The Word of Wisdom

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mes5464
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The Word of Wisdom

Post by mes5464 »

This article made me think of the Word of Wisdom and my own health:

New study finds meat is healthy, no real health risks - TheBlaze
Researchers at the University of Washington’s Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation (IHME) released a study titled: "Health effects associated with consumption of unprocessed red meat: a Burden of Proof study." The paper was published in Nature journal in October.

The scientists declared, "We found weak evidence of association between unprocessed red meat consumption and colorectal cancer, breast cancer, type 2 diabetes, and ischemic heart disease. Moreover, we found no evidence of an association between unprocessed red meat and ischemic stroke or hemorrhagic stroke."

The authors of the study noted, "While there is some evidence that eating unprocessed red meat is associated with increased risk of disease incidence and mortality, it is weak and insufficient to make stronger or more conclusive recommendations."
Not long ago, I was diagnosed pre-diabetic. A knew before the doctor told me because the Holy Ghost has been hounding me about it for some time. I like to drink Colas is one problem and like most people I consumed my share of potatoes and grains. When my A1C came back 0.1% in the diabetic range I decided to pay attention to my blood sugar and see what I could do about it. I bought a glucose meter at Walmart and started testing 8 times a day to see my trends. I cut out all sugars (which was very hard) and I switched to keto friendly breads. I found that my body couldn't handle the grains or potatoes. I finally changed to a meat and low carb vegetable diet my blood sure came down but I still hover in the mid to high 100s. I can easily end up in the red by eating some bread or potatoes. Now that I have made the switch to a keto diet I have started to loose weight and my blood sugar is in the green (on the high end for sure but according to my glucose meter I'm within the acceptable range). The only way I could get my sugar down any more would be to stop eating all together.

I have a nagging feeling about the Word of Wisdom (not to mention food storage). Am I keeping with the WoW? Should I be eating breads and such, and just accept that diabetes might shorten my life? The WoW does say to eat meat sparingly and with keto one is doing anything but that so I'm torn and looking to see what other opinions I can get on the subject.

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Wondering Wendy
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Wondering Wendy »

mes5464 wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:31 am This article made me think of the Word of Wisdom and my own health:

New study finds meat is healthy, no real health risks - TheBlaze
Researchers at the University of Washington’s Institute for Health Metrics and Evaluation (IHME) released a study titled: "Health effects associated with consumption of unprocessed red meat: a Burden of Proof study." The paper was published in Nature journal in October.

The scientists declared, "We found weak evidence of association between unprocessed red meat consumption and colorectal cancer, breast cancer, type 2 diabetes, and ischemic heart disease. Moreover, we found no evidence of an association between unprocessed red meat and ischemic stroke or hemorrhagic stroke."

The authors of the study noted, "While there is some evidence that eating unprocessed red meat is associated with increased risk of disease incidence and mortality, it is weak and insufficient to make stronger or more conclusive recommendations."
Not long ago, I was diagnosed pre-diabetic. A knew before the doctor told me because the Holy Ghost has been hounding me about it for some time. I like to drink Colas is one problem and like most people I consumed my share of potatoes and grains. When my A1C came back 0.1% in the diabetic range I decided to pay attention to my blood sugar and see what I could do about it. I bought a glucose meter at Walmart and started testing 8 times a day to see my trends. I cut out all sugars (which was very hard) and I switched to keto friendly breads. I found that my body couldn't handle the grains or potatoes. I finally changed to a meat and low carb vegetable diet my blood sure came down but I still hover in the mid to high 100s. I can easily end up in the red by eating some bread or potatoes. Now that I have made the switch to a keto diet I have started to loose weight and my blood sugar is in the green (on the high end for sure but according to my glucose meter I'm within the acceptable range). The only way I could get my sugar down any more would be to stop eating all together.

I have a nagging feeling about the Word of Wisdom (not to mention food storage). Am I keeping with the WoW? Should I be eating breads and such, and just accept that diabetes might shorten my life? The WoW does say to eat meat sparingly and with keto one is doing anything but that so I'm torn and looking to see what other opinions I can get on the subject.
The whole point of the Word of Wisdom is to be wise in what we consume, I believe. I think this means to do what is best for our bodies, and we all have differences. It sounds like what you are doing is best for your body, so, I vote you're not breaking it.

You might just pray for peace on the matter and see if the Lord will ease your mind. Maybe he will have further instruction. :)

Atrasado
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Atrasado »

Have you tried eating grain cooked whole like steal cut oats, quinoa, or cooked wheat? I've heard that those don't spoke blood sugar and insulin.

Jashon
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Jashon »

The way to be healthy is to have insulin sensitivity, not insulin resistance. Long-term unhealthy eating leads to the latter. Sometimes the damage takes a long time to overcome. The only way for you to get healthy is to eat very low carb for a very long time. This leads to a clash with the WoW.

The counsel on not eating meat except during times of famine or winter in the WoW is an interpretive problem. It might be that winter was fine for meat-eating because refrigeration was naturally available in winter. It also seems to be ethnocentric because some cultures back in 1830 had to be meat-eating in order to survive. Surely the Lord would not want them starving by not eating meat.

The notion that red-meat causes cancer and other problems is an artifact of confounded epidemiological studies. This untruth conveniently allows large food corporations to boost their profits. Don't believe it. Longevity is high in various places where meat-eating is high. When you boil down the components of meat, it is mainly amino acids and fatty acids, all of which our body uses for nutrition.

May you eat well and heal.

silverado
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by silverado »

Eating meat is healthy the study finds--but not for the animals that get eaten. If the Lord cares about a sparrow that falls, he cares about an animal that gets slaughtered. D&C 89;12-13 says THEY (not 'it') are to be used sparingly. We usually think of that as an amount. Sparingly means more than that. To be held in reserve to be used if needed (spare tire), to treat with mercy and compassion, to use tenderly.

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nightlight
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by nightlight »

A resurrected God eating meat:

And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.

38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?

39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet.

41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?

42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.

43 And he took it, and did eat before them
..........

9 As soon then as they were come to land, they saw a fire of coals there, and fish laid thereon, and bread.

10 Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught.

11 Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken.

12 Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord.

13 Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Shawn Henry »

Jashon wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:24 am The counsel on not eating meat except during times of famine or winter in the WoW is an interpretive problem.
It's a translation problem as well.

Read it after the comma was added:

"And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine."

Now read the original without the comma and see if it the meaning doesn't feel reversed.

"And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine."

The first reading says, only in those times, and the second reading says, not only in those times, all because a comma was taken out.

logonbump
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by logonbump »

The word, "only" has a classical interpretation meaning "except". With that understanding, it makes more sense.
We should all read Leonard Arrington's article on the subject, An Economic Interpretation of the Word of Wisdom.
https://byustudies.byu.edu/article/an-e ... of-wisdom/
Last edited by logonbump on November 21st, 2022, 12:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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BigT
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by BigT »

mes5464 wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:31 amThe WoW does say to eat meat sparingly…
I’ve been dealing with this issue for many years, after my wife and I had our health turned around (for good, so far) by giving up a carb-based diet for a keto diet. Here are a few thoughts I’ve had:

1. The wheat we eat today is not the wheat eaten during Joseph Smith’s day. The protein molecule gluten is completely different and nowhere as near problematic as modern wheat. Likely due to hybridization. The old wheat can be found today and is grown in Idaho. It’s call Eikhorn. Many people with gluten sensitivities or allergies can eat Eikhorn.

2. The comma after the word “used” in 89:13 was not found in the text until the 1921 edition of the D&C, likely inserted by error by the printer (some say). Here’s an excerpt from Historical Development of the D&C by Woodford:

“The only other variation in this section of any consequence is the comma following verse 13. It was never found in any text prior to the 1921 edition of the Doctrine and Covenants. According to T. Edgar Lyons, Joseph Fielding Smith, when shown this addition to the text, said: Who put that in there?”

3. Lastly, the first 3 verses of Section 89 were added by Orson Hyde as directed by Brigham Young for the 1879 edition of the D&C. This gives me great pause.

Try reading Section 89 without the first 3 verses and without the added comma in verse 13, especially verse 13. Makes quite a difference.

(We no longer eat strict keto. My wife has lost a little more weight since then [likely the lightest she’s been in the 22+ years we’ve been married] but I’ve put on about 13-15 lbs. Why? I’ve been eating carbs. Not like we did before but enough to pick up some of the lost weight.)

Ha ha. Shawn beat me to it. Too slow typing on an iPad.

FoundMyEden
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by FoundMyEden »

silverado wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:29 am Eating meat is healthy the study finds--but not for the animals that get eaten. If the Lord cares about a sparrow that falls, he cares about an animal that gets slaughtered. D&C 89;12-13 says THEY (not 'it') are to be used sparingly. We usually think of that as an amount. Sparingly means more than that. To be held in reserve to be used if needed (spare tire), to treat with mercy and compassion, to use tenderly.
The fox and coyotes eat more of our chickens than we do. I think that’s an organic way for us to eat meat sparingly😂…although not merciful or compassionate on the end of the foxes. 😳

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Luke
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Luke »

BigT wrote: November 21st, 2022, 12:10 pm 3. Lastly, the first 3 verses of Section 89 were added by Orson Hyde as directed by Brigham Young for the 1879 edition of the D&C. This gives me great pause.
Historically inaccurate.

1. Joseph Smith wrote the first three verses originally as an introduction.

2. It was Orson Pratt who compiled the D&C as we know it under Brigham Young’s direction, not Orson Hyde.

3. It was in 1876, not 1879. Brigham Young died in 1877.

It does appear that people’s disdain for Brigham leads to considerable ignorance.

silverado
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by silverado »

logonbump wrote: November 21st, 2022, 11:51 am The word, "only" has a classical interpretation meaning "except". With that understanding, it makes more sense.
We should all read Leonard Arrington's article on the subject, An Economic Interpretation of the Word of Wisdom.
https://byustudies.byu.edu/article/an-e ... of-wisdom/
Another place, in sec 121:36, "That the rights of the priesthood are inseparably connected with the powers of heaven, and that the powers of heaven cannot be controlled nor handled ONLY upon the principles of righteousness." With or without the comma, 'only' plainly means 'except'. I've never seen anyone question the meaning of this 'only'.

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FrankOne
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by FrankOne »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 21st, 2022, 11:37 am
Jashon wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:24 am The counsel on not eating meat except during times of famine or winter in the WoW is an interpretive problem.
It's a translation problem as well.

Read it after the comma was added:

"And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used, only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine."

Now read the original without the comma and see if it the meaning doesn't feel reversed.

"And it is pleasing unto me that they should not be used only in times of winter, or of cold, or famine."

The first reading says, only in those times, and the second reading says, not only in those times, all because a comma was taken out.
hahaha. good catch there. That's why I like this site so much. So many minds with so many perspectives.

I know that some do well with a high meat diet. I also know that some do poorly with a high meat diet. The answer? Know thyself.

When I lived in Puerto Rico , on my mission, If I ate too much meat, it really bogged me down. I had been used to eating more than the average amount of meat and while there, I had to cut back to feel good and light. I presume it had to do with the constant high heat and humidity.

A wise diet is prescribed by the body of the individual.

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FrankOne
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by FrankOne »

nightlight wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:43 am A resurrected God eating meat:

And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

37 But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit.

38 And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts?

39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.

40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet.

41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them, Have ye here any meat?

42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb.

43 And he took it, and did eat before them
..........

9 As soon then as they were come to land, they saw a fire of coals there, and fish laid thereon, and bread.

10 Jesus saith unto them, Bring of the fish which ye have now caught.

11 Simon Peter went up, and drew the net to land full of great fishes, an hundred and fifty and three: and for all there were so many, yet was not the net broken.

12 Jesus saith unto them, Come and dine. And none of the disciples durst ask him, Who art thou? knowing that it was the Lord.

13 Jesus then cometh, and taketh bread, and giveth them, and fish likewise.
another excellent catch. Thanks.

Serragon
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Serragon »

The Word of Wisdom was a revelation given to a very specific group of people. It addressed the issues they faced. It was never meant to be used as it is today.

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Fred
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Fred »

silverado wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:29 am Eating meat is healthy the study finds--but not for the animals that get eaten. If the Lord cares about a sparrow that falls, he cares about an animal that gets slaughtered. D&C 89;12-13 says THEY (not 'it') are to be used sparingly. We usually think of that as an amount. Sparingly means more than that. To be held in reserve to be used if needed (spare tire), to treat with mercy and compassion, to use tenderly.
Jesus ate fish. That is one of the purposes of animals. They even eat each other.

randyps
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by randyps »

mes5464 wrote: November 21st, 2022, 4:31 am
I have a nagging feeling about the Word of Wisdom (not to mention food storage). Am I keeping with the WoW? Should I be eating breads and such, and just accept that diabetes might shorten my life? The WoW does say to eat meat sparingly and with keto one is doing anything but that so I'm torn and looking to see what other opinions I can get on the subject.
Im in the exact same boat as you. My advice is to go on youtube and listen to every diet that promotes reversing diabetes. Empower yourself with information.

7 Years ago I was borderline pre-diabetic (A1C 5.6), I started excercising by going to the gym for 3 hours 5 days a week, this helped improve my numbers as I continued to eat the normal American garbage diet (fast foods, soda, desserts, meats everyday). Eventually my numbers went back up. You cant out-excercise a bad diet.

Insulin Resistence: Insulin takes the glucose (found in carbs) from your blood stream and delivers it to the cells to burn as energy. When you consume excess sugar, processed foods, and fats found in meats...the cells in your body start to become filled with those fat particles, over time (many years) the cells no longer have room for the glucose so the cells tell insulin "sorry I cant take that glucose because I have too much fat in here". The effects of a bad diet over many years is what causes this insulin resistence and leads to type 2 diabetes. A birthday cake with ice cream is not bad, red meat is not bad, hot dog chips and soda is not bad....but these things in excess is what leads to bad health. If you are a young teenager or twenty-something then cut back on all these junk foods, if you are already on the path to pre-diabetes or type 2 then you need to eliminate them.

Dr. McDougall explains that a new machine was recently created (similar to a CATscan found in hospitals) that can measure the fat contents of your cells. This level of information was never known back in the early 2000s and is the early detector of when a person will develop insulin resistence later in life aka diabetes.

Keto diet (high fats, low carbs): Solves insulin resistence problems by lowering the amount of glucose intake via carbs and forces your body to use fat as energy. You dont need the help of insulin if you dont intake carbs/glucose. You will lose weight and improve your numbers but this does not solve the root of the problem which is the insulin resistence, you are just avoiding the problem by avoiding carbs.

Whole Food Plant based (high carb, low fat) solves insulin resistence by lowering fats/oils from the diet and allowing your body its natural source of enegry which is carbs found in fruits, legumes and vegetables.

After many weeks and weeks of studying various diets I am convinced that a whole food plant based diet is the natural diet for man. Look up "Mastering Diabetes" on youtube. Also look up Chef AJ.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Shawn Henry »

silverado wrote: November 21st, 2022, 2:57 pm With or without the comma, 'only' plainly means 'except'. I've never seen anyone question the meaning of this 'only'.
Nice!!!

You change the word only to except and then in the very next sentence you tell us you have never seen anyone question the meaning.

You should have just written, "I'm the only person I've seen substitute the word only for another word."

Thanks, but we all already know what only means. It means only.

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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by sushi_chef »

"August 26, 2011 Eating Fish Often Lowers Diabetes Risk Improves Insulin Resistance

 A multi-purpose cohort study (JPHC Study) conducted by the National Cancer Center, the National Center for Global Health and Medicine, and others has revealed that "men who eat more fish have a lower risk of developing diabetes. Men who eat a lot of fish have a 30% lower risk of developing diabetes than men who eat little fish. The study also found that the risk was lower for oily fish such as horse mackerel, sardines, and saury.

Fish is rich in high-quality fatty acids

 Fish is rich in high-quality fatty acids that are believed to be effective in preventing cardiovascular diseases such as myocardial infarction and angina pectoris. Fish contain the n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA). n-3 fatty acids also improve insulin secretion and insulin resistance, and research has shown that eating fish can be expected to reduce the risk of diabetes.

 The survey was conducted in 1990 and 1993 with 52,680 men and women aged 40-75 (22,921 men and 29,759 women) living in 10 prefectures (Iwate, Akita, Ibaraki, Tokyo, Niigata, Nagano, Osaka, Kochi, Nagasaki, and Okinawa). The participants had no diabetes, cancer, or cardiovascular disease at the time of the study.

 Based on the results of a questionnaire survey conducted five years after the start of the study, the participants were classified into four groups according to the amount of seafood they consumed, and the association with the development of diabetes was examined.

 The research team from the National Center for Global Health and Medicine, the National Cancer Center, and others classified the subjects into four groups according to the amount of seafood they consumed. The highest median seafood intake was 172 g for men and 163 g for women, while the lowest was 37 g for men and 35 g for women.

 The weight per slice of fish before cooking would be about 40 g for mackerel and 90 g for salmon; per fish, 90 g for saury, 60 g for horse mackerel, and 40 g for sardines (all without the head, bones, and organs).

 During the five-year follow-up period, 971 subjects (572 men and 399 women) developed diabetes. Onset of diabetes was defined as having been diagnosed with diabetes within the time period in a questionnaire survey conducted 10 years after the study began.

Higher seafood intake lowers diabetes risk

 The results of the association between fish intake and the development of diabetes showed that the risk of developing diabetes tended to decrease with higher seafood intake in men, with the highest intake group having about a 30% lower risk of diabetes than the lowest intake group. In women, there was no difference in the incidence of diabetes regardless of fish intake.
 When the survey results were analyzed by type of fish, it was found that small and medium-sized fish such as horse mackerel, sardines, Pacific saury, mackerel, and eels were most closely associated with a lower risk of diabetes. When fish were classified according to the amount of fat they contained, it was found that the risk of diabetes was reduced for fat-rich fish such as salmon, trout, horse mackerel, sardines, Pacific saury, mackerel, eels, and sea bream.

 On the other hand, non-fish seafood such as squid, octopus, shrimp, and shellfish, as well as salted and dried fish and processed seafood, showed no effect on lowering the risk of diabetes.

 The research team stated that "n-3 polyunsaturated fatty acids and vitamin D, which are abundant in fish, are thought to improve insulin sensitivity and insulin secretion. The Japanese eat more fish than any other people in the world, but in the West, fried fish is preferred in some regions, and fish consumption is not necessarily linked to diabetes prevention.

 One possible reason for the difference in the study results is that the types of fish consumed and the cooking methods used differ between Japan and the West. Further investigation is needed. As for the lack of association among women, it is possible that women have more body fat and are more susceptible to the effects of fat-soluble environmental pollutants," team said.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version) ++
"
:arrow:

silverado
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by silverado »

Shawn Henry wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 1:01 am
silverado wrote: November 21st, 2022, 2:57 pm With or without the comma, 'only' plainly means 'except'. I've never seen anyone question the meaning of this 'only'.
Nice!!!

You change the word only to except and then in the very next sentence you tell us you have never seen anyone question the meaning.

You should have just written, "I'm the only person I've seen substitute the word only for another word."

Thanks, but we all already know what only means. It means only.
Maybe I wasn't clear. You misunderstood what I was saying. I have never seen anyone question the "only" as if the comma or lack of comma changes the meaning, in 121:36 the way they do the one in the WoW.

This is the argument: "(Animals) should not be used only in times winter or of cold or famine." No comma means you shouldn't limit your use of them to just those times. With a comma means limiting your use to those times.

"...The powers of heaven cannot be controlled only upon the principles of righteousness." has no comma, yet no one argues that means you aren't limited to just the principles of righteousness. Probably everyone understands that means exclusively upon the principles of righteousness, even though there is no comma.
Last edited by silverado on November 22nd, 2022, 10:20 am, edited 2 times in total.

silverado
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by silverado »

Fred wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:20 pm
silverado wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:29 am Eating meat is healthy the study finds--but not for the animals that get eaten. If the Lord cares about a sparrow that falls, he cares about an animal that gets slaughtered. D&C 89;12-13 says THEY (not 'it') are to be used sparingly. We usually think of that as an amount. Sparingly means more than that. To be held in reserve to be used if needed (spare tire), to treat with mercy and compassion, to use tenderly.
Jesus ate fish. That is one of the purposes of animals. They even eat each other.
One of their purposes, yes it is. But we generally eat them a lot more than we need to.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Shawn Henry »

silverado wrote: November 22nd, 2022, 9:27 am "...The powers of heaven cannot be controlled only upon the principles of righteousness." has no comma, yet no one argues that means you aren't limited to just the principles of righteousness. Probably everyone understands that means exclusively upon the principles of righteousness, even though there is no comma.
I agree that that would read the same with or without a comma.

Jashon
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by Jashon »

silverado wrote: November 21st, 2022, 10:29 amEating meat is healthy the study finds--but not for the animals that get eaten. If the Lord cares about a sparrow that falls, he cares about an animal that gets slaughtered.
You seem to believe in the ethical superiority of plant-based eating, but quadrillions of insects are intentionally killed each year, just in the US, in the production of plant food. Also, huge numbers of mammals are killed in the production of plant food. Parts of insects and mammals can end up in plant food, esp. in grains.

Whether one eats plant or animal food, the most humane way to eat is to raise the food yourself. If it's impossible, then well-chosen food sourcing is important.

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ajax
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by ajax »

Research 'Insulin Resistance'

A good new-ish book on the topic is Why We Get Sick by Benjamin Bikman of BYU.

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nightlight
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Re: The Word of Wisdom

Post by nightlight »

Eating healthy also includes the space between meals

It's strange how good you feel if keep yourself hungry

Whole wheat in moderation goes a long way

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