In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bible.

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kirtland r.m.
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In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bible.

Post by kirtland r.m. »

I have seen on this forum this week, comments like "restored doctrine" including Book of Mormon information, does not really match up with historical information(including the Bible) about ancient Israel. This is quite baffling to me really, as I just on my own, have started close to 100 threads on this very subject on this forum. It is only in restoration information for example, that we know Adam and Eve knew as much as they did about the fullness of the gospel. This is the only church that fills in tons of detail about what are mysteries elsewhere. It is the only church which when compared with Bible information, makes sense.

Here is yet another thread. Here is a sample of this information.

Adam in Ancient Texts and the Restoration
Adam and the Angels

Although not found in the Biblical account, Latter-day Saint scripture and other ancient texts tell how the first couple were visited by heavenly messengers sent from God. Alma taught that after the Fall of Adam and Eve, God, “sent angels to converse with them, who caused men to behold his glory” (Alma 12:29). The Prophet Mormon also taught that the Lord “sent angels to minister unto the children of men, to make manifest concerning the coming of Christ; and in Christ there should come every good thing . . . .Wherefore, by the ministering of angels, and by every word which proceeded forth out of the mouth of God, men began to exercise faith in Christ” (Moroni 7:22-25). In the Doctrine and Covenants God states, “I, the Lord God, gave unto Adam and unto his seed, that they should not die as to the temporal death, until I, the Lord God, should send forth angels to declare unto them repentance and redemption, through faith on the name of mine Only Begotten Son. And thus did I, the Lord God, appoint unto man the days of his probation–that by his natural death he might be raised in immortality unto eternal life, even as many as would believe” (D&C 29:42-43). The account of Adam and his family in the book of Moses recounts the ministration of other heavenly messengers as well (Moses 5:6). Not only angelic messengers, but God himself is said to have spoken to Adam directly. “And thus the Gospel began to be preached, from the beginning, being declared by holy angels sent forth from the presence of God, and by his own voice, and by the gift of the Holy Ghost” (Moses 5:58).https://www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/con ... estoration

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Luke
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Luke »

Interesting snippet in the Bible about Adam in Daniel 7. It reveals quite a bit! 😉

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Robin Hood
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Robin Hood »

Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:43 am Interesting snippet in the Bible about Adam in Daniel 7. It reveals quite a bit! 😉
I just read Daniel 7. What do you think it reveals?

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Luke
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Luke »

Robin Hood wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:51 am
Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:43 am Interesting snippet in the Bible about Adam in Daniel 7. It reveals quite a bit! 😉
I just read Daniel 7. What do you think it reveals?
If you go in with the understanding that the Ancient of Days = Adam, it reveals that the Ancient of Days is God.

I was being a little jokey/facetious with my original comment, but I do believe that Daniel 7 makes it obvious that the Ancient of Days is God.

NLT Daniel 7
21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against God’s holy people and was defeating them,
22 until the Ancient One—the Most High—came and judged in favor of his holy people. Then the time arrived for the holy people to take over the kingdom.

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Robin Hood
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Robin Hood »

Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:53 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:51 am
Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:43 am Interesting snippet in the Bible about Adam in Daniel 7. It reveals quite a bit! 😉
I just read Daniel 7. What do you think it reveals?
If you go in with the understanding that the Ancient of Days = Adam, it reveals that the Ancient of Days is God.

I was being a little jokey/facetious with my original comment, but I do believe that Daniel 7 makes it obvious that the Ancient of Days is God.

NLT Daniel 7
21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against God’s holy people and was defeating them,
22 until the Ancient One—the Most High—came and judged in favor of his holy people. Then the time arrived for the holy people to take over the kingdom.
That's fine. But surely "Ancient of Days" is a title/name, much like Elohim or Jehovah. More than one person can operate under that title at different times.

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TheDuke
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by TheDuke »

It is true LDS have more information about Adam. But, for example the statement of Alma 12:29 in OP, does not in fact, say anything about messengers to Adam and Eve. I suppose you could interpret it that way, today anyway, or perhaps after 1840, but not when BoM was written. It says "men" not Adam. In the temple we hear about these messengers and Adam making an offering, but it isn't that clear that is the case in Adam's day.

Much like in the Book of Moses where it talks about Adam's book of remembrance. It mentions Enoch reading this but it says he was 70 years old before he even heard of it? What did his parents teach him the first 70 years?

To me, it isn't clear exactly what our early ancestors knew. Now Adam and Eve were in the garden, many years and were taught much directly by the Lord or messengers. Not sure why it would need to be retaught after getting out of Eden? Why would they need to be taught then? Wouldn't they just understand better over time?

Like I have said over and over and we just discussed on another thread. We (speaking of LDS experts understanding) seem to keep re-writing things in our current mind and understanding. Like the statements of "Christ" in the OP. It is a Christian concept of a Hebrew Messiah using words and terms not created until the Greek language was formed.

I'm not disputing that Adam and Eve didn't know a lot about the evolution of this world and the concept of atonement. but our story has some confusion in the garden, most teachings from Satan, and the temple story is more allegory and figurative than intended to be factual. As I mentioned above, even Enoch was stunned to hear some of the story of a redeemer after 3/4 century of life. Likely he was taught by the spirit to understand words recorded (not sure how or what form Adams BoR was?) that even his parents didn't really comprehend.

I guess I just think we need to beware of stories that put ancient peoples in modern contexts, especially when the outcomes and circumstances don't hold up. I mean how many of Adam's own children even believed in god? Couple hundred years before Cain and Abel, and they didn't work out and it took to Seth. And how many of his siblings?

I don't buy that many (if any) really knew the details of Jesus and Mary, by name, what crucifixion was, etc... All we have has been captured to our understanding for our time and for our minds more than to accurately relate what Adam did for his 900+ years of life. IMO

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Luke
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Luke »

Robin Hood wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:28 am
Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:53 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:51 am

I just read Daniel 7. What do you think it reveals?
If you go in with the understanding that the Ancient of Days = Adam, it reveals that the Ancient of Days is God.

I was being a little jokey/facetious with my original comment, but I do believe that Daniel 7 makes it obvious that the Ancient of Days is God.

NLT Daniel 7
21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against God’s holy people and was defeating them,
22 until the Ancient One—the Most High—came and judged in favor of his holy people. Then the time arrived for the holy people to take over the kingdom.
That's fine. But surely "Ancient of Days" is a title/name, much like Elohim or Jehovah. More than one person can operate under that title at different times.
I’m sure that others can have that title. But Joseph explicitly said that:

Daniel in his seventh chapter speaks of the Ancient of Days; he means the oldest man, our Father Adam, Michael, he will call his children together and hold a council with them to prepare them for the coming of the Son of Man. He (Adam) is the father of the human family, and presides over the spirits of all men, and all that have had the keys must stand before him in this grand council.” (Circa 2 July 1839, TPJS 157)

Also see D&C 116.

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Robin Hood
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Robin Hood »

Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 12:54 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:28 am
Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:53 am

If you go in with the understanding that the Ancient of Days = Adam, it reveals that the Ancient of Days is God.

I was being a little jokey/facetious with my original comment, but I do believe that Daniel 7 makes it obvious that the Ancient of Days is God.

NLT Daniel 7
21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against God’s holy people and was defeating them,
22 until the Ancient One—the Most High—came and judged in favor of his holy people. Then the time arrived for the holy people to take over the kingdom.
That's fine. But surely "Ancient of Days" is a title/name, much like Elohim or Jehovah. More than one person can operate under that title at different times.
I’m sure that others can have that title. But Joseph explicitly said that:

Daniel in his seventh chapter speaks of the Ancient of Days; he means the oldest man, our Father Adam, Michael, he will call his children together and hold a council with them to prepare them for the coming of the Son of Man. He (Adam) is the father of the human family, and presides over the spirits of all men, and all that have had the keys must stand before him in this grand council.” (Circa 2 July 1839, TPJS 157)

Also see D&C 116.
What is the provenance of that quote attributed to Joseph?

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Luke
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Luke »

Robin Hood wrote: March 25th, 2023, 1:52 am
Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 12:54 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 24th, 2023, 9:28 am

That's fine. But surely "Ancient of Days" is a title/name, much like Elohim or Jehovah. More than one person can operate under that title at different times.
I’m sure that others can have that title. But Joseph explicitly said that:

Daniel in his seventh chapter speaks of the Ancient of Days; he means the oldest man, our Father Adam, Michael, he will call his children together and hold a council with them to prepare them for the coming of the Son of Man. He (Adam) is the father of the human family, and presides over the spirits of all men, and all that have had the keys must stand before him in this grand council.” (Circa 2 July 1839, TPJS 157)

Also see D&C 116.
What is the provenance of that quote attributed to Joseph?
Very good. And there’s plenty more saying the exact same thing.

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Robin Hood
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Robin Hood »

Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 3:49 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 25th, 2023, 1:52 am
Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 12:54 am

I’m sure that others can have that title. But Joseph explicitly said that:

Daniel in his seventh chapter speaks of the Ancient of Days; he means the oldest man, our Father Adam, Michael, he will call his children together and hold a council with them to prepare them for the coming of the Son of Man. He (Adam) is the father of the human family, and presides over the spirits of all men, and all that have had the keys must stand before him in this grand council.” (Circa 2 July 1839, TPJS 157)

Also see D&C 116.
What is the provenance of that quote attributed to Joseph?
Very good. And there’s plenty more saying the exact same thing.
Contemporary or recalled some years later?

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Luke
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Luke »

Robin Hood wrote: March 25th, 2023, 8:13 am
Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 3:49 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 25th, 2023, 1:52 am

What is the provenance of that quote attributed to Joseph?
Very good. And there’s plenty more saying the exact same thing.
Contemporary or recalled some years later?
All contemporary. You can find them all on the JSP website.

Obviously there's plenty of later recollections, too.

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Robin Hood
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Robin Hood »

Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 8:15 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 25th, 2023, 8:13 am
Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 3:49 am

Very good. And there’s plenty more saying the exact same thing.
Contemporary or recalled some years later?
All contemporary. You can find them all on the JSP website.

Obviously there's plenty of later recollections, too.
What's the date of the earliest?
I can't navigate the JSP very well on my phone.

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Luke
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by Luke »

Robin Hood wrote: March 25th, 2023, 8:21 am
Luke wrote: March 25th, 2023, 8:15 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 25th, 2023, 8:13 am

Contemporary or recalled some years later?
All contemporary. You can find them all on the JSP website.

Obviously there's plenty of later recollections, too.
What's the date of the earliest?
I can't navigate the JSP very well on my phone.
The earliest reference I think is D&C 116, which is dated 19 May 1838.

Other notable dates are circa 2 July 1839 and circa 5 October 1840.

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kirtland r.m.
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

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The fullness of the gospel is deep, wide, and far reaching.

(As written by LDS Missionary Scott Anderson in his journal.)

We had an unexpected moment in the mission field. We knocked on a door and a lady said something to us we had never heard, 'Come in.' Now remember, I was a German missionary. This never happened to us; no one ever invited us in. My companion said, 'Do you know who we are?'

'You want to talk about religion, don't you?' she said.

'Yes, we do', replied my companion.

'Oh, come in. I've been watching you walk around the neighborhood. I'm so excited to have you here. Please come into my study.' We went in and seated ourselves and she sat down behind the desk. She looked at us with a smile, then pointed to three PHD degrees hanging over her head. One is in Theology, the study of religion, one in Philosophy, the study of ideas, and one in European History specializing in Christianity. She then rubbed her hands together and said, 'Do you see this row of books here?' We looked at a well-arranged row of books. She then said, 'I wrote them all. I'm the Theology professor at the University of Munich. I've been doing this for 41 years. I love to talk about religion. What would you like to discuss?'

My inspired companion said we'd like to talk about the Book of Mormon.
She said, 'I don't know anything about the Book of Mormon.'
He said, 'I know.'

Twenty minutes later we walked out of the room. We had handed her a Book of Mormon and this trade off that we had been on was over. I didn't see this lady again for another eight and a half weeks. It was in a small room filled with people (when I saw her again), as she was standing in the front dressed in white. This Theology professor at the University of Munich was well known throughout Southern Germany. She stood up in front of this small congregation of people and said, 'Before I'm baptized I'd like to tell you my feelings. In Amos chapter 8:11 it says there will be a famine of the work of God. I've been in that famine for 76 years. Why do you think I have three PHD degrees? I've been hungering for truth and have been unable to find it. Then eight and one-half weeks ago, two boys walked into my home. I want you to know these boys are very nice and wonderful young men, but they didn't convert me. They couldn't; they don't know enough.' And then she smiled and said, 'but since the day they walked in my door I have read the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, the Pearl of Great Price, all of Talmage's great writings, Evidence and Reconciliations by John A. Widtsoe and 22 other volumes of church doctrine.'

She then said something which I think is a challenge for every one of us here. She said, _'I don't think you members know what you have.'_ Then in her quiet, powerful way, she said, 'After those years of studying philosophy, I picked up the D&C and read a few verses that answered some of the greatest questions of Aristotle and Socrates! When I read those verses, I wept for four hours.' Then she said again, 'I don't think you members know what you have. Don't you understand the world is in a famine? Don't you know we are starving for what you have? I am like a starving person being led to a feast. And over these eight and one-half weeks I have been able to feast in a way I have never known to be possible.'

Her powerful message and her challenging question were then ended with her favorite scripture, 'For you don't see the truth can make you free.' She said, 'these missionaries don't just carry membership in the church in their hands, they hold in their hands the power to make the atonement of Jesus Christ full force in my life. Today I'm going into the water and I'm going to make a covenant with Christ for the first time with proper authority. I've wanted to do this all my life.'

None of us will forget the day that she was baptized. When she got finished being baptized, she got back out and before she received the Holy Ghost, she stood and said, 'Now I would like to talk about the Holy Ghost for a while.' She then gave us a wonderful talk about the gift of the Holy Ghost.

(Later in Elder Anderson's journal)
Two young missionaries, both relatively new, (one had been out about five months, the other three weeks) accidentally knocked on the door of the seminary in Reagansburg. One hundred twenty-five-wonderful men were studying to become priests inside. They didn't realize this was the door they had knocked on because it looked like any other door. They were invited in. In somewhat of a panic, the man said, 'I am sorry we just don't have time right now.' The two missionaries were relieved, but then he said, 'Would you come back next Tuesday and spend two hours addressing all 125 of our group and answer questions about your church?' They agreed that they would, and ran down the road screaming.

They made a phone call to the mission president and cried for help. The mission president called us and said, 'Do you think that dear lady that you have just brought into the church would like to come help these two missionaries with this assignment?' I called her to explain what was to happen, and she said, 'more than I would like to eat, more than I would like to sleep, more than . . . '
I said, 'Fine, you don't have to explain.'

We drove her to the seminary and as we went in, she grabbed the two missionaries that had originally been invited, put her arms around them and said, 'you are wonderful, young men. Would each of you spend about two minutes bearing your testimony and then sit down and be quiet please?'

They were grateful for their assignment. They bore their testimony and then seated themselves. Then she got up and said, 'For the next 30 minutes I would like to talk to you about historical apostasy.' She knew every date and fact. She had a PHD in this. She talked about everything that had been taken away from the great teachings the Savior had given, mostly organizational, in the first part of her talk. Then the next 45 minutes were doctrinal. She gave every point of doctrinal changes, when it happened and what had changed. By the time she was done, she looked at them and said, 'In 1820 a boy walked into a grove of trees. He had been in a famine just like I have been. He knelt to pray, because he was hungry just like I have been. He saw God the Father and His Son. I know that is hard for you to believe that they could be two separate beings, but I know they are.'

*She shared scriptures that showed that they were and then said, 'I would like to talk about historical restoration of truth.' She then, point by point, dates by date, from the Doctrine and Covenants put back the organizational structure of Christ's church. The last 20 minutes of her talk were absolutely brilliant. She doctrinally put the truth back in place, point by point, principle by principle. When she finished this profound talk, she said, 'I have been in a famine as talked about in Amos. You know that because last year I was here teaching you.' For the first time, we realized that she was their Theology professor. She continued by saying, 'Last year when I was teaching you, I told you that I was still in a famine. I have been led to a feast. I invite you to come.' She finished with her testimony and sat down. What happened next was hard for me to understand. These 125 sincere, wonderful men stood and for the next seven minutes, gave a standing ovation.


By the time four minutes had gone by I was crying. I remember standing and looking into their eyes and seeing the tears in their eyes too. I wondered why they were applauding after the message she had given. I asked many of them later. They said, 'to hear someone so unashamed of the truth, to hear someone teaching with such power, to hear someone who finally has conviction.'

The truth is what can set us free . . .

Do we really know what we have?http://ldsemailforwards.blogspot.com/se ... %20Stories

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kirtland r.m.
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by kirtland r.m. »

If the outcome of hard archeological, historical, and comparative discoveries in the past century is an embarrassment to exclusivistic readings of religion, that, to the [Latter-day Saint], is a kind of confirmation and vindication. His faith assures him not only that Jesus anticipated his great predecessors (who were really successors) but that hardly a teaching or a practice is utterly distinct or peculiar or original in His earthly ministry. Jesus was not a plagiarist, unless that is the proper name for one who repeats Himself. He was the original author. The gospel of Jesus Christ came with Christ in the meridian of time only because the gospel of Jesus Christ came from Christ in prior dispensations. He did not teach merely a new twist on a syncretic-Mediterranean tradition. His earthly ministry enacted what had been planned and anticipated “from before the foundations of the world” (See, e.g., John 17:24; Ephesians 1:4; 1 Peter 1:20; Alma 22:13; D&C 130:20; Moses 5:57; Abraham 1:3), and from Adam down. Truman G. Madsen T. G. Madsen, Essay, p. xvii.

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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

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Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:53 am
Robin Hood wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:51 am
Luke wrote: March 24th, 2023, 8:43 am Interesting snippet in the Bible about Adam in Daniel 7. It reveals quite a bit! 😉
I just read Daniel 7. What do you think it reveals?
If you go in with the understanding that the Ancient of Days = Adam, it reveals that the Ancient of Days is God.

I was being a little jokey/facetious with my original comment, but I do believe that Daniel 7 makes it obvious that the Ancient of Days is God.

NLT Daniel 7
21 As I watched, this horn was waging war against God’s holy people and was defeating them,
22 until the Ancient One—the Most High—came and judged in favor of his holy people. Then the time arrived for the holy people to take over the kingdom.
Wow the NLT has a horribly bad translation of that verse. It really butchered it. I see why you chose that version.
Daniel 7.JPG
Daniel 7.JPG (33.52 KiB) Viewed 82 times
YLT
22 till that the Ancient of Days hath come, and judgment is given to the saints of the Most High, and the time hath come, and the saints have strengthened the kingdom.

NET
22 until the Ancient of Days arrived and judgment was rendered in favor of the holy ones of the Most High. Then the time came for the holy ones to take possession of the kingdom.

LSB
22 until the Ancient of Days came and judgment was given in favor of the saints of the Highest One, and the season arrived when the saints took possession of the kingdom.

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kirtland r.m.
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Re: In contrast to other Christian denominations Latter-day Saint teachings about Adam go far beyond what is in the bibl

Post by kirtland r.m. »

kirtland r.m. wrote: March 29th, 2023, 7:38 pm The fullness of the gospel is deep, wide, and far reaching.

(As written by LDS Missionary Scott Anderson in his journal.)

We had an unexpected moment in the mission field. We knocked on a door and a lady said something to us we had never heard, 'Come in.' Now remember, I was a German missionary. This never happened to us; no one ever invited us in. My companion said, 'Do you know who we are?'

'You want to talk about religion, don't you?' she said.

'Yes, we do', replied my companion.

'Oh, come in. I've been watching you walk around the neighborhood. I'm so excited to have you here. Please come into my study.' We went in and seated ourselves and she sat down behind the desk. She looked at us with a smile, then pointed to three PHD degrees hanging over her head. One is in Theology, the study of religion, one in Philosophy, the study of ideas, and one in European History specializing in Christianity. She then rubbed her hands together and said, 'Do you see this row of books here?' We looked at a well-arranged row of books. She then said, 'I wrote them all. I'm the Theology professor at the University of Munich. I've been doing this for 41 years. I love to talk about religion. What would you like to discuss?'
Now, shortly after these experiences she was baptized. Here is more on the story.
My inspired companion said we'd like to talk about the Book of Mormon.
She said, 'I don't know anything about the Book of Mormon.'
He said, 'I know.'

Twenty minutes later we walked out of the room. We had handed her a Book of Mormon and this trade off that we had been on was over. I didn't see this lady again for another eight and a half weeks. It was in a small room filled with people (when I saw her again), as she was standing in the front dressed in white. This Theology professor at the University of Munich was well known throughout Southern Germany. She stood up in front of this small congregation of people and said, 'Before I'm baptized I'd like to tell you my feelings. In Amos chapter 8:11 it says there will be a famine of the work of God. I've been in that famine for 76 years. Why do you think I have three PHD degrees? I've been hungering for truth and have been unable to find it. Then eight and one-half weeks ago, two boys walked into my home. I want you to know these boys are very nice and wonderful young men, but they didn't convert me. They couldn't; they don't know enough.' And then she smiled and said, 'but since the day they walked in my door I have read the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, the Pearl of Great Price, all of Talmage's great writings, Evidence and Reconciliations by John A. Widtsoe and 22 other volumes of church doctrine.'

She then said something which I think is a challenge for every one of us here. She said, _'I don't think you members know what you have.'_ Then in her quiet, powerful way, she said, 'After those years of studying philosophy, I picked up the D&C and read a few verses that answered some of the greatest questions of Aristotle and Socrates! When I read those verses, I wept for four hours.' Then she said again, 'I don't think you members know what you have. Don't you understand the world is in a famine? Don't you know we are starving for what you have? I am like a starving person being led to a feast. And over these eight and one-half weeks I have been able to feast in a way I have never known to be possible.'

Her powerful message and her challenging question were then ended with her favorite scripture, 'For you don't see the truth can make you free.' She said, 'these missionaries don't just carry membership in the church in their hands, they hold in their hands the power to make the atonement of Jesus Christ full force in my life. Today I'm going into the water and I'm going to make a covenant with Christ for the first time with proper authority. I've wanted to do this all my life.'

None of us will forget the day that she was baptized. When she got finished being baptized, she got back out and before she received the Holy Ghost, she stood and said, 'Now I would like to talk about the Holy Ghost for a while.' She then gave us a wonderful talk about the gift of the Holy Ghost.

(Later in Elder Anderson's journal)
Two young missionaries, both relatively new, (one had been out about five months, the other three weeks) accidentally knocked on the door of the seminary in Reagansburg. One hundred twenty-five-wonderful men were studying to become priests inside. They didn't realize this was the door they had knocked on because it looked like any other door. They were invited in. In somewhat of a panic, the man said, 'I am sorry we just don't have time right now.' The two missionaries were relieved, but then he said, 'Would you come back next Tuesday and spend two hours addressing all 125 of our group and answer questions about your church?' They agreed that they would, and ran down the road screaming.

They made a phone call to the mission president and cried for help. The mission president called us and said, 'Do you think that dear lady that you have just brought into the church would like to come help these two missionaries with this assignment?' I called her to explain what was to happen, and she said, 'more than I would like to eat, more than I would like to sleep, more than . . . '
I said, 'Fine, you don't have to explain.'

We drove her to the seminary and as we went in, she grabbed the two missionaries that had originally been invited, put her arms around them and said, 'you are wonderful, young men. Would each of you spend about two minutes bearing your testimony and then sit down and be quiet please?'

They were grateful for their assignment. They bore their testimony and then seated themselves. Then she got up and said, 'For the next 30 minutes I would like to talk to you about historical apostasy.' She knew every date and fact. She had a PHD in this. She talked about everything that had been taken away from the great teachings the Savior had given, mostly organizational, in the first part of her talk. Then the next 45 minutes were doctrinal. She gave every point of doctrinal changes, when it happened and what had changed. By the time she was done, she looked at them and said, 'In 1820 a boy walked into a grove of trees. He had been in a famine just like I have been. He knelt to pray, because he was hungry just like I have been. He saw God the Father and His Son. I know that is hard for you to believe that they could be two separate beings, but I know they are.'

*She shared scriptures that showed that they were and then said, 'I would like to talk about historical restoration of truth.' She then, point by point, dates by date, from the Doctrine and Covenants put back the organizational structure of Christ's church. The last 20 minutes of her talk were absolutely brilliant. She doctrinally put the truth back in place, point by point, principle by principle. When she finished this profound talk, she said, 'I have been in a famine as talked about in Amos. You know that because last year I was here teaching you.' For the first time, we realized that she was their Theology professor. She continued by saying, 'Last year when I was teaching you, I told you that I was still in a famine. I have been led to a feast. I invite you to come.' She finished with her testimony and sat down. What happened next was hard for me to understand. These 125 sincere, wonderful men stood and for the next seven minutes, gave a standing ovation.


By the time four minutes had gone by I was crying. I remember standing and looking into their eyes and seeing the tears in their eyes too. I wondered why they were applauding after the message she had given. I asked many of them later. They said, 'to hear someone so unashamed of the truth, to hear someone teaching with such power, to hear someone who finally has conviction.'

The truth is what can set us free . . .

Do we really know what we have?http://ldsemailforwards.blogspot.com/se ... %20Stories
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Now, shorty after this she was baptized, here is more.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-keozPyrAk

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