This forum has failed miserably

[Being There]

why ?

before I tell you - at least why I think it has -
your comments will most likely prove why.

Tell me what you think.
why it has - hasn't, or why I would even say this.

[BuriedTartaria]

We haven’t chosen to handle difference of opinion in a civil manner.


I’m trying to do this.

[Being There]

We haven’t chosen to handle difference of opinion in a civil manner.


I’m trying to do this.

amen to that.
I totally agree, and need some work on that myself,
but I was thinking about something - well, something else - something that is even more important;
and could even possibly help that very thing.

[Cruiserdude]

The forum hasn't failed. The goal of the forum is to simply provide a place for discourse and opinions to be shared.
Perhaps it'd be more accurate to state: 'The people using this forum have failed miserably to use it in a productive manner.'?.... And even then, that'd be an opinion.
I don't think the forum has failed miserably.

[Reluctant Watchman]

You've obviously come to some conclusions as to the purpose of this forum, to which you are now at odds. Are you no longer "free" to express your opinion?

[Reluctant Watchman]

I just want to know why BuriedTartaria chose the avatar that they have. Inquiring minds want to know.

[Bronco73idi]

This forum to me is highly successful. Fred made a comment last week to the point that he learned more here in a year then 50 years of going to church.

[Thinker]

The forum hasn't failed. The goal of the forum is to simply provide a place for discourse and opinions to be shared.
Perhaps it'd be more accurate to state: 'The people using this forum have failed miserably to use it in a productive manner.'?.... And even then, that'd be an opinion.
I don't think the forum has failed miserably.

I agree, & you explained it well.
This forum is awesome in many ways - much better than so much out there! YET, it & people are not our version of “perfect.” And many of us - at times - struggle with the deadly combo of pride & ignorance, which makes for dead-end discussions.

Maybe this topic is good to bring up… the elephant in the room…
Why read and post here?

Obvious answers are
1) Where else can I communicate about freedom & how the church is becoming increasingly anti-freedom without going to the opposite leftist herd mentality?
2) We need to join with others who also believe in & defend freedom, as well as godly principles.

Less obvious answers may be (& I can only speak for myself but guess it might apply to some other odd duck too)…
3) This fills a social connection need.
4) This may serve as a distraction from ongoing pain in real life.

[Chip]

This forum serves as a psychological clearinghouse for concerned LDS people (and a few others) who are dealing with the spiritual grind of the last days.

There are the ideals and the gritty realities in all our heads, and the promises from God of what will be. It will all get sorted out, in time.

This is how I see it, anyway.

[HereWeGo]

5) All Church, All Defense, All the time. Some feel that Jesus and the Corporation needs someone to defend them from people who are trying to make sense of things that they are seeing in the church.

[The Red Pill]

This forum serves as a psychological clearinghouse for concerned LDS people (and a few others) who are dealing with the spiritual grind of the last days.

There are the ideals and the gritty realities in all our heads, and the promises from God of what will be. It will all get sorted out, in time.

This is how I see it, anyway.

Very true statement when you say psychological clearinghouse.

The only complaint I have with the forum, is not with the forum itself, but what I would refer to as the "professional agitators".

Differences of opinion are a good thing, if the goal of both parties is to arrive at the truth of something. That's how universities used to be structured in the learning process.

But there are those (you know who you are) that have no interest in arriving at the truth of something, through study, discussion and honest debate. They throw out stuff just to agitate...then more often than not, someone eventually takes the bait..which leads to the famous "two party online fist-fight"...and the discussion gets derailed...or even shut down by a moderator.

I would suggest that moderators should look for the "professional agitators" rather than just contention in a thread....get at the root of the problem...and address it.

I have learned so much from the people on this forum. I thank you for the valuable information you have shared freely in an effort to arrive at the truth of things...The way things really are.

I honestly believe that all truth WILL BE circumscribed into one great whole, and this forum is a significant contributor to that goal.

[Niemand]

Not for me. I get to hear all kinds of things about the church I don't elsewhere.

There are the usual strands of alternative thought but the LDS aspect makes it worthwhile.

It's also much better than social media which is constantly censored.

[Thinker]

This forum serves as a psychological clearinghouse for concerned LDS people (and a few others) who are dealing with the spiritual grind of the last days.

There are the ideals and the gritty realities in all our heads, and the promises from God of what will be. It will all get sorted out, in time.

This is how I see it, anyway.

I like that, Chip.
Interesting & fitting terms, “psychological clearinghouse for concerned LDS” & “sorted out, in time.” This forum serves an essential purpose of helping us “sort things out.” Nobody is all-knowing. We’re all works in progress & it helps to bounce ideas off others in the process of sorting things out. Often I have posted thoughts that I wasn’t sure about & sensed that I was missing something & hoped & was glad when someone would share a perspective I hadn’t considered.

I also like how you mentioned sorted out “IN TIME.” I’m trying to hurry up & be more patient! It took me many YEARS to realize some things. It’s unrealistic for me to expect others to get it faster. Yesterday, someone I know gave a talk mixed with truth & cultish dogma - & at 1st I thought, “Great - more indoctrinated minds!” But then I considered how she reminded me of myself when I was her age - & I think she’ll figure things out - in time.

[Thinker]

5) All Church, All Defense, All the time. Some feel that Jesus and the Corporation needs someone to defend them from people who are trying to make sense of things that they are seeing in the church.

That’s understandable. I used to want to defend the church when family or friends put it down.

It’s a messy thing - sorting through so much to find pearls of truth… & a faith crisis - such betrayal - is also messy. LOSING the illusion that “all is well in the church” is like stages of grief…



For many, there was a lifelong sense of being blamed/gaslighted, so many took that inward as depression & anxiety. To realize that those blaming were more responsible can be create a healthy sense of anger or assertiveness. Though anger can be expressed in less-than-ideal ways which can cause others to feel defensive, especially if they are in a different stage of grief.

[Robin Hood]

I think this forum is excellent.
We get some real characters here, as well as the usual malcontents, attention seekers and... well... weirdos.
It all makes for an interesting and enlightening experience.
It has taught me a lot and helped me draw conclusions about what I can and can't accept, as well as pushing the boundaries of both. At times this forum has been a lifeline.

[Fred]

Not for me. I get to hear all kinds of things about the church I don't elsewhere.

There are the usual strands of alternative thought but the LDS aspect makes it worthwhile.

It's also much better than social media which is constantly censored.

Yes. And people even provide the scriptures that brought about their way of thinking. Much faster and more detailed than in Gospel Doctrine class.

Being able to choose topics to learn from or leave those of no interest. Far more selective than church.

Sometimes personalities clash. But at least we are able to defend our point of view. I went to an AA meeting as I hadn't been for years and wanted a new chip. When I arrived, someone shouted "Did you get your shot?" at me. I said "What, do I have idiot wrote on my forehead?" It went downhill from there and I was viewed as a trouble maker. My point of view was not welcome.

[Thinker]

Not for me. I get to hear all kinds of things about the church I don't elsewhere.

There are the usual strands of alternative thought but the LDS aspect makes it worthwhile.

It's also much better than social media which is constantly censored.

Yes. And people even provide the scriptures that brought about their way of thinking. Much faster and more detailed than in Gospel Doctrine class.

Being able to choose topics to learn from or leave those of no interest. Far more selective than church.

Sometimes personalities clash. But at least we are able to defend our point of view. I went to an AA meeting as I hadn't been for years and wanted a new chip. When I arrived, someone shouted "Did you get your shot?" at me. I said "What, do I have idiot wrote on my forehead?" It went downhill from there and I was viewed as a trouble maker. My point of view was not welcome.

Good for you defending your belief- even on the spot! And kind of funny too. I appreciate your humor in defending truth.

[Reluctant Watchman]

I went to an AA meeting as I hadn't been for years and wanted a new chip.

I must be missing some context here. What does it mean that you "wanted a new chip"?

[madvin]

For me it hasn't failed miserably, although I have felt some failure in myself for my weaknesses. It has given me a good dose of reality and has caused me to dig deeper which has helped me strengthen some of my weaknesses.

It has shown me and does show me now how little I know, but also has strengthened and will continue to strengthen what I do know.

It's where I want to be.

[Fred]

I went to an AA meeting as I hadn't been for years and wanted a new chip.

I must be missing some context here. What does it mean that you "wanted a new chip"?

Anyone is welcome at an AA meeting. Well, as long as they don't stir contention. Sometimes people come that have been sober for just 24 hours. They are awarded a "chip" ( a brass coin about the size of a silver dollar) that says 24 hours on it. There is one for a week, month, year, 5 years, 10 years, 15 years, etc., I guess clear to a hundred. Anyway, I had my 10 year chip and wanted a 15 or 20 year chip. They don't always have every chip on hand. Depends on the group. I didn't know the group as it was during covid and was held in Liberty Park, in Salt Lake.

[BuriedTartaria]

I just want to know why BuriedTartaria chose the avatar that they have. Inquiring minds want to know.

I believe in idealistic, enduring love between one man and one woman. I don’t want to debate or contend with advocates of polygamy and I don’t mean mean them aggression or spite or wrongdoing. But it’s not what I believe in. I chose a symbol to represent that and I got the symbol from a Japanese game series that I’m fond of that I think had a powerful, wholesomeness to it which will probably disappear since the company that owns it wants it to become more popular in the United States.


I didn’t become engaged or start seeing anyone

[Reluctant Watchman]

I didn’t become engaged or start seeing anyone

That thought did cross my mind.

[Chip]

...
The only complaint I have with the forum, is not with the forum itself, but what I would refer to as the "professional agitators".

Differences of opinion are a good thing, if the goal of both parties is to arrive at the truth of something. That's how universities used to be structured in the learning process.

But there are those (you know who you are) that have no interest in arriving at the truth of something, through study, discussion and honest debate. They throw out stuff just to agitate...then more often than not, someone eventually takes the bait..which leads to the famous "two party online fist-fight"...and the discussion gets derailed...or even shut down by a moderator.

I would suggest that moderators should look for the "professional agitators" rather than just contention in a thread....get at the root of the problem...and address it.

I have learned so much from the people on this forum. I thank you for the valuable information you have shared freely in an effort to arrive at the truth of things...The way things really are.

I honestly believe that all truth WILL BE circumscribed into one great whole, and this forum is a significant contributor to that goal.

Yes, the "professional agitators" are the only significant problem this forum has. They absolutely suck, to the Nth degree. They are always on standby, ready to administer their spiritual vaxx. They do not care about the truth, but operate under a canard of honest inquiry. They are always on the side of evil. You could leave for six months, come back here, and find them arguing on the evil side of whatever issue was topical. If they are actually paid by the church to do what they do, that would be most clarifying. Could the institution be that bereft of conscience? In either case, the trolls are evil. I do not know how to solve the problem without becoming evil like Big Tech. Certainly, when knowledge of God finally floods the earth, they will have either repented or been damned.

[CaptainM]

why ?

before I tell you - at least why I think it has -
your comments will most likely prove why.

Tell me what you think.
why it has - hasn't, or why I would even say this.

I have noticed that we all talk about tenets, but don't focus on Christ as much as we should. My opinion.

[Cruiserdude]

I just want to know why BuriedTartaria chose the avatar that they have. Inquiring minds want to know.

I believe in idealistic, enduring love between one man and one woman. I don’t want to debate or contend with advocates of polygamy and I don’t mean mean them aggression or spite or wrongdoing. But it’s not what I believe in. I chose a symbol to represent that and I got the symbol from a Japanese game series that I’m fond of that I think had a powerful, wholesomeness to it which will probably disappear since the company that owns it wants it to become more popular in the United States.


I didn’t become engaged or start seeing anyone

You're a good dude, BT