Why I’m Leaving the Mormon Church

[Reluctant Watchman]

On the contrary, I know that I can do this in my own home...twenty times a day if I really wanted. And of course not. I CHOOSE to do what I do the way I do it in order to fellowship WITH my neighbors.

But do you think you can become a Zion individual all alone on your mountaintop all enlightened by yourself? To be one heart, one mind, having no poor among you all by yourself as a hermit? Or do you plan to trade one church or fellowship for another? Do you prefer to live in a Zion where every enlightened individual dwells on his/her own mountaintop apart from each other and unavailable to one another? Do you expect to enter Zion a stranger or a fellow citizen without having experienced all the struggles and adjustments and reconciliations expected during the forging of bonds with your neighbors? How do you plan to suddenly become one heart and one mind with the Lord if you cannot do this with so many others in preparation to enter Zion? The Celestial Kingdom?

I minister to and fellowship with my neighbors all the time, and I don't need the church to do that. (What I do find is great judgement from my LDS neighbors who have no idea how to talk to a member who questions the prophet) I also have a very large network of people who feel the way that I do. Sometimes we have them in our home on Sunday. Sometimes we visit with them throughout the week. We go on date nights, and weekend getaways. We meet often, and they are far more genuine than most of the people I knew at church.

BTW, Zion will not be anywhere near what the LDS church teaches. It cannot be. You cannot have anti-Christian teachings in Zion. There is a very large community of people who are striving to follow the Lord, in whatever way He has guided them along.

[marc]

On the contrary, I know that I can do this in my own home...twenty times a day if I really wanted. And of course not. I CHOOSE to do what I do the way I do it in order to fellowship WITH my neighbors.

But do you think you can become a Zion individual all alone on your mountaintop all enlightened by yourself? To be one heart, one mind, having no poor among you all by yourself as a hermit? Or do you plan to trade one church or fellowship for another? Do you prefer to live in a Zion where every enlightened individual dwells on his/her own mountaintop apart from each other and unavailable to one another? Do you expect to enter Zion a stranger or a fellow citizen without having experienced all the struggles and adjustments and reconciliations expected during the forging of bonds with your neighbors? How do you plan to suddenly become one heart and one mind with the Lord if you cannot do this with so many others in preparation to enter Zion? The Celestial Kingdom?

I minister to and fellowship with my neighbors all the time, and I don't need the church to do that. (What I do find is great judgement from my LDS neighbors who have no idea how to talk to a member who questions the prophet) I also have a very large network of people who feel the way that I do. Sometimes we have them in our home on Sunday. Sometimes we visit with them throughout the week. We go on date nights, and weekend getaways. We meet often, and they are far more genuine than most of the people I knew at church.

BTW, Zion will not be anywhere near what the LDS church teaches. It cannot be. You cannot have anti-Christian teachings in Zion. There is a very large community of people who are striving to follow the Lord, in whatever way He has guided them along.

That's great that you found what works for you and I am happy for you and your network. I also have networks of friends and we learn a lot from each other. I simply choose to fellowship with my neighbors and through patience and longsuffering be a light to them. Until the day I am exed, shunned or no longer welcome, I continue to preach, teach, expound and exhort them with all diligence. Oddly enough, I was called this year as a Gospel Doctrine teacher where I have further shed light on things that would never occur to them because of the correlated gruel regurgitated every Sunday. I am well aware that Zion will not be anything like the LDS church. But I am the change that I wish to see in my ward whose members are striving the best way they know how to follow the Lord. I know I have made a difference in my ward and many of them have let me know that they have learned a lot from me. I am always pointing them to Jesus Christ and Him alone.

[Reluctant Watchman]

That's great that you found what works for you and I am happy for you and your network. I also have networks of friends and we learn a lot from each other. I simply choose to fellowship with my neighbors and through patience and longsuffering be a light to them. Until the day I am exed, shunned or no longer welcome, I continue to preach, teach, expound and exhort them with all diligence. Oddly enough, I was called this year as a Gospel Doctrine teacher where I have further shed light on things that would never occur to them because of the correlated gruel regurgitated every Sunday. I am well aware that Zion will not be anything like the LDS church. But I am the change that I wish to see in my ward whose members are striving the best way they know how to follow the Lord. I know I have made a difference in my ward and many of them have let me know that they have learned a lot from me. I am always pointing them to Jesus Christ and Him alone.

And I'm happy that you've found what works for you. For me, and this is just for me, I cannot sit quietly and allow false precepts to be taught without raising my voice. I won't beat around the bush. I'll be straight up with any member of the church. I know exactly where my beliefs will lead. I don't need to wait around to be exxed. My spirit abhors certain precepts taught w/in the church. And to the inverse, I have found so much truth in the scriptures, particularly those outside of Mormondom.

[marc]

Maybe this is why the Lord impressed upon my bishop to call me to be Gospel Doctrine teacher. He knows well enough my position on some things because I make them known loud and clear during Fast and Testimony meetings and whenever I give talks. I get to dispel false and incorrect teachings and shed further light on the matters.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Maybe this is why the Lord impressed upon my bishop to call me to be Gospel Doctrine teacher. He knows well enough my position on some things because I make them known loud and clear during Fast and Testimony meetings and whenever I give talks. I get to dispel false and incorrect teachings and shed further light on the matters.

Maybe...

I just don't see myself being welcomed back if I tell my friends (aka ward members) that they are living anti-Christian principles from the pulpit. Not to mention the Q15 have blood on their hands for what they did the past year and how they are drinking from the teet of Babylon.

[Sunain]

Do what the Lord has put in your heart.

The Lord nor his spirit will never tell you to remove your records from His church.

[Gadianton Slayer]

The Lord nor his spirit will never tell you to remove your records from His church.

Well then it's a good thing this corporate organization you call "His church" really isn't.

https://gadiantonslayer.blogspot.com/20 ... st_23.html

[marc]

Maybe this is why the Lord impressed upon my bishop to call me to be Gospel Doctrine teacher. He knows well enough my position on some things because I make them known loud and clear during Fast and Testimony meetings and whenever I give talks. I get to dispel false and incorrect teachings and shed further light on the matters.

Maybe...

I just don't see myself being welcomed back if I tell my friends (aka ward members) that they are living anti-Christian principles from the pulpit. Not to mention the Q15 have blood on their hands for what they did the past year and how they are drinking from the teet of Babylon.

Sooo, just out of curiosity, please tell me what specific anti-Christian teachings and principles you have heard from your pulpit. I really would like to know.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Sooo, just out of curiosity, please tell me what specific anti-Christian teachings and principles you have heard from your pulpit. I really would like to know.

Christ taught us not to trust in the arm of flesh in multiple canons of scripture. Nelson taught the members that there are 15 men in whom we can place our "complete trust." A companion philosophy is that they can never lead us astray. These are anti-Christian philosophies and are at the heart of the most basic belief system of any child of God.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Do what the Lord has put in your heart.

The Lord nor his spirit will never tell you to remove your records from His church.

I'm glad you know how the Lord speaks to me. Kind of like how men have told you that they can NEVER lead you astray and how you can trust them completely.

[Reluctant Watchman]

I should also add, telling members that they should "sustain" (follow) men in order to receive saving ordinances is contrary to the order of heaven IMO.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Tithing the poor is also contrary to the way of heaven. The correct pattern was taught in the early church and this principle has since become very corrupted in the LDS church.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Oh, and how polygamy was introduced as the highest law, yet was a true abomination.

[BuriedTartaria]

I get why people want to leave the Church. The highest leaders are corrupt and the members are asleep. But the way I see it this isn't their Church. It's Christ's Church.

That isn't my view, but I think you make a fair point. I respect your perspective and I see the validity to it.

[Reluctant Watchman]

And that's to say nothing of the idea that the prophet of the restoration may have been killed by his "friends."

[Sunain]

I'm glad you know how the Lord speaks to me. Kind of like how men have told you that they can NEVER lead you astray and how you can trust them completely.

The Lord speaks the same to all people in regards to His church.

[HereWeGo]

That's great that you found what works for you and I am happy for you and your network. I also have networks of friends and we learn a lot from each other. I simply choose to fellowship with my neighbors and through patience and longsuffering be a light to them. Until the day I am exed, shunned or no longer welcome, I continue to preach, teach, expound and exhort them with all diligence. Oddly enough, I was called this year as a Gospel Doctrine teacher where I have further shed light on things that would never occur to them because of the correlated gruel regurgitated every Sunday. I am well aware that Zion will not be anything like the LDS church. But I am the change that I wish to see in my ward whose members are striving the best way they know how to follow the Lord. I know I have made a difference in my ward and many of them have let me know that they have learned a lot from me. I am always pointing them to Jesus Christ and Him alone.

And I'm happy that you've found what works for you. For me, and this is just for me, I cannot sit quietly and allow false precepts to be taught without raising my voice. I won't beat around the bush. I'll be straight up with any member of the church. I know exactly where my beliefs will lead. I don't need to wait around to be exxed. My spirit abhors certain precepts taught w/in the church. And to the inverse, I have found so much truth in the scriptures, particularly those outside of Mormondom.

My brother in law reminds me of you. My brother in law (formerly in Stake High Council), went from HC to inactive. His bishop contacted him to invite him back to church. He told the bishop that it was better that he didn't come to church because he is vocal about false doctrine. He said he would call out any false doctrine taught in classes and that would not be good for the class. The bishop said he understood and it was okay if he remained inactive.

[Reluctant Watchman]

I'm glad you know how the Lord speaks to me. Kind of like how men have told you that they can NEVER lead you astray and how you can trust them completely.

The Lord speaks the same to all people in regards to His church.

Unfortunately, the LDS org has added upon AND taken away from the Lord's gospel. Go read what the Lord said about that and tell me if this is His church.

I think many of you still in the church need to grapple with the reality that men have lied to you. They have abused any keys and authority they think they may have maintained.

[marc]

I'm glad you know how the Lord speaks to me. Kind of like how men have told you that they can NEVER lead you astray and how you can trust them completely.

The Lord speaks the same to all people in regards to His church.

Unfortunately, the LDS org has added upon AND taken away from the Lord's gospel. Go read what the Lord said about that and tell me if this is His church.

I think many of you still in the church need to grapple with the reality that men have lied to you. They have abused any keys and authority they think they may have maintained.

To be fair, so did the Pharisees, high priests, and scribes of the primitive church who yoked the Jews with heavy burdens; they tithed mint and rue but ignored the weightier matters. But Jesus Christ still came to them. Jesus Christ still submitted to the laws of the church even though the Pharisees had corrupted a lot of it. He did not necessarily abide by their traditions and He did buck the system, but He still worked in and with the church to draw all men to Him. He told them to do what they who sit in Moses's seat said to do, but not to do after their works.

[Reluctant Watchman]

I'm glad you know how the Lord speaks to me. Kind of like how men have told you that they can NEVER lead you astray and how you can trust them completely.

The Lord speaks the same to all people in regards to His church.

Unfortunately, the LDS org has added upon AND taken away from the Lord's gospel. Go read what the Lord said about that and tell me if this is His church.

I think many of you still in the church need to grapple with the reality that men have lied to you. They have abused any keys and authority they think they may have maintained.

To be fair, so did the Pharisees, high priests, and scribes of the primitive church who yoked the Jews with heavy burdens; they tithed mint and rue but ignored the weightier matters. But Jesus Christ still came to them. Jesus Christ still submitted to the laws of the church even though the Pharisees had corrupted a lot of it. He did not necessarily abide by their traditions and He did buck the system, but He still worked in and with the church to draw all men to Him. He told them to do what they who sit in Moses's seat said to do, but not to do after their works.

I won't follow the corrupt works of men. Many core traditions/beliefs of our day within the church are false, they are wrong. I do not see the Lord justifying any man in committing sin (yes, I used that word) all in an attempt to remain in organized religion, regardless the heritage it may hold. Joseph himself would not hold claim to this dilapidated barn.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

[marc]

I won't follow the corrupt works of men. Many core traditions/beliefs of our day within the church are false, they are wrong. I do not see the Lord justifying any man in committing sin (yes, I used that word) all in an attempt to remain in organized religion, regardless the heritage it may hold. Joseph himself would not hold claim to this dilapidated barn.

https://www.reluctantwatchman.com/josephs-last-dreams

I know the dream. And I totally understand your position. I'm just saying that it was a very dilapidated barn that Jesus entered and remained in in order to minister to those who presided in and were presided by those who exercised authority in said barn. That's all. I have appreciated our conversation.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Pondering this from my lunch studies:

“For when wickedness is taken up in the hearts of men, it is hardly cleansed out of them when there are many who have taken it up and made it a standard unto themselves. Yea, when it has taken over the governance of a city (*and a church I might add*), it can hardly be cleansed except that the Peacemaker does make such a cleansing.

D&C 84 comes to mind.

[JLHPROF]

Tithing the poor is also contrary to the way of heaven. The correct pattern was taught in the early church and this principle has since become very corrupted in the LDS church.

Yet the widow paid her mite and received all the blessings.

Oh, and how polygamy was introduced as the highest law, yet was a true abomination.

It was never an abomination. Unless God chooses those who commit abominations as his chosen spokesmen, prophets, and covenant people.

I should also add, telling members that they should "sustain" (follow) men in order to receive saving ordinances is contrary to the order of heaven IMO.

There is no salvation without a legal administrator. Joseph was clear on that.

And that's to say nothing of the idea that the prophet of the restoration may have been killed by his "friends."

Pure fiction. Not a shred of historical evidence outside of conspiracy theory. Right up there with faked moon landings etc.

[JLHPROF]

Pondering this from my lunch studies:

“For when wickedness is taken up in the hearts of men, it is hardly cleansed out of them when there are many who have taken it up and made it a standard unto themselves. Yea, when it has taken over the governance of a city (*and a church I might add*), it can hardly be cleansed except that the Peacemaker does make such a cleansing.

D&C 84 comes to mind.

Maybe if you studied actual scripture you'd occasionally get your doctrine correct.

[LateOutOfBed]

Sooo, just out of curiosity, please tell me what specific anti-Christian teachings and principles you have heard from your pulpit. I really would like to know.

My bishop literally said (and I quote as close as I can recall it) "Your job is to figure out what you want in this life and do everything you can to achieve it"... i.e. "Do as thou wilt". And just to be clear he was specifically talking about mortal progression through education at the time and was bragging about what his magnificent children had done in their adult lives (none of which pointed anyone to Christ).

Sad days for sure.