Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

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Lizzy60
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Lizzy60 »

Wolfwoman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 7:55 pm
Niemand wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 3:13 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 5:11 pm
CuriousThinker wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 5:10 pm
I thought you can't get baptized if you have transitioned. Or is it just no temple recommend?
I dunno. The water is pretty murky when you get to that point.
I know for a fact that the RC church has baptised transgender people unknowingly – one of them was boasting about it online. When I got baptised I got the interview from the bishop but never got asked to show a birth certificate.

However, trans people are arguably as entitled to salvation as anyone else. So if someone has transitioned and makes a sincere commitment to be baptised, then that is an issue. Some of these people have had surgery etc. That's where it gets messy. Is a trans-woman supposed to get surgical breast reductions before being baptised? The bit downstairs can't be replaced. Leviticus 21 suggests that a man with crushed stones (i.e. testicles) can't go in the temple.
What is the RC Church?
Yeah, I was thinking, I doubt someone is asking to see their private parts or their birth certificate, etc. when they ask to be baptized. So someone could hide it... there are a few, not many, transgender people who can easily pass for the sex they are trying to be.
RC is Roman Catholic.

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Dusty Wanderer
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Dusty Wanderer »

Serragon wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 5:21 pm
Fred wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 2:52 pm A member of my Bishopric came by the other day and I asked him about gay missionaries and he was adamant that there were not any. I told him I had heard of some and he said that if they have any gay tendencies whatsoever that that can not serve a mission. He said they must have fooled their Bishop to go. I don't know if he is right or not, but I think that by the time a guy is missionary age, if he is queer, people know it.
You would be amazed how many Bishops don't know that the Church no longer considers homosexuality a sin, even though it has been removed from the handbook for a few years now.
My bishop will be doing a fireside in a couple of weeks for parents/adults in our ward to know how to handle their child coming out as gay or transitioning. I couldn't believe it.

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Niemand
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Niemand »

Wolfwoman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 7:55 pm
Niemand wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 3:13 am
Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 5:11 pm
CuriousThinker wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 5:10 pm
I thought you can't get baptized if you have transitioned. Or is it just no temple recommend?
I dunno. The water is pretty murky when you get to that point.
I know for a fact that the RC church has baptised transgender people unknowingly – one of them was boasting about it online. When I got baptised I got the interview from the bishop but never got asked to show a birth certificate.

However, trans people are arguably as entitled to salvation as anyone else. So if someone has transitioned and makes a sincere commitment to be baptised, then that is an issue. Some of these people have had surgery etc. That's where it gets messy. Is a trans-woman supposed to get surgical breast reductions before being baptised? The bit downstairs can't be replaced. Leviticus 21 suggests that a man with crushed stones (i.e. testicles) can't go in the temple.
What is the RC Church?
The Pope's Posse.

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LDS Physician
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by LDS Physician »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 3:44 pm
Fred wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 2:52 pm A member of my Bishopric came by the other day and I asked him about gay missionaries and he was adamant that there were not any. I told him I had heard of some and he said that if they have any gay tendencies whatsoever that they can not serve a mission. He said they must have fooled their Bishop to go. I don't know if he is right or not, but I think that by the time a guy is missionary age, if he is queer, people know it.
There are many YM who have come out as gay on their missions. Receiving hundreds of positive responses on their FB pages. I remember recently seeing a trio of sister missionaries with a new convert. It was a transgender man dressed in a white dress in front of the baptismal font. Ironically this woMAN was a "Mental Health Therapist". Oh, I found the photo:
I have no words.

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

wow. many posts have been put on this forum regarding the watchman. But all of those posts refer to money or the spending of money.

What happened to those watchman protecting our missionaries and our youth? Some have even influenced the adult testimonies of saints. We are supposed to be protected, at least in our church from these babylonian practices.

The posts here sure tell the results of allowing these practices, a sort of acceptance, in any religious institution. One post suggests that some missionaries were at different stages I can only imagine what that means. of course plenty of missionaries have had sex with the opposite sex on their missions, too. Where was the watchman to warn any of them before it was too late?

I totally oppose the acceptance of any deviant immoral behavior . . .which is what it used to be called 20+ years ago. I certainly don't think it should be celebrated . . which is what our saints are actually doing when they parade it in firesides and women's conferences.

I have always know it was a sin and whether the world or the church wants to call good sin and sin good, I will not change my mind. So in my mind, at least, there is not debate.

I see in these posts a very good example of watchman allowing the enemy to enter. there is never any guarantee that a person will repent and the enemy, in the case of the unrepentant, has done his job.

soon it will be too late to fix it

may god have mercy

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

btw the answer to the post question is yes. Even in the temple, I have seen two lesbians hugging and rubbing each other in the chapel as they waited to go to the endowment

we are all watchman and sometimes if we get a calling, especially as bishop, we are definitely watchman. Isaiah claims that ALL the lazy watchman will be replaced.

Lizzy60
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Lizzy60 »

EvanLM wrote: September 25th, 2022, 10:53 am btw the answer to the post question is yes. Even in the temple, I have seen two lesbians hugging and rubbing each other in the chapel as they waited to go to the endowment

we are all watchman and sometimes if we get a calling, especially as bishop, we are definitely watchman. Isaiah claims that ALL the lazy watchman will be replaced.
As long as the two women you saw are not having sexual relations, and are only participating in activities that heterosexual couples can do while dating, they can qualify for a temple recommend. This is straight out of the Holy Handbook, where every word is approved by the First Presidency.

And NO, I do not approve of this. They are making a mockery of the temple.

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

I believe that this actually reflects the apostasy of the church. The parading of this is very subtle and persistent. We have compromised his word.

Our leaders and some saints seem to want to approach God on their own ideas and not approach him on the basis of what he required. Getting closer to God is a matter of the heart and of obedience and is not based on elevation of fleshly conditions. We really cannot mix ungodly beliefs and behaviors or mainstream philosophies that contradict God's word.

We cannot change god's word either to fit us no matter how comfortable we are with LGBTQ and how long it has been around. The results of all these actions will lead to bondage, invasion of a foreign country, loss of sovereignity, loss of our nation, and all other covenant curses being given to us.

these pagan practices are all related to idol worship and will have to be done away with in order to build Zion and receive the savior. There were Old Testament kings that refused to get rid of the idols and this type of LGBTQ worship which belongs with idolatry.

Joshua, the judges, Saul, David, Solomon, Jeroboam, Asa, Jehosaphat, Ahaz, Mannasseh all refused to get rid of idolatry and allowed it in the church running parallel or alongside true doctrine. Our prophets are trying to maintain the LGBTQ movement and true doctrine also while running them parallel. Won't work. Never has worked. Never will work.

I have seen this world and especially our government politicians work hard to brainwash and embed these ideas into our society for some time now. Looks like it worked with our leaders.

Most of the citizens of the usa do NOT believe in transgender or LGBTQ or any of the movement. We have been fed a lie that it is important to mainstream and that it is a majority idea. Not so. It still remains a minority movement.

It has been pushed for years by movies and TV and is now being pushed full force by Biden as it was by Obama. But, again majority of USA do NOT agree with it.

So, I guess I am in the majority. While the citizens of america try to get this out of our schools then the church that I love . . .well, . . .you know. This I will attribute to Gerritt Gong and anyone fool who believes his philosophy on this. He is responsible for the gay movement at BYU.

I KNOW that the remnant will be tearing down all of the idols and groves and abortion clinic sacrament temples and high places and cern and dismanteling and burning every other place of satanic worship. I'll be glad to help. When Josia and Hezekiah, the only kings to destroy any sign of temple worship, became successful then they also had to dispose of the priests as well.

There is a verse in Isaiah that claims we will have to take down idolatry the same way these prophets did.

may god have mercy

Lizzy60
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Lizzy60 »

Today LDS Living featured another feel-good article about a mother who is coping with the grief of losing her teenage son to suicide by helping other parents learn how to see the signs and prevent the same fate with their children. Yes, a noble cause. But what the article leaves out is that her son was gay and that’s why he did what he did. She is now very much on the pro-lgbtq train, where helping prevent teen suicide is wrapped up in acceptance and celebration of our youths’ queerness. She has done a lot of interviews and podcasts and is well-known among those who promote gay sealings, trans acceptance, etc.

I think it’s a bit sly and dishonest for LDS Living to only give a partial view of this woman and her journey.

https://www.ldsliving.com/after-losing- ... hy/s/11013

blitzinstripes
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by blitzinstripes »

EvanLM wrote: September 26th, 2022, 4:56 pm I believe that this actually reflects the apostasy of the church. The parading of this is very subtle and persistent. We have compromised his word.

Our leaders and some saints seem to want to approach God on their own ideas and not approach him on the basis of what he required. Getting closer to God is a matter of the heart and of obedience and is not based on elevation of fleshly conditions. We really cannot mix ungodly beliefs and behaviors or mainstream philosophies that contradict God's word.

We cannot change god's word either to fit us no matter how comfortable we are with LGBTQ and how long it has been around. The results of all these actions will lead to bondage, invasion of a foreign country, loss of sovereignity, loss of our nation, and all other covenant curses being given to us.

these pagan practices are all related to idol worship and will have to be done away with in order to build Zion and receive the savior. There were Old Testament kings that refused to get rid of the idols and this type of LGBTQ worship which belongs with idolatry.

Joshua, the judges, Saul, David, Solomon, Jeroboam, Asa, Jehosaphat, Ahaz, Mannasseh all refused to get rid of idolatry and allowed it in the church running parallel or alongside true doctrine. Our prophets are trying to maintain the LGBTQ movement and true doctrine also while running them parallel. Won't work. Never has worked. Never will work.

I have seen this world and especially our government politicians work hard to brainwash and embed these ideas into our society for some time now. Looks like it worked with our leaders.

Most of the citizens of the usa do NOT believe in transgender or LGBTQ or any of the movement. We have been fed a lie that it is important to mainstream and that it is a majority idea. Not so. It still remains a minority movement.

It has been pushed for years by movies and TV and is now being pushed full force by Biden as it was by Obama. But, again majority of USA do NOT agree with it.

So, I guess I am in the majority. While the citizens of america try to get this out of our schools then the church that I love . . .well, . . .you know. This I will attribute to Gerritt Gong and anyone fool who believes his philosophy on this. He is responsible for the gay movement at BYU.

I KNOW that the remnant will be tearing down all of the idols and groves and abortion clinic sacrament temples and high places and cern and dismanteling and burning every other place of satanic worship. I'll be glad to help. When Josia and Hezekiah, the only kings to destroy any sign of temple worship, became successful then they also had to dispose of the priests as well.

There is a verse in Isaiah that claims we will have to take down idolatry the same way these prophets did.

may god have mercy
Wow. You are on a ROLL tonight, Evan. I love it. You speak the truth. I agree with you 100%. There are a portion of us (minority) in the church who have been awakened as the Book of Mormon commanded us to do. We are the truly woke. The ones who know that all is not well in Zion. The ship has veered it's course. It is imperative that we sound the warning. And much like Samuel the Lamanite they will lash out at us. They may cast us out from among them for speaking too much truth. But we must preach repentance, and here in the church is where it has to begin. We cannot evil "good" and call righteousness "evil".

Serragon
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Serragon »

Lizzy60 wrote: September 26th, 2022, 5:27 pm Today LDS Living featured another feel-good article about a mother who is coping with the grief of losing her teenage son to suicide by helping other parents learn how to see the signs and prevent the same fate with their children. Yes, a noble cause. But what the article leaves out is that her son was gay and that’s why he did what he did. She is now very much on the pro-lgbtq train, where helping prevent teen suicide is wrapped up in acceptance and celebration of our youths’ queerness. She has done a lot of interviews and podcasts and is well-known among those who promote gay sealings, trans acceptance, etc.

I think it’s a bit sly and dishonest for LDS Living to only give a partial view of this woman and her journey.

https://www.ldsliving.com/after-losing- ... hy/s/11013
This is how they train the members to accept homosexuality as virtuous. Slowly, bit by bit, small change by small change. The proper propaganda given in the proper doses. The "Propaganda path" instead of the covenant path.

At first, you are just taught to feel empathy for the mistreated and abused homosexual. You are fed stories about how members may have called them names or even committed violence and ostracized them. After many of these stories you begin to feel that this must be very prevalent (even though you have never seen it) and must be a real problem.

Once you have been carefully led to believe that the homosexual is a victim that needs your protection, you are fed stories about how the homosexual feels instead of what people are doing to them. They feel "alone" at church. they feel "sad". Maybe even suicidal. they feel judged and unaccepted. So you are now led to proactively reach out to them and be "loving'. It isn't enough to just not be abusive.

Once you have been thus conditioned, you are then taught they they are born that way and that there is nothing actually wrong with homosexuality itself. In fact, it is the way God made them on purpose. They might be even more valiant than everyone else. You are now led to be a defender and an advocate. And since they are working so hard on the young people through school and social media, it is inevitable that many of you will have your own children "come out". This makes the job of defense and advocacy even more important and it becomes your new faith.

And all the while, you think you are finally understanding God's will. You think you are now enlightened, while the people who still cling that that old belief of homosexuality as a choice and as a sin are the ones who really have the problem. This is true Christianity, where loving your neighbor means that you indulge their perversions and fetishes. Where accepting and going along with people's fantasies is considered love. Where rejoicing that a healthy brother or sister has voluntarily mutilated their genitalia so they can more fully realize their pretend world is considered compassionate and supportive.

And the fact that the Church and its leaders appear to be supportive or at the least indifferent to all of this really cements in your mind the rightness of your changing beliefs. What you would have been excommunicated for years ago can now be celebrated publicly and at church.. Thank goodness God finally got the world to a place where he could reveal his will to the perverts and natural man worshippers so they could let the prophet and the saints know His will on these issues. It might have been easier to reveal it when the Church was young and the Romans and Greeks were openly practicing bisexuality everywhere around the early Christians... but apparently even then those bigots couldn't get the truth through their closed minds...

This kind of thing will continue to get worse, and the church will increasingly become a dangerous pit instead of a haven from this garbage. Many still live in areas where they are relatively unaffected by the homosexual movement, but that won't last long. The propaganda is strong and real. The movement is organized and merciless. And the church is increasingly spineless in the face of real opposition.

Ado
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Ado »

My sister in law lives 2 miles away from me and is in a totally different stake. She is a new YW leader in her ward. She told me about a recent stake YW training meeting she went to where they brought up LGBT and how there are already trans youth in her stake. They said “if it hasn’t happened in your ward yet it will.” They told them that they can’t allow these youth to talk about it at activities or church, but to respect their pronouns and make them feel welcome.
She has a very small ward with only a handful of youth. My ward is massive in comparison and extremely conservative just from what I can tell, and I haven’t noticed anything like that here yet. Then again, I’ve been in Primary for the last several years.

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

I try to speak the truth and it gets me in trouble a lot. well said serragon except that EVERYWHERE is affected. I watched some cartoons over the last two days . . . for kids age 7 and up . . totally sexual and gay and binary . . totally suggestive. The movement is very real with youth and it makes them think they are smarter than adults cuz the adults in their lives won't mention it.

I don't know who you go to church with but there are few people left in the wards that I have attended that can stand correction or wakening. As well, Isaiah says that people will flaunt their sins which I see with most posts on this thread.

I am not attending my real ward right now cuz I said, in SS, that people shouldn't be sleeping in the endowment. Seemed pretty innocuous at the time. But the RS counselor turned to me and attacked and then the SS teacher and she started crying and I sat there stunned. Then the SS teacher said that Peter and the apostles slept when Jesus was transfigured and it went on from there to other stupid comments.

So then RS counselor texted me so I sent a text back quoting the "please be attentive and alert" in the pre instructions of the endowment. Well . . . . . I got back a three page ripping text that was so dark from the RS counselor. I wasn't fazed or surprised even though that is the first time I have had anyone do that to me.

The first chance I got then I took it to the bishop and had him read it. he made it through half of one page and didn't want to read anymore. don't blame him cuz it was kind of dark. anyway, to avoid her I decided to just go to another ward. I have done that in Utah. I have lived in several places in the same 15 mile radius and always go to the one ward that I love no matter where I live.

anyway I can only imagine if I were to mention something doctrinal that requires more than just staying awake.

hahahahahahahahahahhahahah . . still laughing

btw I live in the heart of jackson county and been here a year. These are the people that come here to build Zion. I think we have a problem. hahahahahahahahahhahahah

however not laughing at the seriousness of our refusing to live as the Lord has asked us.

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

adocrawford wrote: September 26th, 2022, 7:38 pm My sister in law lives 2 miles away from me and is in a totally different stake. She is a new YW leader in her ward. She told me about a recent stake YW training meeting she went to where they brought up LGBT and how there are already trans youth in her stake. They said “if it hasn’t happened in your ward yet it will.” They told them that they can’t allow these youth to talk about it at activities or church, but to respect their pronouns and make them feel welcome.
She has a very small ward with only a handful of youth. My ward is massive in comparison and extremely conservative just from what I can tell, and I haven’t noticed anything like that here yet. Then again, I’ve been in Primary for the last several years.
yea, five years ago my sister's stake in Syracuse had several trans.

At the same timeframe, a transgender male who everyone knew but me in the ward showed up to RS. Our stake had not planned ahead even though I warned them. the stake pres came and dragged Roger out of RS. don't live there any more so don't know if roger is still attending RS and I was told the story cuz I was sneaking off to another ward and stake.

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

they have been given permission at BYU to be open so I guess that would include sunday activities, too, right?

Isaiah . . they will flaunt their sins

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Subcomandante
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Subcomandante »

It is incredibly sad to see how STUPID the Gentile members are becoming north of the border.

Our leaders are more direct down here. That's to be expected in a rural area where the people realize that you can't put two roosters or two hens together and expect them to lay eggs. They are very well aware of all the crap that's being done north of the border, as well as the need of themselves (as well as the other Latin American leaders) to step up where the Gentile leadership are not doing.

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HVDC
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by HVDC »

Subcomandante wrote: September 26th, 2022, 8:44 pm It is incredibly sad to see how STUPID the Gentile members are becoming north of the border.

Our leaders are more direct down here. That's to be expected in a rural area where the people realize that you can't put two roosters or two hens together and expect them to lay eggs. They are very well aware of all the crap that's being done north of the border, as well as the need of themselves (as well as the other Latin American leaders) to step up where the Gentile leadership are not doing.
Silly Wabbit.

With the exception of the Jews among them.

Mexicans are Gentiles too.

A mix of European, Asian and Negro genes does not make a remnant of Jacob.

The Mexicans up here are just as deeply stuck in the mire as many of the misidentified "Gentiles".

This three ring circus won't last much longer.

But it is fun to watch.

On both sides of the border.

Sir H

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

HVDC is speaking the truth . . There are plenty of righteous and faithful saints here, and leaders here, as well, and I know some of them. They will be building Zion in the north end as you call it, while you are still under bondage in the south side.

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Subcomandante
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Subcomandante »

HVDC wrote: September 27th, 2022, 2:32 am
Subcomandante wrote: September 26th, 2022, 8:44 pm It is incredibly sad to see how STUPID the Gentile members are becoming north of the border.

Our leaders are more direct down here. That's to be expected in a rural area where the people realize that you can't put two roosters or two hens together and expect them to lay eggs. They are very well aware of all the crap that's being done north of the border, as well as the need of themselves (as well as the other Latin American leaders) to step up where the Gentile leadership are not doing.
Silly Wabbit.

With the exception of the Jews among them.

Mexicans are Gentiles too.

A mix of European, Asian and Negro genes does not make a remnant of Jacob.

The Mexicans up here are just as deeply stuck in the mire as many of the misidentified "Gentiles".

This three ring circus won't last much longer.

But it is fun to watch.

On both sides of the border.

Sir H
There is a lot of Lamanite blood amongst the Mexicans, as well as the other nations to the south of Mexico ending down in Chile and Argentina. Some of it can also be found amongst the Native Americans and First Nations tribes as well.

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

well when the american USA indian has begun Zion and sends out all of us gatherers, then we will come get y'all

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

thanks for the addresses . . . will make a note

EvanLM
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by EvanLM »

woops correction . . . some are among american natives?

ALL of american natives are lamanites or have their blood as you call it

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Shawn Henry »

Allison wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 1:54 pm Oops, sorry. My bad. 😉
So, Allison, if you want to avoid saying the wrong thing, just watch the Stew Peters show everyday like I do. He's actually very good at keeping people abreast of all the LGBT terms, you'll learn new ones for sure.

I mean, sure, when he said "fudgepacker", I already knew that one, but when he said these "rump rangers" who ride the "hershey highway", I must confess, I learned two new ones that day.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Shawn Henry »

Does anyone feel that the Savior's waring to the Laodicean Christians to pick a side before they get spewed out might be very applicable to our current situation? May we all stand with the word of God!

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Silver Pie
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Re: Is Anyone Openly Gay at Church?

Post by Silver Pie »

Niemand wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 6:26 pm There are a number of people who have regretted their choice but they can't go back to where they were.
Scott Nugent. She's now very vocal about how big of a mistake it is, in spite of serious harassment.

The road to medical transition had plenty of warning signs. Each time the doubt arose, I reached out to professionals to help me figure out what would be best for my life. As I look back, I realize their influence over my journey, and I recognize the power these two therapists not just held but still hold over my life because medical transition? It's not reversible; the decision to transition medically cannot be undone.

When I think of these conversations now, my blood boils because I recognize that if these conversations went differently? I might have made the right decision, the decision not to medically transition. I realize now that not transitioning was the right choice, yet I live the wrong decision. The bad decision and the responsibility of these therapists? It feels criminal like they need to be held accountable for what they pushed. I realize that will never happen. But what I can do? I can walk you through how to make a different decision if you are in the quandary I was.

I listen with an open heart, piercing tongue, and take my words and SCREAM Louder with all my love.

Scott
https://www.trevoices.org/post/this-tim ... -med-trans


This video is over an hour long. I haven't watched it, so I don't know if it is worth it, but I did watch the What is a Woman? documentary. She's in it. Very plain about the issues and operations gone wrong in that interview.

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