March 12 near-catastrophic Carrington event

[markharr]

Forgive my ignorance if I get something wrong here.

In a CME both matter and energy are ejected. The matter is plasma or inoized gas. The fourth state of matter. The energy is electromagnetic.. I suppose it is possible for the plasma to be ejected with such force that it makes it all the way to earth but likely wouldn't get far before it is drawn back in by the gravitational pull of the sun.

The problem is the the electromagnetism that comes from the magnetic field being ejected. That is what would cause the devastation on earth.

The velocity is going to be the speed of light regardless of the size of the explosion and how much matter is ejected.

This is basically a directed energy weapon. The amount of destruction on impact is going to be determined by distance, concentration and amount of energy. Velocity is always going to be the speed of light.

[tmac]

All of that stuff about CME causing megaquakes and tsunamis is pure fiction. The earth's 'magnetosphere' ebbs and flows all the time. Saying a weak 'magnetosphere' combined with a 'maximum' solar phase will cause such things is like pointing to an alignment of planets and predicting catastrophe. People have done this many times and nothing ever happens.The planets are too small to make a difference, just as CMEs are too weak to do physical damage to the earth. The magnetic pole moves around all the time and does not rewrite weather and climate. Even if it should completely reverse, there is no scientific proof that even that would rewrite weather and climate. I'd be interested in reading any peer reviewed publications that say otherwise. Maybe you could post some links to these if you have them handy. Any records to show there is a solar catastrophe every 12000 years?

Here is an article that talks about the solar cycle. Nothing about 12000 years here: https://spaceplace.nasa.gov/solar-cycles/en/

I just want to make sure I understand what you’re saying — that there should be zero concern about any kind of sun-caused natural disaster, that would cause any kind of significant damage on earth? Is that it?

[mike_rumble]

All of that stuff about CME causing megaquakes and tsunamis is pure fiction. The earth's 'magnetosphere' ebbs and flows all the time. Saying a weak 'magnetosphere' combined with a 'maximum' solar phase will cause such things is like pointing to an alignment of planets and predicting catastrophe. People have done this many times and nothing ever happens.The planets are too small to make a difference, just as CMEs are too weak to do physical damage to the earth. The magnetic pole moves around all the time and does not rewrite weather and climate. Even if it should completely reverse, there is no scientific proof that even that would rewrite weather and climate. I'd be interested in reading any peer reviewed publications that say otherwise. Maybe you could post some links to these if you have them handy. Any records to show there is a solar catastrophe every 12000 years?

Here is an article that talks about the solar cycle. Nothing about 12000 years here: https://spaceplace.nasa.gov/solar-cycles/en/

I just want to make sure I understand what you’re saying — that there should be zero concern about any kind of sun-caused natural disaster, that would cause any kind of significant damage on earth? Is that it?

We should be concerned about moderate damage. Maybe to some unshielded satellites and some transmission lines and to some computers, but there is no real scientific, experimental, or peer reviewed evidence that a CME would destroy all electronics all over the world, or that a CME would end modern civilization as we know it. Don't know how you read my post as having zero concern about this. Every article I've ever read about a world ending CME has turned out to be just someone's opinion or guess as to what might happen. If you know of a real scientific paper on the subject, I'd be interested in reading it.

[tmac]

I wasn’t limiting my question to possible damage to electronics, etc., but also to other possible sun-related natural disasters such as changing magnetic fields, pole shift(s), and related events like earthquakes, tsunamis, etc.

[markharr]

The most credible debunkers never completely dismiss everything in it's entirety nor do they fully back it. They analyze the various aspects of a claim and highlight what is truth and what is debunked and allow the reader/viewer to draw their own conclusions.

This guy does a great job of that and has done the Carrington event. Make sure you watch till the end because his style is to tell the story as society tends to tell it and then analyze it at the end.

[mike_rumble]

I wasn’t limiting my question to possible damage to electronics, etc., but also to other possible sun-related natural disasters such as changing magnetic fields, pole shift(s), and related events like earthquakes, tsunamis, etc.

If by "pole shift", you mean the physical earth does a flip over, then unless the Moon or some other planetary body smacks into us, that is never going to happen. I'm pretty sure a discharge of energy from the Sun isn't going to do that.

[Cruiserdude]

The most credible debunkers never completely dismiss everything in it's entirety nor do they fully back it. They analyze the various aspects of a claim and highlight what is truth and what is debunked and allow the reader/viewer to draw their own conclusions.

This guy does a great job of that and has done the Carrington event. Make sure you watch till the end because his style is to tell the story as society tends to tell it and then analyze it at the end.

I like this guy's style. Too many 'experts' incessantly blabbing their opinion all over the youtubes.... This guy's different though

[mike_rumble]

The most credible debunkers never completely dismiss everything in it's entirety nor do they fully back it. They analyze the various aspects of a claim and highlight what is truth and what is debunked and allow the reader/viewer to draw their own conclusions.

This guy does a great job of that and has done the Carrington event. Make sure you watch till the end because his style is to tell the story as society tends to tell it and then analyze it at the end.

He does a good job when discussing past history, but then goes off and weaves a science fiction thriller. It all sounds scary and it's end of the world stuff for sure. What he doesn't mention is that the effects of the Carrington event was hit and miss. Some places experienced problems while others didn't. If you're really worried, then sign up for one of those internet newspaper archives and read for yourself how it all went down. While it's true that we depend on technology these days, things like military assets (submarines, bombers, ships, tanks) are already hardened against EMP and would probably carry on as usual. Some satellites are also shielded against radiation and so on. Electrical transmission lines are better insulated than they were back when Quebec power grid was affected and over the years more and more power lines, phone lines and cable lines are being buried underground instead of being strung between wooden posts. If we're really interested in a world ending event, then the return of Jesus Christ should be the one to look for.

[markharr]

The most credible debunkers never completely dismiss everything in it's entirety nor do they fully back it. They analyze the various aspects of a claim and highlight what is truth and what is debunked and allow the reader/viewer to draw their own conclusions.

This guy does a great job of that and has done the Carrington event. Make sure you watch till the end because his style is to tell the story as society tends to tell it and then analyze it at the end.

He does a good job when discussing past history, but then goes off and weaves a science fiction thriller. It all sounds scary and it's end of the world stuff for sure. What he doesn't mention is that the effects of the Carrington event was hit and miss. Some places experienced problems while others didn't. If you're really worried, then sign up for one of those internet newspaper archives and read for yourself how it all went down. While it's true that we depend on technology these days, things like military assets (submarines, bombers, ships, tanks) are already hardened against EMP and would probably carry on as usual. Some satellites are also shielded against radiation and so on. Electrical transmission lines are better insulated than they were back when Quebec power grid was affected and over the years more and more power lines, phone lines and cable lines are being buried underground instead of being strung between wooden posts. If we're really interested in a world ending event, then the return of Jesus Christ should be the one to look for.

You have no idea what happened with Carrington beyond sparce localized accounts reported in newspapers. They didn't have the same technology that we had now and information didn't move as quickly as it does now.

[HVDC]

Forgive my ignorance if I get something wrong here.

In a CME both matter and energy are ejected. The matter is plasma or inoized gas. The fourth state of matter. The energy is electromagnetic.. I suppose it is possible for the plasma to be ejected with such force that it makes it all the way to earth but likely wouldn't get far before it is drawn back in by the gravitational pull of the sun.

The problem is the the electromagnetism that comes from the magnetic field being ejected. That is what would cause the devastation on earth.

The velocity is going to be the speed of light regardless of the size of the explosion and how much matter is ejected.

This is basically a directed energy weapon. The amount of destruction on impact is going to be determined by distance, concentration and amount of energy. Velocity is always going to be the speed of light.

Unless I am reading it wrong.

Not according to these guys:

CORONAL MASS EJECTIONS
Coronal Mass Ejections (CMEs) are large expulsions of plasma and magnetic field from the Sun’s corona. They can eject billions of tons of coronal material and carry an embedded magnetic field (frozen in flux) that is stronger than the background solar wind interplanetary magnetic field (IMF) strength. CMEs travel outward from the Sun at speeds ranging from slower than 250 kilometers per second (km/s) to as fast as near 3000 km/s. The fastest Earth-directed CMEs can reach our planet in as little as 15-18 hours. Slower CMEs can take several days to arrive. They expand in size as they propagate away from the Sun and larger CMEs can reach a size comprising nearly a quarter of the space between Earth and the Sun by the time it reaches our planet.

...

https://www.swpc.noaa.gov/phenomena/cor ... -ejections

Sir H

[markharr]

Forgive my ignorance if I get something wrong here.

In a CME both matter and energy are ejected. The matter is plasma or inoized gas. The fourth state of matter. The energy is electromagnetic.. I suppose it is possible for the plasma to be ejected with such force that it makes it all the way to earth but likely wouldn't get far before it is drawn back in by the gravitational pull of the sun.

The problem is the the electromagnetism that comes from the magnetic field being ejected. That is what would cause the devastation on earth.

The velocity is going to be the speed of light regardless of the size of the explosion and how much matter is ejected.

This is basically a directed energy weapon. The amount of destruction on impact is going to be determined by distance, concentration and amount of energy. Velocity is always going to be the speed of light.

Unless I am reading it wrong.

Not according to these guys:

CORONAL MASS EJECTIONS
Coronal Mass Ejections (CMEs) are large expulsions of plasma and magnetic field from the Sun’s corona. They can eject billions of tons of coronal material and carry an embedded magnetic field (frozen in flux) that is stronger than the background solar wind interplanetary magnetic field (IMF) strength. CMEs travel outward from the Sun at speeds ranging from slower than 250 kilometers per second (km/s) to as fast as near 3000 km/s. The fastest Earth-directed CMEs can reach our planet in as little as 15-18 hours. Slower CMEs can take several days to arrive. They expand in size as they propagate away from the Sun and larger CMEs can reach a size comprising nearly a quarter of the space between Earth and the Sun by the time it reaches our planet.

...

https://www.swpc.noaa.gov/phenomena/cor ... -ejections

Sir H

They would know more than me for sure.

[blitzinstripes]

All of that stuff about CME causing megaquakes and tsunamis is pure fiction. The earth's 'magnetosphere' ebbs and flows all the time. Saying a weak 'magnetosphere' combined with a 'maximum' solar phase will cause such things is like pointing to an alignment of planets and predicting catastrophe. People have done this many times and nothing ever happens.The planets are too small to make a difference, just as CMEs are too weak to do physical damage to the earth. The magnetic pole moves around all the time and does not rewrite weather and climate. Even if it should completely reverse, there is no scientific proof that even that would rewrite weather and climate. I'd be interested in reading any peer reviewed publications that say otherwise. Maybe you could post some links to these if you have them handy. Any records to show there is a solar catastrophe every 12000 years?

Here is an article that talks about the solar cycle. Nothing about 12000 years here: https://spaceplace.nasa.gov/solar-cycles/en/

Yes. Significant evidence for a 12000 year cycle. Visit Suspicious Observers YouTube channel and take a deep dive. I'm not gonna do your homework for you. I've been following it for years. If you're truly interested, check it out. The evidence is in the crust to validate all of the 12000 year Heinrich events. This is the link to a short video, the first in a 27 part series. Ben cites scientific peer reviewed data and current/ latest papers and NASA data. If the first video piques your interest, I highly recommend the entire series. Happy reading.

https://youtu.be/V2decDcEJqo

[TheDuke]

FYI the last solar cycle max and min is a bust and didn't follow tradition.

I personally don't think that all but the very worst CME would destroy much that cannot be put back quite quickly. I don't buy the burning electrics in a car for example. but then I had a surge a few years back that put 220 in my 110 lines. It did take out the low voltage stuff, i.e. garage door computer but not garage door, some clocks and such. BTW it only hits the side facing the sun when it gets here.

I think the real risk of a moderate/normal CME, in the studies that I've seen is the likelihood of destroying many/most/all the satellites. Don't recall the details of the studies and my focus was on affecting military at one point and aviation on the other study; but it seems likely we would not just lose our military eyes, but our TV, Internet, GPS, aviation flight systems. We'd be cut off for a long, time, maybe a decade to replace, more for some and less for others. Most comm sats are geo stationary and are way up there, more suspect, but some would be behind the globe and less affected. LEO's (like GPS and many mil sats) are lower but circling fast and might get more of them?

In this day and age being cut off completely would be the instigation for some leaders to take advantage of the situation and strike, like WEF and COVID opportunity.

[Cruiserdude]

All of that stuff about CME causing megaquakes and tsunamis is pure fiction. The earth's 'magnetosphere' ebbs and flows all the time. Saying a weak 'magnetosphere' combined with a 'maximum' solar phase will cause such things is like pointing to an alignment of planets and predicting catastrophe. People have done this many times and nothing ever happens.The planets are too small to make a difference, just as CMEs are too weak to do physical damage to the earth. The magnetic pole moves around all the time and does not rewrite weather and climate. Even if it should completely reverse, there is no scientific proof that even that would rewrite weather and climate. I'd be interested in reading any peer reviewed publications that say otherwise. Maybe you could post some links to these if you have them handy. Any records to show there is a solar catastrophe every 12000 years?

Here is an article that talks about the solar cycle. Nothing about 12000 years here: https://spaceplace.nasa.gov/solar-cycles/en/

Yes. Significant evidence for a 12000 year cycle. Visit Suspicious Observers YouTube channel and take a deep dive. I'm not gonna do your homework for you. I've been following it for years. If you're truly interested, check it out. The evidence is in the crust to validate all of the 12000 year Heinrich events. This is the link to a short video, the first in a 27 part series. Ben cites scientific peer reviewed data and current/ latest papers and NASA data. If the first video piques your interest, I highly recommend the entire series. Happy reading.

https://youtu.be/V2decDcEJqo

I'm excited to check this out tonight I must be getting old if this is my Friday night entertainment