Flat Earth

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Allison
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Allison »

larsenb wrote: November 26th, 2022, 11:24 pm
Allison wrote: November 26th, 2022, 5:33 pm
larsenb wrote: November 26th, 2022, 4:52 pm
harakim wrote: November 26th, 2022, 4:00 pm . . . . . . And that's the issue with flat earth debunkers. They are just as bad as the flat earthers. . . . . . I have never seen a round earther do an experiment to prove the earth is round. I have seen them try and fail, though. . . . . . But one thing is for sure: round earthers almost always demand that you accept their view, even though they cannot back it up with facts, . . . . .
Huh??! Amazing assertions. Wow!

Right here on this forum, I've seen many intelligent posters here that basically prove a round earth, and have never seen them rebutted by so-called flat-earthers.

The FACT remains, flat-earth proponents have no predictive theory for their model. The round-earth model does, and the model is used in multiple, multiple ways in our current reality that almost everybody relies on.
I forgot, Larsen, do you also believe in the moon landings? I think you do, right?

The globe model is under constant revision in order to explain away failures as they become exposed by honest inquiry. And that’s with NASA’s $60 million per day budget.

What is the latest on space? Is there, after all, not the vacuum we’ve been told is out there?
Allison, see if you can derive a predictive theory to undergird the flat-earth 'hypothesis'. You can't. That is all one needs to know about flat earth.

To be correct, it’s a lack of curvature hypothesis, that’s all. The fact that you can’t show the requisite curve doesn’t mean that I owe you all of the answers about what IS.

Really, this is like arguing that we must have gone to the moon if I cannot tell you where the fake moon landings were filmed. I don’t have to know that in order to know the moon landings were a ridiculous hoax.

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h_p
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by h_p »

I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.

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Fred
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Fred »

h_p wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:07 pm I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.
Except that on the flat earth model, if you head south from London, you will end up in a different location than if you head south from Hawaii. On the globe, both end up at the south pole. On the flat model, neither end up at the south pole.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

NeveR wrote: November 27th, 2022, 12:31 am We have a model for how a globe earth fits into a wider universe. Ok, it's not perfect, there's a huge amount we don't know and can only theorize about - but the model exists, is coherent & conforms to many astronomical observations.

Is there a similar coherent model for how a flat earth fits into a wider universe?

If there is, can we perhaps have that explained clearly so we can make some basic comparisons on a purely rational & observational basis?
Navigators have used astronomical observations for millennia, all from a flat earth believe. Current astrophysicists have stated that observationally, both a geocentric and heliocentric model fit what we observe.

The current model for how the earth fits in the universe I find quite ridiculous. The earth slingshots the moon around it and the sun slingshots the earth around it, but yet it is powerless to pull the moon off the earth, all the while our sun is slingshot around the galaxy and the galaxy is slingshot around the galactic center. You are traveling at thousands of miles per hour in several different directions, but you don't feel any motion at all. All that was needed for that piece of fiction was S-canning the Michaelson-Morley experiment, which showed the earth to be stationary. Scientists purposefully avoid any repeats of that experiment.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:15 pm On the globe, both end up at the south pole.
How could you possibly know that beyond being told that? Have you looked into the history of south pole trans navigation? Do you know the people involved? Do you know who funded them? Do you think allopathic medicine is the only science money can buy?

larsenb
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by larsenb »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 27th, 2022, 8:29 pm
larsenb wrote: November 26th, 2022, 11:24 pm Allison, see if you can derive a predictive theory to undergird the flat-earth 'hypothesis'. You can't. That is all one needs to know about flat earth.
Like you yourself have ever come up with a predictive theory. Why would you hypocritically expect that from someone else?

All you do is stand on the backs of your scientific high priests and parrot what they say.
Ah Shaw, you miss the point. Allison certainly can't create a predictive theory for the flat-earth hypothesis, but can she, you , or anyone else, even point to such a theory? Maybe one that can predict and explain metonic cycles, for starters.

And you misread me. I don't have any "scientific high priests"; but I have been involved in a lot of scientific investigations and worked with many scientists, where we are simply trying to follow the scientific method.

larsenb
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by larsenb »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:57 pm
Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:15 pm On the globe, both end up at the south pole.
How could you possibly know that beyond being told that? Have you looked into the history of south pole trans navigation? Do you know the people involved? Do you know who funded them? Do you think allopathic medicine is the only science money can buy?
Allopathic medicine?? What on earth (the global one) does that have to do with the flat-earth hypothesis??

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Fred
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Fred »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:57 pm
Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:15 pm On the globe, both end up at the south pole.
How could you possibly know that beyond being told that? Have you looked into the history of south pole trans navigation? Do you know the people involved? Do you know who funded them? Do you think allopathic medicine is the only science money can buy?
Oh please. Flat earthers can't even come up with a model where a compass even works. Dream on, pal.

larsenb
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by larsenb »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 27th, 2022, 8:26 pm
BroJones wrote: November 26th, 2022, 10:17 pm Can we also agree that the atmosphere on the moon is essentially nil?
You must have missed Buzz Aldrin's 3 admissions that we never went.
Can you provide a good source for this? A video of him saying it would be good.

larsenb
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by larsenb »

Allison wrote: November 27th, 2022, 8:54 pm
larsenb wrote: November 26th, 2022, 11:24 pm
Allison wrote: November 26th, 2022, 5:33 pm
larsenb wrote: November 26th, 2022, 4:52 pm

Huh??! Amazing assertions. Wow!

Right here on this forum, I've seen many intelligent posters here that basically prove a round earth, and have never seen them rebutted by so-called flat-earthers.

The FACT remains, flat-earth proponents have no predictive theory for their model. The round-earth model does, and the model is used in multiple, multiple ways in our current reality that almost everybody relies on.
I forgot, Larsen, do you also believe in the moon landings? I think you do, right?

The globe model is under constant revision in order to explain away failures as they become exposed by honest inquiry. And that’s with NASA’s $60 million per day budget.

What is the latest on space? Is there, after all, not the vacuum we’ve been told is out there?
Allison, see if you can derive a predictive theory to undergird the flat-earth 'hypothesis'. You can't. That is all one needs to know about flat earth.

To be correct, it’s a lack of curvature hypothesis, that’s all. The fact that you can’t show the requisite curve doesn’t mean that I owe you all of the answers about what IS.

Really, this is like arguing that we must have gone to the moon if I cannot tell you where the fake moon landings were filmed. I don’t have to know that in order to know the moon landings were a ridiculous hoax.
Your welcome to your beliefs, either flat-earth or fake moon landings. But you've certainly carved out a very, very tough row to hoe.

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FrankOne
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by FrankOne »

h_p wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:07 pm I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.
not exactly.

When I worked in N.Alaska and watched the sun go around me and never go down. (late June/July)
Also, in the winter, late december/early January, the sun would never come up except a slight edge of the sun.

When I worked in Southern Chile and noted the extreme sun position and movements.
When I worked very close to the equator in Ecuador and noted the sun positions and movements.

All of my personal observations match what I was taught in school in this regard. Do I trust NASA or the mainstream media? NO. Do I trust my observations? yes.

I am certain that at twelve noon , the sun is straight up at the equator and that there is absolutely no light on the other side of the planet. If you don't believe this, call someone on the other side of the globe earth when it's 12 noon at your house and ask them if it's pitch black outside. That can't happen on a flat earth no matter what fuzzy logic they twist in. The flat earth theory is completely ridiculous. This is insanity. There is no flat earth theory that works with what I have observed.

off soap box.

larsenb
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by larsenb »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:51 pm
NeveR wrote: November 27th, 2022, 12:31 am We have a model for how a globe earth fits into a wider universe. Ok, it's not perfect, there's a huge amount we don't know and can only theorize about - but the model exists, is coherent & conforms to many astronomical observations.

Is there a similar coherent model for how a flat earth fits into a wider universe?

If there is, can we perhaps have that explained clearly so we can make some basic comparisons on a purely rational & observational basis?
Navigators have used astronomical observations for millennia, all from a flat earth believe. Current astrophysicists have stated that observationally, both a geocentric and heliocentric model fit what we observe.

The current model for how the earth fits in the universe I find quite ridiculous. The earth slingshots the moon around it and the sun slingshots the earth around it, but yet it is powerless to pull the moon off the earth, all the while our sun is slingshot around the galaxy and the galaxy is slingshot around the galactic center. You are traveling at thousands of miles per hour in several different directions, but you don't feel any motion at all. All that was needed for that piece of fiction was S-canning the Michaelson-Morley experiment, which showed the earth to be stationary. Scientists purposefully avoid any repeats of that experiment.
Good grief!

And regarding your claim for the Michaelson-Morley experiment, I've already pointed out in a previous thread, how you've totally misunderstood it. What? No pickup? Why am I not surprised.

At the very least, you could have explained why, in your view, I was wrong in my claim or why those I was quoting were wrong.

larsenb
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by larsenb »

FrankOne wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:31 pm
h_p wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:07 pm I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.
not exactly.

When I worked in N.Alaska and watched the sun go around me and never go down. (late June/July)
Also, in the winter, late december/early January, the sun would never come up except a slight edge of the sun.

When I worked in Southern Chile and noted the extreme sun position and movements.
When I worked very close to the equator in Ecuador and noted the sun positions and movements.

All of my personal observations match what I was taught in school in this regard. Do I trust NASA or the mainstream media? NO. Do I trust my observations? yes.

I am certain that at twelve noon , the sun is straight up at the equator and that there is absolutely no light on the other side of the planet. If you don't believe this, call someone on the other side of the globe earth when it's 12 noon at your house and ask them if it's pitch black outside. That can't happen on a flat earth no matter what fuzzy logic they twist in. The flat earth theory is completely ridiculous. This is insanity. There is no flat earth theory that works with what I have observed.

off soap box.
I dig what you are saying; but you better pick the Vernal or Autumnal Equinoxes for your claim about the sun being directly above at noon when observed from the equator.

larsenb
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by larsenb »

h_p wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:07 pm I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.
Nope. There is massive evidence for a global earth.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

FrankOne wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:31 pm That can't happen on a flat earth no matter what fuzzy logic they twist in.
Of course, it can. Just because you can't see how doesn't mean others can't. Imagine all the water in the atmosphere like a swimming pool. When a light in a pool is far enough away you can't see it and are in darkness. Envisioning light on one side and darkness on the other is actually quite simple with a localized sun.

Scooter
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Scooter »

FrankOne wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:31 pm
h_p wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:07 pm I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.
not exactly.

When I worked in N.Alaska and watched the sun go around me and never go down. (late June/July)
Also, in the winter, late december/early January, the sun would never come up except a slight edge of the sun.

When I worked in Southern Chile and noted the extreme sun position and movements.
When I worked very close to the equator in Ecuador and noted the sun positions and movements.

All of my personal observations match what I was taught in school in this regard. Do I trust NASA or the mainstream media? NO. Do I trust my observations? yes.

I am certain that at twelve noon , the sun is straight up at the equator and that there is absolutely no light on the other side of the planet. If you don't believe this, call someone on the other side of the globe earth when it's 12 noon at your house and ask them if it's pitch black outside. That can't happen on a flat earth no matter what fuzzy logic they twist in. The flat earth theory is completely ridiculous. This is insanity. There is no flat earth theory that works with what I have observed.

off soap box.
Sooo off topic question here, but where did you work in Ecuador?

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gradles21
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by gradles21 »

Fred wrote: November 25th, 2022, 2:21 pm This guy has a certain attitude. Hope you like it.
This same guy (who isn't a professor btw) has this same attitude towards people that believe in God as he does with people that are skeptical of the globe model. He thinks you're just as dumb as flat earthers if you believe in God. He thinks men can be women and women can be men, he thinks abortion is great and that covid vaccines are the best thing ever, along with every other democrat talking point. He's just a shill for big pharm/scientism, i've even heard him say that he has script writers for his youtube videos, which is why if you good anything related to flat earth you'll see nothing but professor dave videos pop up in the search results.

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h_p
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by h_p »

Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:15 pm
h_p wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:07 pm I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.
Except that on the flat earth model, if you head south from London, you will end up in a different location than if you head south from Hawaii. On the globe, both end up at the south pole. On the flat model, neither end up at the south pole.
This is my point. You haven't actually done this and confirmed for yourself, have you? You may have met someone who did (doubtful), but even then, you'd be basing your belief on your trust in your friend.

I'm not a flat-earther by any means. But I base my belief on an inability to believe in the kind of massive world-wide conspiracy that would be needed to hide the truth if it were. I've not actually done any direct experimentation to prove it one way or the other. The vast majority of us round-earth believers are basing our convictions on assumptions that they haven't really even questioned and may not even realize they have.

And the same goes for almost everything else we just simply believe without questioning and think would be preposterous NOT to believe.

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Fred
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Fred »

Here is one far easier to comprehend and impossible to deny.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:14 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:57 pm
Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:15 pm On the globe, both end up at the south pole.
How could you possibly know that beyond being told that? Have you looked into the history of south pole trans navigation? Do you know the people involved? Do you know who funded them? Do you think allopathic medicine is the only science money can buy?
Oh please. Flat earthers can't even come up with a model where a compass even works. Dream on, pal.
It points to the North Pole, just like always.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

gradles21 wrote: November 28th, 2022, 11:30 am
This same guy (who isn't a professor btw) has this same attitude towards people that believe in God as he does with people that are skeptical of the globe model. He thinks you're just as dumb as flat earthers if you believe in God. He thinks men can be women and women can be men, he thinks abortion is great and that covid vaccines are the best thing ever, along with every other democrat talking point. He's just a shill for big pharm/scientism, i've even heard him say that he has script writers for his youtube videos, which is why if you good anything related to flat earth you'll see nothing but professor dave videos pop up in the search results.
Plus, no one really engages him in the Flat Earth community anymore because of his lack of honesty. He's been caught doing some shady stuff.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Shawn Henry »

larsenb wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:31 pm And regarding your claim for the Michaelson-Morley experiment, I've already pointed out in a previous thread, how you've totally misunderstood it. What? No pickup? Why am I not surprised.

At the very least, you could have explained why, in your view, I was wrong in my claim or why those I was quoting were wrong.
Yes, but you explaining how you understand it, doesn't mean I misunderstand it, but I do thank you for your efforts.

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Fred
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by Fred »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 28th, 2022, 12:11 pm
Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:14 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:57 pm
Fred wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:15 pm On the globe, both end up at the south pole.
How could you possibly know that beyond being told that? Have you looked into the history of south pole trans navigation? Do you know the people involved? Do you know who funded them? Do you think allopathic medicine is the only science money can buy?
Oh please. Flat earthers can't even come up with a model where a compass even works. Dream on, pal.
It points to the North Pole, just like always.
You are being dishonest on purpose. Perhaps you think it is funny. It is not.

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FrankOne
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by FrankOne »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 28th, 2022, 5:33 am
FrankOne wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:31 pm That can't happen on a flat earth no matter what fuzzy logic they twist in.
Of course, it can. Just because you can't see how doesn't mean others can't. Imagine all the water in the atmosphere like a swimming pool. When a light in a pool is far enough away you can't see it and are in darkness. Envisioning light on one side and darkness on the other is actually quite simple with a localized sun.
^This my definition of fuzzy logic , the coincidental pun fits as well.
We disagree and will always disagree on this subject.
Since I perceive that this entire existence is a silly simulation, I'm not fired up to engage this topic any further than I have.

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FrankOne
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Re: Flat Earth

Post by FrankOne »

Scooter wrote: November 28th, 2022, 9:31 am
FrankOne wrote: November 27th, 2022, 10:31 pm
h_p wrote: November 27th, 2022, 9:07 pm I think the only thing that really gets proven in these debates is that pretty much everything we believe or even claim we know without a doubt is actually just taken on faith.
not exactly.

When I worked in N.Alaska and watched the sun go around me and never go down. (late June/July)
Also, in the winter, late december/early January, the sun would never come up except a slight edge of the sun.

When I worked in Southern Chile and noted the extreme sun position and movements.
When I worked very close to the equator in Ecuador and noted the sun positions and movements.

All of my personal observations match what I was taught in school in this regard. Do I trust NASA or the mainstream media? NO. Do I trust my observations? yes.

I am certain that at twelve noon , the sun is straight up at the equator and that there is absolutely no light on the other side of the planet. If you don't believe this, call someone on the other side of the globe earth when it's 12 noon at your house and ask them if it's pitch black outside. That can't happen on a flat earth no matter what fuzzy logic they twist in. The flat earth theory is completely ridiculous. This is insanity. There is no flat earth theory that works with what I have observed.

off soap box.
Sooo off topic question here, but where did you work in Ecuador?
I traveled alot, but mostly based in Zaruma. That town is like a bright light in a dark room. The big cities of Ecuador aren't pleasant.

edit to add: Actually Zaruma is an amazing place. If you are thinking of going there or? you can PM me for details.
Last edited by FrankOne on November 28th, 2022, 1:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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