True Book of Mormon Geography Lands - Western New York Model and early Church Leaders

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kirtland r.m.
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True Book of Mormon Geography Lands - Western New York Model and early Church Leaders

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Putting a finer point on the latter movements of the Nephites as well as more about other Book of Mormon people, here are more statements by Joseph F. Smith with a Preface By I am still holding back some Church leaders statements for another time.

Joseph Fielding Smith
The following Preface should cause all readers to consider what President [no he wasn’t President at the time of its writing but he did not change one word of it after becoming President] Joseph Fielding Smith said about Cumorah, and not toss them aside as if they were from just another armchair geography hobbyist’s imagination:


This third volume in the Doctrines of Salvation series gives pointed consideration to many of the most fascinating and little understood principles of the gospel. In it President Joseph Fielding Smith points out the signs of the times, analyzes the prophecies relative to the Second Coming of our Lord, sets forth the events which will precede and attend that glorious day, and describes the conditions destined to prevail during the millennial era.

In addition he tells how priesthood and keys operate, explains the apostolic position, and reveals how the President of the Church is chosen and set apart. Light is throw also on Book of Mormon geography, patriarchal blessings, world governments, the great apostasy, and many more vital subjects. Paying tribute to him on the 80th anniversary of his birth (July 19, 1956), his associates in the Council of the Twelve published a message of love, greeting, and affection which included the following:

President Joseph Fielding Smith has inherited in rich measure the dauntless courage and the unswerving devotion to duty which have characterized the lives of his noble ancestors. For more than forty-six years as a member of the Council of the Twelve he has been a fearless defender of the faith and an untiring preacher of the gospel of repentance. In his vigorous denunciation of the theories of men which would negate the truths of the restored gospel, he has often drawn the criticisms of some of the exponents of the theories he has assailed, but seldom has he failed to win the admiration and respect of his severest critics because of his scholarship and the consistency of his course, which is as undeviating as the stars of heaven. No one ever has had occasion to question where he stood on any controversial issue.

“. . . In his profound gospel writings and in his theological dissertations, he has given to his associates and to the Church a rich legacy which will immortalize his name among the faithful.”

The standard works excepted, probably more copies of his books on gospel subjects have been sold than of any other man in our dispensation. Total copies sold now run to several hundred thousand. Certainly none in our day has spoken or written with greater plainness, or more spiritual insight, or with greater ability to give living meaning to the mysteries of the kingdom than has he.

This third volume of Doctrines of Salvation, containing as it does many doctrinal explanations not found elsewhere in Latter-day Saint literature, warrants the attentive consideration of gospel students everywhere.

As with previous volumes, I am grateful to many people for help and counsel. Chief credit goes to President Smith, himself, for the great doctrinal contribution of the work itself. Again also I am grateful to Elder Oscar W. McConkie, my father, and to Elder Milton R. Hunter of the First Council of Seventy, both of whom have given much counsel and many helpful suggestions. And again also Elder Joseph Fielding Smith, Jr. set the type and made many valued suggestions; and Sister Velma Harvey, my very able secretary, typed the host of documents involved and gave painstaking attention to proofreading and other details.—Bruce R. McConkie (Salt Lake City, Utah July 19, 1956 Joseph Fielding Smith Jr., Doctrines of Salvation, vol.3, p.2)

The following points in support of ONE CUMORAH, in Palmyra, were enough for President Joseph Fielding Smith, yet discarded, not in part, but in full by Mesotheorists:


SPECULATION ABOUT BOOK OF MORMON GEOGRAPHY. Within recent years there has arisen among certain students of the Book of Mormon a theory to the effect that within the period covered by the Book of Mormon, the Nephites and Lamanites were confined almost entirely within the borders of the territory comprising Central America and the southern portion of Mexico—the isthmus of Tehauntepec probably being the “narrow neck” of land spoken of in the Book of Mormon rather than the isthmus of Panama.

This theory is founded upon the assumption that it was impossible for the colony of Lehi’s to multiply and fill the hemisphere within the limits of 1,000 years, or from the coming of Lehi from Jerusalem to the time of the destruction of the Nephites at the Hill Cumorah. Moreover, they claim that the story in the Book of Mormon of the migrations, building of cities, and the wars and contentions, preclude the possibility of the people spreading over great distances such as we find within the borders Of North and South America.

EARTH POPULATED RAPIDLY. If we are willing to accept the Bible record, which is confirmed by the Doctrine and Covenants, the entire civilization of the earth was destroyed in the flood except Noah and his family. Moreover, this destruction took place less than 5,000 years ago, and today the population of the earth, notwithstanding wars and destructions, is estimated at over 2,000,000,000 souls.

The population of Europe, based upon the best records available, is vastly increased over that at the time of the discovery of America; yet upon this hemisphere are to be found hundreds of millions of people, descendants of European and Asiatic ancestors who knew nothing of this land before the discovery by Columbus. The rapid increase of posterity is known to every genealogist who has traced the record of the early settlers in this western country.

LOCALE OF CUMORAH, RAMAH, AND RIPLIANCUM. This modernistic theory of necessity, in order to be consistent, must place the waters of Ripliancum and the Hill Cumorah some place within the restricted territory of Central America, notwithstanding the teachings of the Church to the contrary for upwards of 100 years. BECAUSE OF THIS THEORY SOME MEMBERS OF THE CHURCH HAVE BECOME CONFUSED AND GREATLY DISTURBED IN THEIR FAITH IN THE BOOK OF MORMON.

[Our position is to build faith, not to weaken it, and theories concerning the geography of the Book of Mormon can most certainly undermine faith (The Deseret News, “Geography Problems,” July 29, 1978, p. 16).]

In some instances worthwhile persons may be DISSUADED BY OUR OWN ERRORS from making a complete investigation of Mormonism [i.e. The Book of Mormon]. (Thomas Stuart Ferguson, Cumorah – Where?, 1947 p. 3)

It is for this reason that evidence is here presented to show that it is not only possible that these places could be located as the Church has held during the past century, but that in very deed such is the case.

It is known that the Hill Cumorah where the Nephites were destroyed is the hill where the Jaredites were also destroyed. This hill was known to the Jaredites as Ramah. It was approximately near to the waters of Ripliancum, which the Book of Ether says, “by interpretation, is large, or to exceed all.” Mormon adds: “And it came to pass that we did march forth to the land of Cumorah, and we did pitch our tents round about the hill Cumorah; and it was in a land of many waters, rivers, and fountains; and here we had hope to gain advantage over the Lamanites.”

EARLY BRETHREN LOCATE CUMORAH IN WESTERN NEW YORK. It must be conceded that this description fits perfectly the land of Cumorah in New York, as it has been known since the visitation of Moroni to the Prophet Joseph Smith, for the hill is in the proximity of the Great Lakes and also in the land of many rivers and fountains. Moreover, the Prophet Joseph Smith himself is on record, definitely declaring the present hill called Cumorah to be the exact hill spoken of in the Book of Mormon.

Further, the fact that all of his associates from the beginning down have spoken of it as the identical hill where Mormon and Moroni hid the records, must carry some weight. It is difficult for a reasonable person to believe that such men as Oliver Cowdery. Brigham Young, Parley P. Pratt, Orson Pratt, David Whitmer, and many others, could speak frequently of the Spot where the Prophet Joseph Smith obtained the plates as the Hill Cumorah, and not be corrected by the Prophet, if that were not the fact. That they did speak of this hill in the days of the Prophet in this definite manner is an established record of history.

OLIVER COWDERY PLACES CUMORAH IN WESTERN NEW YORK. The first reference of this kind is found in the Messenger and Advocate, a paper published by the Church in 1834-5. In a brief history of the rise of the Church prepared by Oliver Cowdery, he makes reference to this particular spot in the following words:

“By turning to the 529th and 530th pages of the Book of Mormon you will read Mormon’s account of the last great struggle as they were encamped round this hill Cumorah. In this valley fell the remaining strength and pride of a once powerful people, the Nephites—once so highly favored of the Lord, but at that time in darkness, doomed to suffer extermination by the hand of their barbarous and uncivilized brethren. From the top of this hill, Mormon, with a few others, after the battle, gazed with horror upon the mangled remains of those who, the day before, were filled with anxiety, hope, or doubt. A few had fled to the south, who were hunted down by the victorious party, and all who would not deny the Savior and his religion, were put to death. Mormon himself, according to the record of his son Moroni, was also slain.

“But a long time previous to this national disaster it appears, from his own account, he foresaw approaching destruction. In fact, if he perused the records of his fathers, which were in his possession, he could have learned that such would be the case. Alma, who lived before the coming of the Messiah, prophesied this. He, however, by divine appointment, abridged from those records, in his own style and language, a short account of the more important and prominent items, from the days of Lehi to his own time, after which he deposited, as he says, on the 529th page, all the records in this same hill, Cumorah, and after gave his small record to his son Moroni, who, as appears from the same, finished, after witnessing the extinction of his people as a nation….

HILL RAMAH IN WESTERN NEW YORK. “This hill, by the Jaredites, was called Ramah; by it, or around it, pitched the famous army of Coriantumr their tents. Coriantumr was the last king of the Jaredites. The opposing army were to the west, and in this same valley, and near by, from day to day, did that mighty race spill their blood, in wrath, contending, as it were brother against brother, and father against son. In this same spot, in full view from the top of this same hill, one may gaze with astonishment upon the ground which was twice covered with the dead and dying of our fellowmen….

“In this vale lie commingled, in one mass of ruin, the ashes of thousands, and in this vale was destined to consume the fair forms and vigorous systems of tens of thousands of the human race—blood mixed with blood, flesh with flesh, bones with bones, and dust with dust.”

PROPHET APPROVES OLIVER COWDERY’S VIEWS. The quibbler might say that this statement from Oliver Cowdery is merely the opinion of Oliver Cowdery and not the expression of the Prophet Joseph Smith. It should be remembered that these letters in which these statements are made were written at the Prophet’s request and under his personal supervision. Surely, under these circumstances, he would not have permitted an error of this kind to creep into the record without correction.

At the commencement of these historical letters is found the following: “That our narrative may be correct, and particularly the introduction, it is proper to inform our patrons, that our Brother J. Smith Jr. . has offered to assist us. Indeed, there are many items connected with the fore part of this subject that render his labor indispensable. With his labor and with authentic documents now in our possession, we hope to render this a pleasing and agreeable narrative, well worth the examination and perusal of the saints.”

Later, during the Nauvoo period of the Church, and again under the direction of the Prophet Joseph Smith, these same letters by Oliver Cowdery, were published in the Times and Seasons, without any thought of correction had this description of the Hill Cumorah been an error.

TESTIMONY OF DAVID WHITMER TO HILL CUMORAH. Another testimony of interest is that of David Whitmer given to Elders Orson Pratt and Joseph F. Smith in September 1878, when they paid him a visit at his home in Richmond. To these brethren he said: “When I was returning to Fayette, with Joseph and Oliver, all of us riding in the wagon. Oliver and I on an old-fashioned wooden spring seat and Joseph behind us—while traveling along in a clear open space, a very pleasant, nice-looking old man suddenly appeared by the side of our wagon and saluted us with, ‘Good morning, it is very warm,’ at the same time wiping his face or forehead with his hand. We returned the salutation, and, by a sign from Joseph, I invited him to ride if he was going our way; but he said very pleasantly, ‘No, I am going to Cumorah.’ This name was something new to me; I did not know what Cumorah meant. We all gazed at him and at each other, and as I looked around inquiringly of Joseph, the old man instantly disappeared, so that I did not see him again.”

Joseph F. Smith asked: “Did you notice his appearance?”

David Whitmer: “I should think I did. He was, I should think, about five feet eight or nine inches tall and heavy set…. His hair and beard were white, like Brother Pratt’s, but his beard was not so heavy. I also remember that he had on his back a sort of knapsack with something in, shaped like a book.”

“GLAD TIDINGS FROM CUMORAH.” Who can read the words of Joseph Smith as recorded in section 128 of the Doctrine and Covenants and not feel that he had reference to the Hill Cumorah in western New York?

“And again, what do we hear? Glad tidings from Cumorah! Moroni, an angel from heaven, declaring the fulfilment of the prophets—the book TO BE REVEALED. A voice of the Lord in the wilderness of Fayette, Seneca county, declaring the three witnesses to bear record of the book!”

While in this statement it is not positively declared that the Hill Cumorah is the place where the plates were obtained, yet the implication that such is the case is overwhelming. Moroni declaring from Cumorah the book to be revealed!

JOSEPH SMITH LOCATES CUMORAH IN WESTERN NEW YORK. Perhaps this matter could rest at this point, but the question of the territory now embraced within the United States having been in possession of Nephites and Lamanites before the death of Mormon, carries some weight in the determining of this matter. In the light of revelation it is absurd for anyone to maintain that the Nephites and Lamanites did not possess this northern land. While Zion’s camp was marching on the way to Jackson County, near the bank of the Illinois River they came to a mound containing the skeleton of a man. The history of this incident is as follows:

“The brethren procured a shovel and a hoe, and removing the earth to the depth of about one foot, discovered the skeleton of a man, almost entire, and between his ribs the stone point of a Lamanitish arrow, which evidently produced his death. Elder Burr Riggs retained the arrow. The contemplation of the scenery around us produced peculiar sensations in our bosoms; and subsequently the visions of the past being opened to my understanding by the Spirit of the Almighty, I discovered that the person whose skeleton was before us was a white Lamanite, a large, thickset man, and a man of God. His name was Zelph. He was a warrior and chieftain under the great prophet Onandagus, who was known from the Hill Cumorah, or eastern sea to the Rocky Mountains. The curse was taken from Zelph, or at least, in part—one of his thigh bones was broken by a stone flung from a sling, while in battle, years before his death. He was killed in battle by the arrow found among his ribs, during the last great struggle of the Lamanites and Nephites.”

HEBER C. KIMBALL TELLS OF DEATH OF ZELPH. Elder Heber C. Kimball who was present recorded the following in his journal: “While on our way we felt anxious to know who the person was who had been killed by that arrow. It was made known to Joseph that he had been an officer who fell in battle, in the last destruction among the Lamanites, and his name was Zelph. This caused us to rejoice much, to think that God was so mindful of us as to show these things to his servant. Brother Joseph had inquired of the Lord, and it was made known in a vision.”

ANCIENT CITY OF MANTI IN MISSOURI. The following is also taken from the history of the travels of the Kirtland Camp: “The camp passed through Huntsville, in Randolph County, which has been appointed as one of the stakes of Zion, and is the ancient site of the City of Manti, and pitched tents at Dark Creek, Salt Licks, seventeen miles. It was reported to the camp that one hundred and ten men had volunteered from Randolph and gone to Far West to settle difficulties.”

The following account of the same event is taken from the daily journal of the Kirtland Camp, and was written by Samuel D. Tyler: “September 25, 1838. We passed through Huntsville, Co, seat of Randolph Co, Pop. 450, and three miles further we bought 32 bu, of corn off one of the brethren who resides in this place. There are several of the brethren round about here and this is the ancient site of the City of Manti, which is spoken of in the Book of Mormon and this is appointed one of the Stakes of Zion, and it is in Randolph County, Missouri, three miles west of the county seat.”

NEPHITE AND JAREDITE WARS IN WESTERN NEW YORK. In the face of this evidence coming from the Prophet Joseph Smith, Oliver Cowdery, and David Whitmer, we cannot say that the Nephites and Lamanites did not possess the territory of the United States and that the Hill Cumorah is in Central America. Neither can we say that the great struggle which resulted in the destruction of the Nephites took place in Central America. If Zelph, a righteous man, was fighting under a great prophet-general in the last battles between the Nephites and Lamanites; if that great prophet-general was known from the Rocky Mountains to “the Hill Cumorah or eastern sea,” then some of those battles, and evidently the final battles did take place within the borders of what is now the United States.

There were no righteous prophets, save the Three Nephites, after the death of Moroni, and we learn that Zelph was slain during one of these battles during the great last struggle between the Nephites and Lamanites and was buried near the Illinois River.

In the Book of Mormon story the Lamanites were constantly crowding the Nephites back towards the north and east. If the battles in which Zelph took part were fought in the country traversed by the Zion’s Camp, then we have every reason to believe from what is written in the Book of Mormon, that the Nephites were forced farther and farther to the north and east until they found themselves in the land of Ripliancum, which both Ether and Mormon declare to us was the land of Ramah or Cumorah, a land of “many waters,” which “by interpretation, is large, or to exceed all.”

This being true, what would be more natural then that Moroni, like his father Mormon, would deposit the plates in the land where the battles came to an end and the Nephites were destroyed? This Moroni says he did, and from all the evidence in the Book of Mormon, augmented by the testimony of the Prophet Joseph Smith, these final battles took place in the territory known as the United States and in the neighborhood of the Great Lakes and hills of Western New York. And here Moroni found the resting place for the sacred instruments which had been committed to his care (Printed in Church News, Sept. 10, 1938, pp, 1, 6; Reprinted. Feb. 27, 1954, pp. 2-3).

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kirtland r.m.
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Re: True Book of Mormon Geography Lands - Western New York Model and early Church Leaders

Post by kirtland r.m. »

Narrow Neck of Land
“It may be surprising to realize that the term “narrow neck of land” is used only once in the entire Book of Mormon. (Ether 10:20). Many think this term is the same as found in Alma 22:32 that says, “a small neck of land”. (Narrow doesn’t mean small). Besides, the narrow neck in Mesoamerica is over 140 miles wide. No location in Central America is surrounded by water because at both ends there are enormous continents. In North America, both the land of Zarahemla and the land of Nephi are nearly surrounded by water, with a small neck of land between them.” Moroni’s America page 21-22

The “Narrow Neck of Land” is a term from the Jaredite record. It makes sense to look for archaeology in Jaredite times. this much more favors Great Lakes geography.

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