What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

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ransomme
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Re: What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

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The Mt of Transfiguration was not the Mt of translation.

Peter et al. had not been fully tried and proven yet. Also whom and when people obtain that fullness of according to God's will.

I believe in the last days that their will many who are granted that power unto a renewing of their bodies, given power over the elements, etc. The 144k will be such. And the will be sent out to collect certain faithful from around the world and bring them to Zion and the Church of the Firstborn.

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Pazooka
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Re: What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

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ransomme wrote: September 15th, 2022, 12:10 am The Mt of Transfiguration was not the Mt of translation.

Peter et al. had not been fully tried and proven yet. Also whom and when people obtain that fullness of according to God's will.

I believe in the last days that their will many who are granted that power unto a renewing of their bodies, given power over the elements, etc. The 144k will be such. And the will be sent out to collect certain faithful from around the world and bring them to Zion and the Church of the Firstborn.
THE APOCALYPSE OF PETER

15 And my Lord Jesus Christ, our King, said to me, “Let us go to the holy mountain.” And his disciples went with him, praying.
And behold there were two men there,
and we could not look upon their faces,
for a light came from them, shining more than the sun and their raiment also was shining and cannot be described and nothing is sufficient to be compared to them in this world. And the sweetness of them . . . that no mouth is able to utter the beauty of their appearance, for their aspect was astonishing and wonderful. And the other, great, I say, shines in his aspect above crystal. Like the flower of roses is the appearance of the color of his aspect and of his body . . . his head. And upon his shoulders . . . and on their fore­ heads was a crown of nard woven from fair flowers. As the rainbow in the water, so was their hair. And such was the come­ liness of their countenance, adorned with all manner of ornament.

16 And when we suddenly saw them, we marvelled. And I drew near to God, Jesus Christ, and said to him, “O my Lord, who are these?” And he said to me, “They are Moses and Elijah.” And I said to him, “Where then are Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and the rest of the righteous fathers?” And he showed us a great garden, open, full of fair trees and blessed fruits and of the odor of perfumes. The fragrance was pleasant and reached us. And of that tree...Isawmanyfruits.AndmyLordand God Jesus Christ said to me, “Have you
seen the companies of the fathers?”
“As is their rest, such also is the honor and the glory of those who are persecuted for my righteousness’ sake.” And I re­ joiced and believed and understood that which is written in the book of my Lord Jesus Christ.

And I said to him, “O my Lord, do you wish that I make here three tabernacles, one for you, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah?”

And he said to me in wrath, “Satan makes war against you, and has veiled your understanding; and the good things of this world prevail against you. Your eyes therefore must be opened and your ears unstopped that you may see a tabernacle, not made with hu­man hands, which my heavenly Father has made for me and for the elect.” And we beheld it and were full of gladness.
17 And behold, suddenly there came a voice from heaven, say­ ing, “This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased:5 [he has kept] my com­ mandments.” And then came a great and exceedingly white cloud over our heads and bore away our Lord and Moses and Elijah. And I trembled and was afraid; and we looked up, and the heaven opened and we beheld men in the flesh and they came and greeted our Lord and Moses
and Elijah and went to another heaven. And the word of the scripture was ful­ filled: “This is the generation that seeks him and seeks the face of the God of Jacob.” And great fear and commotion took place in heaven, and the angels pressed one upon another that the word of the scripture might be fulfilled which says, “Open the gates, you princes.”
Thereafter was the heaven shut, that had been open.
And we prayed and went down from the mountain, glorifying God, who has written the names of the righteous in heaven in the book of life.


I believe this is where Peter has his calling and election made sure, which JS makes such a big deal about in his 2 Peter sermon.
…”partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world”… “his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue”…

Are these usages of divine, incorruption, glory - are they just words or do they mean something in the lines of having been raised from a telestial to an Edenic state? And does Peter’s life bear that out? Did his mere shadow heal people, for example. All very interesting to me. I’m definitely giving it consideration.

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Pazooka
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Re: What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

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Another apocryphal account attributes to Peter the power to cause an earthquake and turn a city upside down. Yet another tells of a contest between himself and a magician named Simon. Simon is said to have demonstrated the power of his god by flying in the air and then Peter commands him to fall and break his leg in three places.

How much do we really know about Peter during the latter end of his ministry? How much can we really know about his death? The apostate church used accounts of Peter and manipulated them in order to forge a line of succession between him and their leadership. His death might have been seen as necessary to that succession. Perhaps he didn’t really die but simply went to his rest with the people of Enoch and Melchizedek.
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ransomme
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Re: What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

Post by ransomme »

Pazooka wrote: September 17th, 2022, 10:53 am
ransomme wrote: September 15th, 2022, 12:10 am The Mt of Transfiguration was not the Mt of translation.

Peter et al. had not been fully tried and proven yet. Also whom and when people obtain that fullness of according to God's will.

I believe in the last days that their will many who are granted that power unto a renewing of their bodies, given power over the elements, etc. The 144k will be such. And the will be sent out to collect certain faithful from around the world and bring them to Zion and the Church of the Firstborn.
THE APOCALYPSE OF PETER

15 And my Lord Jesus Christ, our King, said to me, “Let us go to the holy mountain.” And his disciples went with him, praying.
And behold there were two men there,
and we could not look upon their faces,
for a light came from them, shining more than the sun and their raiment also was shining and cannot be described and nothing is sufficient to be compared to them in this world. And the sweetness of them . . . that no mouth is able to utter the beauty of their appearance, for their aspect was astonishing and wonderful. And the other, great, I say, shines in his aspect above crystal. Like the flower of roses is the appearance of the color of his aspect and of his body . . . his head. And upon his shoulders . . . and on their fore­ heads was a crown of nard woven from fair flowers. As the rainbow in the water, so was their hair. And such was the come­ liness of their countenance, adorned with all manner of ornament.

16 And when we suddenly saw them, we marvelled. And I drew near to God, Jesus Christ, and said to him, “O my Lord, who are these?” And he said to me, “They are Moses and Elijah.” And I said to him, “Where then are Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and the rest of the righteous fathers?” And he showed us a great garden, open, full of fair trees and blessed fruits and of the odor of perfumes. The fragrance was pleasant and reached us. And of that tree...Isawmanyfruits.AndmyLordand God Jesus Christ said to me, “Have you
seen the companies of the fathers?”
“As is their rest, such also is the honor and the glory of those who are persecuted for my righteousness’ sake.” And I re­ joiced and believed and understood that which is written in the book of my Lord Jesus Christ.

And I said to him, “O my Lord, do you wish that I make here three tabernacles, one for you, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah?”

And he said to me in wrath, “Satan makes war against you, and has veiled your understanding; and the good things of this world prevail against you. Your eyes therefore must be opened and your ears unstopped that you may see a tabernacle, not made with hu­man hands, which my heavenly Father has made for me and for the elect.” And we beheld it and were full of gladness.
17 And behold, suddenly there came a voice from heaven, say­ ing, “This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased:5 [he has kept] my com­ mandments.” And then came a great and exceedingly white cloud over our heads and bore away our Lord and Moses and Elijah. And I trembled and was afraid; and we looked up, and the heaven opened and we beheld men in the flesh and they came and greeted our Lord and Moses
and Elijah and went to another heaven. And the word of the scripture was ful­ filled: “This is the generation that seeks him and seeks the face of the God of Jacob.” And great fear and commotion took place in heaven, and the angels pressed one upon another that the word of the scripture might be fulfilled which says, “Open the gates, you princes.”
Thereafter was the heaven shut, that had been open.
And we prayed and went down from the mountain, glorifying God, who has written the names of the righteous in heaven in the book of life.


I believe this is where Peter has his calling and election made sure, which JS makes such a big deal about in his 2 Peter sermon.
…”partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world”… “his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue”…

Are these usages of divine, incorruption, glory - are they just words or do they mean something in the lines of having been raised from a telestial to an Edenic state? And does Peter’s life bear that out? Did his mere shadow heal people, for example. All very interesting to me. I’m definitely giving it consideration.
Thanks for sharing, that was great.

It's an interesting question, if this was Peter's et al. C&E or more likely receiving a more sure word of prophecy.

I don't think that Peter fully understood yet, and was still tried like when he denied Christ three times before the cock crowed. More so I think that this Transfiguration was a temporary translation, not a permanent one.

I venture to think that Peter's C&E happened between the Resurrection and Pentecost.

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Pazooka
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Posts: 5222
Location: FEMA District 8

Re: What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

Post by Pazooka »

ransomme wrote: September 18th, 2022, 3:41 am
Pazooka wrote: September 17th, 2022, 10:53 am
ransomme wrote: September 15th, 2022, 12:10 am The Mt of Transfiguration was not the Mt of translation.

Peter et al. had not been fully tried and proven yet. Also whom and when people obtain that fullness of according to God's will.

I believe in the last days that their will many who are granted that power unto a renewing of their bodies, given power over the elements, etc. The 144k will be such. And the will be sent out to collect certain faithful from around the world and bring them to Zion and the Church of the Firstborn.
THE APOCALYPSE OF PETER

15 And my Lord Jesus Christ, our King, said to me, “Let us go to the holy mountain.” And his disciples went with him, praying.
And behold there were two men there,
and we could not look upon their faces,
for a light came from them, shining more than the sun and their raiment also was shining and cannot be described and nothing is sufficient to be compared to them in this world. And the sweetness of them . . . that no mouth is able to utter the beauty of their appearance, for their aspect was astonishing and wonderful. And the other, great, I say, shines in his aspect above crystal. Like the flower of roses is the appearance of the color of his aspect and of his body . . . his head. And upon his shoulders . . . and on their fore­ heads was a crown of nard woven from fair flowers. As the rainbow in the water, so was their hair. And such was the come­ liness of their countenance, adorned with all manner of ornament.

16 And when we suddenly saw them, we marvelled. And I drew near to God, Jesus Christ, and said to him, “O my Lord, who are these?” And he said to me, “They are Moses and Elijah.” And I said to him, “Where then are Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and the rest of the righteous fathers?” And he showed us a great garden, open, full of fair trees and blessed fruits and of the odor of perfumes. The fragrance was pleasant and reached us. And of that tree...Isawmanyfruits.AndmyLordand God Jesus Christ said to me, “Have you
seen the companies of the fathers?”
“As is their rest, such also is the honor and the glory of those who are persecuted for my righteousness’ sake.” And I re­ joiced and believed and understood that which is written in the book of my Lord Jesus Christ.

And I said to him, “O my Lord, do you wish that I make here three tabernacles, one for you, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah?”

And he said to me in wrath, “Satan makes war against you, and has veiled your understanding; and the good things of this world prevail against you. Your eyes therefore must be opened and your ears unstopped that you may see a tabernacle, not made with hu­man hands, which my heavenly Father has made for me and for the elect.” And we beheld it and were full of gladness.
17 And behold, suddenly there came a voice from heaven, say­ ing, “This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased:5 [he has kept] my com­ mandments.” And then came a great and exceedingly white cloud over our heads and bore away our Lord and Moses and Elijah. And I trembled and was afraid; and we looked up, and the heaven opened and we beheld men in the flesh and they came and greeted our Lord and Moses
and Elijah and went to another heaven. And the word of the scripture was ful­ filled: “This is the generation that seeks him and seeks the face of the God of Jacob.” And great fear and commotion took place in heaven, and the angels pressed one upon another that the word of the scripture might be fulfilled which says, “Open the gates, you princes.”
Thereafter was the heaven shut, that had been open.
And we prayed and went down from the mountain, glorifying God, who has written the names of the righteous in heaven in the book of life.


I believe this is where Peter has his calling and election made sure, which JS makes such a big deal about in his 2 Peter sermon.
…”partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world”… “his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue”…

Are these usages of divine, incorruption, glory - are they just words or do they mean something in the lines of having been raised from a telestial to an Edenic state? And does Peter’s life bear that out? Did his mere shadow heal people, for example. All very interesting to me. I’m definitely giving it consideration.
Thanks for sharing, that was great.

It's an interesting question, if this was Peter's et al. C&E or more likely receiving a more sure word of prophecy.

I don't think that Peter fully understood yet, and was still tried like when he denied Christ three times before the cock crowed. More so I think that this Transfiguration was a temporary translation, not a permanent one.

I venture to think that Peter's C&E happened between the Resurrection and Pentecost.
For me the Mount peeks my interest not only because just days earlier Jesus had promised Peter the sealing power and power over the gates of hell but because of what is said in D&C 63. It talks about the Millennial day when the earth is “transfigured”. We know that it will be in a terrestrial condition. That indicates that the earth will be translated. And it links this “pattern” of translation to what happened on the Mount and quite possibly to Peter James and John

20 Nevertheless, he that endureth in faith and doeth my will, the same shall overcome, and shall receive an inheritance upon the earth when the day of transfiguration shall come;
21 When the earth shall be transfigured, even according to the pattern which was shown unto mine apostles upon the mount; of which account the fulness ye have not yet received.

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Pazooka
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Posts: 5222
Location: FEMA District 8

Re: What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

Post by Pazooka »

ransomme wrote: September 18th, 2022, 3:41 am
Pazooka wrote: September 17th, 2022, 10:53 am
ransomme wrote: September 15th, 2022, 12:10 am The Mt of Transfiguration was not the Mt of translation.

Peter et al. had not been fully tried and proven yet. Also whom and when people obtain that fullness of according to God's will.

I believe in the last days that their will many who are granted that power unto a renewing of their bodies, given power over the elements, etc. The 144k will be such. And the will be sent out to collect certain faithful from around the world and bring them to Zion and the Church of the Firstborn.
THE APOCALYPSE OF PETER

15 And my Lord Jesus Christ, our King, said to me, “Let us go to the holy mountain.” And his disciples went with him, praying.
And behold there were two men there,
and we could not look upon their faces,
for a light came from them, shining more than the sun and their raiment also was shining and cannot be described and nothing is sufficient to be compared to them in this world. And the sweetness of them . . . that no mouth is able to utter the beauty of their appearance, for their aspect was astonishing and wonderful. And the other, great, I say, shines in his aspect above crystal. Like the flower of roses is the appearance of the color of his aspect and of his body . . . his head. And upon his shoulders . . . and on their fore­ heads was a crown of nard woven from fair flowers. As the rainbow in the water, so was their hair. And such was the come­ liness of their countenance, adorned with all manner of ornament.

16 And when we suddenly saw them, we marvelled. And I drew near to God, Jesus Christ, and said to him, “O my Lord, who are these?” And he said to me, “They are Moses and Elijah.” And I said to him, “Where then are Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and the rest of the righteous fathers?” And he showed us a great garden, open, full of fair trees and blessed fruits and of the odor of perfumes. The fragrance was pleasant and reached us. And of that tree...Isawmanyfruits.AndmyLordand God Jesus Christ said to me, “Have you
seen the companies of the fathers?”
“As is their rest, such also is the honor and the glory of those who are persecuted for my righteousness’ sake.” And I re­ joiced and believed and understood that which is written in the book of my Lord Jesus Christ.

And I said to him, “O my Lord, do you wish that I make here three tabernacles, one for you, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah?”

And he said to me in wrath, “Satan makes war against you, and has veiled your understanding; and the good things of this world prevail against you. Your eyes therefore must be opened and your ears unstopped that you may see a tabernacle, not made with hu­man hands, which my heavenly Father has made for me and for the elect.” And we beheld it and were full of gladness.
17 And behold, suddenly there came a voice from heaven, say­ ing, “This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased:5 [he has kept] my com­ mandments.” And then came a great and exceedingly white cloud over our heads and bore away our Lord and Moses and Elijah. And I trembled and was afraid; and we looked up, and the heaven opened and we beheld men in the flesh and they came and greeted our Lord and Moses
and Elijah and went to another heaven. And the word of the scripture was ful­ filled: “This is the generation that seeks him and seeks the face of the God of Jacob.” And great fear and commotion took place in heaven, and the angels pressed one upon another that the word of the scripture might be fulfilled which says, “Open the gates, you princes.”
Thereafter was the heaven shut, that had been open.
And we prayed and went down from the mountain, glorifying God, who has written the names of the righteous in heaven in the book of life.


I believe this is where Peter has his calling and election made sure, which JS makes such a big deal about in his 2 Peter sermon.
…”partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world”… “his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue”…

Are these usages of divine, incorruption, glory - are they just words or do they mean something in the lines of having been raised from a telestial to an Edenic state? And does Peter’s life bear that out? Did his mere shadow heal people, for example. All very interesting to me. I’m definitely giving it consideration.
Thanks for sharing, that was great.

It's an interesting question, if this was Peter's et al. C&E or more likely receiving a more sure word of prophecy.

I don't think that Peter fully understood yet, and was still tried like when he denied Christ three times before the cock crowed. More so I think that this Transfiguration was a temporary translation, not a permanent one.

I venture to think that Peter's C&E happened between the Resurrection and Pentecost.
Add to that the saying of Jesus in Matthew 16:28 There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. This is in practically the same breath as promising Peter the power that Elijah was given.

Who are “some”? More than just John, I would assume.

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Pazooka
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Re: What the story of Nephi indicates about sealing power

Post by Pazooka »

Holy smokes. The writer of this LDS article seems to have caught on to the fact that prophets who ascend to heaven in their communications with God are changed, physically, forever. This change to their bodies is part and parcel with the sealing power that they possess. What Barker calls “resurrection” is what we would term “translation.”
Another “problem” is that of the resurrection. Latter-day Saints view the resurrection as a return of the spirit to the body after mortal death. Barker speaks of “resurrection” as a state of perfection or exal- tation that can occur during mortality (see pp. 111–18). For her, resur- rection is tied up in the concept of the “heavenly ascent,” a doctrine of the First Temple but expunged by the Deuteronomists. Even the dis- cussion of the ascent was forbidden. Elements of the heavenly ascent tradition squeaked through into our Bible—for example, in accounts of Ezekiel, Daniel, Isaiah, Jesus, and John. In Barker’s language, once one had experienced the heavenly ascent and had seen God face-to- face, one was in one sense “resurrected.” In his essay “The Meaning of the Atonement,” Nibley notes that the divide is not great; in fact, it is not really a divide at all. Barker tells us that “the central message of Christianity was the atonement” (p. 20). Nibley explains that it is, among other things, the at-one-ment that takes place at the veil of the temple.48 After one has made the journey of the heavenly ascent and has been taken into the embrace of God at the veil, one gains posses- sion of certain keys. He has the keys of traveling at will up and down the path of the heavenly ascent (see D&C 132:19–20). He has the keys to bind, to seal, and to loose. His eventual exaltation is sealed upon him (D&C 131:5–6). Whereas it is given provisionally in the earthly ordinances, it is sealed upon him by the ordinances of the holy of holies.49 In short, once one has the sealing, he becomes as one who has received the blessings received on the Mount of Transfiguration. His blessings and his authority are, in effect, the same as those of one who has been resurrected in glory.50 Barker says it this way: “Resurrection could mean many things, but in temple tradition it meant ascent to the heavenly throne” (p. 111). Then she argues that “this means that ‘res- urrection’ in this sense was part of what it meant to be the Messiah” (p. 112). This expansion of resurrection beyond Jesus himself into the broader temple context has profound implications for the Latter-day Saint concept of becoming “Saviors on Mount Zion.”51 Many of those parts of Barker’s research that may seem dissonant in the Latter-day Saint context find a snug fit when we become better acquainted with the nowadays-lesser-known facets of Joseph Smith’s restoration.
Very, very exciting.

https://scholarsarchive.byu.edu/cgi/vie ... ontext=msr

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