Just think about this for a moment... they are in the throws of battle at this time. Who's gonna stop and create a forge to make metal plates while their buddy stands guard? I bet these guys made extra plates when they had time and tried to find a way to preserve them over time.
Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
- Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
- Robin Hood
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
And yet we are expected to believe she is our mother and gave birth to us.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βOctober 8th, 2022, 1:19 pmShe's a God. We would be consumed if we entered her presence...
A large helping of cognitive dissonance methinks.
- Elizabeth
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- Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
The same goes for Father. I thought this was LDS history 101 w/ Josephβs experience in the grove. Without transfiguration of some type, we would not be able to endure Their presence.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 5:56 amAnd yet we are expected to believe she is our mother and gave birth to us.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βOctober 8th, 2022, 1:19 pmShe's a God. We would be consumed if we entered her presence...
A large helping of cognitive dissonance methinks.
- Wolfwoman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
Iβm a little late to the party, but welcome.illuminating.Grace wrote: βOctober 7th, 2022, 8:15 pm Hi everyone, I'm not a typical forum poster anywhere, however, the Holy Spirit revealed this website to me, I've reviewed it and I'm going to jump in. I'm in Colorado, and its way to cold today.
I'm an active member of the Church, have a callng (Aaronic Priesthood Specialist), I've known for the last 14 months of the seperation of Gods will and word from the false man made commandments that the church teaches. Ive only opened up to a few close people in the church regarding my beliefs and I can clearly see the errors, I'm at the point now that Im ready to open the flood gates.
I've been conferred the Aaronic and the Mechizedek priesthoods, I'm a married man and I love God.
I've received a few callings outside of the ecclesiastical church, and for the last 6 months Ive been working on combining all scriptures together, including the full JST translated old and new testament so that we have a single book of several books, and an App - Website of pure truth, which hasn't existed since the Church of Christ spinoff that Emma Smith was a part of, whome copyrighted the publishing rights of these precious truths, and our church refused to break copyright, thus nothing we read today is properly put together into one resource.
I desire what is truth, in its purest form, this drives me everyday to discern and errors in teaching. I do not believe the family proclamation, nor the rejection of the new and everlasting covenant / the full D&C 132, nor the words of wisdom being labeled as a commandment - it clearly says by principle and not by commandment at the top, nor support the often misleading incorrect chapter summaries to all the books, the long ridiculous list of added requirements to baptism interviews and other interviews.
I'll post more as I am able to in the general discussions.
I've been given a few gifts, that I will expound on as I get comfortable here, the gifts of knowledge, teaching, discernent, and prophecy are a few of them.
I believe that this is the true church, and it is filled with imperfect men, that the enemy has has a foothold in many areas therein, which will soon lead to the prophecies of Isaiah 27,28,29 - woe to Ariel -, Mormon 8, I won't list all the chapters, but the destruction of church is about to come about, due to the abominations had within. All offices are true, and the keys, but men have been unfaithful in their callings, in leading the church. This seemed to mostly start around Wildrow Woodruf + Joseph F. Smith ( the presidential pardon perdicament).
The rejection of plural marriage.
Anyhow, I belief I was led here to help me not feel like Im the only one who has their eyes opened to this stuff, and to help contribute to our awesome fellowship, to teach and grow.
Its nice to meet you all.
Lots of scripture projects going on. You might be interested in the scriptures at
https://scriptures.info/
It was a project years in the making, to create a set of scriptures as close to βcorrectβ as possible. Itβs not all in one book, because that would be a huge book. There are 3 books. The Book of Mormon and the New Testament are combined into one book: The New Covenants. The D&C and some of the Pearl of Great Price is now the T&C (Teachings and Commandments). And the Old Testament is called The Old Covenants. All the JST is included, even parts the RLDS church missed. The T&C includes the Lectures on Faith. If sections are missing from the T&C itβs because the copyright is not up yet or there was not sufficient evidence of the original revelation, etc. Explanations are given for any that you canβt find in there.
- Robin Hood
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
It was a vision.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 6:17 amThe same goes for Father. I thought this was LDS history 101 w/ Josephβs experience in the grove. Without transfiguration of some type, we would not be able to endure Their presence.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 5:56 amAnd yet we are expected to believe she is our mother and gave birth to us.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βOctober 8th, 2022, 1:19 pmShe's a God. We would be consumed if we entered her presence...
A large helping of cognitive dissonance methinks.
The clue is in the name. Joseph was the only person in the woods.
- Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
Truman Madsen more accurately described it as the "First Visitation." Regardless of Joseph's experience, we are unable to endure the glory of Elohim in our mortal state, transfiguration must occur to some degree.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:32 am It was a vision.
The clue is in the name. Joseph was the only person in the woods.
- Robin Hood
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
Truman Madsen was wrong.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:44 amTruman Madsen more accurately described it as the "First Visitation." Regardless of Joseph's experience, we are unable to endure the glory of Elohim in our mortal state, transfiguration must occur to some degree.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:32 am It was a vision.
The clue is in the name. Joseph was the only person in the woods.
- Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
I believe he was more accurate. Joseph fully expected the trees and foliage to be consumed. See highlight above in red, that's what we're talking about anyway.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:03 amTruman Madsen was wrong.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:44 amTruman Madsen more accurately described it as the "First Visitation." Regardless of Joseph's experience, we are unable to endure the glory of Elohim in our mortal state, transfiguration must occur to some degree.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:32 am It was a vision.
The clue is in the name. Joseph was the only person in the woods.
- Robin Hood
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
I have no interest in what Truman Madsen had to say. I've listened to enough of his speeches to know that he talks rubbish half the time.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:11 amI believe he was more accurate. Joseph fully expected the trees and foliage to be consumed. See highlight above in red, that's what we're talking about anyway.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:03 amTruman Madsen was wrong.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:44 amTruman Madsen more accurately described it as the "First Visitation." Regardless of Joseph's experience, we are unable to endure the glory of Elohim in our mortal state, transfiguration must occur to some degree.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:32 am It was a vision.
The clue is in the name. Joseph was the only person in the woods.
Joseph said that when he came to himself he found himself laying on his back.
Coming to himself suggests it was a visionary experience in which he was in some kind of altered reality. Compare with Lehi's visionary experience.
- BeNotDeceived
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
Likely another fabrication IAW the Pious Fraud theory to get a manuscript published, that otherwise would have died in obscurity.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:03 amTruman Madsen was wrong.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:44 amTruman Madsen more accurately described it as the "First Visitation." Regardless of Joseph's experience, we are unable to endure the glory of Elohim in our mortal state, transfiguration must occur to some degree.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:32 am It was a vision.
The clue is in the name. Joseph was the only person in the woods.
A 5.7 magnitude earthquake landed Moroniβs Instrument to signal the fabrication that he showed up as an angel.
- Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
Madsen quoted Joseph in his description of the grove being consumed. Take from that what you will.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:33 pmI have no interest in what Truman Madsen had to say. I've listened to enough of his speeches to know that he talks rubbish half the time.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:11 amI believe he was more accurate. Joseph fully expected the trees and foliage to be consumed. See highlight above in red, that's what we're talking about anyway.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:03 amTruman Madsen was wrong.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:44 am
Truman Madsen more accurately described it as the "First Visitation." Regardless of Joseph's experience, we are unable to endure the glory of Elohim in our mortal state, transfiguration must occur to some degree.
Joseph said that when he came to himself he found himself laying on his back.
Coming to himself suggests it was a visionary experience in which he was in some kind of altered reality. Compare with Lehi's visionary experience.
I also believe Madsen had far more intriguing ideas to contemplate than most of the GAs.
-
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
As listed by those above welcome to the forum! Take everything said here with a grain of salt, and a moment of contemplation.
- Robin Hood
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
I don't.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:54 pmMadsen quoted Joseph in his description of the grove being consumed. Take from that what you will.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:33 pmI have no interest in what Truman Madsen had to say. I've listened to enough of his speeches to know that he talks rubbish half the time.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:11 amI believe he was more accurate. Joseph fully expected the trees and foliage to be consumed. See highlight above in red, that's what we're talking about anyway.
Joseph said that when he came to himself he found himself laying on his back.
Coming to himself suggests it was a visionary experience in which he was in some kind of altered reality. Compare with Lehi's visionary experience.
I also believe Madsen had far more intriguing ideas to contemplate than most of the GAs.
Wouldn't go to the effort of crossing the street to listen to him.
- Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
Follow the prophet.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 1:01 pm
I don't.
Wouldn't go to the effort of crossing the street to listen to him.
- Luke
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
Madsen and his wife selected a plural wife whom they planned to take in the future, assuming that the command was soon to come from SLC. But of course, it never did.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:54 pmMadsen quoted Joseph in his description of the grove being consumed. Take from that what you will.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:33 pmI have no interest in what Truman Madsen had to say. I've listened to enough of his speeches to know that he talks rubbish half the time.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:11 amI believe he was more accurate. Joseph fully expected the trees and foliage to be consumed. See highlight above in red, that's what we're talking about anyway.
Joseph said that when he came to himself he found himself laying on his back.
Coming to himself suggests it was a visionary experience in which he was in some kind of altered reality. Compare with Lehi's visionary experience.
I also believe Madsen had far more intriguing ideas to contemplate than most of the GAs.
- Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
You make it sound like they were picking out furniture or something.
- FrankOne
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
.......whether in the body or out, he could not tell. Then he found himself lying on his back. ...staring upwards. Vision. Truman was a brilliant man, but he was just a man with heavy biases. He wore rose colored glasses.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:33 pmI have no interest in what Truman Madsen had to say. I've listened to enough of his speeches to know that he talks rubbish half the time.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:11 amI believe he was more accurate. Joseph fully expected the trees and foliage to be consumed. See highlight above in red, that's what we're talking about anyway.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:03 amTruman Madsen was wrong.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 10:44 am
Truman Madsen more accurately described it as the "First Visitation." Regardless of Joseph's experience, we are unable to endure the glory of Elohim in our mortal state, transfiguration must occur to some degree.
Joseph said that when he came to himself he found himself laying on his back.
Coming to himself suggests it was a visionary experience in which he was in some kind of altered reality. Compare with Lehi's visionary experience.
- FrankOne
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
huh. that's an interesting piece of information. Could I ask where you heard or read that?Luke wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 2:56 pmMadsen and his wife selected a plural wife whom they planned to take in the future, assuming that the command was soon to come from SLC. But of course, it never did.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:54 pmMadsen quoted Joseph in his description of the grove being consumed. Take from that what you will.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:33 pmI have no interest in what Truman Madsen had to say. I've listened to enough of his speeches to know that he talks rubbish half the time.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 11:11 am
I believe he was more accurate. Joseph fully expected the trees and foliage to be consumed. See highlight above in red, that's what we're talking about anyway.
Joseph said that when he came to himself he found himself laying on his back.
Coming to himself suggests it was a visionary experience in which he was in some kind of altered reality. Compare with Lehi's visionary experience.
I also believe Madsen had far more intriguing ideas to contemplate than most of the GAs.
- Luke
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
You are free to interpret that in whatever way you like.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 3:01 pmYou make it sound like they were picking out furniture or something.
- Luke
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
I was told this by a lady I stayed with in SLC. She was the third wife of her husband. When she was getting into Fundamentalism (I think she had already married her husband at this point), BYU and the Church sent her to Madsen to see if he could change her mind. When she asked him if he believed in the Principle, he said βOf course I do, me and my wife have even chosen a second wife. But we are waiting for the call from SLC.βFrankOne wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 4:11 pmhuh. that's an interesting piece of information. Could I ask where you heard or read that?Luke wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 2:56 pmMadsen and his wife selected a plural wife whom they planned to take in the future, assuming that the command was soon to come from SLC. But of course, it never did.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:54 pmMadsen quoted Joseph in his description of the grove being consumed. Take from that what you will.Robin Hood wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:33 pm
I have no interest in what Truman Madsen had to say. I've listened to enough of his speeches to know that he talks rubbish half the time.
Joseph said that when he came to himself he found himself laying on his back.
Coming to himself suggests it was a visionary experience in which he was in some kind of altered reality. Compare with Lehi's visionary experience.
I also believe Madsen had far more intriguing ideas to contemplate than most of the GAs.
She asked him: βBut what if the call never comes?β
βWell, the Lord will know that we were ready and willing.β he replied.
The rest is history.
I posted her testimony about the Principle the other day on the forum.
- FrankOne
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
interesting. He was a fairly rigid and disciplined member and for me, it seems that he wouldn't have permitted himself to even lean toward polygamy . I guess he played that move close to the vest because I would think it would have been circulated within family . He was a relative of mine. I didn't think his mind was open enough to have considered it. Do you know what time frame/age of his that he had that discussion with the Fundie woman?Luke wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 4:21 pmI was told this by a lady I stayed with in SLC. She was the third wife of her husband. When she was getting into Fundamentalism (I think she had already married her husband at this point), BYU and the Church sent her to Madsen to see if he could change her mind. When she asked him if he believed in the Principle, he said βOf course I do, me and my wife have even chosen a second wife. But we are waiting for the call from SLC.βFrankOne wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 4:11 pmhuh. that's an interesting piece of information. Could I ask where you heard or read that?Luke wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 2:56 pmMadsen and his wife selected a plural wife whom they planned to take in the future, assuming that the command was soon to come from SLC. But of course, it never did.Reluctant Watchman wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 12:54 pm
Madsen quoted Joseph in his description of the grove being consumed. Take from that what you will.
I also believe Madsen had far more intriguing ideas to contemplate than most of the GAs.
She asked him: βBut what if the call never comes?β
βWell, the Lord will know that we were ready and willing.β he replied.
The rest is history.
I posted her testimony about the Principle the other day on the forum.
- Luke
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Re: Hello, I was led to this site by the Holy Spirit
I donβt think he was quite as rigid as people think. All the BYU professors believed in the old time teachings. Rodney Turner even wrote a thesis on the Adam-God Doctrine.FrankOne wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 4:29 pminteresting. He was a fairly rigid and disciplined member and for me, it seems that he wouldn't have permitted himself to even lean toward polygamy . I guess he played that move close to the vest because I would think it would have been circulated within family . He was a relative of mine. I didn't think his mind was open enough to have considered it. Do you know what time frame/age of his that he had that discussion with the Fundie woman?Luke wrote: βNovember 30th, 2022, 4:21 pmI was told this by a lady I stayed with in SLC. She was the third wife of her husband. When she was getting into Fundamentalism (I think she had already married her husband at this point), BYU and the Church sent her to Madsen to see if he could change her mind. When she asked him if he believed in the Principle, he said βOf course I do, me and my wife have even chosen a second wife. But we are waiting for the call from SLC.β
She asked him: βBut what if the call never comes?β
βWell, the Lord will know that we were ready and willing.β he replied.
The rest is history.
I posted her testimony about the Principle the other day on the forum.
It probably happened in the 70s.