Uchtdorf: God gave us masks. God gave us a vaccine.

[Dusty Wanderer]

But even Ben Shapiro finally found his butt with both hands the other day.

Are you referring to his show on the vaxx lies and how young people have been harmed by it?

[Mamabear]

There is no mystery here. Our leaders are just elitists and aristocrats, who like to mingle with others of their class. Their opinions are those of other elites, because it is only through their opinions that they are able to signal to others their class/tribal status. It is no longer sufficient for elites to differentiate themselves by wealth or possessions because these things are too available to the riff-raff. So correct ideas are now one of the main methods of signaling class status.

Masks and vax status are signals, and in Thailand where people are much more accepting of masks, it is also something an elitist would say to try and make the peasants think he is one of them.


Our leaders don't mean to be this way, but they live in self-created bubbles that are virtually impervious to reality. I have had the opportunity to attend leadership meetings with 2 different apostles over the last 4 years. And it has been similar at each meeting. The first part was assuring everyone about how well the church was doing. The next part was talking about the latest program change and how this particular change is different than all previous changes for some unknown reason. Lots of expression of love, support, and appreciation. Then some Q&A where a practical answer is rarely to be seen. "How do I minister to the Young women in my ward when almost all are inactive and don't actually want to attend meetings or activities?" Then a 10 minute rambling answer with "Do your best. God will guide you." as the final result. In fact, sometimes the traveling GA and area authority will try and give a practical answer which is then overwritten by the abstract answer of the apostle.

This is really true, and is evident in so many ways.

There's a lot of tunnels under SLC connecting everything. This means Mormon leaders can move about without having to sully themselves by rubbing shoulders with the rank and file.
Many of them live in gated communities.
In Africa, the (white) leadership live in compounds and have security forces, much of the time they're in isolation with the poor members there.

They are the modern day Pharisees, who, as Jesus criticized, love the chief seats in the synagogues and the adulation. Interesting how he compared them to unmarked graves.

You mean there were no tunnels under Jerusalem so the disciples could avoid the people? I thought I read there were in the book of Snob 7:19
Remember when Peter’s wife gave him the second anointing in the temple?
That’s also in the book of Snob 6:66.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Or could it be, as a guest of the King of Thailand, the Church representative, Uchtdorf in this case, is telling the Thai people to uphold the laws as written right now in that land?

Didn't we just read a few comments/pages ago that Thailand has relaxed all rules related to the mask and vax?

These men have an agenda. Either they are ignorant, deceived, or somehow don't want to get egg on their face by admitting they were wrong. Just think of the lawsuits the church would have over how strongly they promoted the propaganda.

[HereWeGo]

There is no mystery here. Our leaders are just elitists and aristocrats, who like to mingle with others of their class. Their opinions are those of other elites, because it is only through their opinions that they are able to signal to others their class/tribal status. It is no longer sufficient for elites to differentiate themselves by wealth or possessions because these things are too available to the riff-raff. So correct ideas are now one of the main methods of signaling class status.

This is a new idea I had not thought of. This would incorporate many of the other ideas expressed. The idea of them being dumb is left behind.

[Sunain]

God also gave us a brain, the light of Christ and the Gift of the Holy Ghost! All 3 were warning me to avoid masks and the vaccine.

[larsenb]

Now I know that anyone promoting either the mask or shot is simply a dedicated disciple of satan.

To be fair, I think it can fall into two categories: deceived or a deceiver. I wouldn't want to wrongly judge someone's intentions. Some people are just ignorantly going along with the deceivers/wolves. Neither category is good.

I still think God is allowing this for His own purposes, which could be multifaceted to include both good and bad (e.g., an element of punishment). The good could include allowing the situation in the church to develop in order to bring to pass a fundamental change, which might include the DS.

[creator]

Or could it be, as a guest of the King of Thailand, the Church representative, Uchtdorf in this case, is telling the Thai people to uphold the laws as written right now in that land?

No. He could have said that. But instead he chose to say that God gave us masks.

Right, there's a big difference between saying "I will wear a mask for this particular occasion to respect the request of the king of this land I am visiting" and saying "God gave us masks. God gave us a vaccine." Huge difference. One is done out of respect, the other is plain ignorance or evil/deception.

God gave us a body and other natural means of dealing with viruses and diseases. No need for masks and vaccines, which are counter productive to healthy living.

[creator]

I still think God is allowing this for His own purposes, which could be multifaceted to include both good and bad (e.g., an element of punishment). The good could include allowing the situation in the church to develop in order to bring to pass a fundamental change, which might include the DS.

God allows everything, it's called agency. That doesn't mean God is in any way directing the church leaders to do what they are doing. I know some people like to come up with a scenario that eases their cognitive dissonance. Doesn't make it true.

[larsenb]

The State has become their idol.

For many these days, government is their god. In that sense, god did give us masks, vaxxes, lockdown commandments for our own protection and the greater good...

The left/liberal agenda actually rely on government to be their God, the only power they can conceive of as being able to implement their version of 'social justice'.

[larsenb]

I think DU should watch this video: WARNING !! GRAPHIC IMAGES!! GLOBAL DEPOPULATION IN FULL SWING AS ADULT DEATH SYNDROME SKYROCKETS: https://odysee.com/@AussieFighter:8/WAR ... YROCKETS:d

Many of the video clips showing utter tragedy are from an oriental country, maybe even many from Bangkok.

[larsenb]

I still think God is allowing this for His own purposes, which could be multifaceted to include both good and bad (e.g., an element of punishment). The good could include allowing the situation in the church to develop in order to bring to pass a fundamental change, which might include the DS.

God allows everything, it's called agency. That doesn't mean God is in any way directing the church leaders to do what they are doing. I know some people like to come up with a scenario that eases their cognitive dissonance. Doesn't make it true.

Read my use of "allow" vs. your "directing". There is a difference. I hope you understand the distinction.

[Subcomandante]

Or could it be, as a guest of the King of Thailand, the Church representative, Uchtdorf in this case, is telling the Thai people to uphold the laws as written right now in that land?

Didn't we just read a few comments/pages ago that Thailand has relaxed all rules related to the mask and vax?

These men have an agenda. Either they are ignorant, deceived, or somehow don't want to get egg on their face by admitting they were wrong. Just think of the lawsuits the church would have over how strongly they promoted the propaganda.

I put the comment that Thailand had relaxed all the restrictions regarding travelers going to Thailand, as in, people are no longer required to present a vaccination certificate or a negative test upon entry to the country, and that was dated last month. This was taken from a Thai government website.

However, the Health Ministry of Thailand still requires people to mask up locally if they go to crowded places such as a cinema or auditorium (where the Stake Conference was held definitely qualifies as this type of place), or if they go on public transport (a reality for the vast majority of Thais). That was in the Bangkok Post article that I linked up afterwards.

The Church is finishing up the temple in Bangkok right now. They have a good relationship with the local leadership there. Why throw that all away over an inconvenience?

[larsenb]

They all have family and friends who are not so insulated. Surely they have heard something by now. Good or bad, they have supported vaksination for decades.

I think they have heard plenty from those close to them and/or from family; along w/myriad communications from many members. My own wife took a long discourse in written form to one of them where they live, handing it off to one of their apparent offspring.

She was also called on it by our Bishop during a T settlement meeting, being an apparent official no-no.

[Hogmeister]

Now I know that anyone promoting either the mask or shot is simply a dedicated disciple of satan.

To be fair, I think it can fall into two categories: deceived or a deceiver. I wouldn't want to wrongly judge someone's intentions. Some people are just ignorantly going along with the deceivers/wolves. Neither category is good.

I still think God is allowing this for His own purposes, which could be multifaceted to include both good and bad (e.g., an element of punishment). The good could include allowing the situation in the church to develop in order to bring to pass a fundamental change, which might include the DS.

”… for I will show unto them that my wisdom is greater than the cunning of the devil.”

I think this lie that they got caught in will ultimately bring about the spiritual healing of the latter day servant.

[larsenb]

I've always thought it was interesting that Garrett Gong used to give the Q15 curated news reports from MSM sources. Soon after, he is made an apostle, the first Asian apostle, probably proven safe from his servile performance as an advisor to the Q15. Kind of feeds the echo-chamber theory.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CpVh24_wG ... e=youtu.be

Gararett Gong apparently strongly advised we go into Iraq shortly after 9/11, when he was in some kind of governmental advisory body. This tidbit came from a post from a very well known LDS apologist on his blog.

[larsenb]

These men eat a steady diet of CNN, MSNBC, network news, NYT, etc.

They also get their information from "briefings" in church HQ presented to them by people who get their information from the mainstream media.

Revelation from God is clearly not coming to them. It's painful to finally realize that this didn't start in 2020, but looooonng before any of us were born. And for many of us, that realization is too much to bear, so we take the blue pill.

And from the KSL and Deseret News editorial boards, which also imbibe from these named sources.

[larsenb]

There is no mystery here. Our leaders are just elitists and aristocrats, who like to mingle with others of their class. Their opinions are those of other elites, because it is only through their opinions that they are able to signal to others their class/tribal status. It is no longer sufficient for elites to differentiate themselves by wealth or possessions because these things are too available to the riff-raff. So correct ideas are now one of the main methods of signaling class status.

Masks and vax status are signals, and in Thailand where people are much more accepting of masks, it is also something an elitist would say to try and make the peasants think he is one of them.

His statement about Thailand being the 3rd country where FTSOY was printed is also elitist. This is the kind of thing CEOs and other executives say at company meetings to make the workers think there is something special about them.

Our leaders don't mean to be this way, but they live in self-created bubbles that are virtually impervious to reality. I have had the opportunity to attend leadership meetings with 2 different apostles over the last 4 years. And it has been similar at each meeting. The first part was assuring everyone about how well the church was doing. The next part was talking about the latest program change and how this particular change is different than all previous changes for some unknown reason. Lots of expression of love, support, and appreciation. Then some Q&A where a practical answer is rarely to be seen. "How do I minister to the Young women in my ward when almost all are inactive and don't actually want to attend meetings or activities?" Then a 10 minute rambling answer with "Do your best. God will guide you." as the final result. In fact, sometimes the traveling GA and area authority will try and give a practical answer which is then overwritten by the abstract answer of the apostle.

So how is it that they believe in masks and the shot? Because they live in a bubble where tribal affiliation requires this belief. I see it with the people I work with every day. They say they aren't wearing it for themselves. They wear it because they care so much about you.

I think it was Dr. David Malone who picked up the significance of Mattias Desmet's 'mass formation' ideas/research, and printed out the circumstances conducive to 'group think', which of course is a strong component of any 'mass formation' or psychic epidemic (after CG Jung). He listed about 7-10 characteristics leading to group think and the list sounded very much like how the Brethren describe their group decision-making process . . . . the most potent being assenting to the final decision of the leader on any problem/situation they were discussing.

[larsenb]

But even Ben Shapiro finally found his butt with both hands the other day.

Are you referring to his show on the vaxx lies and how young people have been harmed by it?

This would fit with my hearing Ben somehow underwent a course correction. Heretofore, he always came across to me as a show boater, and not quite getting many issues.

[Reluctant Watchman]

Or could it be, as a guest of the King of Thailand, the Church representative, Uchtdorf in this case, is telling the Thai people to uphold the laws as written right now in that land?

Didn't we just read a few comments/pages ago that Thailand has relaxed all rules related to the mask and vax?

These men have an agenda. Either they are ignorant, deceived, or somehow don't want to get egg on their face by admitting they were wrong. Just think of the lawsuits the church would have over how strongly they promoted the propaganda.

I put the comment that Thailand had relaxed all the restrictions regarding travelers going to Thailand, as in, people are no longer required to present a vaccination certificate or a negative test upon entry to the country, and that was dated last month. This was taken from a Thai government website.

However, the Health Ministry of Thailand still requires people to mask up locally if they go to crowded places such as a cinema or auditorium (where the Stake Conference was held definitely qualifies as this type of place), or if they go on public transport (a reality for the vast majority of Thais). That was in the Bangkok Post article that I linked up afterwards.

The Church is finishing up the temple in Bangkok right now. They have a good relationship with the local leadership there. Why throw that all away over an inconvenience?

Ok. But, he could have said a million other things about being safe and taking care of our bodies... but no, he had to tell them that God put his personal stamp of approval on masks and the jab. A purely evil thing.

[Jamescm]

God also gives us pain, disease, heartbreak, dangerous animals with an enmity between we and they, tyranny, abuse, and an eventual death that is all too often neither quick, peaceful, or in old age with our families socially and financially ready to move on without us. God gave us wine, tea, coffee, tobacco, and marajuana.

"God gave us ____" doesn't make ____ good, desirable, or appropriate.

[CuriousThinker]

Or could it be, as a guest of the King of Thailand, the Church representative, Uchtdorf in this case, is telling the Thai people to uphold the laws as written right now in that land?

Didn't we just read a few comments/pages ago that Thailand has relaxed all rules related to the mask and vax?

These men have an agenda. Either they are ignorant, deceived, or somehow don't want to get egg on their face by admitting they were wrong. Just think of the lawsuits the church would have over how strongly they promoted the propaganda.

I put the comment that Thailand had relaxed all the restrictions regarding travelers going to Thailand, as in, people are no longer required to present a vaccination certificate or a negative test upon entry to the country, and that was dated last month. This was taken from a Thai government website.

However, the Health Ministry of Thailand still requires people to mask up locally if they go to crowded places such as a cinema or auditorium (where the Stake Conference was held definitely qualifies as this type of place), or if they go on public transport (a reality for the vast majority of Thais). That was in the Bangkok Post article that I linked up afterwards.

The Church is finishing up the temple in Bangkok right now. They have a good relationship with the local leadership there. Why throw that all away over an inconvenience?

If you look at the pics most people were not wearing masks, including leadership on the stage. So, no excuse to call either one being from God.

[Fred]

Or could it be, as a guest of the King of Thailand, the Church representative, Uchtdorf in this case, is telling the Thai people to uphold the laws as written right now in that land?

Didn't we just read a few comments/pages ago that Thailand has relaxed all rules related to the mask and vax?

These men have an agenda. Either they are ignorant, deceived, or somehow don't want to get egg on their face by admitting they were wrong. Just think of the lawsuits the church would have over how strongly they promoted the propaganda.

I put the comment that Thailand had relaxed all the restrictions regarding travelers going to Thailand, as in, people are no longer required to present a vaccination certificate or a negative test upon entry to the country, and that was dated last month. This was taken from a Thai government website.

However, the Health Ministry of Thailand still requires people to mask up locally if they go to crowded places such as a cinema or auditorium (where the Stake Conference was held definitely qualifies as this type of place), or if they go on public transport (a reality for the vast majority of Thais). That was in the Bangkok Post article that I linked up afterwards.

The Church is finishing up the temple in Bangkok right now. They have a good relationship with the local leadership there. Why throw that all away over an inconvenience?

The video above that larsonb posted showing people just dying for no apparent reason; This never happened like this before the jab. So while the numbers are not a huge percent of the population, they are thousands in number. So anyone that is causing this is a mass murderer. As is anyone suggesting that a person get the shot.

[FrankOne]

Now I know that anyone promoting either the mask or shot is simply a dedicated disciple of satan.

To be fair, I think it can fall into two categories: deceived or a deceiver. I wouldn't want to wrongly judge someone's intentions. Some people are just ignorantly going along with the deceivers/wolves. Neither category is good.

I still think God is allowing this for His own purposes, which could be multifaceted to include both good and bad (e.g., an element of punishment). The good could include allowing the situation in the church to develop in order to bring to pass a fundamental change, which might include the DS.

People make choices as to who they are amidst an insane world. The church leadership has joined the mentally ill and each member makes their choice of what to do. Those that can't see the illness are also ill.

I'm just now beginning to think that the DS won't approach nor endorse any single church.

He will declare the truth of Jesus Christ and those that follow him will be relatively few. If this occurs, the majority of LDS members won't give him a single thought because he won't represent any denomination at all. Thinking this through makes the best sense out of any past postulations of the DS that I've made.

[h_p]

But even Ben Shapiro finally found his butt with both hands the other day.

Are you referring to his show on the vaxx lies and how young people have been harmed by it?

Yeah, that's probably what this article is referring to, though I didn't listen to the show, myself:
https://www.theblaze.com/news/after-adv ... y-everyone

[InfoWarrior82]

I still think God is allowing this for His own purposes, which could be multifaceted to include both good and bad (e.g., an element of punishment). The good could include allowing the situation in the church to develop in order to bring to pass a fundamental change, which might include the DS.

God allows everything, it's called agency. That doesn't mean God is in any way directing the church leaders to do what they are doing. I know some people like to come up with a scenario that eases their cognitive dissonance. Doesn't make it true.

Read my use of "allow" vs. your "directing". There is a difference. I hope you understand the distinction.

Hold up, are you saying that the Lord is allowing them to be deceived? Can you go into further detail on what you mean by this? Like, for example, is Jesus hanging out with these guys and telling them they're doing a bang-up job but secretly he's cringing inside? Or, perhaps, not at all giving these men any sort of revelation on what to do, and letting them hang themselves with their own decisions?

I guess what I'm trying to say is: are they getting allllllllll the revelation a proper prophet of God should, except just not the stuff that counts? That sounds extremely nonsensical.