The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

tmac wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 4:41 pm I agree that teaching our children to receive personal revelation is very important, but it is something I would like to learn myself first.

I am always left scratching my head when I hear so many people make it sound so simple — and then if you were to compare their so-called personal revelations, a lot of them would disagree, and be going in opposite directions.

Although (after well over a decade of working steadily on this), I have only had two indisputable spiritual experiences in my life (and never any “burning of the bosom”), including a very vivid warning dream, and another experience when I was about 18, I can’t deny the reality of having the eyes of my understanding opened in a variety of ways that can only be attributed to the Spirit.

But when it comes to receiving unmistakable revelation about actions to take, and what and what not to do, there is a whole lot more trial and error than I wish there was.

I usually try to act upon the impressions I perceive. But I seldom know with any degree of certainty in advance what the outcome will be — and it is usually only the outcome that is the second witness— or not.

But there are plenty of “Zions Camp” type experiences that leave you scratching your head.

So, I’m always interested when people make it sound like personal revelation is some kind of exact science, with a one-size-fits-all silver bullet formula.
I can relate. I myself am in this process of discovery, but I do feel that after having cast aside many of the traditions of my upbringing was I then able to evaluate truth with a more pure lens and see more clearly, even receiving a witness to my heart and mind that something was true, partially true, or sometimes evil.

To address your last statement, I believe the HG speaks to us on an individual basis. There is no "one-size-fits-all" formula. But I do believe that there are specific things we can do to facilitate the process of revelation.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by JohnnyL »

When I remember that the 15 are still learning how to receive revelation, I don't feel too bad.

Perhaps three easier ways to start are:
1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.

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tmac
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by tmac »

JohnnyL wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 5:29 pm When I remember that the 15 are still learning how to receive revelation, I don't feel too bad.

Perhaps three easier ways to start are:
1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.
Okay, fair enough. Since that is where you think I should start, please tell me, from your perspective, what should I expect to happen? I mean, exactly what should I expect to happen?

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Jonesy
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Jonesy »

nightlight wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 8:30 am Teaching children submission to God is the first step to learning personal revelation.

Children are submissive by nature....so that is why we:

"23 For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do.
26 And we talk of Christ, we rejoice in Christ, we preach of Christ, we prophesy of Christ, and we write according to our prophecies, that our children may know to what source they may look for a remission of their sins."
Along with this, as the Lectures on Faith says, faith requires a knowledge that the course of life you’re pursuing is God’s will. The only way I can see to go about doing that is to make every decision you make to be based on what you believe Jesus would do in your shoes, then do it. You get to Jesus real quick that way and the faith works “immediately” as promised in the Book of Mormon. God starts talking again, or at least now you’re listening again. Now, if you’re wishy-washy as hell like me and stray from time to time, let your kids know you’ve made mistakes so they know you’re not a hypocrite—it keeps you accountable, and they will help you correct course; we need it just as much as they do. Just like the Book of Mormon, many kept the course because they were “admonished continually by the word”—continually.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

I guess the question we should all be asking is, "What has the Lord taught me about personal revation?"

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by JohnnyL »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 7:50 pm I guess the question we should all be asking is, "What has the Lord taught me about personal revation?"
Sounds like a good journal entry!

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Original_Intent
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Original_Intent »

tmac wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 6:59 pm
JohnnyL wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 5:29 pm When I remember that the 15 are still learning how to receive revelation, I don't feel too bad.

Perhaps three easier ways to start are:
1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.
Okay, fair enough. Since that is where you think I should start, please tell me, from your perspective, what should I expect to happen? I mean, exactly what should I expect to happen?
As you stated previously, there doesn't seem to be a silver bullet point answer. In fact, when it comes to teaching our kids, I think therein may lie a problem. We teach them a silver bullet point answer of what worked for us, and when/if it doesn't unfold that way for a chld or anyone else we are trying to help, they either lose faith in us, or faith in god, or worse yet feel unworthy and unloved and believe it worked for you but they are just too evil, or too...something.

Lehi lost 2 of six sons that we know of, father Adam lost Cain quite spectacularly. Not putting it on them, but I am just saying "teaching" to receive revelation isn't really something we can do, in fact of course God can do anything - well that's not exactly true either, but it seems like a big factor is the individual themselves. I mean not in a "if you are receiving revelation it is your own fault" sense, but in a mor alchemical sense. We all start out as base metal but we are most definitely our own unique alloy and the path to being turned to gold is gonna be universal in some ways but unique and personal in others. In other words, I don't believe formulaic answers work.

I'd say a better lesson to teach is to recognize revelation.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

Original_Intent wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 9:29 pm I'd say a better lesson to teach is to recognize revelation.
Receive <> Recognize
Semi analogous…

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tmac
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by tmac »

Fair enough. And JL's suggestions make a very good case in point:

1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.

Based on the collective wisdom involved here, please describe for the class the nature and characteristics of the kind of revelation one should expect to receive and recognize in response to these prayers. I.e., what, exactly, should one expect to happen?

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Dave62 »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 7:11 am I've had this thought on my mind for the past few months, and it kept going through my head last night and this morning.

The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

There is a reason the Lord teaches us in every canon of scripture that we are NOT to trust in the arm of flesh, which includes our own selfish desires along with the philosophies of the world. Being taught by Heaven allows all children of God to set the correct priorities for the day and age in which they live. It is the only path that leads to exaltation.

So, this begs the question, how do we do this? How do we teach the principle of revelation?
Here is my take on it, Watchman. A long time ago I served in the Church's youth program. I was in that calling for just shy of 30 years. We knew our mandate was to help the kids understand the 'language' of the Holy Ghost. So we would do the following...
1. Organise a simple service project that was a small sacrifice for the kids. E.G. Early Saturday morning, a couple of hours of physical labour.
2. At the end, we would gather kids around and ask them how they felt about what they had just done.
3. Always (and I mean, always) they declared that they felt fantastic. "Can we do this again next week?" etc.
4. We would identify that feeling as their Heavenly Father telling them that this was what he wanted them to be doing. And he was communicating this through the medium of the Holy Spirit.

It must be understood that this was not just a feeling of satisfaction but a feeling that motivated the young people to action. They wanted to do it again and again. When impression become actions, faith is being wrought.

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tmac
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

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This is actually a good example of what I’m trying to probe here — the extent to which personal revelation is just a bunch of ambiguous warm and fuzzy feelings?

Let’s say I’m a youth. It’s Friday night. My 4H club is doing a service project bright and early the next morning for a needy widow in the area, and my Ward youth group is going to be doing baptisms for the dead at 10.

I can do one or the other, but I can’t do both. So, I’m going to pray, with faith, for personal revelation and direction about what I should do.

What can I reasonably expect to happen?

Whichever I do, after the fact it is entirely possible that I will have a nice, warm and fuzzy feeling of satisfaction about it that my parents and/or leaders might attribute to the Spirit. What, if anything, does this teach me about personal revelation?
Last edited by tmac on March 24th, 2023, 7:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

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tmac wrote: March 24th, 2023, 7:34 am This is actually a good example of what I’m trying to probe here — the extent to which personal revelation is just a bunch of ambiguous warm and fuzzy feelings?

Let’s say I’m a youth. It’s Friday night. My 4H club is doing a service project bright and early the next morning for a needy widow in the area, and my Ward youth group is going to be doing baptisms for the dead at 11. I can do one or the other, but I can’t do both. So, I’m going to pray, with faith, for personal revelation and direction about what I should do.

What can I reasonably expect to happen?

Whichever I do, after the fact it is entirely possible that I will have a nice, warm and fuzzy feeling of satisfaction about it that my parents and/or leaders might attribute to the Spirit. What, if anything, does this teach me about personal revelation?
It should teach you that serving your fellow men is emulating our Master and that being like Him is pleasing unto our Heavenly Father.....😁 (I know it's not the answer you're looking for😉)

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Hosh »

tmac wrote: March 24th, 2023, 7:34 am This is actually a good example of what I’m trying to probe here — the extent to which personal revelation is just a bunch of ambiguous warm and fuzzy feelings?

Let’s say I’m a youth. It’s Friday night. My 4H club is doing a service project bright and early the next morning for a needy widow in the area, and my Ward youth group is going to be doing baptisms for the dead at 10.

I can do one or the other, but I can’t do both. So, I’m going to pray, with faith, for personal revelation and direction about what I should do.

What can I reasonably expect to happen?

Whichever I do, after the fact it is entirely possible that I will have a nice, warm and fuzzy feeling of satisfaction about it that my parents and/or leaders might attribute to the Spirit. What, if anything, does this teach me about personal revelation?
For me its about where you are in your current understanding of who Jesus is and what He would do in your situation. I think it varies from person to person. For me, where I am at right now, I would serve the living, because all things considered thats what I feel Jesus would do. Does that make it right for everyone? No, but according to MY understanding of what Jesus would do, thats what I would do. You may feel that baptisms for the Dead have more eternal significance and that those are necessary steps in those peoples eternal progress. So according to your best understanding of what Jesus would do, maybe that is it. As long as you are doing what you sincerely believe Jesus would do with your heart and mind fixed on Him and His goodness, that's what you should do. I think grace covers a whole lot of our shortcomings when it comes to our perceptions of what is best. If we have pure intent, and it sincerely Is what we believe Is best, God's grace will fill in the gaps of our imperfection. But its important to always be seeking better and more holy ways and not stay stagnant on what our current paradigm is of what is best.
Last edited by Hosh on March 24th, 2023, 8:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

I think there has to be a balance w/ the feelings we have. The pandemic exposed a lot of twisting of doctrine. How many times did we hear that taking the jab and wearing a face diaper was a sign of Christ-like love? People got emotionally wrapped up in the idea that they'd do everything they could to save a life, yet they didn't realize that what was being asked of them was wrong. Heart AND mind.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Hosh »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:38 am I think there has to be a balance w/ the feelings we have. The pandemic exposed a lot of twisting of doctrine. How many times did we hear that taking the jab and wearing a face diaper was a sign of Christ-like love? People got emotionally wrapped up in the idea that they'd do everything they could to save a life, yet they didn't realize that what was being asked of them was wrong. Heart AND mind.
Exactly. Logic and reason are tools God has given us. If more people used their God given logic and reason with an eye single to God, I dont think we would be in the awful situation we are in now. But when we abandon logic and reason and our eye Is fixed on "the prophet", leadership, or anyone other than Jesus, then yeah we make silly decisions.
Last edited by Hosh on March 24th, 2023, 11:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

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tmac
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

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Hosh wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:28 am As long as you are doing what you sincerely believe Jesus would do with your heart and mind fixed on Him and His goodness, that's what you should do. I think grace covers a whole lot of our shortcomings when it comes to our perceptions of what is best. If we have pure intent, and it sincerely Is what we believe Is best, God's grace will fill in the gaps of our imperfection. But its important to always be seeking better and more holier ways and not stay stagnant on what our current paradigm is of what is best.
I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said, but I’m still struggling to understand what it has to do with personal revelation.

From my perspective, what you have described is a very legitimate process of reasoning out in your mind what Christ might do in any given situation. But I’m still not sure where personal revelation fits into that equation. After I’ve done all the legitimate reasoning I am humanly capable of (whether over a long process and period of time, or in an instant), what I am looking for is God to “weigh-in” on the process and reveal His will. Is that unreasonable? How does that revelation happen? What, if anything, makes it unmistakable?

Personally, I think the simplistic “what would Jesus do?” is a little bit of a cop-out. He was immortal. He is God. As a mortal, I am certainly not capable of doing many things that Christ might do. So that often doesn’t give me much useful direction.

Example: I’m at a wedding. They run out of wine. WWJD? The problem is, I may not have the ability to make water into wine. So then what? What should I do? What would God have me do? And, how do I know that? That is what I want to know.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by JohnnyL »

tmac wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 10:32 pm Fair enough. And JL's suggestions make a very good case in point:

1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.

Based on the collective wisdom involved here, please describe for the class the nature and characteristics of the kind of revelation one should expect to receive and recognize in response to these prayers. I.e., what, exactly, should one expect to happen?
Here's a #4: go back and read your posts 10-15 years ago, on this forum.
But I can't tell you exactly what you should expect to happen, or what will happen.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by JohnnyL »

Dave62 wrote: March 24th, 2023, 12:32 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 7:11 am I've had this thought on my mind for the past few months, and it kept going through my head last night and this morning.

The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

There is a reason the Lord teaches us in every canon of scripture that we are NOT to trust in the arm of flesh, which includes our own selfish desires along with the philosophies of the world. Being taught by Heaven allows all children of God to set the correct priorities for the day and age in which they live. It is the only path that leads to exaltation.

So, this begs the question, how do we do this? How do we teach the principle of revelation?
Here is my take on it, Watchman. A long time ago I served in the Church's youth program. I was in that calling for just shy of 30 years. We knew our mandate was to help the kids understand the 'language' of the Holy Ghost. So we would do the following...
1. Organise a simple service project that was a small sacrifice for the kids. E.G. Early Saturday morning, a couple of hours of physical labour.
2. At the end, we would gather kids around and ask them how they felt about what they had just done.
3. Always (and I mean, always) they declared that they felt fantastic. "Can we do this again next week?" etc.
4. We would identify that feeling as their Heavenly Father telling them that this was what he wanted them to be doing. And he was communicating this through the medium of the Holy Spirit.

It must be understood that this was not just a feeling of satisfaction but a feeling that motivated the young people to action. They wanted to do it again and again. When impression become actions, faith is being wrought.
That's awesome!

This reminded me of an experience on my mission. We were teaching some older teens who asked about the Spirit and didn't understand our explanation--"but that's just happy" kind of thing. So after praying about how to help them, the next time we saw them we had a good, pleasant, and fun conversation--nothing about the gospel--for a while. Then we talked about that conversation, and asked them to feel their emotions (heart) and feelings/sensations (body). Then we said to pay attention, and we bore our testimonies. When we were done, they had felt the difference and got it. An experience can be worth a 1,000 words.

And then a small group experience in the MTC (and other activities later, like FHE), where each person got a note explaining what to do: share your favorite scripture and why, say something positive/ express love to each person in the group, etc. Some really good feel-the-Spirit experiences with that, too.

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tmac
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by tmac »

JohnnyL wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:20 am
tmac wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 10:32 pm Fair enough. And JL's suggestions make a very good case in point:

1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.

Based on the collective wisdom involved here, please describe for the class the nature and characteristics of the kind of revelation one should expect to receive and recognize in response to these prayers. I.e., what, exactly, should one expect to happen?
Here's a #4: go back and read your posts 10-15 years ago, on this forum.
But I can't tell you exactly what you should expect to happen, or what will happen.
I’m still asking many of the same questions that I was asking 10 years ago. But about all I get here is ambiguous, warm and fuzzy answers from people who act like they’ve got it all figured out.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by JohnnyL »

tmac wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:01 am
Hosh wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:28 am As long as you are doing what you sincerely believe Jesus would do with your heart and mind fixed on Him and His goodness, that's what you should do. I think grace covers a whole lot of our shortcomings when it comes to our perceptions of what is best. If we have pure intent, and it sincerely Is what we believe Is best, God's grace will fill in the gaps of our imperfection. But its important to always be seeking better and more holier ways and not stay stagnant on what our current paradigm is of what is best.
I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said, but I’m still struggling to understand what it has to do with personal revelation.

From my perspective, what you have described is a very legitimate process of reasoning out in your mind what Christ might do in any given situation. But I’m still not sure where personal revelation fits into that equation. After I’ve done all the legitimate reasoning I am humanly capable of (whether over a long process and period of time, or in an instant), what I am looking for is God to “weigh-in” on the process and reveal His will. Is that unreasonable? How does that revelation happen? What, if anything, makes it unmistakable?

Personally, I think the simplistic “what would Jesus do?” is a little bit of a cop-out. He was immortal. He is God. As a mortal, I am certainly not capable of doing many things that Christ might do. So that often doesn’t give me much useful direction.

Example: I’m at a wedding. They run out of wine. WWJD? The problem is, I may not have the ability to make water into wine. So then what? What should I do? What would God have me do? And, how do I know that? That is what I want to know.
"what you sincerely believe Jesus would do with your heart and mind fixed on Him and His goodness" from Hosh is not the same as "WWJD", but as you wrote, "What would God have me do?"

Revelation:
--comes in degrees in time (from over a period of decades, to instantaneous);
--comes in degrees of importance and/or urgency to us or others, whether we see/understand or not (from very minor thoughts, to nudges, to "this is good", to promptings, to stronger promptings, to pushes, to direct messages in your mind and heart or that flash of pure knowledge/ wisdom/ clarity);
--comes in degrees of simplicity/ complexity (one-item answers vs. lengthy developed cases built on many evidences of truth and the Spirit's guidance);
--is related to/ often dependent on our faith, obedience, humility, etc.; desire, willingness, and sometimes readiness to follow the Spirit;
--sometimes comes according to the timing of others and their presence, participation, and willingness.

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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by JohnnyL »

tmac wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:34 am
JohnnyL wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:20 am
tmac wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 10:32 pm Fair enough. And JL's suggestions make a very good case in point:

1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.

Based on the collective wisdom involved here, please describe for the class the nature and characteristics of the kind of revelation one should expect to receive and recognize in response to these prayers. I.e., what, exactly, should one expect to happen?
Here's a #4: go back and read your posts 10-15 years ago, on this forum.
But I can't tell you exactly what you should expect to happen, or what will happen.
I’m still asking many of the same questions that I was asking 10 years ago. But about all I get here is ambiguous, warm and fuzzy answers from people who act like they’ve got it all figured out.
Hope the last post helped a little.

The importance of reading what we wrote is often greatly underrated. Give it a try.

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Original_Intent
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Original_Intent »

tmac wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:34 am
JohnnyL wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:20 am
tmac wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 10:32 pm Fair enough. And JL's suggestions make a very good case in point:

1. praying to ask Heavenly Father if He is there, and if He loves you.
2. praying to ask if Jesus Christ is your Savior.
3. reading the Book of Mormon and praying for a witness.

Based on the collective wisdom involved here, please describe for the class the nature and characteristics of the kind of revelation one should expect to receive and recognize in response to these prayers. I.e., what, exactly, should one expect to happen?
Here's a #4: go back and read your posts 10-15 years ago, on this forum.
But I can't tell you exactly what you should expect to happen, or what will happen.
I’m still asking many of the same questions that I was asking 10 years ago. But about all I get here is ambiguous, warm and fuzzy answers from people who act like they’ve got it all figured out.
It seems that you have expressed that there are no silver-bullet point answers, but you still want silver bullet point answers.

If you have not read "Following the Light of Christ into His Presence", I highly recommend it.
If you have read it, and still have these questions, I doubt anyone here can help, I certainly can't, as much as I would like to.

In you example above about the service project and the temple trip, I doubt you will get revelation about which to choose and you will probably get a warm feeling of happiness and satisfaction after doing either. I think that feeling is probably bio chemical based more than anything, but I also think God and Satan both use biochemistry to communicate with us.

I will tell you one example of my own that maybe will be helpful.

My wife has a sever back problem. One day I woke up and was just strongly impressed to try very hard that day to simply follow the promptings of the spirit and do as directed. And the first prompting I got was to attend the temple.

I went to the temple and at the entrance they had a sign up that they needed people to assist with proxy sealings. I thought "I've never done that, sounds interesting, I'll go do that." And I got an immediate prompting "Not now, go do an endowment session." So I did.

After the session, I saw the sign was still up, and I felt that yes, NOW was the time to go do proxy sealings.

Since I was there alone, I was standing in as a son and an older couple were proxy for the parents I was being sealed to.

After we had been doing them for a while, the officiator called a break and he started chatting with the couple, and it was apparent they knew each other and were friends. He asked the wife how here acupuncture treatments to help with her back pain were going, and I immediately knew that this was why I was here. I got involved in the conversation and asked about the treatments she was taking and got the doctor's contact info.

My wife did start seeing him, and although it didn't heal her, it did give her a great deal of relief for many months. (She eventually got a newly developed surgery which didn't 100% resolve the issue, but has helped a lot.) Anyways, I couldn't explain how I recognized it as revelation other than I had decided to do one thing and got a strong impression, prompting or instruction to do something else. And yes I think such prompting can come from either side (good or evil) but the proving of the spirits was in the result.

But I think that is the best litmus test I can give you on revelation is if you are prompted to do something that perhaps you are not inclined to do, or to not do something that you are inclined to do, or I can think of one instance where it was something I was inclined to do but had no plans to do for quite some time. And I was told out of the blue to "do it NOW" and I did.

So there is another leg to the acupuncture story. Several months later, I had been laid off of my job but my wife was still seeing the doctor. While she was in getting her treatment, the couple from the temple came into the reception area. They went to the receptionist and I overheard something about them having some difficulty paying for a treatment. I got the impression that I should pay for them, and I immediately thought "I'm unemployed! I can't do that!" But again I got the strong impression that I needed to do so in faith. So I offered and of course they said No, we can't let you do that, and I said I was just instructed quite clearly to pay for you so you aren't going to get in the way of me following my prompting, are you? And they eventually relented and they were so grateful. And then I told them about the whole previous story about how I had come to be in their sealing session when they first talked about it, the doctor also found out about the entire story and it was simply a great experience for all of us.

From the outside I suppose this might sound like just another warm fuzzy, faith promoting story. From the inside it was not.

Hosh
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Hosh »

tmac wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:01 am
Hosh wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:28 am As long as you are doing what you sincerely believe Jesus would do with your heart and mind fixed on Him and His goodness, that's what you should do. I think grace covers a whole lot of our shortcomings when it comes to our perceptions of what is best. If we have pure intent, and it sincerely Is what we believe Is best, God's grace will fill in the gaps of our imperfection. But its important to always be seeking better and more holier ways and not stay stagnant on what our current paradigm is of what is best.
I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said, but I’m still struggling to understand what it has to do with personal revelation.

From my perspective, what you have described is a very legitimate process of reasoning out in your mind what Christ might do in any given situation. But I’m still not sure where personal revelation fits into that equation. After I’ve done all the legitimate reasoning I am humanly capable of (whether over a long process and period of time, or in an instant), what I am looking for is God to “weigh-in” on the process and reveal His will. Is that unreasonable? How does that revelation happen? What, if anything, makes it unmistakable?

Personally, I think the simplistic “what would Jesus do?” is a little bit of a cop-out. He was immortal. He is God. As a mortal, I am certainly not capable of doing many things that Christ might do. So that often doesn’t give me much useful direction.

Example: I’m at a wedding. They run out of wine. WWJD? The problem is, I may not have the ability to make water into wine. So then what? What should I do? What would God have me do? And, how do I know that? That is what I want to know.
This is my current understanding of what revelation is. It is our current best understanding of what Jesus would do in every decision we make. Moroni 7 describes this process.

12 Wherefore, all things which are good cometh of God; and that which is evil cometh of the devil; for the devil is an enemy unto God, and fighteth against him continually, and inviteth and enticeth to sin, and to do that which is evil continually.

13 But behold, that which is of God inviteth and enticeth to do good continually; wherefore, every thing which inviteth and enticeth to do good, and to love God, and to serve him, is inspired of God.

Every good thing that invites us to be more like God is from God. What is good? Its our current best estimate of who God is and what He would do. This comes through the concience at first as the light of Christ and later through the Holy Ghost as we reconcile ourselves to everything we know Is good and from God. Our perception of what Is good gets better and better over time to where often times what we thought was good in the past may have even been not so good, but at the time, It was the best we knew how to do.

My father in law had your Same question recently. He said, "well yeah but the best thing to do in my situation with this sick man that i home teach would be to heal this man. Thats what Jesus would do."
Sometimes the best we can imagine God doing Is not the best WE can do. Our best does not necessarily mean Gods best. what is good to us is not always good to God, but it mught be the best we have to offer at the time

Daniel 10:8
Therefore I was left alone, and saw this great vision, and there remained no strength in me: for my comeliness was turned in me into corruption, and I retained no strength.

Before Daniel saw God he thought he was a pretty good guy, and by all human perspectives he was. But in the presence of God, his "comeliness was turned to corruption." Everything he thought was good about himself, in comparison to what is good about God, was corrupt.

The best thing you CAN do fails to be the best thing when it's something you cannot yet do. Healing someone for some people IS the best thing they can do because they have grown in faith and love and understanding of God to the point where that is possible. For me right now, its not, so I do what I know IS possible for me as far as what is best. What is good will change as we grow in our understanding of God and become more and more like Him ourselves.
Last edited by Hosh on March 24th, 2023, 11:16 am, edited 2 times in total.

JohnnyL
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Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by JohnnyL »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: March 23rd, 2023, 7:11 am I've had this thought on my mind for the past few months, and it kept going through my head last night and this morning.

The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

There is a reason the Lord teaches us in every canon of scripture that we are NOT to trust in the arm of flesh, which includes our own selfish desires along with the philosophies of the world. Being taught by Heaven allows all children of God to set the correct priorities for the day and age in which they live. It is the only path that leads to exaltation.

So, this begs the question, how do we do this? How do we teach the principle of revelation?
I think it's an important thing. Before that, though, maybe teach them:
--the existence of Heavenly Father and Jesus and their love for us;
--to obey the commandments;
--how to live a righteous life through example;
--listen to their conscience/ light of Christ.

Then they'll have a much stronger base to learn about feeling the Holy Ghost, then revelation.

Hosh
captain of 100
Posts: 836

Re: The most important thing we can teach our children is how to receive personal revelation.

Post by Hosh »

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Last edited by Hosh on March 24th, 2023, 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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