Flat Earth

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Allison
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Allison »

Bronco73idi wrote: December 20th, 2022, 3:07 pm “This earth was organized or formed out of other planets which were broke up and remodelled and made into the one on which we live.”

Joseph Smith
William Clayton recorded that Joseph Smith uttered those prophetic words to a group of Saints in Nauvoo on January 5, 1841. Well, Joseph at least uttered something close to those words. Brother William McIntire, who was also there, recorded him saying it a bit differently: “Earth has been organized out of portions of other Globes that has ben Disorganized.” Whatever words he actually used to say it, what Joseph told the congregation that day was absolutely amazing and way ahead of its time. He said that our planet was formed from the parts of other, dismantled planets or globes. According to the Prophet, our earth was made out of other worlds. (1)

Now, a statement like this makes our imaginations run wild. Where in the world did that come from? What was Joseph Smith thinking? What was he trying to say? What does science today have to say on the subject? I’ll attempt to answer those questions. No, this post is not about the theory that dinosaur bones came from other planets–an erroneous theory we’ll discuss at another time. The truth packed into Joseph’s statement about other planets is so much more compelling and beautiful than that. No, this post is about how the planet Earth actually formed around 4.5 billion years ago. And it’s about a man claiming to be a prophet of God who seemed to have known how the earth actually formed, over a hundred years before scientists figured it out. Yes guys, Joseph was right on the money with this one—our earth was definitely made out of other planets.”

Jospeh Smith was not a flat earth believer……


That’s pretty amazing and I don’t doubt you, but would it be possible to get the references?

Just out of curiosity though, how do we arrive at the age of the Earth being 4.5 billion years?

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h_p
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Re: Flat Earth

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Allison wrote: December 20th, 2022, 5:36 pm I may be a little more open-minded than you think. If I am wrong, I don’t mind eating crow, because it has been super fun and fascinating and has shown me first hand why STEM subjects could be fun and challenging, like a set of puzzles, rather than dry and boring. But all through this journey of debating some really talented people, there have been some surprising and amazing discoveries, such as the (rather obviously) fake space narrative we’ve all been told. Also, I’ve been amazed how weak some of their arguments have been (not necessarily this one).

But to stop rambling, thank you for your honesty. In order to not unduly wear out my husband’s patience, would you be willing to just save this calculation as a possible topic to bring up again? I’ll concede that you may be right (though not necessarily), and if it comes down to it later, we can dig in and look at the pros and cons of your conclusions with my much more math-minded husband involved. Do you mind if we put it on hold for a while and look at some other aspects?
Yes, absolutely. I would like to hear a counter-interpretation to this, as long as it's based in something rigorous. Blaming it on things like humidity or perspective isn't going to be very interesting to me, just being honest. Eventually, I'm wanting to work through more of the geometry to see if what I'm finding actually holds up for all latitudes.

Bronco73idi
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Re: Flat Earth

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Allison wrote: December 20th, 2022, 5:41 pm
Bronco73idi wrote: December 20th, 2022, 3:07 pm “This earth was organized or formed out of other planets which were broke up and remodelled and made into the one on which we live.”

Joseph Smith
William Clayton recorded that Joseph Smith uttered those prophetic words to a group of Saints in Nauvoo on January 5, 1841. Well, Joseph at least uttered something close to those words. Brother William McIntire, who was also there, recorded him saying it a bit differently: “Earth has been organized out of portions of other Globes that has ben Disorganized.” Whatever words he actually used to say it, what Joseph told the congregation that day was absolutely amazing and way ahead of its time. He said that our planet was formed from the parts of other, dismantled planets or globes. According to the Prophet, our earth was made out of other worlds. (1)

Now, a statement like this makes our imaginations run wild. Where in the world did that come from? What was Joseph Smith thinking? What was he trying to say? What does science today have to say on the subject? I’ll attempt to answer those questions. No, this post is not about the theory that dinosaur bones came from other planets–an erroneous theory we’ll discuss at another time. The truth packed into Joseph’s statement about other planets is so much more compelling and beautiful than that. No, this post is about how the planet Earth actually formed around 4.5 billion years ago. And it’s about a man claiming to be a prophet of God who seemed to have known how the earth actually formed, over a hundred years before scientists figured it out. Yes guys, Joseph was right on the money with this one—our earth was definitely made out of other planets.”

Jospeh Smith was not a flat earth believer……


That’s pretty amazing and I don’t doubt you, but would it be possible to get the references?

Just out of curiosity though, how do we arrive at the age of the Earth being 4.5 billion years?
Jospeh Smith was not a flat earth believer…..

This is the only thing I wrote, this is my opinion which is based off of facts that I have read in 2016-17. I knew Jospeh taught this earth is formed from satellites and some satellites have been removed from this earth and they will be reinstalled, ie the earth will be made whole.


I did a quick Google search and found this article.

https://sitatcit.home.blog/2020/04/13/t ... f-planets/

The part I don’t understand about flat earth LDS members is that we believe there are other worlds like ours, are they all flat? If we look in a telescope we can see round globes of other worlds, why would the lord deceive his siblings so?

Allison
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Allison »

Bronco73idi wrote: December 21st, 2022, 12:57 am
Allison wrote: December 20th, 2022, 5:41 pm
Bronco73idi wrote: December 20th, 2022, 3:07 pm “This earth was organized or formed out of other planets which were broke up and remodelled and made into the one on which we live.”

Joseph Smith
William Clayton recorded that Joseph Smith uttered those prophetic words to a group of Saints in Nauvoo on January 5, 1841. Well, Joseph at least uttered something close to those words. Brother William McIntire, who was also there, recorded him saying it a bit differently: “Earth has been organized out of portions of other Globes that has ben Disorganized.” Whatever words he actually used to say it, what Joseph told the congregation that day was absolutely amazing and way ahead of its time. He said that our planet was formed from the parts of other, dismantled planets or globes. According to the Prophet, our earth was made out of other worlds. (1)

Now, a statement like this makes our imaginations run wild. Where in the world did that come from? What was Joseph Smith thinking? What was he trying to say? What does science today have to say on the subject? I’ll attempt to answer those questions. No, this post is not about the theory that dinosaur bones came from other planets–an erroneous theory we’ll discuss at another time. The truth packed into Joseph’s statement about other planets is so much more compelling and beautiful than that. No, this post is about how the planet Earth actually formed around 4.5 billion years ago. And it’s about a man claiming to be a prophet of God who seemed to have known how the earth actually formed, over a hundred years before scientists figured it out. Yes guys, Joseph was right on the money with this one—our earth was definitely made out of other planets.”

Jospeh Smith was not a flat earth believer……


That’s pretty amazing and I don’t doubt you, but would it be possible to get the references?

Just out of curiosity though, how do we arrive at the age of the Earth being 4.5 billion years?
Jospeh Smith was not a flat earth believer…..

This is the only thing I wrote, this is my opinion which is based off of facts that I have read in 2016-17. I knew Jospeh taught this earth is formed from satellites and some satellites have been removed from this earth and they will be reinstalled, ie the earth will be made whole.


I did a quick Google search and found this article.

https://sitatcit.home.blog/2020/04/13/t ... f-planets/

The part I don’t understand about flat earth LDS members is that we believe there are other worlds like ours, are they all flat? If we look in a telescope we can see round globes of other worlds, why would the lord deceive his siblings so?


Here is just one way it could work: Imagine a table covered with snow globes, and each snow globe has water at the bottom with “islands” (continents) scattered. If the table were large enough, there could be worlds without number, and some of the snow globes could have been fashioned out of old material from other worlds.

But I have no idea if it is like that, or something Far far more creative and exciting that I cannot even imagine with my finite brain. That’s why we want to know for sure one way or another—not to be annoying to people who believe in the ball, but just because there are enough inconsistencies and anomalies to raise serious questions about what we’ve been told. And we want to know, not just believe.

Allison
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Re: Flat Earth

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anonymous91
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by anonymous91 »

I've often thought that we are being lied to about the earth, and what we are told it "supposedly" is. Questions such as:

Why do old maps show land masses that no longer exist (or so we are led to believe)?
Why did Admiral Byrd talk about finding new land beyond Antarctica, then quickly recanted when he was a well-respected individual that had nothing to gain from such a tale?
Why do people on the "supposed" Space Station" use CGI, hidden wire harnesses, and other tricks to attempt to convince people that they are floating in space? If they are really in space, why the deception?
How in the world did NASA lose the data to travel back to the moon? One of the most important discoveries in the history of man, yet they were so incompetent in handling the sensitive data that they didn't even consider redundancy?
Why are people routinely stopped in uncharted waters by Military vessels, and told to turn around? Why are trips to Antarctica so regulated where people are allowed to explore? They claim it's for their safety, but is it really? What are they afraid that people will discover?
How is it possible that a spaceship made up of mostly aluminum and stainless steel was able to withstand upper atmospheric temperatures that "science" claims would completely melt both of these metals?

While pondering and researching these questions, I stumbled over something I found very interesting. It seems that someone that goes by the name "stergios" realized that the surface of the moon could actually be a map of the world we live on. He methodically mapped out the surface of the moon throughout all of the lunar cycles, and found something very fascinating, here is one of the images shown below:

Image


There are videos and articles that go into more depth. Here is just one of the videos that explain more about this map & theory:


From what I understand is that the moon we see is considered to be a plasma image, that was taken sometime in the distant past (similar to an x-ray picture) that some speculate could have been taken after God created the earth and that the moon bears witness of his creation (as above, so below). Of course, then there is also a lot of proof for a hollow earth with its own sun. In several apocalyptical accounts of the Adam & Eve story, for example, it seems that Adam & Eve were actually within Hollow Earth (where some believe the Garden of Eden is also located).

Here's another video that talks about what an astronomical clock is, which I found to be fascinating:


Here's another video that asks a lot of good questions about the globe earth to consider:


Things start clicking into place, and all of a sudden it becomes apparent why all of the subterfuge from TPTB. It answers the question of why we are led to believe that we live on a finite planet with limited resources, we are stuck in the sandbox, and are living the "Truman Show".

This explains why they had to convince us that the moon landing was real, and just a planet. What would happen if we discovered its true purpose? If we are led to believe it's just a boring moon rock floating in space, why think that there is something more to it?

It explains a lot of questions for me, and some of the puzzle pieces seem to fit. It would also explain where the lost tribes all of a sudden come from in the last days, I always wondered about that too. It sure would alter the way that future events could potentially play out; if you were to consider that there are lands that we aren't even aware of.

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Re: Flat Earth

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I stumbled upon the Flatter Day Saints recently... :D

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Re: Flat Earth

Post by creator »

anonymous91 wrote: February 5th, 2023, 2:17 pm I've often thought that we are being lied to about the earth, and what we are told it "supposedly" is...
I have some of those same questions.

We are for sure being lied to about the Earth, our solar system, space, etc.

Clearly there is an agenda to obscure and hide truth. Perhaps they want to keep us from really knowing what the cosmos is, what the Moon is, what the planets are... so they feed us this narrative that we went to the Moon, that we have a rover on Mars, that we have probes/satellites in deep space. I suspect flat earth could be a psy op. They use controlled opposition to represent the two sides of the argument that they want to exist, to distract you from the door #3, the actual truth.

Perhaps everything beyond the atmosphere of the Earth is actually non-physical?

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Re: Flat Earth

Post by creator »

anonymous91 wrote: February 5th, 2023, 2:17 pmWhile pondering and researching these questions, I stumbled over something I found very interesting. It seems that someone that goes by the name "stergios" realized that the surface of the moon could actually be a map of the world we live on. He methodically mapped out the surface of the moon throughout all of the lunar cycles, and found something very fascinating, here is one of the images shown below:

There are videos and articles that go into more depth. Here is just one of the videos that explain more about this map & theory:
From what I understand is that the moon we see is considered to be a plasma image, that was taken sometime in the distant past (similar to an x-ray picture) that some speculate could have been taken after God created the earth and that the moon bears witness of his creation (as above, so below). Of course, then there is also a lot of proof for a hollow earth with its own sun. In several apocalyptical accounts of the Adam & Eve story, for example, it seems that Adam & Eve were actually within Hollow Earth (where some believe the Garden of Eden is also located).
Wow, that's a super interesting theory. If the Moon is "a plasma image, that was taken sometime in the distant past", perhaps it's from when the Moon separated from the Earth (according to various esoteric histories). ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Never heard this theory before. But I have seen some of the old maps that have bodies of land that don't exist on our current maps.

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RTStone
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by RTStone »

When Fred brought this up last November I always thought of flat earthers as fringe lunatics or was a Gov op to label conspiracy theorists as nut jobs. Recently my neighbor who I have a lot of respect for told me the earth is flat no doubt about it. So I had to look into it the last couple of months. We have all been lied to about everything. I was so brainwashed about the globe my whole life that I would not even look into flat earth until now. I have just totally dismissed flat earthers. The globe tops all conspiracies combined. If you can actually wrap your head around it, you should be teaching your kids all about this. The most convincing thing is the curvature of the earth that does not exist at all. The curvature cannot be proven. Boats that seem to disappear over the horizon that we always thought were lost from site because of the curvature of the earth can be fully seen with a telescope. In the vid below it points out seeing Chicago from across the lake which would be impossible from that distance if the earth was round like they say it is. Apparently it is not! The ancients new this and much more. They built things that we haven't a clue how they did it. They believed in a flat earth. We have been dumbed down on purpose. Those who really think things out do not make good slaves. Why do you think the most evil men on earth call themselves "Globalists"? Think about it!

https://yandex.com/video/preview/8610681368097037142 This is the shortest most concise version I have found. Just 10 minutes.

The non existence of the curvature of the earth is what convinced me that the earth is flat. Here are 200 proofs of the flat earth:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awYRBT6udQc&t=3361s

Here is a 3 minute short version: https://www.bitchute.com/video/TVvY0y3lBU7y/

For all your answers you can go to flatearthdave.com https://www.theflatearthpodcast.com/

Maybe by now everything I am saying has already been said. I am not writing this to get in a debate.. If you want the answers they are all here for you. It took me over 70 years to actually figure this one out. It took me 69 years to figure out how the LDS church has been deceiving us our whole lives. It is so much easier to tell someone a lie than to convince them they have been lied to their whole life. Don't have the time or inclination to battle you over your belief. I'll leave that debate to Shawn Henry. He is doing a great job and speaks the truth.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

creator wrote: February 27th, 2023, 6:48 pm I suspect flat earth could be a psy op. They use controlled opposition to represent the two sides of the argument that they want to exist, to distract you from the door #3, the actual truth.
The problem with that thought is that the Lord would have to be in on the psy-op. He either physically separated the waters or he didn't and the devil even corrupted Joseph Smith's two creation accounts.

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Re: Flat Earth

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Shawn Henry wrote: March 1st, 2023, 9:34 amThe problem with that thought is that the Lord would have to be in on the psy-op. He either physically separated the waters or he didn't...
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. What does separating the waters have to do with whether the earth is flat or round?

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

creator wrote: March 1st, 2023, 9:38 am
Shawn Henry wrote: March 1st, 2023, 9:34 amThe problem with that thought is that the Lord would have to be in on the psy-op. He either physically separated the waters or he didn't...
I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. What does separating the waters have to do with whether the earth is flat or round?
A dome/firmament above us that holds the earth's waters above us is a physical construct. Just like in a snow globe, the interior would have to have a flat surface.


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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

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Is that the extent of your intellectual contribution? Are you even familiar with Professor Dave's history with flat earthers?

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Re: Flat Earth

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Shawn Henry wrote: March 1st, 2023, 9:42 amA dome/firmament above us that holds the earth's waters above us is a physical construct. Just like in a snow globe, the interior would have to have a flat surface.
You say it's "physical", it's not necessarily physical. In the Bible, God said the firmament = heaven. And a supposed physical dome/firmament doesn't necessarily rule out a globe earth. There are also other interpretations of the waters above and below the firmament.

Yes, we've been lied to about the earth and cosmos, but I'm not convinced 'flat earth' is where the truth is. Maybe the reason some people see scriptural support for a flat earth is a result of not understanding the symbolism or real meaning in a lot of those scriptures. They are taking it too literally and physically.

"God called the firmament Heaven". (Genesis 1)
"..caused darkness to come up upon the face of the deep; and my Spirit moved upon the face of the water" (Genesis 1)

The bible uses symbolical language. Waters can also represent people. The creation story is about God organizing mankind based on their level of progression and development, using terms like sun, moon, stars // light, air, earth, water // beasts of the field, fowls of the air, and fishes of the sea. These are all references to the development of mankind over time.

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Fred
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Re: Flat Earth

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creator wrote: March 1st, 2023, 10:35 am
Shawn Henry wrote: March 1st, 2023, 9:42 amA dome/firmament above us that holds the earth's waters above us is a physical construct. Just like in a snow globe, the interior would have to have a flat surface.
You say it's "physical", it's not necessarily physical. In the Bible, God said the firmament = heaven. And a supposed physical dome/firmament doesn't necessarily rule out a globe earth. There are also other interpretations of the waters above and below the firmament.

Yes, we've been lied to about the earth and cosmos, but I'm not convinced 'flat earth' is where the truth is. Maybe the reason some people see scriptural support for a flat earth is a result of not understanding the symbolism or real meaning in a lot of those scriptures. They are taking it too literally and physically.

"God called the firmament Heaven". (Genesis 1)
"..caused darkness to come up upon the face of the deep; and my Spirit moved upon the face of the water" (Genesis 1)

The bible uses symbolical language. Waters can also represent people. The creation story is about God organizing mankind based on their level of progression and development, using terms like sun, moon, stars // light, air, earth, water // beasts of the field, fowls of the air, and fishes of the sea. These are all references to the development of mankind over time.
I'm glad to see your mind is still open about this. Somebody called me a flat earther for starting this thread. I am not. There are many arguments in favor of each. One thing is clear. There are people that know for sure. They must be laughing their arses off. Anyone can know the truth for themselves by simply flying over the south pole. It is a big fat lie that you will be shot down. There are flights around there daily. Ask Grant Cardone to put an end to the debate once and for all and simply fly his $50 million dollar jet he bought to avoid the taxes and take a camera. Both of you will be famous, forever, one way or the other.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

creator wrote: March 1st, 2023, 10:35 am
Shawn Henry wrote: March 1st, 2023, 9:42 amA dome/firmament above us that holds the earth's waters above us is a physical construct. Just like in a snow globe, the interior would have to have a flat surface.
You say it's "physical", it's not necessarily physical. In the Bible, God said the firmament = heaven. And a supposed physical dome/firmament doesn't necessarily rule out a globe earth. There are also other interpretations of the waters above and below the firmament.

Yes, we've been lied to about the earth and cosmos, but I'm not convinced 'flat earth' is where the truth is. Maybe the reason some people see scriptural support for a flat earth is a result of not understanding the symbolism or real meaning in a lot of those scriptures. They are taking it too literally and physically.

"God called the firmament Heaven". (Genesis 1)
"..caused darkness to come up upon the face of the deep; and my Spirit moved upon the face of the water" (Genesis 1)

The bible uses symbolical language. Waters can also represent people. The creation story is about God organizing mankind based on their level of progression and development, using terms like sun, moon, stars // light, air, earth, water // beasts of the field, fowls of the air, and fishes of the sea. These are all references to the development of mankind over time.
It's not a matter of symbology versus literalism. It's a matter of being right or completely wrong. The creations accounts are clear that all the stars, the sun and moon, are right here underneath the earth's waters. The above waters of the earth enclose the entire cosmos we see in the night sky. It's waters above and below with everything else inside. This means the sun is smaller than the earth.

There's no symbology in getting something completely wrong.

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Re: Flat Earth

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I can also respond by saying you are completely wrong. It doesn't further the conversation. I would go into more details but I can see you don't care to be presented with a different perspective.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

creator wrote: March 1st, 2023, 10:40 pm I can also respond by saying you are completely wrong. It doesn't further the conversation. I would go into more details but I can see you don't care to be presented with a different perspective.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I wasn't saying you are completely wrong. I was saying the text is completely wrong or the text is right.

Either the sun and all the stars are right here underneath the earth's waters or the text is wrong. No amount of symbology can account for the text being so far off.

If you have a different perspective of how the earth's waters can encompass the entire cosmos, please share. That different perspective, however, can't include the fact that the earth's waters don't do that, because that is what would make the text completely wrong.

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Re: Flat Earth

Post by creator »

I would say the text is right, but I don't interpret it from the same perspective. What you are calling a "physical construct", I would say actually has a more spiritual interpretation; a spiritual reality.
Shawn Henry wrote: March 2nd, 2023, 12:32 pmIf you have a different perspective of how the earth's waters can encompass the entire cosmos, please share.
When I have more time I could share more. Although I never said "the earth's waters can encompass the entire cosmos". #strawman

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

creator wrote: March 2nd, 2023, 1:09 pm When I have more time I could share more. Although I never said "the earth's waters can encompass the entire cosmos". #strawman
I know, I didn't say you said that. I'm saying all 3 creation accounts say that.

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Re: Flat Earth

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Last edited by FoxMammaWisdom on March 3rd, 2023, 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Flat Earth

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Shawn Henry wrote: March 2nd, 2023, 1:43 pm
creator wrote: March 2nd, 2023, 1:09 pm When I have more time I could share more. Although I never said "the earth's waters can encompass the entire cosmos". #strawman
I know, I didn't say you said that. I'm saying all 3 creation accounts say that.
Ok, then I misread what I thought you were saying.

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Re: Flat Earth

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Shawn Henry wrote: March 1st, 2023, 9:42 amA dome/firmament above us that holds the earth's waters above us is a physical construct. Just like in a snow globe, the interior would have to have a flat surface.
So, back to this.. you describe a "dome/firmament above us" that is a "physical construct" and "holds the earth's waters above us ". You're giving it limitations that it has to be flat, yet those things could still be true and it also be round. I'm saying the interpretation of what it is is much more spiritual.

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