The Humble Followers of Christ

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CaptainM
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The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by CaptainM »

As I reflect upon the words of Christ, I wish with all my heart that I could count myself as being part of the portion highlighted. I think there is a prevailing sentiment that it includes "me" and few others.

14  They wear stiff necks and high heads; yea, and because of pride, and wickedness, and abominations, and whoredoms, they have all gone astray save it be a few, who are the humble followers of Christ; nevertheless, they are led, that in many instances they do err because they are taught by the precepts of men. (2 Nephi 28)
11:31

Is there a rampant egotistical way that we believe our precepts are correct, and everybody else is at least a little off? I wonder what we all need to do to accomplish Zion? I think there is a tendency we use the words of Christ as a weapon instead of internally holding fast to them.

Your thoughts...???

In Christ. Best wishes...

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cab
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by cab »

Everyone thinks they are the wheat and everyone else is the chaff. That they are built on the rock while others’ foundation is sandy. That they are on the strait path and others are in the midsts of darkness. That they are awake and everyone else is asleep.
I guess the only safety is remaining truly humble and repentant and loving others.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Shawn Henry »

And whoso knocketh, to him will he open; and the wise, and the learned, and they that are rich, who are puffed up because of their learning, and their wisdom, and their riches—yea, they are they whom he despiseth; and save they shall cast these things away, and consider themselves fools before God, and come down in the depths of humility, he will not open unto them.

How many of us actually consider ourselves fools?

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Niemand
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Niemand »

In "The Screwtape Letters", C.S. Lewis has a demon instructing another demon on how to ruin a man. I always remember this bit:
"Your patient has become humble; have you drawn his attention to the fact? All virtues are less formidable to us once the man is aware that he has them, but this is specially true of humility."
In other words, if you keep thinking of how humble you are, you probably aren't. It's a paradox. Try to be humble but don't tell everyone how humble you are.

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ransomme
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by ransomme »

Overcoming ego is a huge step that helps one love more purely and avoid many character flaws/natural man.

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cab
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by cab »

Shawn Henry wrote: January 11th, 2023, 2:37 am And whoso knocketh, to him will he open; and the wise, and the learned, and they that are rich, who are puffed up because of their learning, and their wisdom, and their riches—yea, they are they whom he despiseth; and save they shall cast these things away, and consider themselves fools before God, and come down in the depths of humility, he will not open unto them.

How many of us actually consider ourselves fools?

I’m an idiot

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John Tavner
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by John Tavner »

cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:09 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: January 11th, 2023, 2:37 am And whoso knocketh, to him will he open; and the wise, and the learned, and they that are rich, who are puffed up because of their learning, and their wisdom, and their riches—yea, they are they whom he despiseth; and save they shall cast these things away, and consider themselves fools before God, and come down in the depths of humility, he will not open unto them.

How many of us actually consider ourselves fools?

I’m an idiot
God doesn't want you to think you're an idiot, He wants you te realize you need Him, that you are weak, not for Hiz sake, but for yours, that at one point you despised wisdom and despised discipline. So recognize that, turn to Him in your weakness and then believe HE will make you strong and will always guide you. Seek Him always. Fool wasn't intended to degrade yourself. It was a recognition that man's wisdom can not surpass God's wisdom and all things are in His hand and His path is better than any other path we can think of. That is what it means to "consider yourself a fool before God" It doesn't say "Always consider yoruself a fool" It says "before God" consider yourself a fool. SO anytime you get self-righteous and think you know better than God, realize you're the one who is a fool, before God is. God wants you to look like Him. You and I are giving him deference in that guidance. You can't become like Him, if deep down you have submitted to being an "idiot" all your life. To receive Him we must recognize how awful we are, but we shouldn't stay there. It is the reason HE gives us His Holy Spirit, it is why HE says we are clean and made pure. I'm not saying or implying you're doing this, but sometimes we stay in a false humility our entire life and it is actually a method of damnation because we reject what the Lord is freely offering us.
Last edited by John Tavner on January 11th, 2023, 12:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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John Tavner
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by John Tavner »

cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:29 am Everyone thinks they are the wheat and everyone else is the chaff. That they are built on the rock while others’ foundation is sandy. That they are on the strait path and others are in the midsts of darkness. That they are awake and everyone else is asleep.
I guess the only safety is remaining truly humble and repentant and loving others.
It begins with the comparison. Already we are judging unrighteously, and unknowingly, because the moment you call someone a tare or a wolf, you are condemning them and saying that their eternal and internal nature is that of wickedness and not of God and they have no chance of becoming like Him.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Shawn Henry »

cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:09 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: January 11th, 2023, 2:37 am And whoso knocketh, to him will he open; and the wise, and the learned, and they that are rich, who are puffed up because of their learning, and their wisdom, and their riches—yea, they are they whom he despiseth; and save they shall cast these things away, and consider themselves fools before God, and come down in the depths of humility, he will not open unto them.

How many of us actually consider ourselves fools?
I’m an idiot
That works too, lol.

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NeveR
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by NeveR »

Niemand wrote: January 11th, 2023, 5:19 am In "The Screwtape Letters", C.S. Lewis has a demon instructing another demon on how to ruin a man. I always remember this bit:
"Your patient has become humble; have you drawn his attention to the fact? All virtues are less formidable to us once the man is aware that he has them, but this is specially true of humility."
In other words, if you keep thinking of how humble you are, you probably aren't. It's a paradox. Try to be humble but don't tell everyone how humble you are.
I was just about to make the exact same point!

The paradox of the Christian focus on virtue is it brings self-consciousness. The minute people try to be virtuous because they know it's expected of them and they will be rewarded for it in the afterlife, they defeat every part of the actual value of virtue.

My Dad always says you get better Christians by simply teaching people to be decent human beings than by telling them Jesus will punish their sins and reward their good deeds.
Last edited by NeveR on January 11th, 2023, 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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mike_rumble
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by mike_rumble »

I might get some pushback on this, but I think it's similar to when people write the word "G-d" instead of just writing "God". They think they're being virtuous, but all they are really doing is saying "look at me, I'm so virtuous and faithful and good that I refuse to write any of the terms we use for God". Yes, I know other cultures do this, but they are just trying to send out the same signals. They all look for the praise of men, spoken or unspoken.

endlessQuestions
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by endlessQuestions »

Shawn Henry wrote: January 11th, 2023, 2:37 am And whoso knocketh, to him will he open; and the wise, and the learned, and they that are rich, who are puffed up because of their learning, and their wisdom, and their riches—yea, they are they whom he despiseth; and save they shall cast these things away, and consider themselves fools before God, and come down in the depths of humility, he will not open unto them.

How many of us actually consider ourselves fools?
I do. I even wrote a book about it quite a long time ago where one of the characters was called the Fortunate Fool - a man who understood his true place in the universe, in relation to his God. <shrug>

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Cruiserdude
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Cruiserdude »

Niemand wrote: January 11th, 2023, 5:19 am In "The Screwtape Letters", C.S. Lewis has a demon instructing another demon on how to ruin a man. I always remember this bit:
"Your patient has become humble; have you drawn his attention to the fact? All virtues are less formidable to us once the man is aware that he has them, but this is specially true of humility."
In other words, if you keep thinking of how humble you are, you probably aren't. It's a paradox. Try to be humble but don't tell everyone how humble you are.
I've never read the screwtape letters but that is a powerful excerpt, wow. Incredibly true.

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Silver Pie
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Silver Pie »

cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:09 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: January 11th, 2023, 2:37 am And whoso knocketh, to him will he open; and the wise, and the learned, and they that are rich, who are puffed up because of their learning, and their wisdom, and their riches—yea, they are they whom he despiseth; and save they shall cast these things away, and consider themselves fools before God, and come down in the depths of humility, he will not open unto them.

How many of us actually consider ourselves fools?

I’m an idiot
That's pretty much what I thought when I read this post. "Does considering oneself an idiot count?" My experiences have shown me that I am more a fool or an idiot than anything special.

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Silver Pie
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Silver Pie »

John Tavner wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:17 pm He wants you te realize you need Him, that you are weak, not for Hiz sake, but for yours
I'm definitely the weakest of the weak. And this isn't saying I'm in a spitting contest to see who is the weakest or the stupidest or the whateverest. I know that without God I am nothing. Literally nothing. We can't even breathe and move around if he should choose that we don't.

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marc
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by marc »

CaptainM wrote: January 10th, 2023, 8:38 pmYour thoughts...???

In Christ. Best wishes...
Buy this book. Underline meaningful portions. Read it many times. Apply daily and plead with the Lord to open your understanding:

https://www.amazon.com/Humility-Absolut ... 1481277308?

You can also find it and more by this author free online:

https://christiandiet.com.ng/free-downl ... books-pdf/

p.s. Humility is one book. Absolute Surrender is the other. They are small, but very densely packed with beautiful truths.

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marc
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by marc »

Here's a snippet from my book:
HS1.jpg
HS1.jpg (84.98 KiB) Viewed 485 times
HS2.jpg
HS2.jpg (92.18 KiB) Viewed 485 times

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marc
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by marc »

Jesus said I am meek and lowly in heart. Note the words "lowly in heart." This provides context to being humble and it's why Jesus said in that passage to learn of Him. Saying I am an idiot or I am a loser is not gonna do it. Church leaders get up to the pulpit and confess their own ineptness sometimes as if it's a silly bragging right. But how many abase themselves truly to suffer for the sake of their neighbors...to love them, succor them, serve them, to help them, to SUFFER for them and WITH them in all manner of capacities?

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marc
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by marc »

I've heard people say they would never become a doormat for others to trample. But Jesus became exactly that. He condescended below us all and it was necessary for Him to become LOWER than us all, even the lowliest and least of us so that in doing so, He could lift us all even the least and lowest of us. A lifeboat would be a more apt analogy than a doormat though, but hopefully you get the idea.

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ransomme
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by ransomme »

John Tavner wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:20 pm
cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:29 am Everyone thinks they are the wheat and everyone else is the chaff. That they are built on the rock while others’ foundation is sandy. That they are on the strait path and others are in the midsts of darkness. That they are awake and everyone else is asleep.
I guess the only safety is remaining truly humble and repentant and loving others.
It begins with the comparison. Already we are judging unrighteously, and unknowingly, because the moment you call someone a tare or a wolf, you are condemning them and saying that their eternal and internal nature is that of wickedness and not of God and they have no chance of becoming like Him.
I am more like Nephi, " Nevertheless, notwithstanding the great goodness of the Lord, in showing me his great and marvelous works, my heart exclaimeth: O wretched man that I am! Yea, my heart sorroweth because of my flesh; my soul grieveth because of mine iniquities."

But yes, love more. Although that doesn't mean accepting sin.

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cab
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by cab »

Silver Pie wrote: January 11th, 2023, 3:22 pm
cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:09 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: January 11th, 2023, 2:37 am And whoso knocketh, to him will he open; and the wise, and the learned, and they that are rich, who are puffed up because of their learning, and their wisdom, and their riches—yea, they are they whom he despiseth; and save they shall cast these things away, and consider themselves fools before God, and come down in the depths of humility, he will not open unto them.

How many of us actually consider ourselves fools?

I’m an idiot
That's pretty much what I thought when I read this post. "Does considering oneself an idiot count?" My experiences have shown me that I am more a fool or an idiot than anything special.

I’m just trying to love my wife enough so that she stays with me haha

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

John Tavner wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:20 pm
cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:29 am Everyone thinks they are the wheat and everyone else is the chaff. That they are built on the rock while others’ foundation is sandy. That they are on the strait path and others are in the midsts of darkness. That they are awake and everyone else is asleep.
I guess the only safety is remaining truly humble and repentant and loving others.
It begins with the comparison. Already we are judging unrighteously, and unknowingly, because the moment you call someone a tare or a wolf, you are condemning them and saying that their eternal and internal nature is that of wickedness and not of God and they have no chance of becoming like Him.
The Savior taught us that we are to discern between wolves and sheep in one of his most famous sermons. And he showed us how to do it, “by their fruits ye shall know them.” We need to have the Spirit of knowledge and revelation. We need to have the Spirit of discernment. And that does require righteous judgement. Judging and condemning are two very different things. We have to judge the fruits of any person, and we will be cursed if we don’t measure any of their fruits by a witness of the Holy Ghost. In the end, judgement will be the Lords, but we don’t have to follow false prophets.

I don’t think anyone is saying that to judge the fruits of a person has anything to do with consigning someone to an endless hell. Christ also taught us in that same sermon to pray for those who do wickedness, but we don’t have to follow them in their erroneous ways and teachings.

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John Tavner
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by John Tavner »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 13th, 2023, 6:01 am
John Tavner wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:20 pm
cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:29 am Everyone thinks they are the wheat and everyone else is the chaff. That they are built on the rock while others’ foundation is sandy. That they are on the strait path and others are in the midsts of darkness. That they are awake and everyone else is asleep.
I guess the only safety is remaining truly humble and repentant and loving others.
It begins with the comparison. Already we are judging unrighteously, and unknowingly, because the moment you call someone a tare or a wolf, you are condemning them and saying that their eternal and internal nature is that of wickedness and not of God and they have no chance of becoming like Him.
The Savior taught us that we are to discern between wolves and sheep in one of his most famous sermons. And he showed us how to do it, “by their fruits ye shall know them.” We need to have the Spirit of knowledge and revelation. We need to have the Spirit of discernment. And that does require righteous judgement. Judging and condemning are two very different things. We have to judge the fruits of any person, and we will be cursed if we don’t measure any of their fruits by a witness of the Holy Ghost. In the end, judgement will be the Lords, but we don’t have to follow false prophets.

I don’t think anyone is saying that to judge the fruits of a person has anything to do with consigning someone to an endless hell. Christ also taught us in that same sermon to pray for those who do wickedness, but we don’t have to follow them in their erroneous ways and teachings.
No, He actually says to beware of false prophets. And we can know them by their fruits. That INSIDE they are ravening wolves. It's funny how much we add to his words because we don't read what He says. He doesn't tell you to go around assigning people who happen to be in a church as wolves or sheep or anyone who does wrong things as wolves or sheep. Otherwise you and I and all mankind would be considered wolves, because how many times have we produced bad fruit in our lives? THe word used there in Greek is Pseudoprophet - One who speaks in God's name, but KNOWS what they are saying is not His word - it again goes back to the great commandment of "don't take the Lord's name in vain." Fruit tasting requires faith on the part of the hearer, because faith is like a seed, you ahve to plant it, water it and let it grow. Yet, there is still a difference between one who is deceived and one who is a wolf one who is deceived and has zeal, is not a ravening wolf inside. Immediately after Jesus talks about those who have done many "wonderful works" including casting out devils, Those aren't the fruits HE is talking about. HE is talking about something else. The question to ask yourself first is "are your fruits good or bad" He also says to "remove the beam from your own eye before you try to remove it in another, then you will see clearly" If we can't see clearly in the first place, our judgment is off ( this by the way is before HE starts talking about beware of false prophets. He builds on His words- we ought to as well. Learn to remove the beam, be merciful and kind, know the character 0f God (trust that God wili give you what is good) , Do unto others as you would wnat them to do to you - if you want to borrow, let others borrow, if when you need help, you would like help, give help when asked etc..Make sure you, yourself are on the straight path (you can't see unless you've removed the beam) THEN, beware of false prophets, whom you will know by their fruits. At that point you are already producing good fruit, you will be able to see clearly to know if a prophet is false or not. Too often we get things backwards and haven't even cleared the beam from our own eye to be able to see clearly for ourselves, otherwise most of us would condemn ourselves as false prophets with the things we teach and how we act- just on a lower scale.

Consigning someone as a wolf is assigning their inner desire to consume and do evil = hell. A sheep who has lost their way and does wrong things is not consigned to hte same fate- if you can't see clearly, you will assign both to hell regardless of their intent. Notice as well, all God tells you to do is beware of false prophets, He doesn't say "call them wolves". We are just to discern a false prophet from a true one - HE teaches us in the verses right after that to partake of fruit, one shouldn't have to "suffer immediately" that they shouldn't be pricked (he uses the metaphor of thistles and thorns- the question should be - how does that fit in? And what was the message of CHrist with His APostles :Go forth teach the Kingdom is here and heal the sick, or heal the sick and teach the Kingdom (depends on the gospel for the order). There is a message there for us to help us discern.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

John Tavner wrote: January 13th, 2023, 7:24 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 13th, 2023, 6:01 am
John Tavner wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:20 pm
cab wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:29 am Everyone thinks they are the wheat and everyone else is the chaff. That they are built on the rock while others’ foundation is sandy. That they are on the strait path and others are in the midsts of darkness. That they are awake and everyone else is asleep.
I guess the only safety is remaining truly humble and repentant and loving others.
It begins with the comparison. Already we are judging unrighteously, and unknowingly, because the moment you call someone a tare or a wolf, you are condemning them and saying that their eternal and internal nature is that of wickedness and not of God and they have no chance of becoming like Him.
The Savior taught us that we are to discern between wolves and sheep in one of his most famous sermons. And he showed us how to do it, “by their fruits ye shall know them.” We need to have the Spirit of knowledge and revelation. We need to have the Spirit of discernment. And that does require righteous judgement. Judging and condemning are two very different things. We have to judge the fruits of any person, and we will be cursed if we don’t measure any of their fruits by a witness of the Holy Ghost. In the end, judgement will be the Lords, but we don’t have to follow false prophets.

I don’t think anyone is saying that to judge the fruits of a person has anything to do with consigning someone to an endless hell. Christ also taught us in that same sermon to pray for those who do wickedness, but we don’t have to follow them in their erroneous ways and teachings.
No, He actually says to beware of false prophets. And we can know them by their fruits. That INSIDE they are ravening wolves. It's funny how much we add to his words because we don't read what He says. He doesn't tell you to go around assigning people who happen to be in a church as wolves or sheep or anyone who does wrong things as wolves or sheep. Otherwise you and I and all mankind would be considered wolves, because how many times have we produced bad fruit in our lives? THe word used there in Greek is Pseudoprophet - One who speaks in God's name, but KNOWS what they are saying is not His word - it again goes back to the great commandment of "don't take the Lord's name in vain." Fruit tasting requires faith on the part of the hearer, because faith is like a seed, you ahve to plant it, water it and let it grow. Yet, there is still a difference between one who is deceived and one who is a wolf one who is deceived and has zeal, is not a ravening wolf inside. Immediately after Jesus talks about those who have done many "wonderful works" including casting out devils, Those aren't the fruits HE is talking about. HE is talking about something else. The question to ask yourself first is "are your fruits good or bad" He also says to "remove the beam from your own eye before you try to remove it in another, then you will see clearly" If we can't see clearly in the first place, our judgment is off ( this by the way is before HE starts talking about beware of false prophets. He builds on His words- we ought to as well. Learn to remove the beam, be merciful and kind, know the character 0f God (trust that God wili give you what is good) , Do unto others as you would wnat them to do to you - if you want to borrow, let others borrow, if when you need help, you would like help, give help when asked etc..Make sure you, yourself are on the straight path (you can't see unless you've removed the beam) THEN, beware of false prophets, whom you will know by their fruits. At that point you are already producing good fruit, you will be able to see clearly to know if a prophet is false or not. Too often we get things backwards and haven't even cleared the beam from our own eye to be able to see clearly for ourselves, otherwise most of us would condemn ourselves as false prophets with the things we teach and how we act- just on a lower scale.

Consigning someone as a wolf is assigning their inner desire to consume and do evil = hell. A sheep who has lost their way and does wrong things is not consigned to hte same fate- if you can't see clearly, you will assign both to hell regardless of their intent. Notice as well, all God tells you to do is beware of false prophets, He doesn't say "call them wolves". We are just to discern a false prophet from a true one - HE teaches us in the verses right after that to partake of fruit, one shouldn't have to "suffer immediately" that they shouldn't be pricked (he uses the metaphor of thistles and thorns- the question should be - how does that fit in? And what was the message of CHrist with His APostles :Go forth teach the Kingdom is here and heal the sick, or heal the sick and teach the Kingdom (depends on the gospel for the order). There is a message there for us to help us discern.
You myopically focus on the word “inwardly”, yet you don’t recognize that he used the word “clothing.” Come on man. Just look at the facade the church leaders exude.

Just deal with it, we are to judge people righteously. Christ taught this. He also taught us to avoid unrighteous judgment. If the fruits of the church are bad, I judge them. I can then make a heavenly informed decision to leave such a corporation… *cough* I mean, organization.

I think members need to learn a thing or two from their own restoration prophet: D&C 123

12 For there are many yet on the earth among all sects, parties, and denominations, who are blinded by the subtle craftiness of men, whereby they lie in wait to deceive, and who are only kept from the truth because they know not where to find it—
13 Therefore, that we should waste and wear out our lives in bringing to light all the hidden things of darkness, wherein we know them; and they are truly manifest from heaven—
14 These should then be attended to with great earnestness.

I don’t condemn the wolf/sinner, but I’ll surely point out false doctrines perpetrated under the guise of religion. Do we think we are any better than the Scribes and the Pharisees?

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John Tavner
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Re: The Humble Followers of Christ

Post by John Tavner »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 13th, 2023, 7:56 am
John Tavner wrote: January 13th, 2023, 7:24 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: January 13th, 2023, 6:01 am
John Tavner wrote: January 11th, 2023, 12:20 pm

It begins with the comparison. Already we are judging unrighteously, and unknowingly, because the moment you call someone a tare or a wolf, you are condemning them and saying that their eternal and internal nature is that of wickedness and not of God and they have no chance of becoming like Him.
The Savior taught us that we are to discern between wolves and sheep in one of his most famous sermons. And he showed us how to do it, “by their fruits ye shall know them.” We need to have the Spirit of knowledge and revelation. We need to have the Spirit of discernment. And that does require righteous judgement. Judging and condemning are two very different things. We have to judge the fruits of any person, and we will be cursed if we don’t measure any of their fruits by a witness of the Holy Ghost. In the end, judgement will be the Lords, but we don’t have to follow false prophets.

I don’t think anyone is saying that to judge the fruits of a person has anything to do with consigning someone to an endless hell. Christ also taught us in that same sermon to pray for those who do wickedness, but we don’t have to follow them in their erroneous ways and teachings.
No, He actually says to beware of false prophets. And we can know them by their fruits. That INSIDE they are ravening wolves. It's funny how much we add to his words because we don't read what He says. He doesn't tell you to go around assigning people who happen to be in a church as wolves or sheep or anyone who does wrong things as wolves or sheep. Otherwise you and I and all mankind would be considered wolves, because how many times have we produced bad fruit in our lives? THe word used there in Greek is Pseudoprophet - One who speaks in God's name, but KNOWS what they are saying is not His word - it again goes back to the great commandment of "don't take the Lord's name in vain." Fruit tasting requires faith on the part of the hearer, because faith is like a seed, you ahve to plant it, water it and let it grow. Yet, there is still a difference between one who is deceived and one who is a wolf one who is deceived and has zeal, is not a ravening wolf inside. Immediately after Jesus talks about those who have done many "wonderful works" including casting out devils, Those aren't the fruits HE is talking about. HE is talking about something else. The question to ask yourself first is "are your fruits good or bad" He also says to "remove the beam from your own eye before you try to remove it in another, then you will see clearly" If we can't see clearly in the first place, our judgment is off ( this by the way is before HE starts talking about beware of false prophets. He builds on His words- we ought to as well. Learn to remove the beam, be merciful and kind, know the character 0f God (trust that God wili give you what is good) , Do unto others as you would wnat them to do to you - if you want to borrow, let others borrow, if when you need help, you would like help, give help when asked etc..Make sure you, yourself are on the straight path (you can't see unless you've removed the beam) THEN, beware of false prophets, whom you will know by their fruits. At that point you are already producing good fruit, you will be able to see clearly to know if a prophet is false or not. Too often we get things backwards and haven't even cleared the beam from our own eye to be able to see clearly for ourselves, otherwise most of us would condemn ourselves as false prophets with the things we teach and how we act- just on a lower scale.

Consigning someone as a wolf is assigning their inner desire to consume and do evil = hell. A sheep who has lost their way and does wrong things is not consigned to hte same fate- if you can't see clearly, you will assign both to hell regardless of their intent. Notice as well, all God tells you to do is beware of false prophets, He doesn't say "call them wolves". We are just to discern a false prophet from a true one - HE teaches us in the verses right after that to partake of fruit, one shouldn't have to "suffer immediately" that they shouldn't be pricked (he uses the metaphor of thistles and thorns- the question should be - how does that fit in? And what was the message of CHrist with His APostles :Go forth teach the Kingdom is here and heal the sick, or heal the sick and teach the Kingdom (depends on the gospel for the order). There is a message there for us to help us discern.
You myopically focus on the word “inwardly”, yet you don’t recognize that he used the word “clothing.” Come on man. Just look at the facade the church leaders exude.

Just deal with it, we are to judge people righteously. Christ taught this. He also taught us to avoid unrighteous judgment. If the fruits of the church are bad, I judge them. I can then make a heavenly informed decision to leave such a corporation… *cough* I mean, organization.

I think members need to learn a thing or two from their own restoration prophet: D&C 123

12 For there are many yet on the earth among all sects, parties, and denominations, who are blinded by the subtle craftiness of men, whereby they lie in wait to deceive, and who are only kept from the truth because they know not where to find it—
13 Therefore, that we should waste and wear out our lives in bringing to light all the hidden things of darkness, wherein we know them; and they are truly manifest from heaven—
14 These should then be attended to with great earnestness.

I don’t condemn the wolf/sinner, but I’ll surely point out false doctrines perpetrated under the guise of religion. Do we think we are any better than the Scribes and the Pharisees?
I didn't, regardless people can dress like sheep all the time, God looks upon the heart though the key is actually being a ravening wolf - most of us are hypocrites in someway - we try to look a certain way - it's why Jesus says "get rid of hte beam in your own eye first, then you can see clearly to get rid of the speck in your brother's. Just deal with it, fix yourrself before you judge other and jeven judge truth. More often we like to judge because our identity is tied up in us feeling right, rather than being in the identity of Christ. Mormons have been trained up this way from their youth to see everyone else as wrong and deceived and they don't have truth, it may be true from one perspective, but is deceptive on teh other end because it fails to recognize how God views people and How He desire us to view them and Why He came to give His life. We focus so much on our own "rightness" that we forget the mercy and lvoe of God and why He came in the first place, ironically having a from of godliness, but denying hte power thereof..

No one said don't Point out false doctrines. Our weapons of warfare are against principalities, powers, dominions, etc.. it is the ideas and the lies that are our enemies, not people.

Joseph was wrong if he intended it to be focused on others. No one should "waste and wear out their lives in bringing to light all the hidden things of darkness" except within themselves or rather the lies they have believed within themselves - even then it is through the grace of God. God told us to be the light of the world. Light automatically removes darkness - light does not take it's time looking for darkness, it just is. and darkness flees, exposing truth.

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