Democracy sucks!

[Original_Intent]

[EmmaLee]

Yes, it does! And thank heavens our Founders knew this, and worked tirelessly to form a Constitutional Republic.
~~~
Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide.
John Adams

Democracies have been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their death.
James Madison

It has been observed that a pure democracy if it were practicable would be the most perfect government. Experience has proved that no position is more false than this. The ancient democracies in which the people themselves deliberated never possessed one good feature of government. Their very character was tyranny; their figure deformity.
Alexander Hamilton

Between a balanced republic and a democracy, the difference is like that between order and chaos.
John Marshall

The experience of all former ages had shown that of all human governments, democracy was the most unstable, fluctuating and short-lived.
John Quincy Adams

Democracy is four wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Ambrose Bierce

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill

Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people.
Oscar Wilde

Government is best which governs least.
Thomas Paine

The only foundation for . . . a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.
Benjamin Rush

The problem is that democracy is not freedom. Democracy is simply majoritarianism, which is inherently incompatible with real freedom. Our founding fathers clearly understood this.
Ron Paul

[Cruiserdude]

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[OPMissionary]

Yes, it does! And thank heavens our Founders knew this, and worked tirelessly to form a Constitutional Republic.
~~~
Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide.
John Adams

Democracies have been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their death.
James Madison

It has been observed that a pure democracy if it were practicable would be the most perfect government. Experience has proved that no position is more false than this. The ancient democracies in which the people themselves deliberated never possessed one good feature of government. Their very character was tyranny; their figure deformity.
Alexander Hamilton

Between a balanced republic and a democracy, the difference is like that between order and chaos.
John Marshall

The experience of all former ages had shown that of all human governments, democracy was the most unstable, fluctuating and short-lived.
John Quincy Adams

Democracy is four wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Ambrose Bierce

The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.
Winston Churchill

Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people.
Oscar Wilde

Government is best which governs least.
Thomas Paine

The only foundation for . . . a republic is to be laid in Religion. Without this there can be no virtue, and without virtue there can be no liberty, and liberty is the object and life of all republican governments.
Benjamin Rush

The problem is that democracy is not freedom. Democracy is simply majoritarianism, which is inherently incompatible with real freedom. Our founding fathers clearly understood this.
Ron Paul

Too bad our leaders and 3-letter agencies completely ignore that distinction and collude with corporations to restrict freedom and tighten their global control.

[abijah`]

Democracy sucks and Equality is immoral:

[Claymore]

The problem with republics is the corruption that comes with it. It always ends up becoming a two class system: the elites vs the people. It devolves into an oligarchy. The Roman republic was terrible. That is why the people cheered Caesar when he crossed the Rubicon. Look at the mess our republic is now in...absolute corruption with no way to hold government responsible. We the people only hold the power to vote in others to represent us and once they are in good luck getting them out. They almost all join the club of the elites vs the people. I think republics are a terrible form of government.

Claymore

[captainfearnot]

Direct democracy is practiced in over 200 towns in Vermont, and has been since before the nation's founding. They seem to like it okay.

And democracy has worked for Switzerland pretty well. It's kept them out of the EU at least.

Not saying it's better than any of these other wonderful alternatives, but "sucks" is probably not a fair assessment.

[XEmilyX]

Why do I keep hearing people call the united states a democracy instead of a republic??? The only time I've heard it called a republic is in history class, everyone on the news calls it a democracy.

[Althea]

Why do I keep hearing people call the united states a democracy instead of a republic??? The only time I've heard it called a republic is in history class, everyone on the news calls it a democracy.

It's because people don't know the difference (ignorance) and the media can make their propaganda sound better by using the word "democracy." A Republic is hard to maintain. It requires hard work and constant vigilance. In a Democracy, a majority, even if it's by one person, gets to dictate the rights of all and the media loves this.

[Prana]

Why do I keep hearing people call the united states a democracy instead of a republic??? The only time I've heard it called a republic is in history class, everyone on the news calls it a democracy.

It's because people don't know the difference (ignorance) and the media can make their propaganda sound better by using the word "democracy." A Republic is hard to maintain. It requires hard work and constant vigilance. In a Democracy, a majority, even if it's by one person, gets to dictate the rights of all and the media loves this.

Weird how those who clamor for “minority” rights are the loudest proponents of democracy. The two ideals couldn’t be more incongruent, and neither are based on correct principles. Two strikes with one swing.

[Fred]

Why do I keep hearing people call the united states a democracy instead of a republic??? The only time I've heard it called a republic is in history class, everyone on the news calls it a democracy.

It's because people don't know the difference (ignorance) and the media can make their propaganda sound better by using the word "democracy." A Republic is hard to maintain. It requires hard work and constant vigilance. In a Democracy, a majority, even if it's by one person, gets to dictate the rights of all and the media loves this.

Weird how those who clamor for “minority” rights are the loudest proponents of democracy. The two ideals couldn’t be more incongruent, and neither are based on correct principles. Two strikes with one swing.

They have not done their research on democracy. But then, they are not ones to research anything. That is why they blame other people for their own problems.

[2ndRateMind]

Too bad our leaders and 3-letter agencies completely ignore that distinction and collude with corporations to restrict freedom and tighten their global control.

What do you expect of a corporation? They are in the mix to make money, not to improve the lot of humanity. If that improvement happens, that's an accidentally good result, but not the object of the exercise.

Best wishes, 2RM.

[OPMissionary]

Too bad our leaders and 3-letter agencies completely ignore that distinction and collude with corporations to restrict freedom and tighten their global control.

What do you expect of a corporation? They are in the mix to make money, not to improve the lot of humanity.

Best wishes, 2RM.

And that's why neoliberalism has been such a colossal failure. We reward greed and sociopathic tendencies, which ironically, are the only things that ever "trickle down."

[Robin Hood]

The best form of government is a benevolent monarchy.

[2ndRateMind]

The best form of government is a benevolent monarchy.

I'll vote for you my friend, should you decide to stand for the position of benevolent monarch!

Best wishes, 2RM.

[captainfearnot]

Why do I keep hearing people call the united states a democracy instead of a republic??? The only time I've heard it called a republic is in history class, everyone on the news calls it a democracy.

Because "republic" tells you next to nothing about how a country is actually governed. North Korea is a republic.

"Democracy" at its most pedantic refers to actual, formal, direct democracies, of which there are next to none. Switzerland comes closest. Most people talking about democracy aren't calling for a switch to this form of government.

Democracy is also used to describe the extent to which any and all forms of government—republics, monarchies, etc.—achieve democratic ideals. Pluralism, civil liberties, free and fair elections, etc. The most democratic country in the world in 2020 was Norway, a monarchy. Switzerland (the closest government to a formal democracy) ranked 12th. USA ranked 25th, and North Korea ranked last.

This is what we care about. On the news and in public discourse, we don't talk about which countries are "unitary parliamentary constitutional monarchies" (like Norway) and which are "federal parliamentary constitutional republics" (like Pakistan) because the technical form of government doesn't tell us how a country is actually governed. What we care about is where countries fall on the spectrum between fully democratic and fully authoritarian.

[Thinker]

Too bad our leaders and 3-letter agencies completely ignore that distinction and collude with corporations to restrict freedom and tighten their global control.

True.
Giving corporations “rights” as if citizens - was a big red flag.

It seems all forms of government have problems but the most impactful problem is lack of integrity and independent thinking skills. Whether it be the massive mob - or the elite mob - they tend to vote based on herd mentalities & selfish-bias.

[gkearney]

There is however an example of democracy that has been successful for hundreds of years and continues to this day. That is the town meeting forms found in some small town in New England and Atlantic Canada.

These likely work due to the small scale in which they are applied.

[libertasbella]

I like Heinleins' takes on democracy:

“Democracy is four wolves and a sheep voting on dinner.”

“The greatest fallacy of democracy is that everyone's opinion is worth the same.”

“Democracy is a poor system of government at best; the only thing that can honestly be said in its favor is that it is eight times as good as any other method the human race has ever tried.”

“Democracy can survive anything except Democrats”

[2ndRateMind]

I like Heinleins' takes on democracy:

“Democracy is four wolves and a sheep voting on dinner.”

“The greatest fallacy of democracy is that everyone's opinion is worth the same.”

“Democracy is a poor system of government at best; the only thing that can honestly be said in its favor is that it is eight times as good as any other method the human race has ever tried.”

“Democracy can survive anything except Democrats”

Seems to me a freedom forum needs decide between democracy and anarchy. On the whole, I tend to favour democracy. Not because democracy is better in its conception, simply because it engages the ordinary citizen in the political process.

Best wishes, 2RM.

[[email protected]]

Democracy is a great virtue right up until tyranny gets democratically elected.

[2ndRateMind]

Democracy is a great virtue right up until tyranny gets democratically elected.

Exactly so. Vote for me!

Best wishes, 2RM.

[Prana]

I like Heinleins' takes on democracy:

“Democracy is four wolves and a sheep voting on dinner.”

“The greatest fallacy of democracy is that everyone's opinion is worth the same.”

“Democracy is a poor system of government at best; the only thing that can honestly be said in its favor is that it is eight times as good as any other method the human race has ever tried.”

“Democracy can survive anything except Democrats”

Seems to me a freedom forum needs decide between democracy and anarchy. On the whole, I tend to favour democracy. Not because democracy is better in its conception, simply because it engages the ordinary citizen in the political process.

Best wishes, 2RM.

I believe a Zion type society would best be described as anarchy, which simply means that each individual can govern their own behavior and cooperate peacefully with one another. In the meantime, the original intent of a constitutional republic is a far better option than pure democracy.
This was a great article I came across years ago in my development: http://www.321gold.com/editorials/hultb ... 80805.html

[2ndRateMind]

Seems to me a freedom forum needs decide between democracy and anarchy. On the whole, I tend to favour democracy. Not because democracy is better in its conception, simply because it engages the ordinary citizen in the political process.

I believe a Zion type society would best be described as anarchy, which simply means that each individual can govern their own behavior and cooperate peacefully with one another. In the meantime, the original intent of a constitutional republic is a far better option than pure democracy.
This was a great article I came across years ago in my development: http://www.321gold.com/editorials/hultb ... 80805.html

Yes, I think I would agree with that, mostly. Nevertheless, I need to boast my ignorance. How do we get to a 'Zion type society' if it is not democratically agreed amongst the majority of the population?

Best wishes, 2RM.

[Prana]

Seems to me a freedom forum needs decide between democracy and anarchy. On the whole, I tend to favour democracy. Not because democracy is better in its conception, simply because it engages the ordinary citizen in the political process.

I believe a Zion type society would best be described as anarchy, which simply means that each individual can govern their own behavior and cooperate peacefully with one another. In the meantime, the original intent of a constitutional republic is a far better option than pure democracy.
This was a great article I came across years ago in my development: http://www.321gold.com/editorials/hultb ... 80805.html

Yes, I think I would agree with that, mostly. Nevertheless, I need to boast my ignorance. How do we get to a 'Zion type society' if it is not democratically agreed amongst the majority of the population?

Best wishes, 2RM.

That’s a fair point, I suppose that type of society could be considered to exist democratically in the most generous use of the term. The critical distinction is that a democratically agreed upon “Zion type” society doesn’t initiate aggression against other people or their property, whereas the traditional implementation of democracy cannot exist without it.