THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

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Original_Intent
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Original_Intent »

tmac wrote: March 28th, 2023, 7:58 am I don’t have any bones to pick with his formula. Like Fred, I completely agree with the basic premise — which, in a nutshell, is repentance. Complete repentance.

Moreover, I think the premise of continually asking and DOING what Christ would do in each and every instance, if He were in our shoes, is a sound one (although very deliberative, and sometimes not as certain as one might think — I.e., would JC drive a Ford or a Chevy? Would He root for BYU or Notre Dame?).

Where he loses me a little bit, though, is with the idea that he might be the only person on the face of the earth who is doing this perfectly. I don’t disagree with his skepticism that anyone else is. My genuine skepticism is with the idea that any mortal being is doing (or even capable of doing) it perfectly — including him.

Even if all of his other concepts are correct, to openly and publicly put himself on a pedestal and claim that he is the one and only mortal being alive that has this figured-out can’t help but smack a little bit of pride, and be a little bit of a turn-off. Unless he’s claiming to be God himself, I, for one, struggle a little bit with that premise. But I would be glad to see more fruit to better evaluate that initial, superficial assessment.
Not to pick on you, tmac, you know I love you. and you certainly aren't the only one to feel this way.

Determining if Rob is really as good as he promotes himself is not that relevant, and weighing the purity of his soul is not our job. Like I said, his style is off-putting, but I do think the message which he would have us apply to ourselves is what matters.

I myself am not a righteous person. I love God and try to do His will, and that's the best you can say for me. I stumble often, and I often stumble seriously. But if I speak with the spirit and you hear what I am saying with the spirit, then you have received the word of God. My personal failings don't come into it.

It's why I still watch all 5 sessions of General Conference, occasionally I miss the evening session. With all of their flaws, I do still often hear the Word of God. Sometimes it is in their message, and sometimes the spirit gives me truths that are not even what the speaker is talking about. I come to be fed, and if I am properly prepared I always am. I will say, I have a higher signal to noise ratio with some of the PSRs than others.

Back on point, trying to evaluate if Rob is as good as he portrays himself is just another attempt to find another arm of flesh to lean on. "At last, someone who can do the heavy spiritual lifting for me!" - probably not consciously. I have long felt that God can use whomever He wishes, and if you walk by a homeless guy and he says something that you feel the spirit confirm, you had better pay attention.

To me, Rob feels like someone I need to pay attention to, That may not be the case for everyone, and that is fine. Back in the day there was a strong Denver Snuffer movement here and while I liked him and felt he absolutely nailed it on many things that he said, I did not get caught up in the D.S. movement. And I am not caught up in the Rob Smith movement, but I do feel he is saying things that I need to hear.

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tmac
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by tmac »

OI, I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said. I’ve been thinking a lot about all of this the last few days. It is entirely possible that part of RS’s role is to be able to testify that it is possible. I don’t know.

Having said that (and I realize that I live in a completely, completely different, production oriented world than most people, including RS), I do think that he may operate in a little bit of an academic/theoretical vacuum in terms of the inevitable gap between theory and reality.

Yesterday, for example, I had a long, fairly frustrating day in my world as a rancher. Right now, as it is turning spring, among other things, I am playing midwife to a bunch of livestock, which often means little sleep, and plenty of challenges of all sorts, including weather.

Last night, after a long, frustrating day, full of challenges, I was dealing with a particularly troublesome new mother, who was wreaking havoc with both me, and her new twin babies, who needed their colostrum. As I was starting to lose patience, I thought “WWJD” in this situation? What occurred to me is that, as God, He would have all kinds of options, but as me, a mere mortal, I’m not sure that He would have a lot more options than I do. But, what would He do? Does RS think he knows what Christ would do, as a mortal, under such circumstances?

Atrasado
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Atrasado »

tmac wrote: March 29th, 2023, 7:55 am OI, I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said. I’ve been thinking a lot about all of this the last few days. It is entirely possible that part of RS’s role is to be able to testify that it is possible. I don’t know.

Having said that (and I realize that I live in a completely, completely different, production oriented world than most people, including RS), I do think that he may operate in a little bit of an academic/theoretical vacuum in terms of the inevitable gap between theory and reality.

Yesterday, for example, I had a long, fairly frustrating day in my world as a rancher. Right now, as it is turning spring, among other things, I am playing midwife to a bunch of livestock, which often means little sleep, and plenty of challenges of all sorts, including weather.

Last night, after a long, frustrating day, full of challenges, I was dealing with a particularly troublesome new mother, who was wreaking havoc with both me, and her new twin babies, who needed their colostrum. As I was starting to lose patience, I thought “WWJD” in this situation? What occurred to me is that, as God, He would have all kinds of options, but as me, a mere mortal, I’m not sure that He would have a lot more options than I do. But, what would He do? Does RS think he knows what Christ would do, as a mortal, under such circumstances?
I know exactly what you mean. So often, it just isn't apparent to me what the right answer is to a challenge I face. What do I do then?

I guess we just do the best we can. Maybe that's why Mormon told us to "search diligently in the light of Christ that ye may know good from evil." Sometimes, our conscience just tells us to keep trying. Sometimes, it tells us to just try not to cuss. (I've been around cows before)

Sometimes, we have got to really think about things. Often, we think we have to rush to the end. But I think that sometimes, perhaps most of the time, Heavenly Father wants is to slow down and think things through so that we can grow our spiritual capacity.

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Original_Intent
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Original_Intent »

And as tmac has pointed out, there is no one size fits all answer. Some people seem to pierce the veil easily and others struggle. Some people are more "real world application" and some are more theoretical. I probably lean more to the latter, I have all kinds of ideas of how things might be, but bottom line is that many of those things don't apply to this life, and finding out how things really are after this life is really when it will matter, anyways, so one could say theorizing and pondering is essentially a waste of time. I don't feel that way, but there is a logical argument there that I don't have an answer to.

Maybe more important than knowing specifically what Jesus would do in a situation, is to commit to never do (to the best of our understanding) anything that we know Jesus would NOT do. Perhaps committing to and successfully doing that will help us learn line upon line what he WOULD do.

Hosh
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Hosh »

nightlight wrote: March 28th, 2023, 9:35 pm
Hosh wrote: March 28th, 2023, 9:22 pm
nightlight wrote: March 28th, 2023, 9:15 pm

You're adding words into the scriptures

28And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God. 29Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.

+++++++++++


More ?

Where did He say "more blessed"?

If it's in a different scripture, please quote it...but I can't think of one.

If you're claim that's what Jesus meant, what is this based on?
3 Nephi 12

1 ...therefore blessed are ye if ye shall believe in me and be baptized, after that ye have seen me and know that I am.

2 And again, more blessed are they who shall believe in your words because that ye shall testify that ye have seen me, and that ye know that I am
Thank you

But that is still different than what you are claiming

"therefore blessed are ye if ye shall believe in me and be baptized, after that ye have seen me and know that I am"

Those people believed before they saw Him, and AFTER the fact He came to them.

In what way are they who haven't seen Jesus more blessed? In their ability to do these mighty works, to preach with that great power?? No, the people who Jesus was talking to were doing all the miracles that Jesus was doing, they were receiving the second comforter, etc

Please explain
"In what way are they who haven't seen Jesus more blessed?"

All I know is Jesus says that they are more blessed than those who had Jesus right there in front of them. In what way? I don't really know honestly. Maybe its sort of like, the lessons that are learned on the journey of faith, searching dillegently in the light of Christ, make you better equipped to face telestial challenges than those that just have the answers given to them through concrete evidence? I personally think there is more to it than just that.

Another possibility, through the scope of MMP's, there are those who have been going through endless cycles of telestial lives rejecting over and over the light God gives them to improve and exercise faith. And maybe at this beginning stage of exiting that telestial cycle and progressing forward for that individual, faith on the minimal evidence God gives them through the light of Christ produces far greater power to change them than an angel appearing or some mighty miracle.

On the other hand maybe you have an individual that in previous lives has progressed and is now in a life where his "spiritual watermark" is much higher than others because he has "in the first place" (Alma 13) exercised greater faith than others with minimal evidence, and now it just takes a spark in the form of a mighty miracle or and angel to wake them up to who they are so they can fulfill their mission. Paul and Alma the younger could have been like this.

This of course is just speculation to try and make sense of things, so yeah I don't know for sure. Just some thoughts.

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tmac
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by tmac »

It is true, based on my circumstances, I feel like I live in a very practical, “applied” world. Consequently, for a variety of reasons, I am not near as interested in endlessly debating pure theory, scriptural, purely speculative, or otherwise, as some here seem to be. I am a lot more interested in where the rubber meets the road in the real world that I have chosen to live in.

And back to RS for just a minute. As I have said before, I have no qualms with his message. I think it is based on true and correct principles, and I have no issue with the substantive message in principle. As a stand-alone message, I have no problem with it.

The red flag for me in application, though, is when RS claims what he does about his essentially perfect application of those principles, and then attempts to compare himself to others. In my opinion, even if JC were in RS’s shoes, I would have a hard time seeing JC ever choosing to compare Himself to others in that regard. I don’t see anything constructive or productive coming from comparing ourselves to others, and then commenting publicly on their perceived deficits. If we want to compare ourselves with JC, and the standards He set(s), I don’t really have a problem with that — and we may actually think we stack-up fairly well — whether that is something JC would do or not. But, I don’t see any good really coming from comparing ourselves to anyone else. And I have a hard time seeing JC choosing to do that. But, that’s just me. Obviously, there’s still a lot I don’t comprehend.

And, I do realize that contrary to my theory, I made a hypocritical comparison at the outset of this post.

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tmac
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by tmac »

Following a prayerful, contemplative, meditation process this morning, I seem to be in a more pontificating mode.

I have been pondering a lot lately about the question of what would JC do in every instance if he were in my mortal shoes (WWJD?). First things first, how would He support and provide for Himself, and His family? Would He have a job, or be an entrepreneur, and be a self-employed businessman? Would He own a house, or rent? Would He drive a car or walk? Would He use credit, and incur debt, to do any of the above? How would He organize His life? As a husband, father, grandfather, brother, etc., what would be His priorities? Assuming that He didn’t start out in a theoretical vacuum, and made a variety of mistakes (not necessarily sins — there is a difference), and didn’t do everything perfectly, what kind of corrective process would He engage in, to get everything straightened-out? How would He go about that, given all the competing realities of mortality?

Again, as a very imperfect but very real, mere mortal, operating in the real world, how would JC support and provide for Himself and His family? That is my first question.

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John Tavner
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by John Tavner »

tmac wrote: March 30th, 2023, 9:26 am Following a prayerful, contemplative, meditation process this morning, I seem to be in a more pontificating mode.

I have been pondering a lot lately about the question of what would JC do in every instance if he were in my mortal shoes (WWJD?). First things first, how would He support and provide for Himself, and His family? Would He have a job, or be an entrepreneur, and be a self-employed businessman? Would He own a house, or rent? Would He drive a car or walk? Would He use credit, and incur debt, to do any of the above? How would He organize His life? As a husband, father, grandfather, brother, etc., what would be His priorities? Assuming that He didn’t start out in a theoretical vacuum, and made a variety of mistakes (not necessarily sins — there is a difference), and didn’t do everything perfectly, what kind of corrective process would He engage in, to get everything straightened-out? How would He go about that, given all the competing realities of mortality?

Again, as a very imperfect but very real, mere mortal, operating in the real world, how would JC support and provide for Himself and His family? That is my first question.
1 Tim 5:8 King James Bible
But if any provide not for his own, and specially for those of his own house, he hath denied the faith, and is worse than an infidel.

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Cruiserdude
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Cruiserdude »

tmac wrote: March 30th, 2023, 9:26 am Following a prayerful, contemplative, meditation process this morning, I seem to be in a more pontificating mode.

I have been pondering a lot lately about the question of what would JC do in every instance if he were in my mortal shoes (WWJD?). First things first, how would He support and provide for Himself, and His family? Would He have a job, or be an entrepreneur, and be a self-employed businessman? Would He own a house, or rent? Would He drive a car or walk? Would He use credit, and incur debt, to do any of the above? How would He organize His life? As a husband, father, grandfather, brother, etc., what would be His priorities? Assuming that He didn’t start out in a theoretical vacuum, and made a variety of mistakes (not necessarily sins — there is a difference), and didn’t do everything perfectly, what kind of corrective process would He engage in, to get everything straightened-out? How would He go about that, given all the competing realities of mortality?

Again, as a very imperfect but very real, mere mortal, operating in the real world, how would JC support and provide for Himself and His family? That is my first question.
Don't overthink it. I get what you're saying... most of, if not all, those things you mentioned can be done honorably. You can rent honorably, you can have a mortgage honorably, etc...
You being a farmer/rancher, you have a leg up on most of us with profession... by nature your profession is honorable. It's the decisions we make as we fulfill that role. Are we honorable with our fellow men and our business dealings? Etc etc etc. When we do err or even when we sin(an example applicable to most of us - mistreat someone while under stress, etc etc etc), do we repent of it as soon as it dawns on us, as soon as we recognize it? How about with our family, are we patient, forgiving, understanding, peace seeking? , etc etc
At the moment, this is how I understand what living a Christ-like life would entail.

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tmac
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by tmac »

I’m not asking what a Christ-like life would entail in some theoretical/hypothetical sense. RS is suggesting that the fool-proof “formula” is to consider, ask and answer the question WWJD? in every instance if He were in our mortal shoes, and act accordingly. That requires a lot of thought, and continual thinking and evaluation.

That is an entirely different equation than vaguely striving to live a Christ-like life. JC was an immortal God who not only never sinned, but never made a mistake of any kind. The question here is what would He do as a mere mortal in every instance, if He were in our mortal shoes? In my mind, that is a considerably more complicated and intriguing equation.

Just how much do we actually know about JC, and the nature, mind, and will of God?

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nightlight
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by nightlight »

Cruiserdude wrote: March 30th, 2023, 6:36 pm
tmac wrote: March 30th, 2023, 9:26 am Following a prayerful, contemplative, meditation process this morning, I seem to be in a more pontificating mode.

I have been pondering a lot lately about the question of what would JC do in every instance if he were in my mortal shoes (WWJD?). First things first, how would He support and provide for Himself, and His family? Would He have a job, or be an entrepreneur, and be a self-employed businessman? Would He own a house, or rent? Would He drive a car or walk? Would He use credit, and incur debt, to do any of the above? How would He organize His life? As a husband, father, grandfather, brother, etc., what would be His priorities? Assuming that He didn’t start out in a theoretical vacuum, and made a variety of mistakes (not necessarily sins — there is a difference), and didn’t do everything perfectly, what kind of corrective process would He engage in, to get everything straightened-out? How would He go about that, given all the competing realities of mortality?

Again, as a very imperfect but very real, mere mortal, operating in the real world, how would JC support and provide for Himself and His family? That is my first question.
Don't overthink it. I get what you're saying... most of, if not all, those things you mentioned can be done honorably. You can rent honorably, you can have a mortgage honorably, etc...
You being a farmer/rancher, you have a leg up on most of us with profession... by nature your profession is honorable. It's the decisions we make as we fulfill that role. Are we honorable with our fellow men and our business dealings? Etc etc etc. When we do err or even when we sin(an example applicable to most of us - mistreat someone while under stress, etc etc etc), do we repent of it as soon as it dawns on us, as soon as we recognize it? How about with our family, are we patient, forgiving, understanding, peace seeking? , etc etc
At the moment, this is how I understand what living a Christ-like life would entail.
I appreciate when you speak your mind, bro

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Original_Intent
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Original_Intent »

tmac wrote: March 30th, 2023, 7:39 pm I’m not asking what a Christ-like life would entail in some theoretical/hypothetical sense. RS is suggesting that the fool-proof “formula” is to consider, ask and answer the question WWJD? in every instance if He were in our mortal shoes, and act accordingly. That requires a lot of thought, and continual thinking and evaluation.

That is an entirely different equation than vaguely striving to live a Christ-like life. JC was an immortal God who not only never sinned, but never made a mistake of any kind. The question here is what would He do as a mere mortal in every instance, if He were in our mortal shoes? In my mind, that is a considerably more complicated and intriguing equation.

Just how much do we actually know about JC, and the nature, mind, and will of God?
I don't think it is living in constant analysis of WWJD? I think it is do your best, make your own best judgement but be in tune and willing to change course if prompted. I don't think God wants us wasting away our lives waiting on an answer if we should eat beef or chicken flavored ramen tonight. I think He wants His counsel to be sought for sure, but I also think He wants us to develop decision making capabilities and again, also develop the humility to change course if prompted to do so. And like is written about in "Following the Light of Christ Into His Presence" those promptings MAY be about seemingly minor things like "Pick up those dirty socks" or similar.

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Wolfwoman
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Wolfwoman »

Original_Intent wrote: March 27th, 2023, 9:16 pm He was a university professor and he sacrificed his job (I don't know the details) but I believe it was over him taking an unpopular stand and not backing down. That's admirable.
I’ve commented about this before, and I don’t mean to hate on Rob, but as a woman, I didn’t find it admirable. I don’t have the screenshots; just going off of memory, but he had a blogpost that was all about his advice to young college aged people. He said women’s value is in their youth and their good looks. That’s what gives them the most value. What gives men the most value was working and the amount of money they could make to provide for their family, I think? He said women have their highest value at about age 16-18 or so. So they should definitely get married at age 18 or as close to that as possible. And every year after 25, she’s losing value, because she’s aging and losing her good looks. YCMTSU

So someone at the university saw his crazy blogpost and saw big red flags since he was talking about sex appeal of underage women (age 16-17). So that’s why he lost his job.

Like I said, I’ve mentioned it in here before and some people have gotten offended. Not over the blog content, but the fact that I reported on it here. Not sure why. I haven’t heard any good responses to it. So….I’m open to hearing them.

Maybe he just uh… let his testosterone get the better of him, and he said the quiet part out loud? 😬

Anyway, I’m willing to put it aside as him just being really weird. So I’ll watch the video and see what I think of that too.

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Original_Intent
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Original_Intent »

Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 5:38 am
Original_Intent wrote: March 27th, 2023, 9:16 pm He was a university professor and he sacrificed his job (I don't know the details) but I believe it was over him taking an unpopular stand and not backing down. That's admirable.
I’ve commented about this before, and I don’t mean to hate on Rob, but as a woman, I didn’t find it admirable. I don’t have the screenshots; just going off of memory, but he had a blogpost that was all about his advice to young college aged people. He said women’s value is in their youth and their good looks. That’s what gives them the most value. What gives men the most value was working and the amount of money they could make to provide for their family, I think? He said women have their highest value at about age 16-18 or so. So they should definitely get married at age 18 or as close to that as possible. And every year after 25, she’s losing value, because she’s aging and losing her good looks. YCMTSU

So someone at the university saw his crazy blogpost and saw big red flags since he was talking about sex appeal of underage women (age 16-17). So that’s why he lost his job.

Like I said, I’ve mentioned it in here before and some people have gotten offended. Not over the blog content, but the fact that I reported on it here. Not sure why. I haven’t heard any good responses to it. So….I’m open to hearing them.

Maybe he just uh… let his testosterone get the better of him, and he said the quiet part out loud? 😬

Anyway, I’m willing to put it aside as him just being really weird. So I’ll watch the video and see what I think of that too.
OK, I did not know the details on his blog, and just assumed he had wandered into religious territory and got shut down over it.

LoL @ "YCMTSU" haha

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tmac
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by tmac »

It all just leaves me scratching my head. I haven’t followed him closely, or looked at a ton of his stuff, but what I have looked at I have considered interesting and thought-provoking in many ways, and I don’t have any issue with him promoting his opinions as just that — his opinions. I have already expressed my other biggest concern about his approach. But it does really start to stretch credulity for me when he represents that he is essentially in perfect alignment with the Lord, and never does anything that JC wouldn’t do, if He were in his shoes, and then does stuff like WW described, which is really hard to imagine JC doing. It makes it all a little harder to reconcile.

But, at the end of the day, perhaps it fits along with just about everything else in this world — find truth wherever you can; be discerning, and; don’t worry too much about the rest.

There does not appear to be any mortal source of perfect and complete truth.
Last edited by tmac on March 31st, 2023, 9:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

Hosh
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Hosh »

Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 5:38 am
Original_Intent wrote: March 27th, 2023, 9:16 pm He was a university professor and he sacrificed his job (I don't know the details) but I believe it was over him taking an unpopular stand and not backing down. That's admirable.
I’ve commented about this before, and I don’t mean to hate on Rob, but as a woman, I didn’t find it admirable. I don’t have the screenshots; just going off of memory, but he had a blogpost that was all about his advice to young college aged people. He said women’s value is in their youth and their good looks. That’s what gives them the most value. What gives men the most value was working and the amount of money they could make to provide for their family, I think? He said women have their highest value at about age 16-18 or so. So they should definitely get married at age 18 or as close to that as possible. And every year after 25, she’s losing value, because she’s aging and losing her good looks. YCMTSU

So someone at the university saw his crazy blogpost and saw big red flags since he was talking about sex appeal of underage women (age 16-17). So that’s why he lost his job.

Like I said, I’ve mentioned it in here before and some people have gotten offended. Not over the blog content, but the fact that I reported on it here. Not sure why. I haven’t heard any good responses to it. So….I’m open to hearing them.

Maybe he just uh… let his testosterone get the better of him, and he said the quiet part out loud? 😬

Anyway, I’m willing to put it aside as him just being really weird. So I’ll watch the video and see what I think of that too.
For anyone wanting to make their own judgment on what he believes about all this from His own mouth, watch a recent YouTube video he put out on his Upward Thought channel titled "Female Virginity and Male Income." Its similar to what he had in that old blogpost. At least then you can judge for yourselves. I admit it's different than what we are used to hearing but I don't entirely reject it.

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Wolfwoman
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Wolfwoman »

Hosh wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:37 am
Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 5:38 am
Original_Intent wrote: March 27th, 2023, 9:16 pm He was a university professor and he sacrificed his job (I don't know the details) but I believe it was over him taking an unpopular stand and not backing down. That's admirable.
I’ve commented about this before, and I don’t mean to hate on Rob, but as a woman, I didn’t find it admirable. I don’t have the screenshots; just going off of memory, but he had a blogpost that was all about his advice to young college aged people. He said women’s value is in their youth and their good looks. That’s what gives them the most value. What gives men the most value was working and the amount of money they could make to provide for their family, I think? He said women have their highest value at about age 16-18 or so. So they should definitely get married at age 18 or as close to that as possible. And every year after 25, she’s losing value, because she’s aging and losing her good looks. YCMTSU

So someone at the university saw his crazy blogpost and saw big red flags since he was talking about sex appeal of underage women (age 16-17). So that’s why he lost his job.

Like I said, I’ve mentioned it in here before and some people have gotten offended. Not over the blog content, but the fact that I reported on it here. Not sure why. I haven’t heard any good responses to it. So….I’m open to hearing them.

Maybe he just uh… let his testosterone get the better of him, and he said the quiet part out loud? 😬

Anyway, I’m willing to put it aside as him just being really weird. So I’ll watch the video and see what I think of that too.
For anyone wanting to make their own judgment on what he believes about all this from His own mouth, watch a recent YouTube video he put out on his Upward Thought channel titled "Female Virginity and Male Income." Its similar to what he had in that old blogpost. At least then you can judge for yourselves. I admit it's different than what we are used to hearing but I don't entirely reject it.
Thanks! It was posted 10 days ago. Here is the link for anyone interested.
https://youtu.be/qO_LO24NR_c

I haven’t watched it…
But I read the comments and one thing he said in the comments section is that the number of boyfriends a young woman has is not terribly different from the number of sex partners she has. Ummm…. NO. They are different. At least in an LDS context, assuming women aren’t having sex with their boyfriends…
Reminds me of a silly movie made by homeschooled kids that I watched. The premise was that it was best to not date until you’re engaged to be married. Seriously! The protagonist won’t go on a date with the guy in the movie until he finally proposes to her!

Look, it may have worked at a different time period. It’s not going to work in the modern world. You’re just asking for misery if you do that.

Hosh
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Hosh »

Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:49 am
Hosh wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:37 am
Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 5:38 am

I’ve commented about this before, and I don’t mean to hate on Rob, but as a woman, I didn’t find it admirable. I don’t have the screenshots; just going off of memory, but he had a blogpost that was all about his advice to young college aged people. He said women’s value is in their youth and their good looks. That’s what gives them the most value. What gives men the most value was working and the amount of money they could make to provide for their family, I think? He said women have their highest value at about age 16-18 or so. So they should definitely get married at age 18 or as close to that as possible. And every year after 25, she’s losing value, because she’s aging and losing her good looks. YCMTSU

So someone at the university saw his crazy blogpost and saw big red flags since he was talking about sex appeal of underage women (age 16-17). So that’s why he lost his job.

Like I said, I’ve mentioned it in here before and some people have gotten offended. Not over the blog content, but the fact that I reported on it here. Not sure why. I haven’t heard any good responses to it. So….I’m open to hearing them.

Maybe he just uh… let his testosterone get the better of him, and he said the quiet part out loud? 😬

Anyway, I’m willing to put it aside as him just being really weird. So I’ll watch the video and see what I think of that too.
For anyone wanting to make their own judgment on what he believes about all this from His own mouth, watch a recent YouTube video he put out on his Upward Thought channel titled "Female Virginity and Male Income." Its similar to what he had in that old blogpost. At least then you can judge for yourselves. I admit it's different than what we are used to hearing but I don't entirely reject it.
Thanks! It was posted 10 days ago. Here is the link for anyone interested.
https://youtu.be/qO_LO24NR_c

I haven’t watched it…
But I read the comments and one thing he said in the comments section is that the number of boyfriends a young woman has is not terribly different from the number of sex partners she has. Ummm…. NO. They are different. At least in an LDS context, assuming women aren’t having sex with their boyfriends…
Reminds me of a silly movie made by homeschooled kids that I watched. The premise was that it was best to not date until you’re engaged to be married. Seriously! The protagonist won’t go on a date with the guy in the movie until he finally proposes to her!

Look, it may have worked at a different time period. It’s not going to work in the modern world. You’re just asking for misery if you do that.
That's the thing, I don't think he is ever talking from an LDS context. He has completely separated himself from the LDS and views his audience as anyone from around the world with any background. He's intentional with His wording so that he doesn't cater to any one crowd and their traditions and lingo. So when he is talking about women and how many they date he is talking about the women in babylon/the world in general, not women raised specifically in the LDS church. Granted those two can be (and are often) one and the same, but I agree, what he says isn't totally true if you are focusing on just one specific demographic like woman in the lds church.
I agree it's a pretty large blanket statement he throws out, but like I said, I don't doubt it could be true, I am never surprised to learn the depravity of men (and woman) is far beyond what we sometimes like to pretend. Even (sometimes especially) those with a religious background). Or he could be off his rocker haha. Who knows.

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tmac
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by tmac »

Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:49 am
Hosh wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:37 am
Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 5:38 am

I’ve commented about this before, and I don’t mean to hate on Rob, but as a woman, I didn’t find it admirable. I don’t have the screenshots; just going off of memory, but he had a blogpost that was all about his advice to young college aged people. He said women’s value is in their youth and their good looks. That’s what gives them the most value. What gives men the most value was working and the amount of money they could make to provide for their family, I think? He said women have their highest value at about age 16-18 or so. So they should definitely get married at age 18 or as close to that as possible. And every year after 25, she’s losing value, because she’s aging and losing her good looks. YCMTSU

So someone at the university saw his crazy blogpost and saw big red flags since he was talking about sex appeal of underage women (age 16-17). So that’s why he lost his job.

Like I said, I’ve mentioned it in here before and some people have gotten offended. Not over the blog content, but the fact that I reported on it here. Not sure why. I haven’t heard any good responses to it. So….I’m open to hearing them.

Maybe he just uh… let his testosterone get the better of him, and he said the quiet part out loud? 😬

Anyway, I’m willing to put it aside as him just being really weird. So I’ll watch the video and see what I think of that too.
For anyone wanting to make their own judgment on what he believes about all this from His own mouth, watch a recent YouTube video he put out on his Upward Thought channel titled "Female Virginity and Male Income." Its similar to what he had in that old blogpost. At least then you can judge for yourselves. I admit it's different than what we are used to hearing but I don't entirely reject it.
Thanks! It was posted 10 days ago. Here is the link for anyone interested.
https://youtu.be/qO_LO24NR_c

I haven’t watched it…
But I read the comments and one thing he said in the comments section is that the number of boyfriends a young woman has is not terribly different from the number of sex partners she has. Ummm…. NO. They are different. At least in an LDS context, assuming women aren’t having sex with their boyfriends…
Reminds me of a silly movie made by homeschooled kids that I watched. The premise was that it was best to not date until you’re engaged to be married. Seriously! The protagonist won’t go on a date with the guy in the movie until he finally proposes to her!

Look, it may have worked at a different time period. It’s not going to work in the modern world. You’re just asking for misery if you do that.
Realistically, in terms of a fool-proof mating model, what does actually work in the modern world?

And, this may actually provide an interesting thought exercise with respect to RS’s formula. If JC were in your mortal shoes in this modern world, how would He go about finding a mate? — send ‘em off to college (ideally BYU), and just let hormones do the rest?

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Wolfwoman
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Wolfwoman »

tmac wrote: March 31st, 2023, 10:52 am
Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:49 am
Hosh wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:37 am

For anyone wanting to make their own judgment on what he believes about all this from His own mouth, watch a recent YouTube video he put out on his Upward Thought channel titled "Female Virginity and Male Income." Its similar to what he had in that old blogpost. At least then you can judge for yourselves. I admit it's different than what we are used to hearing but I don't entirely reject it.
Thanks! It was posted 10 days ago. Here is the link for anyone interested.
https://youtu.be/qO_LO24NR_c

I haven’t watched it…
But I read the comments and one thing he said in the comments section is that the number of boyfriends a young woman has is not terribly different from the number of sex partners she has. Ummm…. NO. They are different. At least in an LDS context, assuming women aren’t having sex with their boyfriends…
Reminds me of a silly movie made by homeschooled kids that I watched. The premise was that it was best to not date until you’re engaged to be married. Seriously! The protagonist won’t go on a date with the guy in the movie until he finally proposes to her!

Look, it may have worked at a different time period. It’s not going to work in the modern world. You’re just asking for misery if you do that.
Realistically, in terms of a fool-proof mating model, what does actually work in the modern world?

And, this may actually provide an interesting thought exercise with respect to RS’s formula. If JC were in your mortal shoes in this modern world, how would He go about finding a mate? — send ‘em off to college (ideally BYU), and just let hormones do the rest?
There is no such thing as a fool proof model. Everyone is capable of falling. We are here to be tested and tried. Not everyone passes the test.

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Wolfwoman
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Wolfwoman »

I just finished watching the video in the OP.
Eh. Doesn’t do much for me. The call for repentance is good. But a lot of what he said is problematic. Incredible that he believes he and maybe one other person on earth are actually repentant, doing everything that Christ would do and, apparently belong to the Church of God (and presumably everyone else on earth belongs to the church of the devil, because they’re not repentant). That may be the most prideful thing I’ve ever heard.

I’m also not sure about his idea that the first ones to repent will get the most blessings and the later ones will get less blessings. The parable of the laborers comes to mind, where they were all paid the same even though some worked all day and some only worked at the end of the day.

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Wolfwoman
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Wolfwoman »

tmac wrote: March 31st, 2023, 10:52 am
Wolfwoman wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:49 am
Hosh wrote: March 31st, 2023, 9:37 am

For anyone wanting to make their own judgment on what he believes about all this from His own mouth, watch a recent YouTube video he put out on his Upward Thought channel titled "Female Virginity and Male Income." Its similar to what he had in that old blogpost. At least then you can judge for yourselves. I admit it's different than what we are used to hearing but I don't entirely reject it.
Thanks! It was posted 10 days ago. Here is the link for anyone interested.
https://youtu.be/qO_LO24NR_c

I haven’t watched it…
But I read the comments and one thing he said in the comments section is that the number of boyfriends a young woman has is not terribly different from the number of sex partners she has. Ummm…. NO. They are different. At least in an LDS context, assuming women aren’t having sex with their boyfriends…
Reminds me of a silly movie made by homeschooled kids that I watched. The premise was that it was best to not date until you’re engaged to be married. Seriously! The protagonist won’t go on a date with the guy in the movie until he finally proposes to her!

Look, it may have worked at a different time period. It’s not going to work in the modern world. You’re just asking for misery if you do that.
Realistically, in terms of a fool-proof mating model, what does actually work in the modern world?

And, this may actually provide an interesting thought exercise with respect to RS’s formula. If JC were in your mortal shoes in this modern world, how would He go about finding a mate? — send ‘em off to college (ideally BYU), and just let hormones do the rest?
I’m listening to the video that I linked in here with Rob Smith talking about the virginity of women and the income capability of men.
According to Rob, best case scenario is a 26 year old man who has a great career, makes a great income, and marries an 18 year old virgin. She could be 18-20, but 18 is the best. 22 is too old. He needs to be in the top 1% and so does she. If that’s the case, it’s a match made in Heaven and they will be happy and have joy. The rest of the 99% of us are doomed to misery, I guess, or a less happy existence.

I can’t believe he made a video repeating what he said in the blogpost that got him fired! I guess he really believes it! He did soften a couple of parts. Now it’s age 18 is the most attractive age of women, not 16-18, and a woman isn’t decreasing in value after age 20, she’s just decreasing in the value she can offer to a man who is looking to get married.

Again, I don’t want to hate on Rob, but this is so cringey. I think he would have fit in well in Old Testament times. 🤷🏻‍♀️

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Mindfields
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Mindfields »

Typically the downfall of these types is Polygamy. Let the games begin!

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Thinker
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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Thinker »

Bronco73idi wrote: March 27th, 2023, 9:09 pm He lost me at “the church of God” just saying
Really? Opposite for me.
Who else should we worship?
I guess God is not enough for most.

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Re: THE FORMULA Laid Out Clearly

Post by Thinker »

TheDuke wrote: March 28th, 2023, 9:38 pm I feel it is almost always bad to judge other people. That is not a prophet's job. It is NOT what Jesus would do…
Actually prophets & Jesus are KNOWN for judging people, & that is why they are often disliked & killed. People don’t like being told that they’re behavior is not all that wonderful. Granted, it all should be done in love and wisdom. Still, as the book of Mark starts out introducing the gospel as “baptism of REPENTANCE,” and similarly Jacob is known & renamed for wrestling/repenting of past mistaken ideas of God - repentance is like breathing - needed until we die. And unfortunately some (all?) of us occasionally need a little kick in the toosh to be motivated.

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