the blood of his saints, which shall be shed by them, shall always cry unto him from the ground for vengeance upon them and yet he avenge them not.

Wherefore, O ye Gentiles, it is wisdom in God that these things should be shown unto you, that thereby ye may repent of your sins, and suffer not that these murderous combinations shall get above you, which are built up to get power and gain — and the work, yea, even the work of destruction come upon you, yea, even the sword of the justice of the Eternal God shall fall upon you, to your overthrow and destruction if ye shall suffer these things to be.

Wherefore, the Lord commandeth you, when ye shall see these things come among you that ye shall awake to a sense of your awful situation, because of this secret combination which shall be among you; or wo be unto it, because of the blood of them who have been slain; for they cry from the dust for vengeance upon it, and also upon those who built it up.

For it cometh to pass that whoso buildeth it up seeketh to overthrow the freedom of all lands, nations, and countries; and it bringeth to pass the destruction of all people, for it is built up by the devil, who is the father of all lies; even that same liar who beguiled our first parents, yea, even that same liar who hath caused man to commit murder from the beginning; who hath hardened the hearts of men that they have murdered the prophets, and stoned them, and cast them out from the beginning.

Wherefore, I, Moroni, am commanded to write these things that evil may be done away, and that the time may come that Satan may have no power upon the hearts of the children of men, but that they may be persuaded to do good continually, that they may come unto the fountain of all righteousness and be saved. (Ether 8:22–26)

Arm Chair Quarterback
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by Arm Chair Quarterback »

In light of recent church policy changes supporting vaccines, a new emphasis on outreach to LGBTQ radicalization, and news releases in support of globalist and marxist ideologies, the irony of this statement in the OP made me laugh out loud:

"The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . "

JohnnyL
Posts: 10405

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by JohnnyL »

Still quite a lengthy and laborious read, though slightly better. He did a lot of tip-toeing, but left lots of hints and clues along the way, I guess.
I think it would have helped tremendously to give synopses of lots of conspiracies that have been fleshed out and proven over the years, and point out many mysterious groups of deaths connected to events/ politicians.

All in all, instead I'd definitely spend more time reading something much easier and insightful like Veil of Authority (especially if you have Kindle Unlimited; it's on Amazon.com).

larsenb
Posts: 12096
Location: Between here and Standing Rock

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

Arm Chair Quarterback wrote: November 18th, 2024, 10:54 pm In light of recent church policy changes supporting vaccines, a new emphasis on outreach to LGBTQ radicalization, and news releases in support of globalist and marxist ideologies, the irony of this statement in the OP made me laugh out loud:

"The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . "
The fact that you left out the rest of my quote underscores a tendency to focus on the negative and find fault. Here's the full quote: "The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . . when it does, and as long as they themselves stay on track." Are you claiming I don't think certain members of our leadership have gone off track? Why so eager to find offense?

larsenb
Posts: 12096
Location: Between here and Standing Rock

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

JohnnyL wrote: November 19th, 2024, 11:07 am Still quite a lengthy and laborious read, though slightly better. He did a lot of tip-toeing, but left lots of hints and clues along the way, I guess.
I think it would have helped tremendously to give synopses of lots of conspiracies that have been fleshed out and proven over the years, and point out many mysterious groups of deaths connected to events/ politicians.

All in all, instead I'd definitely spend more time reading something much easier and insightful like Veil of Authority (especially if you have Kindle Unlimited; it's on Amazon.com).
I'm really surprised how no one yet posting here seems to understand what a milestone this series of articles is. I've been waiting for 30 years for some prominent LDS leader or LDS thought leader to delve into this subject. This is the first I've seen someone from this group do it. He even quotes Cleon Skousen's Naked Capitalist and outs Cecil Rhodes, etc.

Why on earth would you expect him to know and comment on everything many of us who have bird-dogged this topic for years may know about??

Daniel Peterson is even jumping on the bandwagon: "The so-called “secret combinations” of the Book of Mormon have long been of particular interest to me. Here are three articles about them from Jeff Lindsay, a valued member of the Interpreter Foundation’s board of directors and until recently one of the editors of Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, that were recently published in Meridian Magazine:" from: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... eyond.html

Arm Chair Quarterback
Posts: 2112

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by Arm Chair Quarterback »

larsenb wrote: November 19th, 2024, 4:19 pm
Arm Chair Quarterback wrote: November 18th, 2024, 10:54 pm In light of recent church policy changes supporting vaccines, a new emphasis on outreach to LGBTQ radicalization, and news releases in support of globalist and marxist ideologies, the irony of this statement in the OP made me laugh out loud:

"The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . "
The fact that you left out the rest of my quote underscores a tendency to focus on the negative and find fault. Here's the full quote: "The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . . when it does, and as long as they themselves stay on track." Are you claiming I don't think certain members of our leadership have gone off track? Why so eager to find offense?
Nevertheless, it made me laugh out loud, regardless if that is perceived as fault finding or taking offense. I did laugh out loud. Promise. Pinky promise. Cross my heart and hope to die.

larsenb
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

Arm Chair Quarterback wrote: November 19th, 2024, 4:39 pm
larsenb wrote: November 19th, 2024, 4:19 pm
Arm Chair Quarterback wrote: November 18th, 2024, 10:54 pm In light of recent church policy changes supporting vaccines, a new emphasis on outreach to LGBTQ radicalization, and news releases in support of globalist and marxist ideologies, the irony of this statement in the OP made me laugh out loud:

"The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . "
The fact that you left out the rest of my quote underscores a tendency to focus on the negative and find fault. Here's the full quote: "The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . . when it does, and as long as they themselves stay on track." Are you claiming I don't think certain members of our leadership have gone off track? Why so eager to find offense?
Nevertheless, it made me laugh out loud, regardless if that is perceived as fault finding or taking offense. I did laugh out loud. Promise. Pinky promise. Cross my heart and hope to die.
I have no doubt you laughed out loud at your misrepresentation. To each his own.

JohnnyL
Posts: 10405

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by JohnnyL »

larsenb wrote: November 19th, 2024, 4:36 pm
JohnnyL wrote: November 19th, 2024, 11:07 am Still quite a lengthy and laborious read, though slightly better. He did a lot of tip-toeing, but left lots of hints and clues along the way, I guess.
I think it would have helped tremendously to give synopses of lots of conspiracies that have been fleshed out and proven over the years, and point out many mysterious groups of deaths connected to events/ politicians.

All in all, instead I'd definitely spend more time reading something much easier and insightful like Veil of Authority (especially if you have Kindle Unlimited; it's on Amazon.com).
I'm really surprised how no one yet posting here seems to understand what a milestone this series of articles is. I've been waiting for 30 years for some prominent LDS leader or LDS thought leader to delve into this subject. This is the first I've seen someone from this group do it. He even quotes Cleon Skousen's Naked Capitalist and outs Cecil Rhodes, etc.

Why on earth would you expect him to know and comment on everything many of us who have bird-dogged this topic for years may know about??

Daniel Peterson is even jumping on the bandwagon: "The so-called “secret combinations” of the Book of Mormon have long been of particular interest to me. Here are three articles about them from Jeff Lindsay, a valued member of the Interpreter Foundation’s board of directors and until recently one of the editors of Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, that were recently published in Meridian Magazine:" from: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... eyond.html
Yes, it is a milestone. I've been waiting for decades for anything, even a tiny piece, of this. And it's not bad. It just would have been very nice--being a milestone--if it had been much simpler, clearer, easier to follow, and more tied in to the scriptures and especially the Book of Mormon and Church history.
Can you imagine seeing a milestone and it's so confusing you have no idea what it's saying, when it could have said, "Chicago: 5 miles"?
It was seriously laborious and "long-winded".

He is obviously not a newbie to this topic.
He could have asked--there are plenty of websites about this topic. Or, he could have come here. 8-)

I would have started out by debunking "baseless conspiracy theories", then somewhere in there, talked about the whole Covid experience, pressure from the government to shut down free speech, etc. :P

I realize he had constrictions, and had to be careful to pretty much only use the enemies' or scholarly material against them.

larsenb
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

JohnnyL wrote: November 19th, 2024, 5:30 pm
larsenb wrote: November 19th, 2024, 4:36 pm
JohnnyL wrote: November 19th, 2024, 11:07 am Still quite a lengthy and laborious read, though slightly better. He did a lot of tip-toeing, but left lots of hints and clues along the way, I guess.
I think it would have helped tremendously to give synopses of lots of conspiracies that have been fleshed out and proven over the years, and point out many mysterious groups of deaths connected to events/ politicians.

All in all, instead I'd definitely spend more time reading something much easier and insightful like Veil of Authority (especially if you have Kindle Unlimited; it's on Amazon.com).
I'm really surprised how no one yet posting here seems to understand what a milestone this series of articles is. I've been waiting for 30 years for some prominent LDS leader or LDS thought leader to delve into this subject. This is the first I've seen someone from this group do it. He even quotes Cleon Skousen's Naked Capitalist and outs Cecil Rhodes, etc.

Why on earth would you expect him to know and comment on everything many of us who have bird-dogged this topic for years may know about??

Daniel Peterson is even jumping on the bandwagon: "The so-called “secret combinations” of the Book of Mormon have long been of particular interest to me. Here are three articles about them from Jeff Lindsay, a valued member of the Interpreter Foundation’s board of directors and until recently one of the editors of Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, that were recently published in Meridian Magazine:" from: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... eyond.html
Yes, it is a milestone. I've been waiting for decades for anything, even a tiny piece, of this. And it's not bad. It just would have been very nice--being a milestone--if it had been much simpler, clearer, easier to follow, and more tied in to the scriptures and especially the Book of Mormon and Church history.
Can you imagine seeing a milestone and it's so confusing you have no idea what it's saying, when it could have said, "Chicago: 5 miles"?
It was seriously laborious and "long-winded".

He is obviously not a newbie to this topic.
He could have asked--there are plenty of websites about this topic. Or, he could have come here. 8-)

I would have started out by debunking "baseless conspiracy theories", then somewhere in there, talked about the whole Covid experience, pressure from the government to shut down free speech, etc. :P

I realize he had constrictions, and had to be careful to pretty much only use the enemies' or scholarly material against them.
The real significance is who he is, and the fact he published in Meridian Magazine, which is an outlet that probably rivals the Ensign in reaching an active LDS audience. Posting or publishing on numerous websites on this topic would have little or no effect on an LDS audience. Or citing such web sites would detract from his 'scholarly' approach.

onefour1
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by onefour1 »

larsenb wrote: October 29th, 2024, 12:13 pm This is such a milestone in my view, that I think it warrants a separate thread. So far, Jeff Lindsay has come out with 3 articles on this subject, starting off with an exhaustive analysis on the various secret combinations described, displayed and warned about, in the Book of Mormon. His latest article came out just today.

He is the former Chief Editor of the Interpreter Journal, A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, whose founding editor was Daniel Peterson, from the 2012 time-frame.

A prominent feature of his articles is his references to Moroni's description and warning about them in Ether 8 and elsewhere.

In his Part 4 article, yet to be published, Lindsay says: "The importance of the modern battle to preserve liberty may become more clear in Part 4. There we will examine some calm, rational insights from those who have been close to some notable secret societies, including the scholarly work of a respected professor. Such insights may help us evaluate the Book of Mormon’s teachings and warnings and better appreciate how relevant it is for our day."

The Church, in my strongly held view is the rather incredible aggregate and variety of views and testimonies of the individual members. The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . . when it does, and as long as they themselves stay on track. But the Church is primarily its congregants, their experiences, their testimonies, their efforts to do good.

Here is a link to Lindsay's latest article: Secret Combinations: A Practical Guide to the Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme-Pt. 3, By Jeff Lindsay · October 28, 2024: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/secret-co ... heme-pt-3/

Here are links to his first two articles, also posted here:: viewtopic.php?p=1521843#p1521843 .

Practical Guide to the Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme: Secret Combinations
By Jeff Lindsay · October 14, 2024 https://latterdaysaintmag.com/a-practic ... binations/

and

Secret Combinations: A Practical Guide to Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme-Pt. 2
By Jeff Lindsay · October 18, 2024 https://latterdaysaintmag.com/secret-co ... ted-theme/
I just read the first article by Jeff Lindsay and was quite impressed. Yes we all need to come to a deep knowledge on this topic and not let these secret combinations get above us!!
THANKS FOR YOUR POST!!!

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Hogmeister
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by Hogmeister »

larsenb wrote: November 19th, 2024, 4:36 pm
JohnnyL wrote: November 19th, 2024, 11:07 am Still quite a lengthy and laborious read, though slightly better. He did a lot of tip-toeing, but left lots of hints and clues along the way, I guess.
I think it would have helped tremendously to give synopses of lots of conspiracies that have been fleshed out and proven over the years, and point out many mysterious groups of deaths connected to events/ politicians.

All in all, instead I'd definitely spend more time reading something much easier and insightful like Veil of Authority (especially if you have Kindle Unlimited; it's on Amazon.com).
I'm really surprised how no one yet posting here seems to understand what a milestone this series of articles is. I've been waiting for 30 years for some prominent LDS leader or LDS thought leader to delve into this subject. This is the first I've seen someone from this group do it. He even quotes Cleon Skousen's Naked Capitalist and outs Cecil Rhodes, etc.

Why on earth would you expect him to know and comment on everything many of us who have bird-dogged this topic for years may know about??

Daniel Peterson is even jumping on the bandwagon: "The so-called “secret combinations” of the Book of Mormon have long been of particular interest to me. Here are three articles about them from Jeff Lindsay, a valued member of the Interpreter Foundation’s board of directors and until recently one of the editors of Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, that were recently published in Meridian Magazine:" from: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... eyond.html
I think we have reached a point where it would be very detrimental for the top brass to continue to avoid the most neglected subject and commandment. I think this article series is some kind of appeasement to, if possible, avoid a split or breach among the general grass roots membership in the church. But I wouldn't hold my breath that someone will sound the trump in GC.
Last edited by Hogmeister on November 26th, 2024, 5:01 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Hogmeister
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Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by Hogmeister »

onefour1 wrote: November 25th, 2024, 3:56 pm
larsenb wrote: October 29th, 2024, 12:13 pm This is such a milestone in my view, that I think it warrants a separate thread. So far, Jeff Lindsay has come out with 3 articles on this subject, starting off with an exhaustive analysis on the various secret combinations described, displayed and warned about, in the Book of Mormon. His latest article came out just today.

He is the former Chief Editor of the Interpreter Journal, A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, whose founding editor was Daniel Peterson, from the 2012 time-frame.

A prominent feature of his articles is his references to Moroni's description and warning about them in Ether 8 and elsewhere.

In his Part 4 article, yet to be published, Lindsay says: "The importance of the modern battle to preserve liberty may become more clear in Part 4. There we will examine some calm, rational insights from those who have been close to some notable secret societies, including the scholarly work of a respected professor. Such insights may help us evaluate the Book of Mormon’s teachings and warnings and better appreciate how relevant it is for our day."

The Church, in my strongly held view is the rather incredible aggregate and variety of views and testimonies of the individual members. The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . . when it does, and as long as they themselves stay on track. But the Church is primarily its congregants, their experiences, their testimonies, their efforts to do good.

Here is a link to Lindsay's latest article: Secret Combinations: A Practical Guide to the Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme-Pt. 3, By Jeff Lindsay · October 28, 2024: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/secret-co ... heme-pt-3/

Here are links to his first two articles, also posted here:: viewtopic.php?p=1521843#p1521843 .

Practical Guide to the Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme: Secret Combinations
By Jeff Lindsay · October 14, 2024 https://latterdaysaintmag.com/a-practic ... binations/

and

Secret Combinations: A Practical Guide to Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme-Pt. 2
By Jeff Lindsay · October 18, 2024 https://latterdaysaintmag.com/secret-co ... ted-theme/
I just read the first article by Jeff Lindsay and was quite impressed. Yes we all need to come to a deep knowledge on this topic and not let these secret combinations get above us!!
THANKS FOR YOUR POST!!!
Too little too late. The combination is in control everywhere.

larsenb
Posts: 12096
Location: Between here and Standing Rock

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

Hogmeister wrote: November 26th, 2024, 4:55 am
larsenb wrote: November 19th, 2024, 4:36 pm
JohnnyL wrote: November 19th, 2024, 11:07 am Still quite a lengthy and laborious read, though slightly better. He did a lot of tip-toeing, but left lots of hints and clues along the way, I guess.
I think it would have helped tremendously to give synopses of lots of conspiracies that have been fleshed out and proven over the years, and point out many mysterious groups of deaths connected to events/ politicians.

All in all, instead I'd definitely spend more time reading something much easier and insightful like Veil of Authority (especially if you have Kindle Unlimited; it's on Amazon.com).
I'm really surprised how no one yet posting here seems to understand what a milestone this series of articles is. I've been waiting for 30 years for some prominent LDS leader or LDS thought leader to delve into this subject. This is the first I've seen someone from this group do it. He even quotes Cleon Skousen's Naked Capitalist and outs Cecil Rhodes, etc.

Why on earth would you expect him to know and comment on everything many of us who have bird-dogged this topic for years may know about??

Daniel Peterson is even jumping on the bandwagon: "The so-called “secret combinations” of the Book of Mormon have long been of particular interest to me. Here are three articles about them from Jeff Lindsay, a valued member of the Interpreter Foundation’s board of directors and until recently one of the editors of Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, that were recently published in Meridian Magazine:" from: https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... eyond.html
I think we have reached a point where it would be very detrimental for the top brass to continue to avoid the most neglected subject and commandment. I think this article series is some kind of appeasement to, if possible, avoid a split or breach among the general grass roots membership in the church. But I wouldn't hold my breath that someone will sound the trump in GC.
I think it's an honest attempt by Jeff Lindsay to broach a topic that dearly needs airing. I don't see what he has done as being instigated by higher ups using him as their agent. This doesn't mean that airing the topic doesn't have the effect you suggest.

larsenb
Posts: 12096
Location: Between here and Standing Rock

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

Hogmeister wrote: November 26th, 2024, 4:58 am
onefour1 wrote: November 25th, 2024, 3:56 pm
larsenb wrote: October 29th, 2024, 12:13 pm This is such a milestone in my view, that I think it warrants a separate thread. So far, Jeff Lindsay has come out with 3 articles on this subject, starting off with an exhaustive analysis on the various secret combinations described, displayed and warned about, in the Book of Mormon. His latest article came out just today.

He is the former Chief Editor of the Interpreter Journal, A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship, whose founding editor was Daniel Peterson, from the 2012 time-frame.

A prominent feature of his articles is his references to Moroni's description and warning about them in Ether 8 and elsewhere.

In his Part 4 article, yet to be published, Lindsay says: "The importance of the modern battle to preserve liberty may become more clear in Part 4. There we will examine some calm, rational insights from those who have been close to some notable secret societies, including the scholarly work of a respected professor. Such insights may help us evaluate the Book of Mormon’s teachings and warnings and better appreciate how relevant it is for our day."

The Church, in my strongly held view is the rather incredible aggregate and variety of views and testimonies of the individual members. The leadership is important in administrating the organization and in its successful attempts to keep the membership from going off track .. . . when it does, and as long as they themselves stay on track. But the Church is primarily its congregants, their experiences, their testimonies, their efforts to do good.

Here is a link to Lindsay's latest article: Secret Combinations: A Practical Guide to the Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme-Pt. 3, By Jeff Lindsay · October 28, 2024: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/secret-co ... heme-pt-3/

Here are links to his first two articles, also posted here:: viewtopic.php?p=1521843#p1521843 .

Practical Guide to the Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme: Secret Combinations
By Jeff Lindsay · October 14, 2024 https://latterdaysaintmag.com/a-practic ... binations/

and

Secret Combinations: A Practical Guide to Book of Mormon’s Most Neglected Theme-Pt. 2
By Jeff Lindsay · October 18, 2024 https://latterdaysaintmag.com/secret-co ... ted-theme/
I just read the first article by Jeff Lindsay and was quite impressed. Yes we all need to come to a deep knowledge on this topic and not let these secret combinations get above us!!
THANKS FOR YOUR POST!!!
Too little too late. The combination is in control everywhere.
Tough to avoid this conclusion much of the time. But what is one supposed to do, just roll over?

larsenb
Posts: 12096
Location: Between here and Standing Rock

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

Here is another outstanding article by Jeff Lindsay, posted in Meridian Magazine on 13 Jan 2025: The Word of Wisdom and the Science of Secret Combinations, at: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/the-word- ... binations/

I think these articles by Lindsay shows that members of the church, and prominent ones at that, are very aware and are trying to get the word out. He doesn't address directly the issue of our leaders pushing the mandate protocols and the shots, but by implication, I think you could have a very good discussion with Jeff on this subject, and he wouldn't be lockstep by any stretch of the imagination.

He even addresses the COVID fiasco and tragedy and the damage done by the shots, etc., to include delving into the Great Barrington Declaration.

I'm posting just one section from a long article on this subject:
The Government’s Response to the Great Barrington Declaration: Real Science vs. the Cult of Science

At a critical moment in American history, as a nation in fear was being asked to continue sacrificing many liberties as lockdowns were being imposed across the country. These would shut down many parts of the economy, our schools, organized religion, etc., and adversely affect the health of children in many ways (increased obesity from lack of activity, severe mental health issues, developmental problems, etc.). We were told that this is what “the science” demanded and almost no journalists dared ask questions about this.

At that time, three of the greatest experts in public health and epidemiology spoke out and reminded of key best practices based upon science and sound policy. These were Dr. Jay Bhattacharya (Stanford Univ.), Dr. Sunetra Gupta (Oxford) and Dr. Martin Kulldorff (Harvard). They came together at the American Institute for Economic Research in Great Barrington, Massachusetts to discuss the crisis, and spontaneously decided to draft a declaration to the scientific community, political leaders, and the world warning that the policies being pursued would come at great costs and make things worse. What became the “Great Barrington Declaration” was written from October 2 to 4, 2020, then released to the public on October 5. The declaration has now been signed by nearly 1 million people and a great number of scientists. It directly challenged what politicians had been calling “the science” as they ramped up their power and trampled on ours.

Whose science was right? What does one do when two groups of scientists have strongly different theories? The scientific method is clear: explore data and the analysis; test the theories; if things are murky, design new experiments and get more data. This was time for a classic scientific debate based on logic and evidence. Instead, the leaders of the U.S. public health apparatus got together and literally conspired to use the popular media to “take down” their political enemies, those scientists who dared challenge their power. Here is what the head of the NIH, Dr. Francis Collins, wrote to Anthony Fauci on Oct. 8, three days after the Great Barrington Declaration (GBD) was posted:

This proposal from the three fringe epidemiologists . . . seems to be getting a lot of attention – and even a co-signature from Nobel Prize winner Mike Leavitt at Stanford. There needs to be a quick and devastating published take down of its premises. Is it underway?

That email and others were obtained through a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request by the American Institute for Economic Research. Those emails showed that Collins and Fauci managed a propaganda campaign against the GBD. Popular media organizations conducted what was essentially a smear campaign to silence the once-widely respected “fringe epidemiologists.” For example, Collins went to the Washington Post. They responded with an Oct. 14 article whose headline declared that the Great Barrington Declaration gained Trump’s approval “but appalls top scientists.” Collins was quoted:

This is a fringe component of epidemiology. This is not mainstream science. It’s dangerous. It fits into the political views of certain parts of our confused political establishment.

We know from the “Twitter Files” and other documents that government figures pressured social media to silence these independent thinkers. Even finding the GDB on Google or finding discussion of it on other platform became difficult. The media was on board. The critics were shunned and silenced and America and many other nations continued marching down the path of draconian lockdowns, following the example of China, though not as harsh. Millions would lose their jobs and more would be denied education, healthy activity, and family visits. Economies would be crushed, supply chains destroyed, and freedom suppressed, including freedom of religion.

The elderly would die alone without family at their side. When my 88-year-old mother with severe dementia broke her leg and was rushed to a large hospital in Salt Lake City, the hospital staff refused to let anyone from her family accompany her. She was dragged away from them, screaming in fear without loved-ones present, in great pain and having no idea what was going on. After getting guidance from a relative who was a physician familiar with that hospital, it took me two hours of making calls and working through an ugly system to finally get a top administrator to agree that their own rules allowed for some accommodation given her severe emotional distress and psychological needs. Thanks to unlocking a touch of humanity, I was allowed to come to the hospital and stay with her, but absolutely no more than one visitor at a time was allowed because of “science.” It was eerie being in that hospital that seemed so empty. I felt as if I were the only visitor there when so much lonely suffering must have been underway. Humanity and common sense had taken a setback.

The lockdowns were a global disaster. Sweden, Tanzania, and other countries that ignored the sacrifices demanded by the Cult of Science did well, as the GBD declared. The most severe, most heavily enforced lockdowns of all in China only delayed the infection that almost everyone got and had made everything much worse, exactly as the Great Barrington Declaration predicted. In my opinion, the censorship that kept a vital debate from taking place was a crime against humanity and one of the ugliest “works of darkness” in modern history. But it was a great time for would-be tyrants who reveled in their power. Now a good deal of scientific research confirms what a failure they were. One early example is Ari R. Joffe, “Rethinking the Lockdown Groupthink,” Frontiers in Public Health (Feb. 26, 2021). For a broad overview of a large body of literature, see the press release for 220-page downloadable book, Did Lockdowns Work? The verdict on Covid restrictions by Jonas Herby, Lars Jonung & Steve H. Hanke, published July 2023 by the London-based Institute of Economic Affairs. (The book is an updated version of a 2022 report from by the Johns Hopkins Institute for Applied Economics, Global Health, and the Study of Business Enterprise.) This comprehensive meta-study on the impact of the lockdowns demands attention. One of the authors, Dr. Lars Jonung summarizes their findings: “It demonstrates that lockdowns were a failed promise. They had negligible health effects but disastrous economic, social and political costs to society. Most likely lockdowns represent the biggest policy mistake in modern times” (emphasis added).

Whatever the consequences of the lockdowns, they were not based on real science. Rather, they were an expression of the Cult of Science justifying massive power grabs. Much of the world marched in lockstep with unscientific demands of a combination of public health officials in the U.S., the U.K., the World Health Organization, and many other accomplices. Those who questioned were shut down.

larsenb
Posts: 12096
Location: Between here and Standing Rock

Re: Jeff Lindsay's Articles on Secret Combinations -Meridian Magazine

Post by larsenb »

larsenb wrote: January 17th, 2025, 1:10 pm Here is another outstanding article by Jeff Lindsay, posted in Meridian Magazine on 13 Jan 2025: The Word of Wisdom and the Science of Secret Combinations, at: https://latterdaysaintmag.com/the-word- ... binations/

I think these articles by Lindsay shows that members of the church, and prominent ones at that, are very aware and are trying to get the word out. He doesn't address directly the issue of our leaders pushing the mandate protocols and the shots, but by implication, I think you could have a very good discussion with Jeff on this subject, and he wouldn't be lockstep by any stretch of the imagination.

He even addresses the COVID fiasco and tragedy and the damage done by the shots, etc., to include delving into the Great Barrington Declaration.

I'm posting just one section from a long article on this subject:
The Government’s Response to the Great Barrington Declaration: Real Science vs. the Cult of Science

At a critical moment in American history, as a nation in fear was being asked to continue sacrificing many liberties as lockdowns were being imposed across the country. These would shut down many parts of the economy, our schools, organized religion, etc., and adversely affect the health of children in many ways (increased obesity from lack of activity, severe mental health issues, developmental problems, etc.). We were told that this is what “the science” demanded and almost no journalists dared ask questions about this.

At that time, three of the greatest experts in public health and epidemiology spoke out and reminded of key best practices based upon science and sound policy. These were Dr. Jay Bhattacharya (Stanford Univ.), Dr. Sunetra Gupta (Oxford) and Dr. Martin Kulldorff (Harvard). They came together at the American Institute for Economic Research in Great Barrington, Massachusetts to discuss the crisis, and spontaneously decided to draft a declaration to the scientific community, political leaders, and the world warning that the policies being pursued would come at great costs and make things worse. What became the “Great Barrington Declaration” was written from October 2 to 4, 2020, then released to the public on October 5. The declaration has now been signed by nearly 1 million people and a great number of scientists. It directly challenged what politicians had been calling “the science” as they ramped up their power and trampled on ours.

Whose science was right? What does one do when two groups of scientists have strongly different theories? The scientific method is clear: explore data and the analysis; test the theories; if things are murky, design new experiments and get more data. This was time for a classic scientific debate based on logic and evidence. Instead, the leaders of the U.S. public health apparatus got together and literally conspired to use the popular media to “take down” their political enemies, those scientists who dared challenge their power. Here is what the head of the NIH, Dr. Francis Collins, wrote to Anthony Fauci on Oct. 8, three days after the Great Barrington Declaration (GBD) was posted:

This proposal from the three fringe epidemiologists . . . seems to be getting a lot of attention – and even a co-signature from Nobel Prize winner Mike Leavitt at Stanford. There needs to be a quick and devastating published take down of its premises. Is it underway?

That email and others were obtained through a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request by the American Institute for Economic Research. Those emails showed that Collins and Fauci managed a propaganda campaign against the GBD. Popular media organizations conducted what was essentially a smear campaign to silence the once-widely respected “fringe epidemiologists.” For example, Collins went to the Washington Post. They responded with an Oct. 14 article whose headline declared that the Great Barrington Declaration gained Trump’s approval “but appalls top scientists.” Collins was quoted:

This is a fringe component of epidemiology. This is not mainstream science. It’s dangerous. It fits into the political views of certain parts of our confused political establishment.

We know from the “Twitter Files” and other documents that government figures pressured social media to silence these independent thinkers. Even finding the GDB on Google or finding discussion of it on other platform became difficult. The media was on board. The critics were shunned and silenced and America and many other nations continued marching down the path of draconian lockdowns, following the example of China, though not as harsh. Millions would lose their jobs and more would be denied education, healthy activity, and family visits. Economies would be crushed, supply chains destroyed, and freedom suppressed, including freedom of religion.

The elderly would die alone without family at their side. When my 88-year-old mother with severe dementia broke her leg and was rushed to a large hospital in Salt Lake City, the hospital staff refused to let anyone from her family accompany her. She was dragged away from them, screaming in fear without loved-ones present, in great pain and having no idea what was going on. After getting guidance from a relative who was a physician familiar with that hospital, it took me two hours of making calls and working through an ugly system to finally get a top administrator to agree that their own rules allowed for some accommodation given her severe emotional distress and psychological needs. Thanks to unlocking a touch of humanity, I was allowed to come to the hospital and stay with her, but absolutely no more than one visitor at a time was allowed because of “science.” It was eerie being in that hospital that seemed so empty. I felt as if I were the only visitor there when so much lonely suffering must have been underway. Humanity and common sense had taken a setback.

The lockdowns were a global disaster. Sweden, Tanzania, and other countries that ignored the sacrifices demanded by the Cult of Science did well, as the GBD declared. The most severe, most heavily enforced lockdowns of all in China only delayed the infection that almost everyone got and had made everything much worse, exactly as the Great Barrington Declaration predicted. In my opinion, the censorship that kept a vital debate from taking place was a crime against humanity and one of the ugliest “works of darkness” in modern history. But it was a great time for would-be tyrants who reveled in their power. Now a good deal of scientific research confirms what a failure they were. One early example is Ari R. Joffe, “Rethinking the Lockdown Groupthink,” Frontiers in Public Health (Feb. 26, 2021). For a broad overview of a large body of literature, see the press release for 220-page downloadable book, Did Lockdowns Work? The verdict on Covid restrictions by Jonas Herby, Lars Jonung & Steve H. Hanke, published July 2023 by the London-based Institute of Economic Affairs. (The book is an updated version of a 2022 report from by the Johns Hopkins Institute for Applied Economics, Global Health, and the Study of Business Enterprise.) This comprehensive meta-study on the impact of the lockdowns demands attention. One of the authors, Dr. Lars Jonung summarizes their findings: “It demonstrates that lockdowns were a failed promise. They had negligible health effects but disastrous economic, social and political costs to society. Most likely lockdowns represent the biggest policy mistake in modern times” (emphasis added).

Whatever the consequences of the lockdowns, they were not based on real science. Rather, they were an expression of the Cult of Science justifying massive power grabs. Much of the world marched in lockstep with unscientific demands of a combination of public health officials in the U.S., the U.K., the World Health Organization, and many other accomplices. Those who questioned were shut down.
Bump 1. I want to keep this elevated. A really important development in my view. It needs widespread promulgation and is direct evidence that the views and actions of our higher ups and thought leaders may not be a monolithic as those on this forum (and of course, else where) might suppose.

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