Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

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Reluctant Watchman
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Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

I found it to be quite ironic that the upcoming Come, Follow Me lesson schedule does not cover Jeremiah 23. If you haven’t read it in a while I’d highly recommend it. And sure, they don’t cover every chapter in the OT, but what a chapter to skip given what is going on in the church.

For those of you who don’t want to crack open your scriptures:
1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord.
2 Therefore thus saith the Lord God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord.
3 And I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase.
4 And I will set up shepherds over them which shall feed them: and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall they be lacking, saith the Lord.
5 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, The Lord Our Righteousness.
7 Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that they shall no more say, The Lord liveth, which brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt;
8 But, The Lord liveth, which brought up and which led the seed of the house of Israel out of the north country, and from all countries whither I had driven them; and they shall dwell in their own land.
9 Mine heart within me is broken because of the prophets; all my bones shake; I am like a drunken man, and like a man whom wine hath overcome, because of the Lord, and because of the words of his holiness.
10 For the land is full of adulterers; for because of swearing the land mourneth; the pleasant places of the wilderness are dried up, and their course is evil, and their force is not right.
11 For both prophet and priest are profane; yea, in my house have I found their wickedness, saith the Lord.
12 Wherefore their way shall be unto them as slippery ways in the darkness: they shall be driven on, and fall therein: for I will bring evil upon them, even the year of their visitation, saith the Lord.
13 And I have seen folly in the prophets of Samaria; they prophesied in Baal, and caused my people Israel to err.
14 I have seen also in the prophets of Jerusalem an horrible thing: they commit adultery, and walk in lies: they strengthen also the hands of evildoers, that none doth return from his wickedness: they are all of them unto me as Sodom, and the inhabitants thereof as Gomorrah.
15 Therefore thus saith the Lord of hosts concerning the prophets; Behold, I will feed them with wormwood, and make them drink the water of gall: for from the prophets of Jerusalem is profaneness gone forth into all the land.
16 Thus saith the Lord of hosts, Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of the Lord.
17 They say still unto them that despise me, The Lord hath said, Ye shall have peace; and they say unto every one that walketh after the imagination of his own heart, No evil shall come upon you.
18 For who hath stood in the counsel of the Lord, and hath perceived and heard his word? who hath marked his word, and heard it?
19 Behold, a whirlwind of the Lord is gone forth in fury, even a grievous whirlwind: it shall fall grievously upon the head of the wicked.
20 The anger of the Lord shall not return, until he have executed, and till he have performed the thoughts of his heart: in the latter days ye shall consider it perfectly.
21 I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran: I have not spoken to them, yet they prophesied.

22 But if they had stood in my counsel, and had caused my people to hear my words, then they should have turned them from their evil way, and from the evil of their doings.
23 Am I a God at hand, saith the Lord, and not a God afar off?
24 Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the Lord. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the Lord.
25 I have heard what the prophets said, that prophesy lies in my name, saying, I have dreamed, I have dreamed.
26 How long shall this be in the heart of the prophets that prophesy lies? yea, they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart;

27 Which think to cause my people to forget my name by their dreams which they tell every man to his neighbour, as their fathers have forgotten my name for Baal.
28 The prophet that hath a dream, let him tell a dream; and he that hath my word, let him speak my word faithfully. What is the chaff to the wheat? saith the Lord.

29 Is not my word like as a fire? saith the Lord; and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces?
30 Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord, that steal my words every one from his neighbour.
31 Behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord, that use their tongues, and say, He saith.
32 Behold, I am against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the Lord, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the Lord.
33 And when this people, or the prophet, or a priest, shall ask thee, saying, What is the burden of the Lord? thou shalt then say unto them, What burden? I will even forsake you, saith the Lord.
34 And as for the prophet, and the priest, and the people, that shall say, The burden of the Lord, I will even punish that man and his house.
35 Thus shall ye say every one to his neighbour, and every one to his brother, What hath the Lord answered? and, What hath the Lord spoken?
36 And the burden of the Lord shall ye mention no more: for every man’s word shall be his burden; for ye have perverted the words of the living God, of the Lord of hosts our God.
37 Thus shalt thou say to the prophet, What hath the Lord answered thee? and, What hath the Lord spoken?
38 But since ye say, The burden of the Lord; therefore thus saith the Lord; Because ye say this word, The burden of the Lord, and I have sent unto you, saying, Ye shall not say, The burden of the Lord;
39 Therefore, behold, I, even I, will utterly forget you, and I will forsake you, and the city that I gave you and your fathers, and cast you out of my presence:
40 And I will bring an everlasting reproach upon you, and a perpetual shame, which shall not be forgotten.
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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

Is anybody teaching the Isaiah 56 lesson that’s coming up? That would be a fun one.

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Chip
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Chip »

This proves that the church is true and it's not built up to get gain or anything.

There are parts of the scriptures we can safely ignore from now on because they don't apply, anymore.

We. Are. Awesome. We follow men. The BEST men.

To Kolob and BEYOND!!!!!

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BigT
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by BigT »

Come Follow Me = gospel light

Refraction75
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Refraction75 »

I remember a talk in general conference years ago about not picking and choosing cafeteria style which gospel principles we should live or not live....

The point of the talk was to live the whole gospel of Jesus Christ.

Now if we could just apply this to our scripture lessons....

briznian
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by briznian »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 21st, 2022, 8:13 pm Is anybody teaching the Isaiah 56 lesson that’s coming up? That would be a fun one.
No, it conveniently fell on General Conference weekend, so everyone will be focused elsewhere.

Momma J
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Momma J »

Refraction75 wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 2:35 am I remember a talk in general conference years ago about not picking and choosing cafeteria style which gospel principles we should live or not live....

The point of the talk was to live the whole gospel of Jesus Christ.

Now if we could just apply this to our scripture lessons....
I agree. I am curious as to how others chose which scriptures to study at any given time. I have read the scriptures from cover to cover. I have also studied, based on years of church lessons. And yet, my favorite way of studying is when I am having moments of uncertainty and seek out a particular topic and delve in.... often studying in tangents that are not in line with my original search. Very fulfilling for some reason. It is like finding treasures while searching for shells on the beach.

As to the original topic... Thank you for putting that scripture up!

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InfoWarrior82
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by InfoWarrior82 »

briznian wrote: September 22nd, 2022, 1:04 pm
Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 21st, 2022, 8:13 pm Is anybody teaching the Isaiah 56 lesson that’s coming up? That would be a fun one.
No, it conveniently fell on General Conference weekend, so everyone will be focused elsewhere.
Everyone will be busy lapping up all the vomit.

(Isaiah reference for all of you who were disgusted by my comment).

abijah
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by abijah »

come follow me gets way overpraised. basically common core scripture aide. we could/should have so much better.

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Alexander
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Alexander »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 21st, 2022, 8:01 pm I found it to be quite ironic that the upcoming Come, Follow Me lesson schedule does not cover Jeremiah 23. If you haven’t read it in a while I’d highly recommend it. And sure, they don’t cover every chapter in the OT, but what a chapter to skip given what is going on in the church.

For those of you who don’t want to crack open your scriptures:
1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the Lord.
2 Therefore thus saith the Lord God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the Lord.
3 And I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase.
4 And I will set up shepherds over them which shall feed them: and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall they be lacking, saith the Lord.
5 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.
6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, The Lord Our Righteousness.
7 Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that they shall no more say, The Lord liveth, which brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt;
8 But, The Lord liveth, which brought up and which led the seed of the house of Israel out of the north country, and from all countries whither I had driven them; and they shall dwell in their own land.
9 Mine heart within me is broken because of the prophets; all my bones shake; I am like a drunken man, and like a man whom wine hath overcome, because of the Lord, and because of the words of his holiness.
10 For the land is full of adulterers; for because of swearing the land mourneth; the pleasant places of the wilderness are dried up, and their course is evil, and their force is not right.
11 For both prophet and priest are profane; yea, in my house have I found their wickedness, saith the Lord.
12 Wherefore their way shall be unto them as slippery ways in the darkness: they shall be driven on, and fall therein: for I will bring evil upon them, even the year of their visitation, saith the Lord.
13 And I have seen folly in the prophets of Samaria; they prophesied in Baal, and caused my people Israel to err.
14 I have seen also in the prophets of Jerusalem an horrible thing: they commit adultery, and walk in lies: they strengthen also the hands of evildoers, that none doth return from his wickedness: they are all of them unto me as Sodom, and the inhabitants thereof as Gomorrah.
15 Therefore thus saith the Lord of hosts concerning the prophets; Behold, I will feed them with wormwood, and make them drink the water of gall: for from the prophets of Jerusalem is profaneness gone forth into all the land.
16 Thus saith the Lord of hosts, Hearken not unto the words of the prophets that prophesy unto you: they make you vain: they speak a vision of their own heart, and not out of the mouth of the Lord.
17 They say still unto them that despise me, The Lord hath said, Ye shall have peace; and they say unto every one that walketh after the imagination of his own heart, No evil shall come upon you.
18 For who hath stood in the counsel of the Lord, and hath perceived and heard his word? who hath marked his word, and heard it?
19 Behold, a whirlwind of the Lord is gone forth in fury, even a grievous whirlwind: it shall fall grievously upon the head of the wicked.
20 The anger of the Lord shall not return, until he have executed, and till he have performed the thoughts of his heart: in the latter days ye shall consider it perfectly.
21 I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran: I have not spoken to them, yet they prophesied.

22 But if they had stood in my counsel, and had caused my people to hear my words, then they should have turned them from their evil way, and from the evil of their doings.
23 Am I a God at hand, saith the Lord, and not a God afar off?
24 Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the Lord. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the Lord.
25 I have heard what the prophets said, that prophesy lies in my name, saying, I have dreamed, I have dreamed.
26 How long shall this be in the heart of the prophets that prophesy lies? yea, they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart;

27 Which think to cause my people to forget my name by their dreams which they tell every man to his neighbour, as their fathers have forgotten my name for Baal.
28 The prophet that hath a dream, let him tell a dream; and he that hath my word, let him speak my word faithfully. What is the chaff to the wheat? saith the Lord.

29 Is not my word like as a fire? saith the Lord; and like a hammer that breaketh the rock in pieces?
30 Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord, that steal my words every one from his neighbour.
31 Behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord, that use their tongues, and say, He saith.
32 Behold, I am against them that prophesy false dreams, saith the Lord, and do tell them, and cause my people to err by their lies, and by their lightness; yet I sent them not, nor commanded them: therefore they shall not profit this people at all, saith the Lord.
33 And when this people, or the prophet, or a priest, shall ask thee, saying, What is the burden of the Lord? thou shalt then say unto them, What burden? I will even forsake you, saith the Lord.
34 And as for the prophet, and the priest, and the people, that shall say, The burden of the Lord, I will even punish that man and his house.
35 Thus shall ye say every one to his neighbour, and every one to his brother, What hath the Lord answered? and, What hath the Lord spoken?
36 And the burden of the Lord shall ye mention no more: for every man’s word shall be his burden; for ye have perverted the words of the living God, of the Lord of hosts our God.
37 Thus shalt thou say to the prophet, What hath the Lord answered thee? and, What hath the Lord spoken?
38 But since ye say, The burden of the Lord; therefore thus saith the Lord; Because ye say this word, The burden of the Lord, and I have sent unto you, saying, Ye shall not say, The burden of the Lord;
39 Therefore, behold, I, even I, will utterly forget you, and I will forsake you, and the city that I gave you and your fathers, and cast you out of my presence:
40 And I will bring an everlasting reproach upon you, and a perpetual shame, which shall not be forgotten.
Jeremiah 6
10 To whom shall I speak, and give warning, that they may hear? behold, their ear is uncircumcised, and they cannot hearken: behold, the word of the Lord is unto them a reproach; they have no delight in it.

Jeremiah 8
8 How do ye say, We are wise, and the law of the Lord is with us? Lo, certainly in vain made he it; the pen of the scribes is in vain.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Shawn Henry »

They probably omitted it because conference time is a really bad time to bring up verse 30: "Therefore, behold, I am against the prophets, saith the Lord, that steal my words every one from his neighbour."

Not a good time to highlight that the Lord is against regurgitated talks that are pawned off as the word of God.

"I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran: I have not spoken to them, yet they prophesied."

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Shawn Henry »

The raising up of a Davidic servant is also highlighted in this chapter and that is always a tough navigation for the church. How do you explain that the current leadership will soon yield to the Davidic servant, which leads to more talk of setting the house in order and we can't highlight that either.

There are also verses 7 and 8. "Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that they shall no more say, The Lord liveth, which brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt; But, The Lord liveth, which brought up and which led the seed of the house of Israel out of the north country, and from all countries whither I had driven them; and they shall dwell in their own land."

How do you talk about exodus miracles that will dwarf the splitting of the Red Sea when your current doctrine is one that says having enough faith means you don't get healed?

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Shawn Henry »

Maybe this is why the chapter was axed.

"from the prophets of Jerusalem is profaneness gone forth into all the land."

We can't have anyone figuring out that prophets can and do lead astray.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Shawn Henry »

Here's another smoking gun.

"Thus shalt thou say to the prophet, What hath the Lord answered thee? and, What hath the Lord spoken?"

Here the Lord specifically tells us to ask our prophets for the revelations they are given. That's a problem now isn't it?

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Chip
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Chip »

Shawn Henry wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 1:44 pm Here's another smoking gun.

"Thus shalt thou say to the prophet, What hath the Lord answered thee? and, What hath the Lord spoken?"

Here the Lord specifically tells us to ask our prophets for the revelations they are given. That's a problem now isn't it?
Maybe someone can ask them that on the next Face-to-Face production.

Or, I suppose the proper way would be to ask our stake presidents to ask them. Or, we could write them a letter, but such a direct approach might be frowned upon.

Seriously, though, to accept that these guys are prophets is to accept that God must be a jerk.

We should disabuse ourselves of such falsity.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

Chip wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 1:48 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 1:44 pm Here's another smoking gun.

"Thus shalt thou say to the prophet, What hath the Lord answered thee? and, What hath the Lord spoken?"

Here the Lord specifically tells us to ask our prophets for the revelations they are given. That's a problem now isn't it?
Maybe someone can ask them that on the next Face-to-Face production.

Or, I suppose the proper way would be to ask our stake presidents to ask them. Or, we could write them a letter, but such a direct approach might be frowned upon.

Seriously, though, to accept that these guys are prophets is to accept that God must be a jerk.

We should disabuse ourselves of such falsity.
Every single question on the F2F events is pre-scripted. These men have rehearsed all of the answers. A woman who worked for the church as a writer saw all of this behind the scenes. She even wrote E. Gong's temple dedicatory prayer for one of the temples.

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Chip
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Chip »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 2:24 pm
Chip wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 1:48 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 1:44 pm Here's another smoking gun.

"Thus shalt thou say to the prophet, What hath the Lord answered thee? and, What hath the Lord spoken?"

Here the Lord specifically tells us to ask our prophets for the revelations they are given. That's a problem now isn't it?
Maybe someone can ask them that on the next Face-to-Face production.

Or, I suppose the proper way would be to ask our stake presidents to ask them. Or, we could write them a letter, but such a direct approach might be frowned upon.

Seriously, though, to accept that these guys are prophets is to accept that God must be a jerk.

We should disabuse ourselves of such falsity.
Every single question on the F2F events is pre-scripted. These men have rehearsed all of the answers. A woman who worked for the church as a writer saw all of this behind the scenes. She even wrote E. Gong's temple dedicatory prayer for one of the temples.

She must be the Jen Psaki of the Q15. Peppermint Patty.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

Chip wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 2:39 pm
She must be the Jen Psaki of the Q15. Peppermint Patty.
She was actually a very intelligent woman that eventually saw the corruption in the church and left. She felt the church hired her because her family history was that of inactivity and then rejoining the church, and she wrote in such a way that connected with members.

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Shawn Henry
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Shawn Henry »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 2:24 pm Every single question on the F2F events is pre-scripted. These men have rehearsed all of the answers. A woman who worked for the church as a writer saw all of this behind the scenes. She even wrote E. Gong's temple dedicatory prayer for one of the temples.
I imagine there used to be newly called apostles who really thought they were apostles. They went forth with diligence trying to be chosen as well as called, only to find out later that the Lord wasn't speaking to any of them. Now, they are so well vetted and groomed to be a loyal corporate man that they come in already knowing that they are just a front to placate the members. Elder Gong probably wasn't one bit surprised that someone would be writing his dedicatory prayer for him.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

Shawn Henry wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 2:49 pm
Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 2:24 pm Every single question on the F2F events is pre-scripted. These men have rehearsed all of the answers. A woman who worked for the church as a writer saw all of this behind the scenes. She even wrote E. Gong's temple dedicatory prayer for one of the temples.
I imagine there used to be newly called apostles who really thought they were apostles. They went forth with diligence trying to be chosen as well as called, only to find out later that the Lord wasn't speaking to any of them. Now, they are so well vetted and groomed to be a loyal corporate man that they come in already knowing that they are just a front to placate the members. Elder Gong probably wasn't one bit surprised that someone would be writing his dedicatory prayer for him.
There are several leaked videos of the Q15 being presented with data on social issues. One of these presenters was Gong. It was his job to gather research and present it to the brethren. This is where his close association w/ the brethren most likely began before he was called to the Q15.

These videos are quite revealing btw. That's when I realized that I knew far more about certain societal issues than these men. And that they are being fed information and probably don't do a lot of their own research.

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Chip
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Chip »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 3:05 pm
Shawn Henry wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 2:49 pm
Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 2:24 pm Every single question on the F2F events is pre-scripted. These men have rehearsed all of the answers. A woman who worked for the church as a writer saw all of this behind the scenes. She even wrote E. Gong's temple dedicatory prayer for one of the temples.
I imagine there used to be newly called apostles who really thought they were apostles. They went forth with diligence trying to be chosen as well as called, only to find out later that the Lord wasn't speaking to any of them. Now, they are so well vetted and groomed to be a loyal corporate man that they come in already knowing that they are just a front to placate the members. Elder Gong probably wasn't one bit surprised that someone would be writing his dedicatory prayer for him.
There are several leaked videos of the Q15 being presented with data on social issues. One of these presenters was Gong. It was his job to gather research and present it to the brethren. This is where is close association w/ the brethren most likely began before he was called to the Q15.

These videos are quite revealing btw. That's when I realized that I knew far more about certain societal issues than these men. And that they are being fed information and probably don't do a lot of their own research.
Maybe they had ventured onto the interwebs, in the past, and found Alex Jones, but didn't feel the Spirit, so they asked Gong to distill for them what trusted sources like CNN and MSNBC were saying. That way, they could know what was going on in the world.

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Reluctant Watchman
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by Reluctant Watchman »

BTW, here's the Mormon Leaks YT channel w/ those videos of E. Gong: https://www.youtube.com/results?sp=mAEB ... leaks+gong

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BuriedTartaria
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by BuriedTartaria »

Reluctant Watchman wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 3:05 pm There are several leaked videos of the Q15 being presented with data on social issues.
I wonder where the leak in the organization is. I feel the hole that allowed the leak is probably getting larger in size with other openings in different areas forming

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LDS Physician
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Re: Jeremiah 23 left out of CFM for 2022

Post by LDS Physician »

Shawn Henry wrote: September 23rd, 2022, 1:29 pm The raising up of a Davidic servant is also highlighted in this chapter and that is always a tough navigation for the church. How do you explain that the current leadership will soon yield to the Davidic servant, which leads to more talk of setting the house in order and we can't highlight that either.

There are also verses 7 and 8. "Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that they shall no more say, The Lord liveth, which brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt; But, The Lord liveth, which brought up and which led the seed of the house of Israel out of the north country, and from all countries whither I had driven them; and they shall dwell in their own land."

How do you talk about exodus miracles that will dwarf the splitting of the Red Sea when your current doctrine is one that says having enough faith means you don't get healed?
Oh Brother Henry, this is the Old Testament. It's not referring to Our Day. We have the Fullness of the Gospel! We are led by prophets who Cannot Lead Us Astray! We are on The Covenant Path!

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